Blood magic in Dragon Age - Your opinions

[KOMega]

I hardly remember what I did in Dragon Age Origins.

But I remember blood magic to be really good, especially when combined with the powers of the arcane warrior, who took up most of your mana anyways powering persistent spells, so being able to cast from hit points was very helpful.

 

[DoPo]

In DAO.....blood magic was I believe the weakest specialization....with the largest penalties as well. Why do blood mages suddenly lose all ability to cast spells normally? Shouldn't blood magic be in ADDITION to normal spell casting? That would make way more sense, and effectively double the ability of blood mages to cast spells...while also giving them some spells only they could cast.

What are you talking about? The blood magic is the second best specialisation, and that's only because the arcane warrior is the most ridiculously OP thing in the whole game. The shapeshifter is weird and useless (mages own, if you're not casting magic, you're not owning), and the spirit healer gets some extra healing...although casting heals means you're not casting spells that own (still, though - third best specialisation in the game). And what downside is to blood mages? If you're out of mana, you switch over to the blood magic casting mode - true, healing is hampered at that point, but you don't really have to be in blood magic mode. You can even toggle it off and on, if you really need to. Blood Sacrifice can heal you though and it only steals health from those allies who don't need it. Which is anybody who isn't a blood mage. Blood Wound is the OP spell of the game - huge AOE, (almost) instant cast time, stun, good damage, and you don't break the effect by attacking. It combines everything you want in an attack spell. When I played DAO, Blood Control was bugged and (sometimes?) didn't deal the damage, but it's otherwise a really good spell as well - just take over that pesky high health/damage critter or if you can't, you nuke it. Pretty much no downside from deploying the spell at any opportunity.

What drawback are you talking about here?

I'm sorry, your right the last 2 spells may actually be worth it but why would you bother going through a whole spell tree to get 2 good spells?[/quoite]

The whole spell tree of...4 spells in total. So you need to go through 2 moderately useful spells to get the 2 really good ones. Wow. It's not like you've got a severe shortage of points there, you know.

Compare the spells sucking health from an ally to say the mass heal spell, why would you pick killing an ally in battle for a spell which healed you BOTH? that's just STUPID

Because you're winning anyway? And why would you be healing everybody if you can just snap your fingers and all that's left of your enemies would be charred remains - the mages win the combat, the other characters are around for a filler, who cares if they are missing some more health than normal? Regeneration kicks in after combat anyway, so it's not like you HAVE to heal them all the time.

 

[RicoGrey]

What I didn't like was how the gameplay didn't represent the story and setting. According to the story its this overpowered super badass way of magic, summoning demons and the like. But in the game it adds a few flimsy powers and takes power from the one thing a mage character doesn't have a lot of: health! I would have accepted the health cost if you could summon a demon-thrall or made the powers I casted using "blood" more powerful.

This, so much this. Nothing else needs to be said, as this is the correct answer. The lore and the game play do not match. Personally I feel like they could have made it work simply by making everyone like you less/hate you more if you went the route of blood magic. This would cause you to be more powerful, but if/when people found out you were a blood mage, your problems would become a whole lot bigger, just like how it was for the actually blood mage in the game, can't remember his name.

 

[NeutralDrow]

Never played Dragon Age, but after reading everything, I kind of want to, since I find that concept pretty awesome. Not sure if it's the high-risk/high-reward glass cannon tack, the insane idea, or maybe if I just want to play another game where I can imitate <url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9bdATVi_AxA>this guy.

Sadly, blood bending concept was butchered for me in Legend Of Korra. It's still terrifying, but now it's so overpowered it's almost comical.

Did you watch all the way to the end?

Spoiler

There were exactly three people who could do the superpowered bloodbending, and all of them are now dead with no heirs.

 

[IllumInaTIma]

Never played Dragon Age, but after reading everything, I kind of want to, since I find that concept pretty awesome. Not sure if it's the high-risk/high-reward glass cannon tack, the insane idea, or maybe if I just want to play another game where I can imitate <url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9bdATVi_AxA>this guy.

Sadly, blood bending concept was butchered for me in Legend Of Korra. It's still terrifying, but now it's so overpowered it's almost comical.

Did you watch all the way to the end?

Spoiler

There were exactly three people who could do the superpowered bloodbending, and all of them are now dead with no heirs.

I did, but still, bloodbending whole court including THE AVATAR during daytime is just plain ridiculous.

 

[Denamic]

It's not inherently evil, but it does render the mage much more vulnerable to demons and/or spirits, and can 'infect' other mages if possessed. So like I said, not evil, but there's huge safety concerns.

In gameplay terms though, it was weird. Everyone freak out about blood magic, to the point of calling for the execution of suspects, yet no one seem to care when you publicly use it with no regards to subtlety.

 

[DementedSheep]

The impression I got was that it is very very open to abuse with the mind control, drawing power from others blood, human sacrifice, demon summoning and just the shear amount of power involved. So basically it?s the problem with mages already but taken up to 11. Not necessarily "evil" by itself, you could have a good, non corrupt blood mage but it being widely practiced would be bad. It would be like if a whole bunch of random people had access to WMDs and were also prone to going crazy.

Game mechanic wise it kind of sucks. ..though you could abuse it the first game for some broken builds. You really shouldn't be able to use it in public without consequences but thats would be a challenge to implement gameplay wise. You getting outed as bloodmage would kill the plot. Also slitting your own wrist and having gush blood all over the place or shoving your staff through your own chest while dramatic is kinda stupid.

 

[Cybylt]

I don't think they've ever shown enough of the fall of someone to an abomination to straight up say blood magic is inherently evil and leads to becoming an abomination. Most abominations you come across are people who were put into dire situations and in that moment are taken over or desperate enough to turn to becoming one by choice.

The WMD scenario is how many in the setting see magic as a whole to begin with. Most templar organizations don't help either, Kirkwall was just even more extreme to the point of self fulfilling prophesy.

"We kill and lobotomize people to stop them from becoming evil mages and they become evil mages to stop us from killing and lobotomizing them and their friends. Whatever, it's all their fault for being evil mages."

I also get that you play as these extremely bad ass people (and Varric is probably exaggerating in the case of 2) but a team of four cleared out a tower of abominations including Pride, Desire and Sloth demons. And then you talk to people they make it sound like rage demons are capable of leveling city blocks. Rage demons are the low end of elite mobs at best, abominations are standard mobs in 2, it really undersells the urgency and fear these people have of abominations.

As far as I've seen it it's a case of correlation doesn't mean causation. For all we know the blood magic view in where you play is just from centuries of anti-empirium fear and propaganda. It's clearly more used there but they exist at the total opposite extreme of what you see in Ferelden and the Marches.

 

[Texas Joker 52]

I actually liked Blood Magic in the 'Dragon-Age-that-shall-not-be-named' (Which I felt was much more fun, for me at least, than Origins). I only ended up using two spells: Grave Robber, which was extremely helpful since it ended up replenishing quite a bit of health in the middle of a fight, particularly when upgraded, and Hemorrhage, which was absolutely devastating against most of what I fought.

Another benefit of blood magic was the fact that it rendered the cost of sustained spells, like Arcane Shield and Elemental Weapons moot, meaning I rarely had to worry about being unable to cast spells. Added to it that I always used Voracity by the end, along with Awakened's Might, I usually got a little more bang for my blood buck (Literally, since I was also very fond of Fire Magic).

As for justifying it as Hawke, I always felt that, after a certain point, my Hawke was willing to go to extreme lengths to protect those she cared for: Her Brother, her friends, her love, and the city of Kirkwall as a whole, and since she was both too smart and too stubborn to give into a demon willingly, she would see Blood Magic as a tool like any other, particularly since she lived by Malcolm Hawke's Philosophy: "My magic will serve that which is best in me, not that which is most base.".

Not only that, but she wants to prove that even Blood Magic, when properly used by someone who knows the risks and is willing to use it responsibly and for the good of others, has its place.

 

[franticfarken]

I like the whole Blood magic taboo and ethical concerns surrounding it, using it as a mage however is awful.
So as a fighter and roll playing as a Templar it makes a more compelling character attachment in my opinion but when using blood magic, it's almost as if Bioware didn't expect anyone to actually pick the darn thing so they left out so so much potential for a very different world basically. To me it would be awesome if the game would recognize you as the "infamous grey warden" using unquestionable magic to fight the blight.

 

[Lieju]

I liked the way Blood Magic was handled in the storyline, because it's not black-and-white whether it's evil or not, and I can see why people would ban it.

Using your own blood to power spells is totally okay in my book, using the blood of others, now we are getting iffy, killing other people for that, bad.

Also the way you can summon demons and control others? Very easily abused. And dangerous.

I always got the feeling the label of 'Bloodmagic' was just a label for stuff the Chantry didn't approve of, because it was too dangerous/unethical. I mean, Spirit healing is pretty similar; you're summoning spirits (which are the same as demons, apart from the label) and manipulating the bodies of others.

But because it's useful and benign, they don't label it 'Bloodmagic'. Although it's mentioned the templars are especially wary about the Spirit healers.

I would like to know how Tevinters classify their magic.

 

[Furbyz]

People seem to have not noticed that Blood Magic can let you solo the game on nightmare pretty easily. What's the one downside to Arcane Warrior? The Passives take up pretty much your whole mana bar, leaving you with a tiny pool to cast from. Now, since you're completely fucking invulnerable as an Arcane Warrior, skim off the top of your health pool and destroy everything.

Or don't even bother with Arcane warrior and completely annihilate everything when it can't move because it's just too busy with the whole writhing in utter agony thing. The other spells are ok, but Blood Wound is absolutely game-breakingly good.

 

[Odbarc]

Mechanically, it wasn't as impressive to use as it was in cut scenes.
But realistically, you just took damage with every cast.

Now, if it were some massive damage AoE spell that took you down to 10% of your health you could cast once a minute or something like that, it would make sense that it was "all powerful, fearful" or if at least the Dark Spawn used it exclusively it would make more sense to be a banned method of magic school.

I never got really far in Dragon Age 2 to get more lore out of the game(s) after the first.

 

[Smiley Face]

I really enjoyed it story-wise - it's very grey, there are people who obviously over-react towards it without really knowing what it means, but there are clearly also some dangers involved. Sometimes it's clearly a bad idea (i.e. the CRAZY over-the-top psychos), and other times it seems like using a dangerous tool when it's the only one that will work. Seeing everyone's opinions on the matter is, like in all Bioware games, the really fun bit.

Alas, they never apply it to your character, because that would dramatically change the course of the story, which it seems is a no-no for Bioware these days, all characters, no matter how seemingly diverse, must have the same adventure (That's loving criticism though - still love their stuff). When I last played DA2, I played as a blood mage, and it was never really acknowledged by anyone (I mean, you would have thought when I was running around helping the templars, someone would have pointed out the hypocrisy, or just taken notice and done something, but no...). Still, it was fun from an RP perspective, particularly showing solidarity with Merrill - Blood Mage Fist Bump! (People explode).

 

[ABLb0y]

My character's a blood mage in every playthrough. It gets a bit weird, especially in Dragon Age 2 as I exclusively romance Anders (Who hates blood magic).

 

[Ed130 The Vanguard]

In gameplay terms for Origins it was pretty good and if the Mage wasn't so overpowered and Arcane Warrior so broken it would be the best specialization. Shapeshifter is crap even without Arcane Warrior available for those who wanted a magic knight and the Sprit Healer while good for support isn't exactly suited to a Nuker or Mezzer. Blood Wound in particular is worth it, combining DOT with a form of stunning (that doesn't end when the target gets attacked) and a short cast time.

The lack of healing could be counted by stacking CON and the absurd number of healing pots you could make/carry/use at once.

I didn't use it in DA2 as I had to turn both mages into healbitches due to the retarded spawn system dropping heavies behind my battleline and attempting to rape my fire-support characters combined with timers for healing pots.

In terms of story, it should be treated with extreme caution with heavy Templar supervision when any research is performed (one of the few times the Chantry's extreme view on magic is justified). There shouldn't be a total ban as Blood Magic has been used for good before (most notably the creation of the Grey Wardens) and drawing the line at using sacrifices/consorting with Demons is a good start.

-snip-

The lack of demonic ROFLstomping the Warden party is part a part of gameplay/story segregation as the tower, heck most enimes scale to the player with certain exceptions like the Beefgates at the entrance to Orzammar. If you don't believe me then activate the Black Vial in the Mage Tower to summon Cale Viazagat, The First Corpse Walker (a corpse possessed by a Pride Demon known as a Reverent) at low level. You will be murdered.

Abominations are the most visible form of blood magic (or at least one possible result) and you shouldn't discount them, just ask Redcliffe village who suffered a zombie invasion due to Connor becoming possessed or the Circle which imploded due to blood magic opening holes to the Veil due to Uldred getting a little to close to a Pride Demon.

One of the biggest issues with Blood Magic is that you can use it to take control of others and is the biggest problem with the school of magic in the eyes of many.

Even even when not dealing with demons or mind control it is still rather iffy with unscrupulous mages sacrificing people to enhance their powers, most notably the slaver Caladrius from Origins offering to sacrifice all the slaves in the room to improve the Warden.

All those issues aside it can be used for good, with The Grey Warden Joining ritual for example is Blood Magic as well as rather ironically the Phylacteries the Templars use to hunt down fleeing Mages.

 

[Chris Tian]

Blood magic was useless, your a mage and it HURTS you to use it, you don't have high constitution as it is and all it really did was draw magic from your health instead of your mana which is useless

No offense, but if you think Blood Magic is useless in either Dragon Age game you just couldn't use it right. Blood Magic is extremely powerfull in DA:O and DA2.
The ability to cast from health is totaly awesome in itself, it makes it viable to give your caster lots of health points, and thus making him much tougher than non-blood mages, and since blood gives you more mana you can cast non stop without any lyrium potions.
And Blood Wound is OP like f*ck, a spell that paralizes enemys and deals some serious pain for the duration. It is basically the AoE version of Crushing Prison and that spell was already overpowered like nobodys buisness. That spell alone would have been worth taking four different versions of a "The Warden/Hawke falls to his/her knees and beggs for mercy" skill, but luckily enough most BM skills are very usefull.


OT: What bugged me about Blood Magic was, that nobody noticed it. If you make such a big plot point about blood magic and make this ability availabe to the player character you should tie that together, such a big discrepancy between gameplay and story is just bad game design.

 

[Kayevcee]

I've got no time for Blood Mages in Dragon Age: Origins (the only one I've played) for the same reason I've got no time for Batarians in Mass Effect and Ree-Yees in Knights of the Old Republic- because every one I've ever met has either immediately tried to kill me or has completely fucked up everything around them. Look at what that useless prick did to Redcliffe- he was hired to give the local prince a hand with his homework and managed to get the kid possessed and half the town devoured by zombies. It's like the meme picture of Homer Simpson standing with an apron and a chef's hat on in front of a bowl of corn flakes which he's somehow managed to set on fire- he fucked up in ways you wouldn't think it would be possible to fuck up given the task in hand.

All the other Blood Mages I encountered were bonk-eyed nutbags that wanted to either blow my face off or sacrifice me to their dark masters. If that's what blood magic does for you, you can stick it up your arse.

-Nick

 

[Senare]

Eh... I thought it was a bit thematically boring. Boring spells, necessarily evil and such. In the way that I think about magic Blood Magic would be more closely associated to healing, since that would allow you to target blood (which is pretty important). Yet all healing is pretty mystical in fantasy settings. In the evil spells department I find it lacking when compared to Blood Boil: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ZWAbkABMAg
But Blood Magic in Dragon Age is still not nearly as boring as the darkspawn themselves. And the combat system takes the cake all on its own.

Maybe that is just me and my idea of fantasy.

 

[ItsNotRudy]

Doesn't seem like anyone played the game on a difficult setting. No appreciation for the OPness that is Blood Wound at all. At a small health cost you get to AoE Stun and damage without hitting party members. Also converting anyone temporarily outside bosses is insane. I'd gladly 'waste' 2 spell points to get those.