An Apology to Jon Finkel

[eels05]

This chick will probably start to get desperate in her mid thirties when the realization hits that her life isn't like an episope of 'Sex in the City'.
Then she'll probably settle for the first wanker that crawls along that fits her narrow definition of acceptable.

 

[BehattedWanderer]

Haters gonna Hate. Strut on, Jon Finkel, you god among godly men. She did you a favor, man--she revealed how shallow she was at the start, saving you time, money, and hope. There will be others, possibly even those who seek you out because of how big this story has gone, and would like a decent guy, but are amazing enough to realize that everyone has different interests. If she wants to be the emotionally judgmental equivalent of a high school sophomore, then let her find someone similar, that they might judge each other as much as they like.

Special thanks to Susan for starting this up, and to all the ladies who want to show that they have their geeky sides too, or at least support men who are unafraid to show theirs. You all are amazing.

 

[Formica Archonis]

That'll do it. I remember when my mom switched from smaller needles to larger ones because of problems with her hands. The next pair of wool slippers I got didn't fit so well!

And they were probably really thick, too. I hope she worked out the new gauge for your second pair.

Yeah, she handled it fine. She was nothing if not a quick learner. Still have 'em and their successors, though many are so close to disintegration from use that they're relegated to warm-fuzzy-memory symbols. Don't have the heart to wear the few good pairs either.:/

 

[Phantomess]

It's amusing to see how political one bad date gets, isn't it? I suppose there are always going to be people on both sides of the battlefield, which is what makes a healthy debate.

Gunboat, I'm not the dating police, nor do I agree with your viewpoint, but I respect your right to have it. I don't think my rage at this article is even really connected with the fact that I knew who Jon Finkel was prior to reading the article. It was just a demonstration of behaviour that I personally find reprehensible. To dismiss someone based on the fact that they are different reminds me of schoolyard bullying... and I can't stomach it.

I do, however, agree with you that everyone is entitled to be with the partner of their choice. I just don't believe that you should reject a person just because they do something different to you. That's my opinion. It is neither right nor wrong. But I support the idea of an apology - does everyone remember the little girl who was bullied for having a Star Wars lunch box? Good.

But I heartily congratulate you on the ability to inspire a healthy debate over gender roles. Good work!

 

[penthesilea180]

Who is this Alyssa and how can I send her *hate mail?


*By hate mail, I mean a strongly worded letter indicating that I disagree with her opinion...and some magic cards.

 

[LilithSlave]

Well it's a good thing I don't like to do nerdy things like play video games and post on internet forums, I might get shamed by some lady on a date.

Oh wait...

 

[GreyJedi]

Bravo, indeed. A well-written piece and a justified, polite outrage.

 

[GunboatDiplomat]

4. During my tenure at this site, The Escapist has won six Webby Awards and was named as one of Time's Best 50 Web Sites of the Year. Before joining The Escapist, I wrote for numerous publications including 1up and Wired. As one of the few female editors in this industry, I get plenty of recognition all by myself - I don't need to write about something controversial to increase my visibility, or pad traffic. I chose to call attention to this matter because it was something that mattered to me personally, for a variety of reasons. None of which, I can assure you, was sucking up to the male members of our audience.

Every few years in europe a few countries get to vote in a referendum relating to the European Union as it slowly changes our constitutions. Most of the time I vote No for a variety of reasons. Then I look at some of the other people who vote No - for quite different reasons. The religious right wing (such as it is in europe), various conservative, nationalist and even fascistic elements also vote No. Jean Marie Le-Pen and his Front National are big "Non" advocates most of the time.

I still vote No but I do stop and consider am I objectively doing the right thing? Perhaps the reasons I'm voting No aren't what I conciously consider. Or perhaps the effects of my voting No won't result in an outcome I desired.

 

[ImprovizoR]

I don't understand why people feel the need to apologize for other people's actions, but whatever.

 

[TokenRupee]

I find it rather ironic that people would look down on something like magic, but then they watch poker tournaments...

Not only that, but at least you're having to play smart in magic where as poker is usually just luck and how well you can bluff. Seriously, what did she want? To date some guy only interested in buying sports cars and showing them off so he can having admiration from his peers, but nothing concrete like tournament winnings in the form of cash?

Anyway, good article. Whether a woman harping on a man about it or vice versa, it's wrong either way.

 

[surg3n]

It'd be different if she wasn't such a fkn munter herself. It's almost like she has this list of traits that she needs in a man, but she's dating online because men who see her face to face, know her, and who 'tick all the boxes' are out of her league. Like that Carrie in Sex in the City with the face shaped like a pork chop - is that who she thinks she is!

Too many chick flicks have convinced too many average women that Hugh Grant or some other tosser is waiting for them. What is wrong with a honest bloke with a harmless hobby, moreover when you make $300,000 a year from it... it's ok Gawker, I'm sure Mr.Right is right around the corner, hitting on your better looking friends.

 

[Abedeus]

Wow, I read about this ***** few days ago, thought it was like "oh, so it probably happened what, months or years ago, whatever...", and it turns out it was recently?

Geez, I really lose track of time during summer.

 

[similar.squirrel]

Okay. I find the idea of spending hundreds of currencies on pieces of printed paper with dragons on them kind of pathetic, but this woman was out of line to a disgusting degree. It's gratifying to see how much shit she got for writing that, because she deserves every bit of it.

 

[WhiteandNeardy99]

Who... wait.... what?

No idea who any of them are, nor what's going on.

I second this, the names in that article mean nothing to me, not saying it's right just that I have no idea.

 

[Ken Sapp]

IT is useless to be ashamed for someone who doesn't appear to know the meaning of the word. I wish I had been able to find out the details without having to follow the links to the original Gawker article as I don't like supporting people like that and every unique IP that reads her article is going to be counted as a success.

People like her are the reason people like me tend to be lonely. They don't let things rest at "This is not going to work out", but rather feel the need to publicly humiliate those they don't like for their own amusement with no consideration for how that may affect the object of their ridicule. For myself, I have thankfully managed mature with a healthy sense of self (some may disagree) that is not based on the opinions of others. Unfortunately, many are not able to easily shrug off the words and opinions of those who denigrate them. She should never have been allowed to publish that article as it was. Any decent editor (and there is always someone in ultimate authority as to what is allowed to be published under a brand) should have at a minimum made her rewrite it to protect the identity of her unfortunate date. He may not have treated her to the most romantic experience but nothing described deserved the vitriol she wrote towards him (personally I consider a play based on J Dahmer's life to be poor taste but not worthy of social castration).

I am glad to see other women stepping up to denounce her actions and remind us that not all of them are sadistic psychos. It is a good thing to remember that in general the extreme minority which acts badly tends to receive all of the attention, thus coloring our perceptions of the entire group.

 

[GunboatDiplomat]

I did indeed give it the attention it deserved, because you are blowing this article out of proportion and looking a larger issue that, while associated, isn't the point. This article is a tongue-in-cheek "apology" by the "women of nerdom" to a guy (who is a nerd king in his own right) who was essentially baited and used by a morally bankrupt woman so that she could write, in a very public way, what she billed an expose on OkCupid. What she did was wrong. Period. The end. She publicly humiliated a man for his hobby, one which several women who are part of this site happen to like and respect, and gave his name so that other women could beware (or something). In actuality I couldn't care less that this is happening between a woman and a man, it could be happening to two men, two women, or two ponies, and it'd still be wrong (though the ponies would be interesting).

The larger issues of sexism in the gaming industry and women hating/bashing are indeed relevant issues, and very serious ones. Issues that are close to my heart in fact. But that doesn't take away from the fact that this journalist (who by the way, happens to be a woman) did something very wrong and unprofessional in a public forum. Worse of all, she happened to do it to one of "our own". We too (Susan et. all) have a public forum. So guess what? We're calling her out on her shitty behavior. You may agree or disagree (probably the later) but quite frankly, she doesn't get a pass because women have been wronged far more than men.

You honestly don't think your adjectives are a bit over the top? "Public humiliation" "Morally bankrupt" "unprofessional"?

How on earth is Alyssa being unprofessional as a journalist. Journalists write about their own experiences all the time. Sometimes they change names, sometimes they don't. If its a celebrity they usually don't. Did she lie about any aspect of the date or Jon? No. Did she make derogatory comments, true or otherwise? No. Is it Pulitzer prize winning material? Hardly.

"Morally bankrupt" Woah woah. Colonel Gadaffi is morally bankrupt, Shell is considered, by some, to be morally bankrupt. Bernie Madoff, Conrad Black, theres no shortage of people who are morally bankrupt. What version of morality if you consider a harmless aricle about a minor celebrity to be in the same league as Bernie Madoff? How would you describe, in moral terms, Bernie Madoff now that you've used up that phrase? Morally genocidal? I'm no fan of Bernie Madoff but that might be going a bit far.

"Public humiliation" Alyssa did NOT humiliate this guy. All she did was tell the truth about his hobby, publicly. Of course he was embarrassed by this because, well its an embarrassing hobby in most peoples eyes, at least at that level. Yet he doesn't hide it, good for him. I was a runner up in a D&D competition in Reading a few years ago. I still love to game. Not something I bring up on a first date. Duh.

 

[GunboatDiplomat]

It's amusing to see how political one bad date gets, isn't it? I suppose there are always going to be people on both sides of the battlefield, which is what makes a healthy debate.

Gunboat, I'm not the dating police, nor do I agree with your viewpoint, but I respect your right to have it. I don't think my rage at this article is even really connected with the fact that I knew who Jon Finkel was prior to reading the article. It was just a demonstration of behaviour that I personally find reprehensible. To dismiss someone based on the fact that they are different reminds me of schoolyard bullying... and I can't stomach it.

I do, however, agree with you that everyone is entitled to be with the partner of their choice. I just don't believe that you should reject a person just because they do something different to you. That's my opinion. It is neither right nor wrong. But I support the idea of an apology - does everyone remember the little girl who was bullied for having a Star Wars lunch box? Good.

But I heartily congratulate you on the ability to inspire a healthy debate over gender roles. Good work!

Well its certainly dificult for the bad date to stay apolitical when it unleashes so much misogyny. And despite Susan Arendt's belated appeal for knocking off that crap it just keeps on coming:

It'd be different if she wasn't such a fkn munter herself. It's almost like she has this list of traits that she needs in a man, but she's dating online because men who see her face to face, know her, and who 'tick all the boxes' are out of her league. Like that Carrie in Sex in the City with the face shaped like a pork chop - is that who she thinks she is!

Too many chick flicks have convinced too many average women that Hugh Grant or some other tosser is waiting for them. What is wrong with a honest bloke with a harmless hobby, moreover when you make $300,000 a year from it... it's ok Gawker, I'm sure Mr.Right is right around the corner, hitting on your better looking friends.

But of course it keeps on coming. The anger about Alyssa's article is driven by her daring to reject a man.

Consider if Alyssa was a male journalist and "he" wrote an article about a date with a woman who although she seemed pleasant enough and wasn't bad looking had the biggest doll collection in the world. Does she still play with dolls? Yes (Strike 1). How often? This coming weekend, all weekend (strike 2). Who does she hang out with? She met all of her friends through doll collecting activities (Strike 3). yada yada yada not going to date this woman and will google the hell out of the next one!

Could you imagine a shitstorm of abuse hitting such a journalist? Hardly. Doll enthusiasts know their hobby is not respected unless its very casual indeed. Hardcore doll collectors are creepy. Ok my analogy is imperfect. Not everyone shares my perspective of dolls being inherently creepy. Some sick bastards probably find it a turn-on. Brrrr!(whereas my foot fetish on the other hand is a perfectly reasonable turn on). Likewise with gaming, our hobby is not respected unless its casual. Otherwise, many, even most people find it creepy.

She could have been nasty about this. She could have called him a loser, living in moms basement at 40, small willy, socially inept, smelly, dirty, no dress sense - in other words she could have used a fraction of the vitriol directed at her.

Instead she called herself shallow for not getting over this and made a couple of mild jokes. Alyssa made NOT A SINGLE derogatory comment about Jon other than she was creeped out by his gaming.

 

[Slycne]

Instead she called herself shallow for not getting over this and made a couple of mild jokes. Alyssa made NOT A SINGLE derogatory comment about Jon other than she was creeped out by his gaming.

No she did, it's just been mostly edited out of the .com version. Here's most of what's been edited or omitted.

I actually think there's an interesting article to be had in this experience about what are the modern societal expectations of disclosure, but this really is simply unprofessional.

This is what happens, I thought, when you lie in your online profile. I was lured on a date thinking I?d met a normal finance guy, only to realise he was a champion dweeb in hedge funder?s clothing.

I later found out that he infiltrated his way into OKCupid dates with at least two other people I sort of know, including one of my co-workers. Mothers, warn your daughters! This could happen to you. You?ll think you?ve found a normal bearded guy with a job, only to end up sharing goat cheese with a world champion of nerds.

But if everyone stopped lying in their profiles, maybe there also wouldn?t be quite as many OKCupid horror stories to tell.

So what did I learn? Google the shit out of your next online date. Like, hardcore. Also, for all you world famous nerds out there: Don?t go after two Gawker Media employees and not expect to have a post written about you. We live for this kind of stuff.

http://www.gizmodo.com.au/2011/08/my-okcupid-affair-with-a-world-champion-magic-the-gathering-player

 

[LilithSlave]

I agree GunboatDiplomat, that people on the internet are too prone to using any excuse to saying misogynist things.

And no matter how stupid and typical "nerd suppression" of society at large this is, it doesn't excuse misogynist responses. On the other hand, the negative backlash is because of just that, people getting sick of stereotypical "nerd bashing" in 2011. People, nerds in particular, aren't going to allow for something like playing a card game that just happens to be about fantasy to tear down someone and shame and stigmatize them in front of the world anymore. This might have slid in 90s TV, but not on the 2011 internet.

 

[Yureina]

Narf

If you please, add me to that list as well. Twitter is @Yureina