BioWare Did Right By Us

Candidus

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Spoilers follow.
For me, the extended cut fixed very little, unfortunately.

The way that Shepard calls down the Normandy to collect ONE injured squadmade from right in front of the beam was stomach turning. Think about it. Never mind the fact that the beam is being defended by Harbinger and a second reaper because it's THAT important, and the Normandy just strolls right up... the real problem is that Commander Shepard appears to use the privilege of being Shepard to call the Normandy down from a battle in space (which takes less than 10 seconds), to collect ONE of the tens of thousands of people being wounded in the fight against the reapers right then and there.

What. The. Fuck? All this did was prove that absolutely no thought was given to the problem before it was pointed out by people who were dissatisfied with the ending. I think I liked the question more than the answer in this case, and I hated the question. But at least it wasn't blatantly character breaking.

And the big kicker for me all along; the Star Child (ugh, that name) is the Reaper God-AI. It is the citadel. I'm supposed to believe that it can't open the arms of the citadel itself? Funny, there are no reapers connected to it as Sovereign sought to be when it SHUTS the arms prior to the final battle. And I'm supposed to believe it couldn't monitor the life using it as the centers of their civilisations either?

No, sorry, the Star Child still totally wipes out the premise of the first game. Sovereign was just unnecessary.

You don't deal a deathblow to a significant portion of your own lore and retain your artistic integrity, but I guess I appreciate the effort. That's the most I can say for the DLC.
 

The Floating Nose

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Tiamat666 said:
I still haven't touched ME3 because I'm still waiting for the smoke to clear.
It's been 3 months and people are still complaining. So if you wait for the smoke to clear, you'll probably have a chance to play it hummm....when the next COD comes out or next year...
 

samaugsch

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Tiamat666 said:
I still haven't touched ME3 because I'm still waiting for the smoke to clear.

And because I'm afraid I will be very disappointed from all I've heard about the suckish ending. Maybe it's better to relish the memories of ME1 and 2 and pretend Sheperd died from a ruptured hemorrhoid on a particularly explosive toilet break.
Or you could mentally rewrite the last 10 minutes of the game. :3
 

samaugsch

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Irridium said:
Scars Unseen said:
Irridium said:
Scars Unseen said:
Diana Kingston-Gabai said:
Scars Unseen said:
Oh, and one minor nitpick about the EC... I see that in addition to Multi-Core Shielding, we have added some serious Plot Armor to the Normandy. Or did Harbinger just decide that the ship that carries the people that have been screwing with the Reapers' plans at every turn just wasn't worth shooting at? Maybe Joker had a Red Cross painted on the hull?
I actually attributed that to the Normandy's stealth systems - they've said many times that the only way you could detect the ship would be if you were looking at it, and Reapers don't have "eyes"... :)
The problem with that assumption is that the Reaper-created Collector ship could detect the Normandy just fine, even in stealth mode.
It's possible that the Normandy didn't have its stealth systems up when the Collector's attacked. That's the only reason I can think of, at least.
Presley specifically says that they had stealth systems engaged.
Oh. Well I don't know, then.
Maybe the Collector ship had heat sensors.
 

Lunar Templar

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anthony87 said:
All I want to know is why the hell they couldn't have done all that in the first place? IF the content of the EC had been in the game originally then there wouldn't have been the fuss that there was.
i agree.

i don't see why they could not have done what they did with the EC first

fanboys would still ***** of course, you'll never stop that, but it wouldn't have been the month long embarrassment it was
 

Dennis Scimeca

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The EC is only better than the original cut because these were things that SHOULD have been there from the start. This wasn't a case of ambiguity, these things were basic storytelling mistakes that Bioware should have not even had in the released copy of the game.

As for the story itself, it's still poorly written and the new added "REJECT" ending reeks of passive aggressive bitchiness on Casey Hudson's part.
"Oh, you don't like the shitty choices that we give to you? FINE, EVERYONE DIES. DEAL WITH IT!"

Nice, Bioware, real classy.
 

Apollo45

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The EC did improve the game a lot. It's still a crappy ending, but at least it's not story-breaking anymore. I can play through the last ten minutes without a constant urge to smash my controller into the screen. There are still some issues - like the Crucible being nothing more than a giant power plant, for instance, which only makes less sense than before - but it's a marked improvement overall.

Still, the PR debacle beforehand, the fact that the ending is still shitty overall, and everything else that's gone on means that I'm not buying any more BioWare games right off the shelf for quite a while.
 

tmande2nd

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Still has a stupid author avatar that pulls major BS out of its ass in the end?
Check.
Still have ending A/B/C where you choices dont matter?
Check.
Still is a giant smelly turd that spits on its own lore, ignores everything you did and ends with a rip off of Deus Ex?
Check.
Still shits on the universe so Hack Walters, and Clueless Hudson get to write their amazing fanfiction?
Check.
Still has Starbrat and his "logic" being shove in your face?
Check.

Sorry, its to little, to late, and it changed squat.
In the end since there wont be any post ending DLC, there wont be anymore of my money, and qute a few of my friends dollars heading to Bioware.

Why invest money into something that is shit?
 

Mylinkay Asdara

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Nov 28, 2010
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I haven't been able to bring myself to play it yet. Even though I fought for it and waited for it... I am gun-shy I guess. I will know what I feel when I know what it is, but just the fact that I am leery of going through what I did with the first ending again is a statement about the series - to be interpreted either positively or negatively, I guess, but I want it to be enough.
 

Dennis Scimeca

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Diana Kingston-Gabai said:
I disagree with the notion that the EC works in absolutes (ie: fixes everything/fixes nothing) - what it does is allow emotional satisfaction (by way of the character-centric epilogues) at the expense of intellectual satisfaction (because allowing the Catalyst to elaborate doesn't change how utterly dumb that entire segment is). It's still a net gain overall, though, because it makes the latter tolerable - I still hate the Starchild and everything it represents, but that's not all there is to the ending anymore.
This is exactly how I feel about it. Well said. Yay, my crew live happily ever after, it's just too bad the Mass Effect universe is that much dumber for the Star Child's existence.

Somehow though I was even more upset and angry after the EC than before. I guess now it feels like the Reapers win no matter what you do since Refusing to compromise with them = Game Over. Irritated me, I suppose.
 

Solracziad

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The Lunatic said:
Scars Unseen said:
Oh, and one minor nitpick about the EC... I see that in addition to Multi-Core Shielding, we have added some serious Plot Armor to the Normandy. Or did Harbinger just decide that the ship that carries the people that have been screwing with the Reapers' plans at every turn just wasn't worth shooting at? Maybe Joker had a Red Cross painted on the hull?
Reaper IFF.

You collected it during ME2.

Reapers think the Normandy is a Reaper ship, apparently.
Then why didn't the Normandy just fly Shepard directly to the beam? You can't have it both ways. Either the reapers can detect the ship or it can't. Also, does that mean that the Reapers can't see any of the Geth since they uploaded the Reaper code into their system? Imho the EC created as many plotholes as it tried to fix.

edit for stupid mistake(s) =P
 

Talvrae

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Fr said:
anc[is]Almost missed this thanks to the new layout. Yes it is a definite improvement and I give them credit. But Bioware is still circling the drain. Chobot is still there, that Cerberus ninja dude is still there, the gambling based multiplayer is still there. The quality of their games just dropped like a rock. I paid $60 for DA2 based on this sites review, and have never felt more ripped off. Not making that mistake again. Call me when ME3 is in the bargain bin.
Leng is in the novels since the secound one, who was written by Drew Kapensky, it's not surprising that "ninja dude" get there as well as Kahlee Sanders.
 

Dennis Scimeca

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Talvrae said:
Fr said:
anc[is]Almost missed this thanks to the new layout. Yes it is a definite improvement and I give them credit. But Bioware is still circling the drain. Chobot is still there, that Cerberus ninja dude is still there, the gambling based multiplayer is still there. The quality of their games just dropped like a rock. I paid $60 for DA2 based on this sites review, and have never felt more ripped off. Not making that mistake again. Call me when ME3 is in the bargain bin.
Leng is in the novels since the secound one, who was written by Drew Kapensky, it's not surprising that "ninja dude" get there as well as Kahlee Sanders.
Poor excuse. One shouldn't be forced into reading cash in novels to understand why the story in a GAME is doing what it does.
 

Savber

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Solracziad said:
Then why didn't the Normandy just fly Shepard directly to the beam? You can't have it both ways. Either the reapers can detect the ship or it can't. Also, does that mean that the Reapers can't see any of the Geth since they uploaded the Reaper code into their system? Imho the EC created as many plotholes as it tried to fix.

edit for stupid mistake(s) =P
Close your eye and picture that for a second. Harbinger is sensing Normandy as a friend due to the Reaper IFF when suddenly it propels forward and dropping an organic right next to the beam. I don't know but I'm willing to bet that alarm would have went off in which Harbinger blasts the Normandy and probably Shepard out of the sky. I doubt Shepard would have allowed such a risky maneuver otherwise as after all, he wanted to make sure "someone made it out alive" so sending his beloved ship directly into the Reaper's faces was pushing it.

Also the Reaper code isn't the same as having a Reaper IFF. The geth had Reaper advancement which made it smarter but that does not equate having an IFF system.
 

FFHAuthor

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Exposition about bad logic does not make it good logic, it merely makes it well talked about bad logic.
 
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Mcoffey said:
This is exactly how I feel about it. Well said. Yay, my crew live happily ever after, it's just too bad the Mass Effect universe is that much dumber for the Star Child's existence.

Somehow though I was even more upset and angry after the EC than before. I guess now it feels like the Reapers win no matter what you do since Refusing to compromise with them = Game Over. Irritated me, I suppose.
Well... I guess it depends on how you played the game (or rather, what values you attached to your avatar). For me, there was never any deliberation or hesitation: my Shepard chooses Destroy, every time, because it's the only ending in which she does not compromise with the Catalyst. The Reapers are obliterated, their horrors are purged from the galaxy, and the Catalyst's precious cycle will never hurt another living thing again. Sure, it's unfortunate that EDI and the geth are killed as well, but even Paragon Shepard wipes out a batarian colony to delay the invasion back in "Arrival". So I see that as the very last sacrifice she could make, the last time she would ever have to be put in that position of deciding who lives and who dies.

And for me, a lot of the frustration I experienced with the original ending was ameliorated by the EC, because Hackett acknowledges what I'd always hoped to be true: they'll rebuild. The geth are gone, but the quarians have Rannoch again. EDI is dead, but Samara and her daughter have been reunited. You can't save Anderson, but the Citadel is rebuilt (and since the Wards and the Presidium weren't completely destroyed, maybe people you cared about like Liara's father and Conrad Verner survived). And at the very end, Garrus doesn't put her name up on the wall, because somehow he just knows.

These are the things I wanted to see both as a player (in terms of how my choices affect the galaxy) and as someone experiencing the story (because yes, I cried when I saw Bakara holding a baby krogan in her arms, knowing what that meant and remembering that Mordin died to make that possible). And if I had to endure another iteration of the Architect's rambling nonsense from the second "Matrix" movie, at least this time Shepard is able to openly proclaim that it's just a screwy AI and therefore you don't have to take anything it says at face value.

It's not perfect, not by a long shot. But at least now we actually have endings and consequences, rather than just inferring and extrapolating.
 

bullet_sandw1ch

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Scars Unseen said:
Diana Kingston-Gabai said:
Scars Unseen said:
Oh, and one minor nitpick about the EC... I see that in addition to Multi-Core Shielding, we have added some serious Plot Armor to the Normandy. Or did Harbinger just decide that the ship that carries the people that have been screwing with the Reapers' plans at every turn just wasn't worth shooting at? Maybe Joker had a Red Cross painted on the hull?
I actually attributed that to the Normandy's stealth systems - they've said many times that the only way you could detect the ship would be if you were looking at it, and Reapers don't have "eyes"... :)
The problem with that assumption is that the Reaper-created Collector ship could detect the Normandy just fine, even in stealth mode.
im sure the reapers tech is advanced enough to sense a ship, even if its the best of the best.
 

Solracziad

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Savber said:
Solracziad said:
Then why didn't the Normandy just fly Shepard directly to the beam? You can't have it both ways. Either the reapers can detect the ship or it can't. Also, does that mean that the Reapers can't see any of the Geth since they uploaded the Reaper code into their system? Imho the EC created as many plotholes as it tried to fix.

edit for stupid mistake(s) =P
Close your eye and picture that for a second. Harbinger is sensing Normandy as a friend due to the Reaper IFF when suddenly it propels forward and dropping an organic right next to the beam. I don't know but I'm willing to bet that alarm would have went off in which Harbinger blasts the Normandy and probably Shepard out of the sky. I doubt Shepard would have allowed such a risky maneuver otherwise as after all, he wanted to make sure "someone made it out alive" so sending his beloved ship directly into the Reaper's faces was pushing it.

Also the Reaper code isn't the same as having a Reaper IFF. The geth had Reaper advancement which made it smarter but that does not equate having an IFF system.
....But Harbinger wasn't there until they did their whole lets charge everything we got towards the beam blah blah blah, he was in space....battling the Fleets. So what I am to assume here is that, if they had just dropped Shepard and Co. at the beam before any of the Sovereign-class reapers realized it they could have prevented the deaths of....like a shit-ton of people and saved me having to wade through waves upon waves on Reaper trash. I'm sorry it just doesn't work and if they didn't have that endlessly slow limping part, the player wouldn't have a crap ton of time to be pondering all the shit writing.

Edited for slightly better clarity.
 

Zeckt

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You know what? I'll admit to being angry at bioware enough that I won't even give the extended cut a glance. They wanted to end an epic trilogy with a piss poor ending that was so bad it not only dissapointed me it downright disgusted me. If thats the way they want to end trilogies then let them, I will never pay any attention to their shit ever again. Why even PLAY their games anymore if they don't respect not only their fans but their own franchises?

Too late to save face bioware, especially after feeding us DA2. Bioware, your so bad now its laughable. You have no respectable franchises anymore and I hope you lose millions upon millions now that you realize ending your ip's like this leaves you with NO IP'S! they reap what they sow, and its a massive harvest of feces. Bioware and their garbage 800 ms hour long dc's are boycotted. Forever. And they deserve it for kicking their fans in the balls for the last damn time. #$%#% bioware. 12 dollar hour long dlc's? 4 of them is only equal to 4 hours. Your better off buying cod full price and only playing the single player then you are with bioware dlc and that goes beyond bad to just downright wretched and pathetic. How's KOTOR treating you bioware? I'm laughing at you for losing so much money because its what you deserve!
 

Savber

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Solracziad said:
....But Harbinger wasn't there until they did their whole lets charge everything we got towards the beam blah blah blah, he was in space....battling the Fleets. So what I am to assume here is that if they had just dropped Shepard and Co. at the beam before any of the Sovereign-class reapers realized it they could have prevented the deaths of....like a shit-ton of people and saved me having to wade through waves upon waves on Reaper trash. I'm sorry it just doesn't work and if they didn't have that endlessly slow limping part, the player wouldn't have a crap ton of time to be pondering all the shit writing.
Wrong, Harbinger have already begun the rapid descent down to Earth after the Destroyer was knocked out.

Oh and did you forget about that Destroyer? The big Reaper that was shooting down everything in front of the beam, deflecting every shot? You can't exactly fly past it and stop long enough for a drop-off.

As for shit writing, the fact that we're arguing about this is kinda proving otherwise. Shit writing would be the original ME3 ending in where it was utterly non-nonsensical in every fashion and form.

Zeckt said:
Bioware and their garbage 800 ms hour long dc's are boycotted. Forever. And they deserve it for kicking their fans in the balls for the last damn time. #$%#% bioware. 12 dollar hour long dlc's? 4 of them is only equal to 4 hours.
Bioware hasn't price a single DLC since its release so what the hell are you talking about? And who cares? An entertainment company disappointed you.. cry me a river. There are better companies out there like CDPR and Valve so why be complaining about things that you have already decided on? Why the HELL are you wishing that normal people that work at Bioware lose their JOBS and livelihood?

Seriosuly grow up... Bioware might have failed in YOUR eyes but there's no reason to wish misfortune on the people that worked on it.