Britain Blocks Hacker's US Extradition on Human Rights Grounds

Woodsey

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Eternal_Lament said:
I'm confused, the guy hacks into the Pentagon, and because he MAY kill himself if extradited due to his disorder that extradition is denied, and the main response is "Good, the government finally made the right decision"? How is this a good thing?

Perhaps I'm just too ignorant on the history of this, but I don't see why him avoiding extradition is supposed to be a good thing, especially considering the argument used to deny it. I don't foresee good things coming out of this precedent. Can someone clear this for me?
Claims that he "hacked into the Pentagon" are pretty overblown, it's thought that he basically used a program to search for passwords on the network that had been left blank/default.

If he's seriously at risk of hurting himself then it's not worth taking him over there, especially for an entirely victimless crime. I mean, they do get professionals into assess these people you know. Their solicitors don't say "oh well he might kill himself" and then the judge lets them off.
 

Ilikemilkshake

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Eternal_Lament said:
Ilikemilkshake said:
Eternal_Lament said:
I'm confused, the guy hacks into the Pentagon, and because he MAY kill himself if extradited due to his disorder that extradition is denied, and the main response is "Good, the government finally made the right decision"? How is this a good thing?

Perhaps I'm just too ignorant on the history of this, but I don't see why him avoiding extradition is supposed to be a good thing, especially considering the argument used to deny it. I don't foresee good things coming out of this precedent. Can someone clear this for me?
Because in the past half a decade there's been growing resentment in the UK towards our government for bending over and taking it every time the US comes calling.

This guy could have done just about anything short of murder and people would be happy the government finally grew some balls and said no.

Have a quick read of these article, it pretty much sums up most peoples opinions regarding the matter:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2011/oct/27/uk-us-extradition-treaty-unfair
So this is less a "That guy is totally innocent, leave him be!" and more "Hooray! Take that US!"? If so then I guess I see what the attitude is all about, I just think the attitude is rather bizarre. Then again I'm not British so chances are I won't really understand the sentiment.
Pretty much. Put it this way, if he were a US citizen and bearing in mind he has a number of mental disorders, lets say he hacked into Russian computers to check for the existence of mole people or something.. do you think most people in the US would be happy to send him over to Russia?
 

Eternal_Lament

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Woodsey said:
Claims that he "hacked into the Pentagon" are pretty overblown, it's thought that he basically used a program to search for passwords on the network that had been left blank/default.

If he's seriously at risk of hurting himself then it's not worth taking him over there, especially for an entirely victimless crime. I mean, they do get professionals into assess these people you know. Their solicitors don't say "oh well he might kill himself" and then the judge lets them off.
I'm still not thrilled that he got off because of that though. Part of it is that I'm not fond of the concept of actions they may commit instead of the ones they already did. If he is so mentally unstable that being extradited could result in him killing himself then I would hope he'd be put into some psych facility immediately, because clearly someone like that needs help. It worries me further because it also throws off any attempt to prosecute him Britain. At least had they gone with a different reason he could still stand trial, just he'd have to do so in Britain, but now because it's determined that jail will cause him to kill himself now there's nothing that can really be done.

Ilikemilkshake said:
Pretty much. Put it this way, if he were a US citizen and bearing in mind he has a number of mental disorders, lets say he hacked into Russian computers to check for the existence of mole people or something.. do you think most people in the US would be happy to send him over to Russia?
Oh I'm not doubting that, in general I usually suspect that a country will do whatever they can to stop their own citizens from being extradited. For general purposes I find all of it to be rather bizarre behavior. EDIT: I find the behavior of being proud that someone who should be extradited isn't as being odd, not the behavior of wanting to protect one's citizens. Thought I should clarify
 

Raidenko

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Yeah, they will probably shorten his sentence and he will be working for MI6 in about five years.
 

Doclector

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I'm pleased he hasn't been dragged off to america, but that's not to say he should entirely get away with it.
 

PunkRex

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Daystar Clarion said:
scotth266 said:
Fine, try him in the UK then. So long as we're not mistakenly under the assumption that you can hack Pentagon computers and get off with absolutely no repercussions just because you have a disorder.
Yeah, those UFO files could be used against America to steal freedom or something.

Maybe even copy the Big Mac secret sauce.


They should hire the guy if he managed to break into the fucking Pentagon.

Either that, or their system is fucking awful.
Basically this, they should be throwing the guy a fucking parade! If a kook looking for UFO's was able to do this then what if some actual cyber-terrorists attck? I am seriously worried about the worlds economic future if all the people in charge of protecting it can think when 'some guy' hands them their ass like this is "He needs to be sent to jail!"

Disclaimer: Im not saying he shouldn't be punished but lets not joke about here people, they wanted to make an example of him to scare the public, thats something ive never agreed with. He should be punished for his crimes, not in place of 'future' criminals.
 

BehattedWanderer

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scotth266 said:
Fine, try him in the UK then. So long as we're not mistakenly under the assumption that you can hack Pentagon computers and get off with absolutely no repercussions just because you have a disorder.
Pretty much this. Try him wherever you like, he's still going to have to face repercussions for his actions.
 

dangoball

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Jhooud said:
Fascinating idea! A Modest Proposal [http://emotionalliteracyeducation.com/classic_books_online/mdprp10.htm], as it were.
My friend, you have provided me with some fine entertainment for the evening. I especially enjoy the classy form in which utilizing our socially weak is described.
And I also have to thank you, for from now on I will be very careful of dinner invitations from any fine gentleman.

OT:
Not being British or from the US I don't have much to say about this, but if an autistic kid can hack Pentagon and send entire networks to scrambles, US should look into their security and maintenance first. And due to my general distaste for US and their foreign politics I'm also pleased to read that their request was denied.
 

J Tyran

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Eternal_Lament said:
Ilikemilkshake said:
Eternal_Lament said:
I'm confused, the guy hacks into the Pentagon, and because he MAY kill himself if extradited due to his disorder that extradition is denied, and the main response is "Good, the government finally made the right decision"? How is this a good thing?

Perhaps I'm just too ignorant on the history of this, but I don't see why him avoiding extradition is supposed to be a good thing, especially considering the argument used to deny it. I don't foresee good things coming out of this precedent. Can someone clear this for me?
Because in the past half a decade there's been growing resentment in the UK towards our government for bending over and taking it every time the US comes calling.

This guy could have done just about anything short of murder and people would be happy the government finally grew some balls and said no.

Have a quick read of these article, it pretty much sums up most peoples opinions regarding the matter:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2011/oct/27/uk-us-extradition-treaty-unfair
So this is less a "That guy is totally innocent, leave him be!" and more "Hooray! Take that US!"? If so then I guess I see what the attitude is all about, I just think the attitude is rather bizarre. Then again I'm not British so chances are I won't really understand the sentiment.
Lots of British also recognize the fact that every time we make an extradition request to the US they say FU! and will not extradite a US citizen. Like the recent gun smuggling ex-marine, he made a fortune smuggling guns into the UK in bits and pieces but the US courts refused to extradite him and insisted he face trial in the US.
 

Ilikemilkshake

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Eternal_Lament said:
Ilikemilkshake said:
Pretty much. Put it this way, if he were a US citizen and bearing in mind he has a number of mental disorders, lets say he hacked into Russian computers to check for the existence of mole people or something.. do you think most people in the US would be happy to send him over to Russia?
Oh I'm not doubting that, in general I usually suspect that a country will do whatever they can to stop their own citizens from being extradited. For general purposes I find all of it to be rather bizarre behavior.
I'm actually for extradition treaties, it means people can't just hop to another country to escape justice. The key word being justice though and for a number of high profile cases involving Brits being extradited to the US most people don't feel that justice is being done by extraditing them.
 

Kinguendo

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Eternal_Lament said:
I'm confused, the guy hacks into the Pentagon, and because he MAY kill himself if extradited due to his disorder that extradition is denied, and the main response is "Good, the government finally made the right decision"? How is this a good thing?

Perhaps I'm just too ignorant on the history of this, but I don't see why him avoiding extradition is supposed to be a good thing, especially considering the argument used to deny it. I don't foresee good things coming out of this precedent. Can someone clear this for me?
He is mentally unstable and has Aspergers, the fact that he had a high risk of killing himself meant sending him to America would have been a death sentence... and we arent barbarians. Not to mention the living hell that is the American Prisons.
 

Doom972

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It seems many people are happy to hear that this guy isn't being extradited on principle alone.
This guy actually hacked a foreign government's military computers. If the US prison system scares him that much, then maybe he should've hacked the military computers of a country with nicer prisons.
 

Little Gray

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Tiamattt said:
Not fond of the precedent this sets. "If I'm messed up enough I can commit whatever crimes I want in another country". At least make him stand trial first, they can sort out the terms of his imprisonment if he's found guilty. It's not like UK prisons would be all sunshine and rainbows, and I seriously doubt the US has absolutely no place to put prisoners with special needs.
Im with you but as long as the guy does jail time in England then we should be ok.
 

Kinguendo

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Kopikatsu said:
This actually is one case where the defendant should be extradited to the US, because his crime involves the US rather heavily.

We have suicide watch in our prisons. Just stick him in a straight jacket and he'll be fine.
You also execute the retarded... I would try to commit suicide at EVERY opportunity if I was told I were to be imprisoned in America and I am entirely sound of mind. Your prison system is a disgrace and hopefully this embarrassment causes reform.
 

Aeshi

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Wait, you/we can do that?!

BRB, off to commit a load of crimes and say I can't go to jail because I have a disorder and thus would result in "a high risk of me ending my life"
 

Smooth Operator

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My god they found someone with a spine, it's really not much since they hung it all on mental illness, but hey... baby steps.
 

Tiamattt

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Little Gray said:
Tiamattt said:
Not fond of the precedent this sets. "If I'm messed up enough I can commit whatever crimes I want in another country". At least make him stand trial first, they can sort out the terms of his imprisonment if he's found guilty. It's not like UK prisons would be all sunshine and rainbows, and I seriously doubt the US has absolutely no place to put prisoners with special needs.
Im with you but as long as the guy does jail time in England then we should be ok.
That would be great, although if what I'm reading from other posts here are true then what he did isn't even considered a crime over there.Granted my understanding of British laws are extremely limited so please forgive me if I'm mistaken.