Autumn, a game about rape

Darknacht

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NuclearKangaroo said:
Revnak said:
NuclearKangaroo said:
as for the game personally i think its a bad idea, first of all, as a game the idea doesnt sound entertaining in the slightest,
First, that's just like, your opinion man. Also, why do games have to be entertaining in a traditional sense?
i dont know, does a plane need to fly?

games are a mean of entertainment, their only purpose is to entertain
Serious movies also are not movies and serious book are not books, people need to understand that all serious artsy fartsy stuff needs to have their own names.
 

NuclearKangaroo

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Revnak said:
I know that games are an artform, that other artforms have addressed this, and that other artforms also started out as entertainment first and foremost. If you want games to be nothing more than entertainment, then go live your close minded life, but don't humor yourself into thinking you actually have an argument to support that.
other artforms remain entertainment, nobody watches movies to be bored, nobody plays games to be bored

ok ill go sit and live closed minded in my huge pile of fun, atleast i wont be bored out of my skull thinking that you have to be an art conossieur to enjoy video games, also

"but don't humor yourself into thinking you actually have an argument to support that"

what an amazing way to finish your paragraph, nothing says open minded like "shut up, you are not right, you will never be right"

Revnak said:
I've watched my friend play a good deal of it. Pretty certain that most of that can be done with just lighting effects. Further, I really don't see why all other games which are going for a minimalist artstyle need to look like anti-chamber. This game is trying to use it's visuals to portray alienation and depression (I presume) and bleached out visuals with faceless people does an excellent job of that.
one game shows a representation of non-eucliden 3D space, the other has no textures, guess which is which

"This game is trying to use it's visuals to portray alienation and depression (I presume) and bleached out visuals with faceless people does an excellent job of that."

so you dont even know why if the minimalist art style has a reason to be, you just assume its brilliant?


Revnak said:
yes the game was utterly simplistic

in fact, i think you could port it into text adventure format, theres no problem solving or reflex skills involved, no time limit, and the final outcome is merely the result of a few A, B, C or D decisions you make

all the wandering around in first person, is just filler, there isnt even a lot of interaction going on

Revnak said:
Good job misrepresenting what I was saying. And given that I am also a software engineer (working towards it at the very least), I am pretty aware of what a fucking algorithm is. I was saying that the rule that games must have goals is an artificial one, one you just made up, one without purpose.
so the idea of giving purpose to a game is without purpose?

are you aware of what you are saying?

Revnak said:
No. To a degree, in that they could understand how it makes survivors feel. No.
wow, ok youll have to provide me with some evidence if you actually want to support such ridiculous claim

i think the fact rape IS A FREAKIN' CRIME and nobody seems to have a problem with it staying that way, im inclined to believe people in general, think rape is not good

people cannot truthly understand how a rape victim feels, not without experiencing it themselves

Revnak said:
Given that you seem convinced that all games must exist for entertainment first and foremost, yes, you really aren't giving them credit.
just because i think planes should fly first and foremost doesnt mean i dont give planes credit for what they can accomplish

Revnak said:
They can, to some degree or another. They can definitely help.
no it doesnt work that way, we are aware is not real, thats why we cant fully relate to being raped

Revnak said:
And if a person who experiences those things wants to try and relate those feelings, is it some entirely futile endeavor? Is man so inherently alien to man that empathy is functionally impossible? No.
i dont have to understand entirely how you feel in order to feel bad for you, when you are feeling depressed, vulnerable, scared or alone, those are basic feelings people can relate to because most people have felt them at one time or another, when someone we care for is feeling sad, we can relate to that and we know thats not something we desire for the people we care for

Revnak said:
A fact I am acutely aware of thank you very much. I don't need your help to know that. It doesn't change the fact that I would like others to understand how such a thing feels, at least for a short time. It doesn't change the fact that I would like my own experiences to be understood. I want to reach out to people. I want to speak to someone. And so I will defend the idea of someone else doing likewise.
im not calling the game to be banned, im saying its a terrile game and it will fail, theres a difference

Revnak said:
Talking about an entirely human experience, attempting to relate it, that cannot be, in any shape, way, or form, pretentious.
yes it is, when you think your empathy and understanding can break all barries and extend to things you have never ever experienced in your life, you are incredibly pretentious

Revnak said:
It just isn't. And I refuse to let my personal experiences be relegated to side stories and minor characters for the sake of your low-brow thoughtlessness. What I have lived through is not pretentious. What I have dealt with is not pretentious. It was human. It was life. And you will never convince me that any effort I or anyone else may make to relate such circumstances is "pretentious." You will never make me believe that it is too irrelatable, too thoughtful, too emotional, too painful. Because I was fucking there. I lived through it. And I know what it was. And I will not be silent for your sake, nor should anyone else.
i present you

suicide guy, a suicide simulator

 

NuclearKangaroo

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Darknacht said:
NuclearKangaroo said:
Revnak said:
NuclearKangaroo said:
as for the game personally i think its a bad idea, first of all, as a game the idea doesnt sound entertaining in the slightest,
First, that's just like, your opinion man. Also, why do games have to be entertaining in a traditional sense?
i dont know, does a plane need to fly?

games are a mean of entertainment, their only purpose is to entertain
Serious movies also are not movies and serious book are not books, people need to understand that all serious artsy fartsy stuff needs to have their own names.
are you implying people are not entertained by serious movies and serious books?

ridiculous
 

Darknacht

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NuclearKangaroo said:
Darknacht said:
NuclearKangaroo said:
Revnak said:
NuclearKangaroo said:
as for the game personally i think its a bad idea, first of all, as a game the idea doesnt sound entertaining in the slightest,
First, that's just like, your opinion man. Also, why do games have to be entertaining in a traditional sense?
i dont know, does a plane need to fly?

games are a mean of entertainment, their only purpose is to entertain
Serious movies also are not movies and serious book are not books, people need to understand that all serious artsy fartsy stuff needs to have their own names.
are you implying people are not entertained by serious movies and serious books?

ridiculous
There are lots of depressing but very good books and movies if your definition of 'entertaining' is broad enough to include them, than a game about dealing with the effects of being raped should be able to be 'entertaining' too.
 

Revnak_v1legacy

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NuclearKangaroo said:
Revnak said:
Talking about an entirely human experience, attempting to relate it, that cannot be, in any shape, way, or form, pretentious.
yes it is, when you think your empathy and understanding can break all barries and extend to things you have never ever experienced in your life, you are incredibly pretentious
You know what? Fuck this shit. I'm done. I don't know if I generally dislike your posts, but I am just fucking done with your shit now. Ignored.
 

Vigormortis

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TravelerSF said:
Yup. If they'd divide the game into pre- and post-rape parts there's a lot they could do. After introducing the player into the game mechanics during the first part they could cripple them during the second part. Walking alone, in the night could turn into a disorientating and unpleasant experience. Daily functions could be interrupted by minigames which draw your mind back to the rape. Visual images or distortion could make regular human interactions difficult, or even possible. The overarching narrative could be a new relationship which you try to make work, despite how badly the rape has harmed you both emotionally and sexually. Failures could cause you miss meetings, skip eating or showers and just generally keep pushing you further away from society.

Granted I'm not a game designer and a lot of the things I mentioned could end up being very gimmicky, but I just would've wanted to see the designers to actually try to take advantage of what GAMES can do as a medium.
Precisely.

And based on the trailer and game description, they seem more inclined to show everything as bleak and gloomy, expecting the players to think, "Oh how dark and dreary life becomes after being raped!", rather than presenting situations and choices that would make the player feel how traumatic the experience is.

It's a terrible design philosophy that trivializes the struggles real rape victims face.

Granted, the final product may do more than what is on display thus far. I certainly hope it does, as tackling a topic such as rape in a mature, meaningful manner would be just the sort of thing video gaming needs to mature as a medium. However, I'm not holding my breath.

But at least some devs are trying. The efforts may leave a LOT to be desired, but at least some are trying.
 

BleedingPride

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I think it's an interesting idea and I am open to trying it to open my awareness and broaden horizons. Also holy shit @ that comment section. The trolls are strong with this one.
 

cleric of the order

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Silvanus said:
"Another" what?

What relevance do two entirely unrelated game have to this?
Intention is everyone, and this seems to be the intention of a lot of youngish, hamfisted game devs to miss handle a dangerous topic for the sake of edginess and street cred.

My own personal beef with this game is it seems to make the event beyond traumatic.
I understand the premise i understand the idea, perhaps this is just the mind blindness but this whole thing seems over dramatic.
Mind you while i have never been raped, I have lived in a state of violence all my life.
For most of my life I've had to worry if my dad was drinking and was going to bust down the door.
I've nearly died multiple times and I can say quite plainly that while living with object of my fear, i was able to function, i was able to live as a normal human being, when he was not out of sight. You really do get over it. it drains you sometimes yes but I seriously feel that anything this game is going to convey is over and beyond that level.
Andy Warhol said it the best, when he was shot by Valerie Solanas,
"Before I was shot, I always thought that I was more half-there than all-there - I always suspected that I was watching TV instead of living life. People sometimes say that the way things happen in the movies is unreal, but actually it's the way things happen to you in life that's unreal. The movies make emotions look so strong and real, whereas when things really do happen to you, it's like watching television - you don't feel anything. Right when I was being shot and ever since, I knew that I was watching television. The channels switch, but it's all television"
But the visual metaphors they tried to display, on top of being entirely clique are really over hyping from my understanding.
If they really do overdramatize it it should a true lack of empathy. these people need a little help, a little compassion, a silent patient kind of help, perhaps simply solitude. not to be paraded around the streets of Roma, like a prize.
 

Savagezion

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I am not a real big believer in the word pretentious. I understand people using it from time to time but it tends to leave a bad taste in my mouth most often. The problem is the word is usually used in a pretentious manner. (Yay irony) As most people usually never substantiate why they find it pretentious and thereby end up sounding pretentious towards the thing they are calling pretentious and instead like to use the word as shorthand for "I have better taste than those who like this". Which is a pretentious attitude.

Personally, I think the visual communication in this trailer is just downright poor and perhaps lazy. The trailer doesn't offer anything into why they chose this aesthetic. You can't actively draw from it without injecting thing from your own perception into it. However, if you have never been raped, you are at risk of projecting the wrong thing into it thus undermining the entire purpose of the game. Imagine if the trailer had shown a cutscene where an NPC or the PC had expressed a psychological perspective that coorelates with that imagery. This would be much better as you are explaining why the audience is seeing things the way they are. INstead of making them guess or imagine why.

I don't know what it is like to be raped, but I can imagine. And I can do that without a video game that makes me imagine. Thus the entire point of this video game is moot for me because I can imagine what it is like to be raped without the need of it. The game wants me to inject meaning into it with my imagination, so what exactly is it offering? What do I gain by using this game as an imagination helper?

You could argue that this game sets limitations to the imagination to help "guide" your imagination and impose restriction to help keep your perspective contained into a more focused or precise perspective. HOwever, from the trailer it seems everything is a blank slate so where is my guide? As well, going back to the beginning and seeing that they intend to use the mythical rape bogeyman (which I have named the rapist in this game) you have to ask "what if they set false parameters for this supposed guide?" Not only does that undermine the point of the game, but now the game may serve to work against what it is trying to achieve.

I haven't played the game. However, considering that the aesthetic is not explained in the trailer and the terrible opening sequence regarding the rape bogeyman - I have to say that the trailer speaks more in favor of this game being pretentious than it does against it. That is not a term I use lightly.

The problem with the rape bogeyman is if we assume that somewhere out there, if a woman plays this game and takes it to heart - she may start to develop social anxiety towards males through irrational fear. IF she already has social anxiety this game has just enabled it and reinforced it. However concerning actual rape statistics, you have reinforced an irrational fear in the wrong place (John Q Public walking down the street) and as a primary threat. But hey, yay art.
 

Karathos

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Based on the trailer this feels like another case of a walking simulator telling me I should feel certain feelings. You can't just make a game, say it's about a certain subject matter, and then tell me to feel bad. At worst, I can't say I'd be surprised if people actually came out after release and said this game belittles the experience.
 

Gordon_4_v1legacy

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If I were a game designer, I'd personally resist having something like rape in my game as it feels like reaching for low hanging fruit and an easy manipulation of emotion. That said, if my boss put a gun to my head, the best way I can think of to include it would be a sort LA Noire style crime drama where you play as the police officer investigating the crime.
 

NuclearKangaroo

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Darknacht said:
NuclearKangaroo said:
Darknacht said:
NuclearKangaroo said:
Revnak said:
NuclearKangaroo said:
as for the game personally i think its a bad idea, first of all, as a game the idea doesnt sound entertaining in the slightest,
First, that's just like, your opinion man. Also, why do games have to be entertaining in a traditional sense?
i dont know, does a plane need to fly?

games are a mean of entertainment, their only purpose is to entertain
Serious movies also are not movies and serious book are not books, people need to understand that all serious artsy fartsy stuff needs to have their own names.
are you implying people are not entertained by serious movies and serious books?

ridiculous
There are lots of depressing but very good books and movies if your definition of 'entertaining' is broad enough to include them, than a game about dealing with the effects of being raped should be able to be 'entertaining' too.
the problem my friend is that the GAMEPLAY or THE GAME does not look entertaining, it looks like yet another walking simulator that wants to lecture the players about an issue, rather than doing something interesting with it

and honestly, how can you turn rape into a game machanic?, how? (and not become a porn game)