Zero Punctuation: The Witcher

[WW]

It was a fair comment, wasn't it? If Yahtzee's line about reviews made this one a review, then his comments about putting his genitals in someone's salad should also be taken seriously.

I wasn’t talking about that, when I was reading your post I also had dinner…

I don't, because I can't recall those games being heavy on the "kill ten of [enemy] then come to [NPC] for [reward]". There's nothing inherently bad with those types of quests, but the Witcher handled them in an unashamedly open way. It was rather jarring to be caught up in an epic political plot, but still having to fetch six Ghoul Toes for someone.

You don’t recall, oh please spare me. Does games are exactly like that – get a quest, go there, kill/get/save something/someone/info collect exp-points/cash/unique item. Does are the elements that build the main part of an RPG (…and not only an RPG).

“Unashamedly” – my God it’s so filthy. Kalkstein asks you to get for him xxx (don’t remember what it was) and you do it. That’s the only quest in Act 1 (not counting the “Get the Big Downers ass&#8221, the rest is masked as you would call it.

Which, again, makes his comments accurate. The first chapter is perhaps the dreariest and most poorly made. There's very little, if any, of the moral ambiguity in later chapters and the combat seems unbalanced at that point (I'm looking at you, Dog Boss). It's a good game, but a terrible opening.

Marked text: What?
And what do you mean “at that point”?

(I’m getting the feeling you didn’t go far into the game)

It's called hyperbole - something he's using for dramatic effect and humor. Like his comments about putting his genitals in someone's salad.

Believe me or not but I already know that you will pull a fast one with the “hyperbole”.

Let me explain this: Yes, he used a hyperbole but still he was LYING.

A statement with a hyperbole that would be true would sound something like this:
“This manual is for an RPG? Well Shit, it’s so thin I couldn’t even kill a cockroach with it!”
So kids, remember – if someone is using a hyperbole with a statement that is not true it doesn’t change the fact that it still is a BIG FAT LIE.

No, I just got the idea you were trying to excuse the English voice acting because the Polish one is better? I'm not sure what you were saying initially though; if you clarify I'll answer again.

Your are right, it needs to be clarified.
What I mean, Atari was responsible for the English version. Because they aren’t swimming in cash right now they cut the polish version (something like 30% of the script) to save some money, to save some more they hired some lame-ass actors that made the shit you call “English ver.”.

And Yes, the Polish version is superior in every aspect (script and voice acting).
From where do I know – Played both.

 

[Poptart Fairy]

You don?t recall, oh please spare me. Does games are exactly like that ? get a quest, go there, kill/get/save something/someone/info collect exp-points/cash/unique item. Does are the elements that build the main part of an RPG (?and not only an RPG).

Except very few of them rely on the MMO-esque "kill ten of [thing] then return to [person]". At least the "slay giant scorpion" and "rescue squad of trapped warriors" quests in the likes of Fallout having narrative beyond "I need this specific number dead because of, um, some reason".

?Unashamedly? ? my God it?s so filthy. Kalkstein asks you to get for him xxx (don?t remember what it was) and you do it. That?s the only quest in Act 1 (not counting the ?Get the Big Downers ass?), the rest is masked as you would call it.

Huh? Ghoul blood, the Drowner brains, the Hound skulls, etc. It's all very arbitrary.

Marked text: What?

As in things are very clearly good and evil. NPCs are easily seen through with their motives, and there's a definite good/bad way to go with things. As opposed to, say, Chapter 4 when you have to make some very significant choices between two factions that are simply fighting for different things - rather than deciding if a horde of screaming, ranting religous nuts should live or die despite burning an innocent woman.

And what do you mean ?at that point??

Precisely like I said: at that point in the game, it's boring. Later on the game really picks up.

(I?m getting the feeling you didn?t go far into the game)

Did you?

Believe me or not but I already know that you will pull a fast one with the ?hyperbole?.

Let me explain this: Yes, he used a hyperbole but still he was LYING.

A statement with a hyperbole that would be true would sound something like this:
?This manual is for an RPG? Well Shit, it?s so thin I couldn?t even kill a cockroach with it!?
So kids, remember ? if someone is using a hyperbole with a statement that is not true it doesn?t change the fact that it still is a BIG FAT LIE.

Um, the entire point of hyperbole is to exaggerate. "A manual big enough to kill a goat" - when the manual is pretty chunky compared to most other PC games - certainly fits. I seriously doubt anyone other than yourself is taking that line so seriously. But again, if you take that bit of dialogue so seriously, why aren't you calling Yahtzee out on his other reviews?

By your interpretation of 'hyperbole', Yahtzee is a complete and utter liar, totally incapable of telling the truth; simply because all his reviews and first impression segments are done in the same humorous manner.

Your are right, it needs to be clarified.
What I mean, Atari was responsible for the English version. Because they aren?t swimming in cash right now they cut the polish version (something like 30% of the script) to save some money, to save some more they hired some lame-ass actors that made the shit you call ?English ver.?.

And Yes, the Polish version is superior in every aspect (script and voice acting).
From where do I know ? Played both.

Which really doesn't excuse anything in the English version, IMO. Poor acting and wobbly dialogue is still poor acting and wobbly dialogue. If something could get away from criticism by not having a big budget, then Uwe Boll is one of the finest directors around.

 

[Fire Daemon]

Is anyone else wondering what the critical mass is going to be on Zero Punctuation before the whole thing collapses on itself and everyone finds the new flavor of the month? I thought this phenomenon had capped at about 180 comments, but with the review of Mario and Crysis, the boards have been getting even crazier, although half the comments are bitching and moaning about how unfunny/terribly misrepresentative the "review" was.

Uhhh wait till he reveiws Cod4 (he said he would), the forums will run red with fanyboy flaming. It only takes one link to another website to destroy another.

Come on guys, Yahtzee takes the piss out of everygame he reviews, its what he does, its the whole point of his reviews. Not to give an accurate description of the game and an non bias opinion. Hell the only reason they are actually called reviews is because he says if he likes the game or not. The description should read "This week on Zero Puntuation Yahtzee makes fun of blah blah blah" not "This week on Zero Puntuation Yahtzee reviews blah blah blah"

 

[Um...TE]

I thought his video would have been better had he played enough of the game to make his criticisms ring true. Even though I loved the game, I listed a whole bunch of things he could have teed off on.

The points Yahtzee was critical of were either "meh" or "huh?"

 

[ShmenonPie]

LOL, best review so far IMO, Painkiller at the end was inspired, and washing the gimp of course.
On the more serious side, I don't understand why developers feel the need to exclude huge numbers of people by making their game so complicated, it seems as though it would just slow sales and lower review scores; who enjoys trawling through lots of complex manuals? Most of my friends think FFX is too complex, they would hate this game with a passion!

 

[ZippyDSMlee]

Silverookami
I like RPGs and I find the witcher average....hell most JRPGs are grind whores now a days theres lil fun to be had its all about power grinding for one thing or another and strategy in combat is mindless button whacking..or in FF12s case let it play with itself wat the hell happened to FF the equipment ,spells and items were once upon a time the best in RPGs and now its MMO style water torture....uuhgggg

Okay, I can admit that nowadays a lot of the JRPGs are more about cashing in and grinding through 40 hours of game play, but I still find them preferable to their American counterparts, I can handle playing through slogging battles because I find the backstories and characters more interesting than the traditional heroes in American games who tend to be super soldier buff men, bland impersonal dumbasses, or women with a surplus of boobs and loose morals, which being a chick myself I find hardly appealing. (although I can admit JRPs find giving women huge boobies just as fascinating.)
None of this changes the fact that I still love JRPGs, although I think they probably climaxed back with Earthbound.

The witcher is a euro game

But really whats worse medicoreley detailed game like kotor NWNs or a sloped together MMO reject?

When both are bad they both stink but the US RPGs seem to have a lesser ratio of poorly made RPGs, while JRPGs are mostly grindish cash ins with some fun titles.

Xenosaga and FF are good example of a medicore JRPG that can match most medicore US RPGs in tediousness.

now Xeno is a short RPG very much like any US RPG really(KOTOR,NWN,ect,ect),while FF is just longer(2 worlds?,morrowind/edler scrolls).... while I do like a long game the fun factor on Jrpgs has fell into the casam of mediocrity or worse devoured by the dark MMO grind god lurking at its bottom(BTW it ate oblivion and nawed on morrwind).

I really do not play many Jrpgs anymore without a cheat device even ones like FF12 and DQ8 supposedly the best of the JRPG lot are incessant grind whores and are poorly designed in terms of equipment removing the only thing left to have fun with in the game.

The witcher is a euro game based on MMOs..hell IT IS A JRPG! LOL

 

[ZippyDSMlee]

LOL, best review so far IMO, Painkiller at the end was inspired, and washing the gimp of course.
On the more serious side, I don't understand why developers feel the need to exclude huge numbers of people by making their game so complicated, it seems as though it would just slow sales and lower review scores; who enjoys trawling through lots of complex manuals? Most of my friends think FFX is too complex, they would hate this game with a passion!

FFX.....complex?....... its fcking simplified...FF8 is complex.....and FF12 is incoherent....

here how FFX works you kill things for gems which you use to buy skills and stats on a ONE WAY PATH...a bonus to the oversimplification you are giving 3 equipable equipment 1 acc,1 armor, 1 weapon..at least in FF12 we have some equipment back..only its MMO fair with nothing interesting/ really worth while and are stuck with 1 Gdamn acc....give me 3 and FF12 might be fun to play...hell add the customize weapon system like was in FFX(that came in WAY TO LATE to save the game)....

I just can not stand poorly thought out/sluggish/lagging/annoyng game play design, BTW...... I have the Wild arms remake(alter F?) have you played it? I been putting it off....not even opened it yet LOL

 

[[HD]Rob Inglis]

The humor seems to be changing. The speed of talking is greatly down from the first few episodes, and I'm dissipointed that it is so. The jokes themselves are still funny.

 

[WW]

Except very few of them rely on the MMO-esque "kill ten of [thing] then return to [person]". At least the "slay giant scorpion" and "rescue squad of trapped warriors" quests in the likes of Fallout having narrative beyond "I need this specific number dead because of, um, some reason".

Stop right there! You do know that cRPGs like Fallout and Co. was years earlier then the MMO Era? MMO games are build on “parts”(couldn’t find a better word) of old RPGs – not the other way around.

“Unashamedly” – my God it’s so filthy. Kalkstein asks you to get for him xxx (don’t remember what it was) and you do it. That’s the only quest in Act 1 (not counting the “Get the Big Downers ass&#8221, the rest is masked as you would call it.

Huh? Ghoul blood, the Drowner brains, the Hound skulls, etc. It's all very arbitrary.

I see what you are heading too.

As in things are very clearly good and evil. NPCs are easily seen through with their motives, and there's a definite good/bad way to go with things. As opposed to, say, Chapter 4 when you have to make some very significant choices between two factions that are simply fighting for different things - rather than deciding if a horde of screaming, ranting religious nuts should live or die despite burning an innocent woman.

In Act 3 there was the “The Bank” (for me of course it was obvious because I already sided with the squirrel but still made me think) and “The Vampire Burdello”(“blue eyes” or something) quest – it was a side quest that had 3 choices – that was also not to clear if you know what I mean.

On a side Note: On one of the forums I met a guy that was cretin that in Act 1 burning the Witch was the lesser evil because she was the most guilty – very disturbing.

You are right, it needs to be clarified.
What I mean, Atari was responsible for the English version. Because they aren’t swimming in cash right now they cut the polish version (something like 30% of the script) to save some money, to save some more they hired some lame-ass actors that made the shit you call “English ver.”.

And Yes, the Polish version is superior in every aspect (script and voice acting).
From where do I know – Played both.

Which really doesn't excuse anything in the English version, IMO. Poor acting and wobbly dialogue is still poor acting and wobbly dialogue. If something could get away from criticism by not having a big budget, then Uwe Boll is one of the finest directors around.

Hmmm… I could agree with you partly. Taking into account that The Witcher was made for 8 mln $ BUT you have to agree that a small budget doesn’t help (let’s take Bioware, if it goes for voice acting they always have a BIG budget, dialogue… are quit the opposite? Don’t know.

On the other topic: Do you even know why Boll’s films always suck? And no, it’s not that he sucks.

Um, the entire point of hyperbole is to exaggerate. "A manual big enough to kill a goat" - when the manual is pretty chunky compared to most other PC games - certainly fits. I seriously doubt anyone other than yourself is taking that line so seriously. But again, if you take that bit of dialogue so seriously, why aren't you calling Yahtzee out on his other reviews?

By your interpretation of 'hyperbole', Yahtzee is a complete and utter liar, totally incapable of telling the truth; simply because all his reviews and first impression segments are done in the same humorous manner.

I have to agree with you here.

After thinking this over, I think I know why the “exaggeration”. For a PC Gamer as myself TW manual isn’t anything special but for a Console Player as He is it may seem as something very, very-fucking BIG.

 

[Poptart Fairy]

Stop right there! You do know that cRPGs like Fallout and Co. was years earlier then the MMO Era? MMO games are build on “parts”(couldn’t find a better word) of old RPGs – not the other way around.

Which doesn't change what I said. If anything this counts against the Witcher once more, because it isn't trying anything new - merely taking the MMO formula and ham-fistedly cramming into a context that doesn't really fit.

In Act 3 there was the “The Bank” (for me of course it was obvious because I already sided with the squirrel but still made me think) and “The Vampire Burdello”(“blue eyes” or something) quest – it was a side quest that had 3 choices – that was also not to clear if you know what I mean.

On a side Note: On one of the forums I met a guy that was cretin that in Act 1 burning the Witch was the lesser evil because she was the most guilty – very disturbing.

Well, here's the thing: stuff like Chapter 3 isn't found in Chapter 1.

As Yahtzee only had experience with the first couple of hours, he isn't going to see the depth that a lot of people are raving about. I really disliked the "moral challenges" early on, but then later...well. I could spend about twenty minutes fussing over a choice. This is the kind of thing that hooks people, not the "collect ten brains" quests.

Just a shame the Witcher didn't try a little more grey shades at the beginning. Would have been so much more captivating.

Hmmm… I could agree with you partly. Taking into account that The Witcher was made for 8 mln $ BUT you have to agree that a small budget doesn’t help (let’s take Bioware, if it goes for voice acting they always have a BIG budget, dialogue… are quit the opposite? Don’t know.

Well, of course, that's a given. I'm one of those people who prefers no voice acting over really poor acting though - the disjointed style in the UK dub is really off-putting.

"Why THANK YOU for doing this. AND I'M REALLY GLAD YOU HELPED. Because of SOMETHING THAT HAPPENED."

It completely breaks character.

I have to agree with you here.

After thinking this over, I think I know why the “exaggeration”. For a PC Gamer as myself TW manual isn’t anything special but for a Console Player as He is it may seem as something very, very-fucking BIG.

A lot of PC games seem to be skimping on the manuals lately too, which is dissapointing. Granted, I can't expect Shooter Blasted Mayhem 5 to have much depth in the written text, but still...

:|

 

[VMerken]

I would just like to add one thing (and break the 300 posts barrier), concerning the comments about the "gratuitous pornographic exposure" in this game:

At no point in The Witcher are you *forced* to get it on with the fairer sex. It is entirely possible to say "no" and complete the game without a single bed adventure. You, and only YOU, decide if Geralt gets busy or not. As such, I don't quite get why people and some of the posters here are getting worked up over it. Don't want to see those explicit mammary pictures? Then don't get seduced, it's as simple as that. You control Geralt's actions, and that's why it's a RPG.

 

[ZippyDSMlee]

I would just like to add one thing (and break the 300 posts barrier), concerning the comments about the "gratuitous pornographic exposure" in this game:

At no point in The Witcher are you *forced* to get it on with the fairer sex. It is entirely possible to say "no" and complete the game without a single bed adventure. You, and only YOU, decide if Geralt gets busy or not. As such, I don't quite get why people and some of the posters here are getting worked up over it. Don't want to see those explicit mammary pictures? Then don't get seduced, it's as simple as that. You control Geralt's actions, and that's why it's a RPG.

Even mas effect dosent really have that,theres one quest I forget which if you take it you get busy if you want to or not,silly game devs rushing content.....

 

[entropy3ko]

1. No comment.
2. Can you tell me what kind of a mysterious connection does the dialogue have with the cards?
3. You have made a good point, the people who will buy this are:
- Horny Nerds
- Kiddies (does will play for 5 minutes the leave it because it?s stupid ??I hate RPG?s?)
- RPG fans
(I don?t care for the first two but if more copies will sell then the better)
4. Only and especially for you I will explain it, there are:
- main plot quests (thanks to them you advanced in the plot)
- side quests (you get them from people, similar to the ?main plot quests? ? but you already know that)
- side quests #2 a.k.a. Monster Contracts a.k.a. Board Quests (does are the ?Fetch that?? quests that you do to get exp. points, I didn?t do them because I didn?t have the time to fuck around)
5. Your honor, the public prosecutor is trying to butt rape me (and I assume you know a game that doesn?t have flaws).

And the commotion is about 3 things:
- Many think this is a review
- Many Kiddies believe this ?first impression? to the letter
- Many things are made up by Yahtzee because he hadn?t have the patients to look for the really ?mean? parts in this game that made a lot of people pissed

1- No commento on the No comment
2- They are both on the 'erotica' side
3-As a RPG fan I will probably buy the witcher... as soon as the bugs and minutes long loading times problems are resolves (well patch 1.2 should have, or so they say).I do not think I could stand a game that takes 5 minutes to load an environment (and several reviewers pointed that this was basically the main problem.,.. I do not understand why actually did not mention this... perhaps he did not enter a city?)
4-Hey according to many the quests-story-environment are super-dupah-great... so perhaps Yahtzee DID misjudge this haviong not enough patience. I did not play the game so I can only tell from hearsay...
5-All game have flaws The important thing is that the good bits strongly outweight the bad bits.

I just finished playing DREAMFALL (The longest Journey sequel) and OK, it was very short, combat was 'meh', and actually more than a game it was an interactive adventure... but the characters, voices, environments and especially the story were so finger-licking good (at least for my tastes) that I do not care if this game had this evident flaws. I enjoyed so much!!! So I do not really care now if this game is not a game but more an interactive movie (let's call it the for lack of a proper term). Of course I hope the next installment will resolve the issues.

--

-Well he DID say it was a first impression and just played a couple of hours...
-It's NOT a game for kiddies... it's clearly for adults (and this is stated by most reviewers, it's noty a bad thing, acutally is a good thing if you do not like more childish RPG) so Kiddies should not buy it and go play Dangeoun Siege 2 (if they have been really really naughty) or Neverwinter Nights 2 if theyt have been good
-I agree that Yahtzee did not push himself this time. But did he let me down? No (well perhaps as a scrupulous reviewer he did) but I had fun watching the review (pardon: 1st impression) even if it's not completely true.
In any case Yahtzee was not the only one to criticize the repetitive combat system and the inventory screens.


In the END:

reading OTHER reviews,it appears that (apart technical problems and loading times which frustrate many apparently... also the combat system was criticized as a little boring... ) everyone is saying that: this is a game put next to Halo 3, god of RPG's, must have for all creatures under the sky

So it's either a 'Halo 3' Hype or it is really a good game. I hope the latter of course... I already have Dungeon Siege 2 XDDDDDD

--------------------------

PS: and one more thing.... this LONG LOADING TIMES BUG ME OFF. Even if I did not experience them yet it raises a question: do the damn companies that make these games even test them?! Kidnap a few people from the streets and make them play? Why are we once more subject to these abuse?

Why bring out a game full of bugs and THEN release patches to remove the bugs, insrtead of testing the game, bring it out a few months later and with less bugs (ok the goal is bugs free but nobody is perfect I know)

This is not an attack at the Witcher, but at the gameing industry in general. Of course it's like with many hollywood big budget movies, you'd think all the money would produce something good, but apparently it goes only down the SFX drain.
Games follow the same trend apparently, replacing SFX with graphics that murder your PC.

Probably the people who work on video games do not play them nor do they like them, so to expect they can distinguish between a good game and a bad game it's like expecting a blind man to distinguish between a Picasso and road sign...

 

[deadly.by.design]

I'd just like to point out that The Witcher isn't a click-fest when compared to the likes of Diablo or Dungeon Siege. The combat involves clicking, yes, but not the ad nauseum / carpal tunnel inducing amount that other games require. You click once to engage, and again at various stages of the attack sequence. Screw it up and you fail the attacks - simple as that.

(also, both Dungeon Siege games rank pretty low on my quality list.. the first one was boring and the second didn't interest me enough to play beyond a half hour)

The Witcher's cinematics and overall story were good quality for the PC RPG genre. (although I think you lose a tiny bit of the "getting it" if you haven't read the books...which I haven't) The dialogue had its quirks, but it's not as consistently butchered as most people claim. You have some awkward transitions or sudden voice changes every so often, but I didn't find it to be an every day thing in my playing experience. Some of the voice actors, White Rayla springs to mind, ARE really awful. They're more the exception than the rule though, I'd say, as the voice acting wasn't as bad as other titles I've played. (Hello? Far Cry anyone?)

Downsides:
- Long load times (even after the 1.2 patch)
- Still a little buggy (after patch, tho not as much)
- Awkward sexuality that, while not forced upon the player, wasn't handled very maturely
- Some language vulgarity that seemed in there just for the sake of... well... being in there
- The GUI wasn't the greatest, but I've seen worse
- Various voice acting / dialogue quirks
- Some tedious running for quests

Those things aside, and I do believe other games have had the courtesy of downsides being overlooked, The Witcher stands out in the PC RPG genre as a bit of a gem. It's a niche gem that's somewhere between of D&D ruleset hardcore fans and Diablo "ooh, shiny" click-fest addicts, but a gem in its own way.

The only thing I have a problem with his the bias of over-emphasizing the bugs. They were there. They couldn't be avoided entirely. The game's still worth playing for most PC RPG fans though, despite everything. (although I do hope CD PROJECT takes the game's criticisms to heart for any possible sequels/expansions)

Like I said earlier: The fact that he doesn't even mention the obviously glaring load times tells me where he wanted to take this review. (I say "review" because it seems he decided to forego playing the whole game out of dislike, rather than original intent)

 

[Mkoll]

As funny as the Painkiller bit is, I consider this ZP to be the weakest of all. Yahtzee hates the genre which we all know by now. He set out to bash this game as quickly as possible without really stopping to look at it.

I know the purpose of those reviews and I usually enjoy them regardless of my own opinion but in this case Yahtzee's hostility towards Witcher feels superficial. He could have done exactly the same without actually installing the game. Yahtzee, just stay away from games you don't have anything to say about.

 

[entropy3ko]

(also, both Dungeon Siege games rank pretty low on my quality list.. the first one was boring and the second didn't interest me enough to play beyond a half hour)

I totally Agree


Anyway I sure hope they do something about those loading times

 

[WW]

(also, both Dungeon Siege games rank pretty low on my quality list.. the first one was boring and the second didn't interest me enough to play beyond a half hour)

I totally Agree


Anyway I sure hope they do something about those loading times

entropy3ko, what part of the "the 1.2 patch fixed the loding times" don't you understand?

 

[deadly.by.design]

entropy3ko, what part of the "the 1.2 patch fixed the loding times" don't you understand?

I don't know that "fix" is the right word, but the 1.2 patch certainly helps them. Fix might be appropriate for the saving though, as they're quick now.

 

[entropy3ko]

(also, both Dungeon Siege games rank pretty low on my quality list.. the first one was boring and the second didn't interest me enough to play beyond a half hour)

I totally Agree


Anyway I sure hope they do something about those loading times

entropy3ko, what part of the "the 1.2 patch fixed the loding times" don't you understand?

What part of 'Loading Times are still DAMN LONG even AFTER patch 1.2' don't YOU understand?!

Patch 1.2 shortened the Loading times but they are still pretty long. DURRR

 

[WW]

(also, both Dungeon Siege games rank pretty low on my quality list.. the first one was boring and the second didn't interest me enough to play beyond a half hour)

I totally Agree


Anyway I sure hope they do something about those loading times

entropy3ko, what part of the "the 1.2 patch fixed the loding times" don't you understand?

What part of 'Loading Times are still DAMN LONG even AFTER patch 1.2' don't YOU understand?!

Patch 1.2 shortened the Loading times but they are still pretty long. DURRR

As a RPG fan I will probably buy the witcher...

Now, please tell how do you know that the loading times are long if you didn't played it?

And how much is "pretty long" for you?

(note: I have 1gig of RAM DDR 1)