Amber Guyger has been found GUILTY

[aegix drakan_v1legacy]

I was bemused to see that the defence attempted to use the Castle Doctrine - that a homeowner has a right to kill an intruder - on the grounds that if she genuinely (even if mistaken) thought that was her flat, she had a right to lethal force. It would have been intolerably ironic, so I'm glad to see that it didn't work.

I ju-

They-

Bu-

Like...I'm still appalled just thinking that the defense even TRIED that. It's a completely insane argument if you stop and think about the implications for about 2 seconds!

That said...I'm honestly shocked that total malarkey didn't end up working, in this completely upside-down world we live in.

 

[Saelune]

That story is just too fishy for me. There had to have been something shady going on there, nobody can be this dumb.

Either way, good thing that she's going away. Lock your doors.

when this first happened it was reported she was drunk. The police department determined on their own she wasnt. So maybe they swept it under the rug, so no one looks into drinking on the job and drunk driving police.

Either way color me surprised. I totally expected her to get off. Makes me wonder though if a white Male officer would have been found guilty? And I say that as a white Male- it's interesting the cop found guilty was a woman.

I am surprised you made this point before I could.

I am absolutely glad she got punished, but I do think that male cop after male cop is not punished, but this woman not given the same treatment?

 

[Dreiko_v1legacy]

That story is just too fishy for me. There had to have been something shady going on there, nobody can be this dumb.

Either way, good thing that she's going away. Lock your doors.

when this first happened it was reported she was drunk. The police department determined on their own she wasnt. So maybe they swept it under the rug, so no one looks into drinking on the job and drunk driving police.

Either way color me surprised. I totally expected her to get off. Makes me wonder though if a white Male officer would have been found guilty? And I say that as a white Male- it's interesting the cop found guilty was a woman.

I am surprised you made this point before I could.

I am absolutely glad she got punished, but I do think that male cop after male cop is not punished, but this woman not given the same treatment?

No if anything a male would be punished harsher. It's documented that women get something like half as severe sentences for the same crime as men do.

 

[Silvanus]

It's documented that women get something like half as severe sentences for the same crime as men do.

I'd like to see that documentation please.

 

[Exley97_v1legacy]

I suppose some things from Guyger's testimony did not stand up under scrutiny and the jury agreed premeditation was the only explanation for their actions.

Not her testimony -- her texts and social media. Take a look at some of things she texted to other officers about blacks. When you start a message with "I'm not racist but..." then you're probably racist. Also, some of the social media reflect an extremely cavalier attitude toward using force and shooting unarmed civilians, and that's putting it in the best possible terms. I've seen some folks defending Guyer by saying that stuff was all "cowboy" or tough guy locker room talk that was made in jest -- which is horseshit, because she unfortunately lived up to those exact attitudes with her actions.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2019/10/02/amber-guyger-offensive-texts-botham-jean-murder/

I was bemused to see that the defence attempted to use the Castle Doctrine - that a homeowner has a right to kill an intruder - on the grounds that if she genuinely (even if mistaken) thought that was her flat, she had a right to lethal force. It would have been intolerably ironic, so I'm glad to see that it didn't work.

Radley Balko, who covers criminal justice for the Washington Post and has written books about law enforcement abuse, has studied 15 years worth of cases involving the Castle Doctrine and said he couldn't ever remember a case where a judge even *ALLOWED* a defendant to use that position when they were mistakenly in the wrong home. In this case, however, she was. I don't think it's a coincidence, given the defendant was a cop.

 

[ObsidianJones_v1legacy]

I am absolutely glad she got punished, but I do think that male cop after male cop is not punished, but this woman not given the same treatment?

I've completely thought this was going to be a case of "She's going away" the second she broke down.

In fact, this feels slated against her from the get-go.

If she appeared hard and calculated, she would have turned off others like Hillary. Her 'unfeminine manner' would have turned people against her.

If she broke down (which she did), she would appear unready for the streets. A typical 'weak willed' woman who lost control of the situation and got overwhelmed.

This is Denzel Washington getting an Oscar for Training Day. The award committee would never give it to him for Malcolm X. For Heavens, what message would that give?

So, they took a woman who looked like a wreck and who wasn't on duty, and gave it to us as a gift. Even though she was not doing anything in a professional police capacity, the next time a police officer guns down an innocent and/or unarmed black person and is not convicted of anything... I bet you they will mention Guyger with the quickness, saying that cops do go to jail when there is fault.

As an added side bonus, female recruits can be held to a higher standard because "We don't need another Guyger here". Forcing new female recruits and officers to suffer in silence because of they carry the burden of every loss and mistake as one due to a shared Gender.

 

[Abomination]

I suppose some things from Guyger's testimony did not stand up under scrutiny and the jury agreed premeditation was the only explanation for their actions.

Not her testimony -- her texts and social media. Take a look at some of things she texted to other officers about blacks. When you start a message with "I'm not racist but..." then you're probably racist. Also, some of the social media reflect an extremely cavalier attitude toward using force and shooting unarmed civilians, and that's putting it in the best possible terms. I've seen some folks defending Guyer by saying that stuff was all "cowboy" or tough guy locker room talk that was made in jest -- which is horseshit, because she unfortunately lived up to those exact attitudes with her actions.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2019/10/02/amber-guyger-offensive-texts-botham-jean-murder/

I prefer evidence pertaining to the actions on the day than social media history. I think the severe inebriation angle is the only defense against murder, but if that was thrown into doubt then murder is the only possible verdict to be reached. Complicating factor is how inebriated Guyger was, if they were just buzzed and so threw away basic inhibitions - or were they a razor's edge from blacked out (hah).

 

[ObsidianJones_v1legacy]

I prefer evidence pertaining to the actions on the day than social media history. I think the severe inebriation angle is the only defense against murder, but if that was thrown into doubt then murder is the only possible verdict to be reached. Complicating factor is how inebriated Guyger was, if they were just buzzed and so threw away basic inhibitions - or were they a razor's edge from blacked out (hah).

She wasn't intoxicated at all [https://ktla.com/2019/09/24/dallas-officer-accused-of-killing-neighbor-had-no-drugs-or-alcohol-in-system-detectives-testifies/].

A white Dallas police officer who fatally shot her black neighbor in his apartment last year had no drugs or alcohol in her system at the time, a police detective testified Tuesday.

Detective Eddie Ibarra's testimony during the second day of Amber Guyger's murder trial marked the first time her toxicology results have been publicly revealed.

 

[aegix drakan_v1legacy]

So, they took a woman who looked like a wreck and who wasn't on duty, and gave it to us as a gift. Even though she was not doing anything in a professional police capacity, the next time a police officer guns down an innocent and/or unarmed black person and is not convicted of anything... I bet you they will mention Guyger with the quickness, saying that cops do go to jail when there is fault.

As an added side bonus, female recruits can be held to a higher standard because "We don't need another Guyger here". Forcing new female recruits and officers to suffer in silence because of they carry the burden of every loss and mistake as one due to a shared Gender.

Yeah, this seems to be the most likely scenario.

 

[Dreiko_v1legacy]

It's documented that women get something like half as severe sentences for the same crime as men do.

I'd like to see that documentation please.

https://www.law.umich.edu/newsandinfo/features/Pages/starr_gender_disparities.aspx

 

[Saelune]

That story is just too fishy for me. There had to have been something shady going on there, nobody can be this dumb.

Either way, good thing that she's going away. Lock your doors.

when this first happened it was reported she was drunk. The police department determined on their own she wasnt. So maybe they swept it under the rug, so no one looks into drinking on the job and drunk driving police.

Either way color me surprised. I totally expected her to get off. Makes me wonder though if a white Male officer would have been found guilty? And I say that as a white Male- it's interesting the cop found guilty was a woman.

I am surprised you made this point before I could.

I am absolutely glad she got punished, but I do think that male cop after male cop is not punished, but this woman not given the same treatment?

No if anything a male would be punished harsher. It's documented that women get something like half as severe sentences for the same crime as men do.

They get to throw a cop under the bus to help PR and they get rid of a woman who is trying to do a 'man's job'.

We're talking cops here, not regular criminals.

 

[Dreiko_v1legacy]

That story is just too fishy for me. There had to have been something shady going on there, nobody can be this dumb.

Either way, good thing that she's going away. Lock your doors.

when this first happened it was reported she was drunk. The police department determined on their own she wasnt. So maybe they swept it under the rug, so no one looks into drinking on the job and drunk driving police.

Either way color me surprised. I totally expected her to get off. Makes me wonder though if a white Male officer would have been found guilty? And I say that as a white Male- it's interesting the cop found guilty was a woman.

I am surprised you made this point before I could.

I am absolutely glad she got punished, but I do think that male cop after male cop is not punished, but this woman not given the same treatment?

No if anything a male would be punished harsher. It's documented that women get something like half as severe sentences for the same crime as men do.

They get to throw a cop under the bus to help PR and they get rid of a woman who is trying to do a 'man's job'.

We're talking cops here, not regular criminals.

Is being a cop a man's job? First time I hear that lol. I don't know of anyone in this day and age who'd really think that.

 

[Abomination]

I prefer evidence pertaining to the actions on the day than social media history. I think the severe inebriation angle is the only defense against murder, but if that was thrown into doubt then murder is the only possible verdict to be reached. Complicating factor is how inebriated Guyger was, if they were just buzzed and so threw away basic inhibitions - or were they a razor's edge from blacked out (hah).

She wasn't intoxicated at all [https://ktla.com/2019/09/24/dallas-officer-accused-of-killing-neighbor-had-no-drugs-or-alcohol-in-system-detectives-testifies/].

A white Dallas police officer who fatally shot her black neighbor in his apartment last year had no drugs or alcohol in her system at the time, a police detective testified Tuesday.

Detective Eddie Ibarra's testimony during the second day of Amber Guyger's murder trial marked the first time her toxicology results have been publicly revealed.

Well, there ya go. Murder.

Death sentence seems a bit redundant now, surviving prison will be difficult.

 

[Smithnikov_v1legacy]

Wonder where the usual /pol/ crowd is? I figured Anonymous, Steven Crowder, and the rest of the usual suspects would be lobbying hard to get this woman off the hook or giving her a medal like they did with Anders Brevik.

Wait, they tried to get that brevik asshole, off?

Yep, they lobbied for him to get a medal and considers him a hero.

 

[ObsidianJones_v1legacy]

I saw a youtube video about Botham's brother, Brandt, and how he forgave Amber and hugged her [https://www.cnn.com/2019/10/02/us/botham-jean-brother-amber-guyger-hug/index.html].

I have a problem with him doing it. And that's my biggest problem of all. That I have any issues of him forgiving.

You see, even when we have to forgive, we forgive as a monolith.

I have a brother. I dislike him greatly. He saddled me with my parents when they both had strokes and was more concerned about his life than helping us out. I hate him. And I would never forgive his killer so quickly and so publicly as Brandt did. Thinking about it, I can't say I'll never forgive. But it would take a lot. A-fucking-lot.

And honestly, Brandt is spiritual and he might find strength in doing this. He might even think this is what Botham wanted him to do. and while I can't wrap my head around it, I as an individual can make peace with it.

But my issue is this. Almost every perceived action of a few in the black community echoes within all of us to non-blacks. We all play basketball because of the popular perception. We all are thugs because they have seen people wear some clothing and assumed that those people were thugs. We all love Orange soda because... you know, I just realized I don't know why people think that. Doesn't everyone who drinks soda like orange soda?

Anyway, that's what's killing me. Because this very public and very controversial trial, everyone is looking for some type of hallmark or rubric to understand and figure out how we're going to proceed next as a society with these race relations. I'm afraid that people will look at Brandt's forgiveness and expect it over and over again. Because this will happen again. More 'mistakes'. More 'horrible tragedies'.

As it is, there's little understanding on why black people take to the streets to protest unjust police shootings. There are people in this world who legitimately don't get why Blacks get so upset that another unarmed or nonthreatening black man (usually) was shot down. Some people honestly think blacks make a big deal about these constant shootings. Now, we have Brandt's example and I can just feel people ready to run to it the second the next shooting comes up and while we're mobilizing a protest, someone on some right-wing show will tell them to calm down and handle it like Brandt.

And this is what Vexes me about his actions. As an individual human being, I am humbled and in awe of someone doing something like that. As a black man, I realize we're never individuals. And I can see this action being used against us. And I hate that I have to think in 4d chess anytime there's a black person in media doing anything. And I super hate that I have to judge someone's healing process because I know it will have ramifications for all of us.

 

[Dreiko_v1legacy]

Forgiveness is just a Christian thing as opposed to a race thing. It's how we prevented blood feuds back in the day. Not sure it's all that relevant nowadays with a functional criminal justice system. I genuinely don't think anything of that and since having grown up in a 99% orthodox Christian society I see not forgiving someone as the first step down a dark path of obsession and resentment that will only really harm you in the end.

Forgiving is less "this person that did this bad thing is now cool with me" and more " I will not obsessively make my life from now on revolve around this horrible thing done to me". It's really about saving your own heart from hatred, not about making a killer feel better.

 

[Worgen]

Wonder where the usual /pol/ crowd is? I figured Anonymous, Steven Crowder, and the rest of the usual suspects would be lobbying hard to get this woman off the hook or giving her a medal like they did with Anders Brevik.

Wait, they tried to get that brevik asshole, off?

Yep, they lobbied for him to get a medal and considers him a hero.

Are you sure? I mean, I can see them doing that, but that's what makes me distrust it. It seems too... cartoonish.

 

[Batou667]

Wonder where the usual /pol/ crowd is? I figured Anonymous, Steven Crowder, and the rest of the usual suspects would be lobbying hard to get this woman off the hook or giving her a medal like they did with Anders Brevik.

Wait, they tried to get that brevik asshole, off?

Yep, they lobbied for him to get a medal and considers him a hero.

Are you sure? I mean, I can see them doing that, but that's what makes me distrust it. It seems too... cartoonish.

Yeah, that never happened. Smithnikov is just making unsubstantiated mutterings that reinforce his/her preconceptions.

Certain far, FAR right individuals along with trolls and shitposters may have made giving Breivik a medal into a short-lived meme. Without even Googling it I can assure you that Steven Crowder would not piss his reputation up the nearest wall by making those kind of "social media suicide" statements, nor would it match the spirit of anything he's previously said publicly. In Smithnikov's mind I expect Crowder and "the usual suspects" is a left-wing dogwhistle for an imagined amorphous mass of alt-Right boogeymen. Sorry to disappoint but even anti-Islamist, anti-immigration conservatives want nothing to do with Breivik.

 

[Trunkage]

Wonder where the usual /pol/ crowd is? I figured Anonymous, Steven Crowder, and the rest of the usual suspects would be lobbying hard to get this woman off the hook or giving her a medal like they did with Anders Brevik.

Wait, they tried to get that brevik asshole, off?

Yep, they lobbied for him to get a medal and considers him a hero.

Are you sure? I mean, I can see them doing that, but that's what makes me distrust it. It seems too... cartoonish.

I thought he asked for a medal

 

[Agema]

I saw a youtube video about Botham's brother, Brandt, and how he forgave Amber and hugged her [https://www.cnn.com/2019/10/02/us/botham-jean-brother-amber-guyger-hug/index.html].

I have a problem with him doing it. And that's my biggest problem of all. That I have any issues of him forgiving.

If we are going to hold an individual to represent a wider group, we can also look at it from the point of view that forgiveness can signal that it's not necessarily some mindless vendetta against cops when they shoot people they shouldn't.

More simply, he has to be allowed to speak for himself; as I am aware he is just a person who has never asked to represent anyone else and that needs to be respected.