US 2024 Presidential Election
- Thread starter gorfias
- Start date
You have my sword.
Then take heart in the fact that republicans are only strong because they tie their awful politics to a handful of popular (smart is debatable, but popular) policies to force people to vote for their shit. If these policies stand on their own, the awful shit, it fails. People (at least a majority) are in fact better, the electoral system we have is just incredibly shit.
Sadly it is precisely what happened. Already leaks from the campaign have come in saying that left shift around the convention and Walz got muzzled when the donors got skittish. Then they went with Mark Cuban and Liz Cheney, on demand of the donor class. They were literally paid to fail. I'm not sure if they knew it was going to doom the election and they didn't care, I can't read minds, but they did it.
You can't make them think it. This is a lesson that is demonstrated to them constantly, and one they refuse to take in. They are paid to not realize this.
The answer to that is yes, the Greens do do interviews and forums and all sorts of other content. And as you note, you didn't know. I suppose I could have posted more Stein/Ware things on here, which would indeed be smart, but then I'm just reaching the Escapist here. But people post these things across twitter and facebook and whatever else, but what breaks into the mainstream, what people see, are influencers boosting very specific content. Like cutting a small snippet of Ware's interview on a local radio station where he basically wanted to codify Roe v Wade, but the influencer labeled his message as asking for an abortion ban and then every dem influencer spread that link with that message, even though it was complete bullshit. The people who share green content have like a dozen followers, dem influencers have thousands, 6 or 7 digit follower counts. We are online, a lot of people are, a lot of people aren't, and more importantly the online social media environment is carefully curated to create echo chambers. Shit sucks, you still need mailers, as passé as they seem.
I'll tell you right now, I got a dozen mailers from Ted Cruz telling me how much of a communist Collin Allred is (I wish), but the only time I heard anything from Allred was on embedded youtube videos in discord. I saw or heard nothing from him otherwise. Apart from his message that he's a family value christian who will stand against the trans menace. Admittedly, I think he was hedging his bets and lying on that, but it's a bad look.
And dems are easy to blame for suppressing the greens when they quite literally litigate to suppress the greens.
I think that was twitter, which means we can officially blame Elon Musk, even if it predates his takeover.
The dems inability to look in a mirror, and the electorate calling them out on it.
So first off, yes, obviously the whole "just better than Trump" shtick is a lame horse that already lost 2016, no arguments there. I also didn't say that*. And I will say that you donating money to local causes is genuinely amazing, and I wish I had spare time/money to do the same. Good on you, truly.
But yes I can say that, because as another straight white male with leftist views, I am in the same amount of danger as you, which is to say, not much (at the moment). Because for as much noise as conservatives make, the thought police don't actually exist yet, and so long as you can go without wearing a "Communism Is Great!" T-shirt or spontaneously shouting "Free Palestine!" while out walking, they aren't going to be able to pick you out of a crowd and go "He's a lefty, get him!", you know? Unlike anyone with skin darker than pasty white, holds hands with their SO, or even those who outwardly look like a woman, who have much easier to spot things that make it easier to persecute, you know?
Also, this whole "you don't care because it doesn't affect you" is wild, because which one of us has been sitting in here loudly going on and on about how they're above the trolley problem because of they're voting preference? Because guess the fuck what, you have just as much as responsibility to that lever as most of the people you're arguing with, because you're an American too! You share just as much anguish and fury that we will support Genocide and other cruel vicious acts just as you share the culpability for its continued existence, and that doesn't change because you cast a fucking ballot.
My God, your tone in this thread is less the demure tones of someone who donates their precious resources to help local causes and now will have to work harder, and more of a smug asshole taking a victory lap. For what, I could hardly begin to even imagine, because you literally cannot say that the Dems did terrible and the Greens didn't, not without looking insane. You keep up this "haha, look at all you assholes who didn't learn anything, sucks to suck." like you aren't riding in this exact same car, flying off this exact same cliff. Like, if you want to hold the DNC's failures (of which you have already stared they don't learn from) as being the fault of people here (especially the non-Americans, Jesus), then do we get to hold you responsible for the Greens not being able to pick up 80 million votes?
Because guess what? I voted for the Pro-Genocide candidate. That is my shame and burden to bear as someone who does care about the Genocide (because empathy and the cruel destruction of a people indeed fills me with anguish too), because I'm also left with the disgusting but real blood calculus that, in an emergency situation, you put your own oxygen mask on first. The only thing harder than saving one drowning person, is trying to save two. And no, I do no at all think that the DNC would somehow save us, far from it, it's just that, for those who sure seem to still believe in the power of democracy and civic power deep down, I feel like we could have at least tried bandaging the wound before moving right to the hacksaw. And yes, I know that this usually doesn't work, but it's either the Dems (which as above, usually doesn't work) or the Republicans (which never works).
But, I don't have the luxury of being able to vote fully with my conscious, because it's not just me out here. I have four sisters, and even my mom (who seems to be the prototypical conservative woman these days, right down to "God put me here to keep my husband's house and rear his kids") to also worry about, two of which are currently engaged to Latino men, whose status as EDIT: *American* citizens won't matter much when Arpaio's old deputy takes charge with express permission to harass anyone who looks "illegal". Hell, I'm barely keeping my own goddamn head above the rocky waves of depression, much less do more than cling to what little hope I have left that voting and democracy in general still work to try and stave off what seems like a forgone conclusion.
Please don't take any of this as an attack, or even arguing really. It's mainly just a plea for you to try and just, slow your roll for a moment. This holier than though attitude, and this whole persecuted martyr complex you have where you act like the only person burdened with empathy shtick is wearing thin, and causing all of us to bicker and waste time while these right wing cunts run away from us. Especially trying to pin wanting to burn this shit down out of lack of concern on others when you've already stated that you both think the US should probably burn/will burn anyway,
and then try and add fucking qualifiers to it
*Like, if you get to sit here and try and draw distinctions around how your burning everything down is totally different than Trumps, than I get to draw one around the fact that "one evil being worse than another doesn't make one lesser or invalidate them altogether".
Edit: I will also point out, as a measure towards me not wanting to fight, that I do look like an abject clown coming into a thread already 2,000 posts deep and try and moderate, especially pretty much one side it seems, so my bad there.
Last edited:
I hope so, because being stuck out here for so long and hear none stop guff is getting too much, I'll tell you what.
Oh no, I knew that had happened (Harris/Walz being muzzled and a shift right-off a cliff), that was mainly about the thought of leftists intentionally voting for Trump to spite the Dems (like they need help losing, lol).
Yeah, it just sucks.
OK, so first this is all reasonable and I do agree, but I must again point out this weird notion that influencers who would follow someone who distorts something to that extent are either Dems, or that their followers would be the types of votes sought after. Worse still, is that I don't know whether or not I've just been around my insane parents too long or purely from my point of ignorance and my own personal 'vibes', but I can't help but feel like the Greens underperform to a degree bordering on them being a 'fix', you know? Like, we accept that the Dems are obviously being paid to fail, but that those people paying them to fail aren't also paying them to maintain an outwardly anti-left nature to a corrupt degree, or even fund and create their own party to further the evil corrupt left narrative? Are we really going to sit here and say that an organization, who's sole purpose is put politicians into elected office, just doesn't know how to file their own paperwork, and just so happens to coincidently need to be shown how by the very party they would be ostensibly running against, and both just happen to be the only remotely left wing parties on the ballot?
I can't help but feel like the call is coming from inside the house at times, you know? But again, this is my ignorant ass blowing bubbles in the tub, so I'm (hopefully) wrong.
Trump has said that Tom Homan, former acting director of ICE and an author of Project 2025, will be in control of borders and deportations in Trump's administration.
Homan at the Convention: “Trump comes back in January, I’ll be on his heels coming back, and I will run the biggest deportation force this country has ever seen.”
Homan at the Convention: “Trump comes back in January, I’ll be on his heels coming back, and I will run the biggest deportation force this country has ever seen.”
To take this aside all the way to the station, I also propose adding whomever thought that Discord should replace forums to this shoelace King of Rats with the other two, and then use that sword to slap the shit out of all three of them.
So I guess we can expect an uptick in women getting their tubes tied, seeing as the "barbaric" nature of abortion and "sanctity" of life completely overrides their safety, which I'm sure won't cause the Republicans to take steps in banning that procedure as well.
I dread visiting family.
Oh that part, yeah. I don't know. On the one hand it is up there in counterproductive moves, but on the other it means that vote count is transient. But in any case, I don't know.
In that specific instance of faulty paperwork, they were actually supposed to be told by the government officials that they had submitted paperwork incorrectly (which I can't fault, I've failed to government paperwork before), but the officials simply didn't tell them. The Greens didn't know they failed to paperwork until it was too late. But in general, there are problems with the Greens, true. But if I'm going to spend time to help build up a party, I'm going to spend that time on a party I actually want to build up. Even if we reach the point where we accept both are captured by capital, that just means we discard the Dems anyway and focus on fixing the Greens. I don't think the Greens are, I think they're chronically underfunded and run by volunteers who may make more mistakes than the lawyers the big boys can pay for, but even if we accept that as true, that doesn't pull me back to the Dems.
Try living with them (though once again, I am truly sorry, this shit is straight all bad no good)
Me neither dude.
OK, but see, which one is most likely, that the entire DNC conspired to jam up this paperwork, that they paid off the clerk or whomever was in charge of this to do so, or (honestly most likely) that an overworked government employee in an understaffed department simply did what government in general is wont to do and took to long to notice the mistake and unfortunately just happened to be for something that would hit the news this time?
Because again, as a fellow believer in civic power, I wouldn't want you to. You should have a party that represents you and the power to change it should it fail to meet those ideals, hell even conservatives too (provided they don't use the power to do stupid shit), and what I wouldn't give to get some ranked voting and parliamentary style 12 different parties in office and such, it's just that it would be remiss of me not to point out the folly in trying to blame the entirety of the Green Party performance up to now on some huge orchestrated effort to keep them out of power, both in its uselessness to help the party grow and in its gross parallel to what the right keeps saying is happening to them. Like I said, I voted for Stein back in '16, and I'd be happy to vote Green again at some point when it all isn't so fraught (as bad as that does sound).
That'd be wonderful, but I absolutely reject the notion either is Fring. Both Hector. Who White tho?
You might notice a pattern with all of my "holier than though" posts. They're all done in response to people telling me I have to vote for the Pro-Genocide candidate because otherwise the other Pro-Genocide candidate will win.
I've said repeatedly that while I wouldn't vote for Harris, I understand why others would be willing to but if people are still going to come at me, I have zero issues throwing hands right back. If people don't want me to punch back, they should stop throwing punches at me because I have zero qualms about matching energy.
As soon as you show me how voting Harris stopped the bombs
Sorry to relitigate, but that simply isn't true. I never told you that. I said over and again your choice was principled and rational. You told me that I was supporting genocide anyway.
I told you the same thing I told all Harris supporters
You might not be a racist if you vote for Trump but Racism is clearly not a deal breaker for you
You might not be Pro-Genocide if you vote for Harris but Genocide is clearly not a deal breaker for you
If it's a fair enough line to use on Republicans, it's a fair enough line to use on Democrats
Which is all the same holier-than-thou stuff. So it wasn't just in response to people telling you you have to vote a certain way. It was directed towards anyone voting outside the 0.4%, even tactically.