Supreme Court overturns Roe v. Wade; states can ban abortion

TheMysteriousGX

Elite Member
Legacy
Sep 16, 2014
8,316
6,822
118
Country
United States
Sure, if the Founding Fathers were stupid. The Founding Fathers Thomas Jefferson in particular wanted to include a passage in the Declaration of Independence condemning slavery but took it out because they knew the colonies as a whole would never support the revolution otherwise. Afterward, they didn't ban slavery when the Constitution was drafted because they knew the entire country would be torn apart, like it nearly was a century later. Right after the Revolutionary War was an even worse time to do it since the chaos might have allowed the British to swoop in and reclaim the country.

There were plenty of reasons to not do these things yet, which is why the 9th amendment is important because it allowed room for those to be added in at a later time. Whatever the motivations for each of them society was NOT capable of allowing slavery or women's rights among other things when the United States was founded and the Founding Fathers knew that. So they left it to future generations when there would be a chance in hell that the country could survive the addition of these rights.
Thomas Jefferson was also the what, 3rd largest slave owner in the country who didn't have any problem enslaving the children he had with the child slave he raped? He only advocated for gradually getting rid of slavery in such a way that he'd be long dead before it became personally inconvenient for him. And we're just ignoring all the Founding Fathers who were fine and dandy owning other human beings, denying poor men the vote, denying women's rights to own property and vote, etc

You don't get credit for advances made by other people just because you technically came up with the mechanism for change.
 

TheMysteriousGX

Elite Member
Legacy
Sep 16, 2014
8,316
6,822
118
Country
United States
And just in case you thought conservatives actually gave a shit about equality and that this was a good faith argument
 

Trunkage

Nascent Orca
Legacy
Jun 21, 2012
8,697
2,881
118
Brisbane
Gender
Cyborg
No, but governmentally enforced segregation is harder to fix than what occurs naturally, and not trying to fix what occured naturally was itself a failure.
Is this a typo? 'Not trying to fix what occurred naturally was itself a failure'

How is this relevant to what I said?

You're pretending the culture hasn't changed in 60 years, which is delusional. Black people can get good jobs and live in nice neighborhoods in 2022, some places actively pursue that happening.
Kerner came out in '68. I talking about 2 specific talking points you used from that report that came out in 1968. Thus, I have been limiting the timeline up to 1968. Whenever I'm replying to you in this area, it only got to do with your 2 specific talking points and aimed at the Kerner report unless I state otherwise (eg. talking about Reagan etc.)

It's not all white people being racists, but enough to materially impact the experience of black people in the 1960s. Absolutely there were a ton of white racists in the 60s with the power to exclude people from their community.
Great
This whole time I've just been pointing to how it doesn't matter what you or anyone else would do, they are still going to act that way.
For example: Racist will use Affirmative Action to justify punishing people
Racist will also use police brutality as an example of WHY the victim deserved it. It doesn't matter if the victim did anything wrong or if they did something wrong, whether the punishment justified the treatment
Even if you let racist have everything they want - segregation, slavery of a particular people, expulsion form a country. Even genocide. They will still try to punish those they hate, even when they are dead and buried

If there were white employers who didn't want to hire blacks based on race before and then still after, welfare had nothing to the employers actions. They were always going to not hire them, welfare is just an excuse. It's like how people used welfare queens, drug dealers and just being too lazy to earn money to punish black people

The only thing that will change when that generation dies off

It is also really bad to make an assessment on a policy based on not offending white people who are racist. In fact, people getting mad about having to pay tax is a positive. It's an indication that you have chosen the right path

There is a simple solution, if the white employers didn't want to pay the 'extra tax' they could just give black people jobs. It's a really simple solution. If they don't want to give them jobs, they pay the tax
 

immortalfrieza

Elite Member
Legacy
May 12, 2011
2,336
270
88
Country
USA
To be perfectly honest, it doesn't actually matter to the argument whether you think the Founding Fathers personally would've supported true equality if they could or not. The point is they didn't. The point of contention here was whether the Constitution as it exists promised true equality, and it clearly didn't.
Actually, it matters a lot. I don't know how old you are but you're looking through everything from the lens of free people who have had rights probably for your entire lifetime, not from the perspective of a people struggling to get a country off the ground. There's a massive difference between "The Constitution could have done X but didn't" and "The Constitution wanted to do X but couldn't" and the Founding Fathers were the latter. The Constitution could've promised anything the Founding Fathers wanted but it means precisely jack if they can't actually make it happen.

There were reasons both political and practical NOT to just put every possible right into the Constitution when it was drafted. That's what the 9th amendment was about, making that possible in the future. If you think why they didn't do X doesn't matter then you're not being reasonable at all.
 

tstorm823

Elite Member
Legacy
Aug 4, 2011
6,484
928
118
Country
USA
Kerner came out in '68. I talking about 2 specific talking points you used from that report that came out in 1968. Thus, I have been limiting the timeline up to 1968. Whenever I'm replying to you in this area, it only got to do with your 2 specific talking points and aimed at the Kerner report unless I state otherwise (eg. talking about Reagan etc.)
You referenced Reagan, Clinton, etc in part of your post.
I responded to that line specifically.
Now you're telling me that you're only talking about thing's older than '68 unless you reference something like Reagan, which is exactly what I was responding to.
If there were white employers who didn't want to hire blacks based on race before and then still after, welfare had nothing to the employers actions. They were always going to not hire them, welfare is just an excuse.
Sure. I'll buy that for a dollar. Lyndon Johnson wasn't making people racist, he was giving racists an excuse. At a time in history when American society was rapidly and painfully coming to terms with the horrible treatment of the black community, Johnson sent the message "no, you well off white people aren't evil, we've given the poor black people welfare."
The only thing that will change when that generation dies off
This is also reasonable assessment. That's my biggest argument against the supposed "party flip". We are told that after the Civil Rights Act, all the racists switched to the Republican Party, but the south continued to vote for primarily Democrats for nearly four decades, and by the time those states genuinely turned red, enough time had passed for two generations of racists to have died off and been replaced by voters who were born after the Civil Rights Movement took hold.
 

Silvanus

Elite Member
Legacy
Jan 15, 2013
11,087
5,818
118
Country
United Kingdom
Actually, it matters a lot. I don't know how old you are but you're looking through everything from the lens of free people who have had rights probably for your entire lifetime, not from the perspective of a people struggling to get a country off the ground. There's a massive difference between "The Constitution could have done X but didn't" and "The Constitution wanted to do X but couldn't" and the Founding Fathers were the latter. The Constitution could've promised anything the Founding Fathers wanted but it means precisely jack if they can't actually make it happen.

There were reasons both political and practical NOT to just put every possible right into the Constitution when it was drafted. That's what the 9th amendment was about, making that possible in the future. If you think why they didn't do X doesn't matter then you're not being reasonable at all.
Dude, I wasn't saying there's no difference between the two positions at all. I was saying that it's not relevant to the discussion we were having, which was solely concerning whether it did, not whether it could have.
 

Phoenixmgs

The Muse of Fate
Legacy
Apr 3, 2020
9,010
795
118
w/ M'Kraan Crystal
Gender
Male
okay. So then, by that same token, you believe that one can't be against abortion and against vaccine mandates. Right?
Depends on the principle you're going by. "My body, my choice" is not consistent with being for a vaccine mandate.

A) We don't have free speech and never did. B) You're justifying slavery
Nice and vague, no relation to specific topic, weaker than normal deflection
For the record, I am also against the government forcing people to get vaccinated on pain of imprisonment with zero exceptions, both state and federal
Right, so we should be worried when the right says that LGBT people should be marginalized and eliminated for their perverse lifestyle, yes? Because the right fights for it's morals?
If this Supreme Court were in session for Obergefell, it would've been 3-6 against. Why do you think it won't go that way if challenged now? They'd *absolutely* detonate Federal marriage benefits to stop gay marriage if they thought all the straight people losing their tax benefits would put up with it.
I mean, most of them went on to write the articles of confederation, the US constitution, and the first federal laws, so yes? Obviously? They didn't have an authority that could overrule them, that's what the war was about
Yes, I'm justifying slavery :rolleyes:

Inequality is greater in blue states...

So, you're not for covid vaccine mandates?

The right (the majority) wants to marginalize and eliminate LGBT?

Because abortion and gay marriage are 2 different things.

And they totally didn't have to compromise whatsoever to get all the states/colonies on board?


Justices-- it's in the majority opinion. Yes, they did; you've already been provided with the direct quote in which they say so.



For most of the existence of the United States, same-sex marriage was not considered included in the right to marriage. Four of the Justices involved in Obergefell argued that it isn't included. 3 of whom still serve.

All they need is a flimsy justification. "It doesn't count as 'marriage' if it's same-sex, therefore same-sex marriage isn't included". "Gay people already have the right to marriage, because they can marry the opposite sex". <-- both arguments used very extensively by Republican opponents of same-sex marriage.



I promise you that my occasional posts on this forum about same-sex marriage are not detracting from my ability to care about other issues. :rolleyes:



Nope. But not because the Constitution stands in their way; because American society is wholly against slavery, including the vast majority of Republicans.

Same-sex marriage, on the other hand? A large chunk of Republican politicians and voters oppose it.
Wasn't all the quotes taken from a single justice's opinion?

And simple arguments like the 14th amendment and the why should someone be disadvantaged if they choose to live with someone else aren't even more basic and better arguments?

I didn't say people can't care about other things just as well. But being able to get things to change by putting in time and resources is limited. If you have the public all-in on gay marriage for example, they obviously are putting stuff like healthcare reform on the back burner, not that they don't care equally or even more about that. That's exactly what they want people to be bitching about, stuff that really doesn't matter much. Hell, they even accomplished that in the midst of a pandemic where people lost jobs losing healthcare and still no huge push for healthcare reform when it was affecting more Americans than ever before. Americans are fighting over shit other countries got past like decades ago.

70% of republicans back gay marriage...


It says exactly what I think it says.
The 9th amendment doesn't make abortion a right...
 

Silvanus

Elite Member
Legacy
Jan 15, 2013
11,087
5,818
118
Country
United Kingdom
Wasn't all the quotes taken from a single justice's opinion?
That's not how a majority opinion works. Five Justices signed onto it.

And simple arguments like the 14th amendment and the why should someone be disadvantaged if they choose to live with someone else aren't even more basic and better arguments?
Of course they are. These cases are not decided by which is the better argument. Hence why four Justices disregarded those arguments entirely in the original filing of Obergefell.

I didn't say people can't care about other things just as well. But being able to get things to change by putting in time and resources is limited. If you have the public all-in on gay marriage for example, they obviously are putting stuff like healthcare reform on the back burner, not that they don't care equally or even more about that. That's exactly what they want people to be bitching about, stuff that really doesn't matter much. Hell, they even accomplished that in the midst of a pandemic where people lost jobs losing healthcare and still no huge push for healthcare reform when it was affecting more Americans than ever before. Americans are fighting over shit other countries got past like decades ago.
If opponents stopped expending time and energy trying to strip back rights, then supporters wouldn't need to expend time and energy defending them.

70% of republicans back gay marriage...
I think you might need to read that again. 70% is the total for all respondents, not Republicans specifically. 55% of Republican respondents said they support it.

And we all know from the last five years or so that the Republican agenda is primarily decided by its loudest, most vocal, and most aggressive members.
 

TheMysteriousGX

Elite Member
Legacy
Sep 16, 2014
8,316
6,822
118
Country
United States
Yes, I'm justifying slavery :rolleyes:
Quite literally, by saying it's okay to force prisoners to work, which is slavery, which you literally said was okay
Inequality is greater in blue states...
Love how you're bring up something even less relevant to the topic at hand, then doubling down in it after it was mentioned it was less relevant to the topic at hand. Why're you deflecting so hard in the Supreme Court Kills Roe thread?
So, you're not for covid vaccine mandates?
I said exactly what I said
The right (the majority) wants to marginalize and eliminate LGBT?
Yes
Because abortion and gay marriage are 2 different things.
Both of which conservative leadership wants to get rid of, yes
And they totally didn't have to compromise whatsoever to get all the states/colonies on board?
Correct, they compromised their morality with themselves and set the country up to be inherently unequal. As a consequence it's been two and a half centuries and we're only at the point where we're mostly equal on paper
And simple arguments like the 14th amendment and the why should someone be disadvantaged if they choose to live with someone else aren't even more basic and better arguments?
Not according to 2/3rds of the Supreme Court. Maybe 5/9ths if Roberts has a fit of self-preservation
I didn't say people can't care about other things just as well. But being able to get things to change by putting in time and resources is limited. If you have the public all-in on gay marriage for example, they obviously are putting stuff like healthcare reform on the back burner, not that they don't care equally or even more about that. That's exactly what they want people to be bitching about, stuff that really doesn't matter much. Hell, they even accomplished that in the midst of a pandemic where people lost jobs losing healthcare and still no huge push for healthcare reform when it was affecting more Americans than ever before. Americans are fighting over shit other countries got past like decades ago.
"Which is why the democrats should stop playing defense at all, because who cares what rights the GOP attacks and overturns if *I* don't think they're important?"
The 9th amendment doesn't make abortion a right...
The 9th amendment didn't make slavery wrong either, that's the point.
 

Phoenixmgs

The Muse of Fate
Legacy
Apr 3, 2020
9,010
795
118
w/ M'Kraan Crystal
Gender
Male
That's not how a majority opinion works. Five Justices signed onto it.



Of course they are. These cases are not decided by which is the better argument. Hence why four Justices disregarded those arguments entirely in the original filing of Obergefell.



If opponents stopped expending time and energy trying to strip back rights, then supporters wouldn't need to expend time and energy defending them.



I think you might need to read that again. 70% is the total for all respondents, not Republicans specifically. 55% of Republican respondents said they support it.

And we all know from the last five years or so that the Republican agenda is primarily decided by its loudest, most vocal, and most aggressive members.
Because signing the majority opinion means they agreed with literally everything in it?

Arguments matter, why even have lawyers make a case and argue if they don't matter?

There have been no rights stripped.

My bad, I thought it was just a republican poll initially. Same with the democrat agenda...

Quite literally, by saying it's okay to force prisoners to work, which is slavery, which you literally said was okay
Love how you're bring up something even less relevant to the topic at hand, then doubling down in it after it was mentioned it was less relevant to the topic at hand. Why're you deflecting so hard in the Supreme Court Kills Roe thread?
I said exactly what I said
Yes
Both of which conservative leadership wants to get rid of, yes
Correct, they compromised their morality with themselves and set the country up to be inherently unequal. As a consequence it's been two and a half centuries and we're only at the point where we're mostly equal on paper
Not according to 2/3rds of the Supreme Court. Maybe 5/9ths if Roberts has a fit of self-preservation
"Which is why the democrats should stop playing defense at all, because who cares what rights the GOP attacks and overturns if *I* don't think they're important?"

The 9th amendment didn't make slavery wrong either, that's the point.
Nope.

The left causes more harm to groups you vow to protect, yet you stand on their side.

Yes or no, are you for covid vaccines?

Yes because political parties actually do what their platforms say they will. You should look at the laughable democratic platform then.

That isn't true.

There'd be no country if they didn't compromise.

Based on a different argument. The cases for gay marriage didn't make such an argument.

Would it be better for the American public if there was legit healthcare reform or gay marriage? One is more important than the other. Democrats play offense for policies that create inequality. Again, they are the same fucking team, how can't you get this through your head?

Nobody tried using the 9th amendment against slavery.
 

TheMysteriousGX

Elite Member
Legacy
Sep 16, 2014
8,316
6,822
118
Country
United States
lmao
Again, inherently there is nothing wrong with having prisoners work. I'm not here to talk about how it's been exploited, I'm just here to state there is nothing wrong with the 13th amendment as it is.
The left causes more harm to groups you vow to protect, yet you stand on their side.
"Debate my very real and important distraction!"
Yes or no, are you for covid vaccines?
I'm pro-vaccination in general. Getting a Hep B one just because my work is legally obligated to pay for it
Yes because political parties actually do what their platforms say they will. You should look at the laughable democratic platform then.
That isn't true.
Hey man, you're the one that says the right fights for their morals. There's their morals.
There'd be no country if they didn't compromise.
And? Nothing more damning to the "the country was made for equality" argument then saying the country wouldn't even exist without codifying many forms of blatant inequality.
Based on a different argument. The cases for gay marriage didn't make such an argument.
That's just lying to protect your pride at this point. Are you so utterly incapable of admitting you're wrong that you're ignoring that gay marriage was decided on a 5-4 vote less than a decade ago and that the court has dramatically shifted towards the 4?
Would it be better for the American public if there was legit healthcare reform or gay marriage? One is more important than the other.
Throwing a marginalized group under the bus because they don't count is fascism. What rights of yours are up for grabs, seeing as abortions and anything LGBT don't apply to you? What of yours is an acceptable loss? Anything?
EDIT: No fault divorce is on the chopping block too. Is that worthy enough to fight for?
Democrats play offense for policies that create inequality. Again, they are the same fucking team, how can't you get this through your head?
This thread shows some very stark differences that you are bound and determined to ignore. What's the third option besides "vote for this techno-bro who's party can't even hold a mayorship"?
Nobody tried using the 9th amendment against slavery.
That is quite possibly the stupidest thing I've ever heard. They had to draft two whole amendments to even get the ball rolling on anything approaching equality and you think, what, they just forgot the 9th was a thing? If the 9th doesn't work for abortion, other healthcare, water, housing, fucking anything else, why the fuck would it work for slavery. The 9th Amendment was the first one conservatives took behind the woodshed and put two slugs into
 
Last edited:

Casual Shinji

Should've gone before we left.
Legacy
Jul 18, 2009
19,605
4,412
118
Does Phoenixmgs get a quarter everytime he posts that liberal hypocricy video or something - I've seen him post that thing at least 4 times now.
 
  • Like
Reactions: MrCalavera

Silvanus

Elite Member
Legacy
Jan 15, 2013
11,087
5,818
118
Country
United Kingdom
Because signing the majority opinion means they agreed with literally everything in it?
Oh lol. If they objected to a major plank of the opinion they wouldn't have fucking signed it.

I'm sorry, but the majority of SCOTUS Justices signed an opinion in direct contradiction to your view. You're going to have to come to terms with that.

Arguments matter, why even have lawyers make a case and argue if they don't matter?
Why even hold an election in Russia if votes don't decide the outcome? Same answer. Its a show.

There have been no rights stripped.
Trans people lost the right to join the military, until the ban was repealed last year. Various state governors have signed bills banning trans kids from involvement in athletics, or barring them from using appropriate bathrooms. There have also been several motions to allow discrimination against gay customers if its on religious grounds.


^ aaaand over 670 bills aimed at restricting or removing LGBT+ rights or protections have been filed since 2018. And that number is rising precipitously; over 300 were in 2022 alone.

My bad, I thought it was just a republican poll initially. Same with the democrat agenda...
Except Dem voters overwhelmingly support same sex marriage, and Dem justices in the SCOTUS also supported Obergefell, whereas Republican justices didn't.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Dirty Hipsters

Trunkage

Nascent Orca
Legacy
Jun 21, 2012
8,697
2,881
118
Brisbane
Gender
Cyborg
Does Phoenixmgs get a quarter everytime he posts that liberal hypocricy video or something - I've seen him post that thing at least 4 times now.
I'm very willing to say that there is Liberal hypocrisy. Eg. Affirmative Action didn't stop Liberals looking down on minorities when they were picked and started entering schools/colleges

Also, Johnny Harris has done a lot of hypocrisy. In fact, most of his videos since he ventured out on his own.
 

Casual Shinji

Should've gone before we left.
Legacy
Jul 18, 2009
19,605
4,412
118
I'm very willing to say that there is Liberal hypocrisy. Eg. Affirmative Action didn't stop Liberals looking down on minorities when they were picked and started entering schools/colleges
I don't disagree, it's just that I think posting a video once is enough. Twice is, like, okay sure. But four times? Dude, we get it, this video exists.

Also, Johnny Harris has done a lot of hypocrisy. In fact, most of his videos since he ventured out on his own.
Yeah, he seems to have been embellishing on facts for the sake of making his videos more exciting.
 

Phoenixmgs

The Muse of Fate
Legacy
Apr 3, 2020
9,010
795
118
w/ M'Kraan Crystal
Gender
Male
lmao

"Debate my very real and important distraction!"
I'm pro-vaccination in general. Getting a Hep B one just because my work is legally obligated to pay for it
Hey man, you're the one that says the right fights for their morals. There's their morals.
And? Nothing more damning to the "the country was made for equality" argument then saying the country wouldn't even exist without codifying many forms of blatant inequality.
That's just lying to protect your pride at this point. Are you so utterly incapable of admitting you're wrong that you're ignoring that gay marriage was decided on a 5-4 vote less than a decade ago and that the court has dramatically shifted towards the 4?
Throwing a marginalized group under the bus because they don't count is fascism. What rights of yours are up for grabs, seeing as abortions and anything LGBT don't apply to you? What of yours is an acceptable loss? Anything?
EDIT: No fault divorce is on the chopping block too. Is that worthy enough to fight for?
This thread shows some very stark differences that you are bound and determined to ignore. What's the third option besides "vote for this techno-bro who's party can't even hold a mayorship"?
That is quite possibly the stupidest thing I've ever heard. They had to draft two whole amendments to even get the ball rolling on anything approaching equality and you think, what, they just forgot the 9th was a thing? If the 9th doesn't work for abortion, other healthcare, water, housing, fucking anything else, why the fuck would it work for slavery. The 9th Amendment was the first one conservatives took behind the woodshed and put two slugs into
Having prisoners work is not slavery.

You for covid vaccines, yes or no?

Not everything a person let alone a political party does is fighting for their morals.

That's how things were at the time. Doing the best you can at the time is bad? If we can change 1 thing in healthcare now to make it better and help at least some people, should it not be done because there's still a lot wrong with healthcare?

Again, the votes are based on arguments presented, not on the morality of something. It's not like someone went to the SC and said gay marriage should be allowed because of morals, they went up there with a legal argument. The SC is not the moral court. It's just like RBG said Roe was argued poorly and a different argument would be a lot more legally solid.

Reformed healthcare also helps gay people probably even more than gay marriage does. If you have the option to do Thing_A that helps 100 people and Thing_B that helps 10 people, which one do you think you should prioritize? It's not throwing Thing_B under the bus, it's just doing it at a later time.

What stark differences? You mean like one's the face and one's the heel but they're playing the same game?

Like said, you have to make a legal argument. You can't just go up to the SC and say slavery is bad and have them figure out for you that it's against the current laws.

Does Phoenixmgs get a quarter everytime he posts that liberal hypocricy video or something - I've seen him post that thing at least 4 times now.
Because you all hand wave away all the bad policies the dems put into place, their policies create more inequality than the right's.

Oh lol. If they objected to a major plank of the opinion they wouldn't have fucking signed it.

I'm sorry, but the majority of SCOTUS Justices signed an opinion in direct contradiction to your view. You're going to have to come to terms with that.



Why even hold an election in Russia if votes don't decide the outcome? Same answer. Its a show.



Trans people lost the right to join the military, until the ban was repealed last year. Various state governors have signed bills banning trans kids from involvement in athletics, or barring them from using appropriate bathrooms. There have also been several motions to allow discrimination against gay customers if its on religious grounds.


^ aaaand over 670 bills aimed at restricting or removing LGBT+ rights or protections have been filed since 2018. And that number is rising precipitously; over 300 were in 2022 alone.



Except Dem voters overwhelmingly support same sex marriage, and Dem justices in the SCOTUS also supported Obergefell, whereas Republican justices didn't.
A major plank of the single justice's opinion was not that other things like gay marriage need to be reexamined.

It's a show in America too...

So there is no ban on trans military? So they have that right it looks like. Athletics is based on sex, not gender. Stores have always been allowed to discriminate based on anything, it's private property, they can tell you to leave because you have on jorts if they want. Again, what rights, just sounds like they might not be able to use the bathroom they want... and like where is that actually gonna be enforced...?

And dems vote on things that majorly help gay people? Because they actually don't vote on such things.


I'm very willing to say that there is Liberal hypocrisy. Eg. Affirmative Action didn't stop Liberals looking down on minorities when they were picked and started entering schools/colleges

Also, Johnny Harris has done a lot of hypocrisy. In fact, most of his videos since he ventured out on his own.
Here's another one...

When you actually look at what dem policy has done, it's caused a lot of inequality. Red states have more overall equality than blue states.
 

Casual Shinji

Should've gone before we left.
Legacy
Jul 18, 2009
19,605
4,412
118
Because you all hand wave away all the bad policies the dems put into place, their policies create more inequality than the right's.
First of all, no. Secondly, most people here aren't really fans of democrates either since they're just as much in the pockets of corporations as republicans are.

And it's cute you keep saying this, seeing as half of US citizens rights have been taken away by the Right just two months ago. No, scratch that, it's not cute, it's fucking sad.
 

tstorm823

Elite Member
Legacy
Aug 4, 2011
6,484
928
118
Country
USA
Secondly, most people here aren't really fans of democrates either
It doesn't help much if you resent a party while believing every word they say about their opposition. It'd be like saying "I'm not really a fan of Russia, but I heard Ukraine is run by nazis."
 

TheMysteriousGX

Elite Member
Legacy
Sep 16, 2014
8,316
6,822
118
Country
United States
Having prisoners work is not slavery.
He says, after saying that the 13th amendment is fine as it is, allowing for slavery as long as it's prisoners
You for covid vaccines, yes or no?
Yes, I am for the covid vaccine, fucking hell. I'm also for the polio vaccine, the MMR vaccine, the chicken pox vaccine, the tetanus vaccine, the HPV vaccine, all of the hepatitis vaccines, the flu vaccines, and any other vaccines not mentioned by name
Not everything a person let alone a political party does is fighting for their morals.
Hell of a backpedal
That's how things were at the time. Doing the best you can at the time is bad? If we can change 1 thing in healthcare now to make it better and help at least some people, should it not be done because there's still a lot wrong with healthcare?
Oh, we absolutely should. Just miss me with the "healthcare has always been fine, look we can change it" justification. "The best we could at the time" was "slavery is great, women and poor people shouldn't vote, and the natives are camping out on our land"
Again, the votes are based on arguments presented, not on the morality of something. It's not like someone went to the SC and said gay marriage should be allowed because of morals, they went up there with a legal argument. The SC is not the moral court. It's just like RBG said Roe was argued poorly and a different argument would be a lot more legally solid.
Which doesn't matter when 5/9ths of the court are ideologues who don't give a shit.
Reformed healthcare also helps gay people probably even more than gay marriage does. If you have the option to do Thing_A that helps 100 people and Thing_B that helps 10 people, which one do you think you should prioritize? It's not throwing Thing_B under the bus, it's just doing it at a later time.
Except when we already *have* Thing B, and you're willing to sacrifice it for...?
What stark differences? You mean like one's the face and one's the heel but they're playing the same game?
Well, there's this bit where in some states a 10 year old rape victim would need to stay pregnant until it almost kills them, even if it would cause permanent injury.
EDIT: Lmao, totally the same
Like said, you have to make a legal argument. You can't just go up to the SC and say slavery is bad and have them figure out for you that it's against the current laws.
So the 9th means nothing and you shouldn't've brought it up.
Because you all hand wave away all the bad policies the dems put into place, their policies create more inequality than the right's.
Lmao
So there is no ban on trans military? So they have that right it looks like.
...did you miss that whole legal fight?
Stores have always been allowed to discriminate based on anything, it's private property, they can tell you to leave because you have on jorts if they want.
And you've just invented the "No Blacks Allowed" sign, amazing.
 
Last edited: