Can a guy gamer get a say in this bull?

[ajemas]

You know, I have only been here for one day, but I am quite surprised by this thread.
From what I have seen so far, the moderators are very good about banning people who are rude in any way, but perhaps too much so. (I'm thinking of a time somebody went on probation for posting a "facepalm".) So why is it that this blatant misogynist rant is going unchecked? I personally find this very offensive (though I am a heterosexual man). Gender roles vary widely from society to society, and saying that games only target men because they feature guns, cars, and explosions prominently is just stupid. You are not being funny, you are being ignorant, sexist, and acting like a testosterone filled twat. Again, I have only been here for one day, but I feel that it is perfectly reasonable for me to tell you to fuck off.

 

[Raigne]

The hypersexualization happens with both male and female characters, as someone else pointed out. It doesn't bother me. I agree with the poster who said she'd be a lot happier if she could just choose to play a female character. One of the things that irked me about Diablo 2 the first time I played it was that class was tied to gender. It was the first thing I noticed about Torchlight as well. In just about every RPG made, a male PC has a much better written romance than a female PC and often has more options as to who they choose to have one with. Women often have different expectations of what a reward should be in a game, and often require something different than men to find a game engaging in the same way. This isn't true across the board, of course, but it is true for a significant cross section of that demographic.

 

[Archetypal_Maniac]

You know, I have only been here for one day, but I am quite surprised by this thread.
From what I have seen so far, the moderators are very good about banning people who are rude in any way, but perhaps too much so. (I'm thinking of a time somebody went on probation for posting a "facepalm".) So why is it that this blatant misogynist rant is going unchecked? I personally find this very offensive (though I am a heterosexual man). Gender roles vary widely from society to society, and saying that games only target men because they feature guns, cars, and explosions prominently is just stupid. You are not being funny, you are being ignorant, sexist, and acting like a testosterone filled twat. Again, I have only been here for one day, but I feel that it is perfectly reasonable for me to tell you to fuck off.

Everyone has the right to be offended, and if you think this is sexist than you have missed the whole point of what I am saying. I am in full support of games directed at girls gaming, but since you are struggling with interpreting what I am writing I will break it into managable segments.

> I feel games are refered to as sexist far far too often.
> I am sick of being labled a pervert, or being told that I purchase games for the sexualisation of women within the game, as if I am some sort of shallow moron.
> I see many posts about the sexism of games, and the fact that games should be more directed at girls, HOWEVER I do not see any ideas or suggestions from actual girl gamers with what they want to see. Now this is not a go at girl gamers saying that they arn't interested, perhaps girls who do game are actually satisfied with what's on offer?

Those are some of the issues I was outlining, I am not sexist and my post was written to outline that actual fact. But thanks for your input I am sure there are more posts out there for you to get completly wrong, respond to them with no actual basis for your opinions then tell that poster to "fuck off"

P.S: The thing about guns, cars and sports was obvious satire, about how we are also generalised. Good effort though.

 

[DracoSuave]

You know, I have only been here for one day, but I am quite surprised by this thread.
From what I have seen so far, the moderators are very good about banning people who are rude in any way, but perhaps too much so. (I'm thinking of a time somebody went on probation for posting a "facepalm".) So why is it that this blatant misogynist rant is going unchecked?

Obvious Satire is Obvious.

You need to learn to Reading Comprehend moar.

I personally find this very offensive (though I am a heterosexual man).

That's sort of the point of Satire.

Gender roles vary widely from society to society, and saying that games only target men because they feature guns, cars, and explosions prominently is just stupid.

Advertisers and marketters and many people who want to sell products to men use guns, cars, and explosions to sell their products to a male demographic.

So what's stupider? The fact that it works, or ignoring this just because it doesn't fit some Politically Correct view of the world, one that does not, in fact, exist.

You are not being funny, you are being ignorant, sexist, and acting like a testosterone filled twat. Again, I have only been here for one day, but I feel that it is perfectly reasonable for me to tell you to fuck off.

And responding in such a way to obvious satire makes you the butt of your own unintentional joke.

Learning how to identify satire is a survival tactic in the world of communication.



Also, my kudos to the OP. Well played, sir. I enjoyed your post up to the point when I realized it was tongue in cheek and then I enjoyed it even more.

 

[squid5580]

I think many female gamers just want games that have real female CHARACTERS, not just annoying bitches with oversized breasts, or naive lolitas...with oversized breasts.
And maybe some unicorns.

Right because the market is so full of Male lead characters that are real and never have biceps the size of thier heads and big chests. The problem isn't male or female. It is the writers who think giving the characters a witty one liner makes them fully developed. And that is even if they get to say a sentence in the first place.

The only people who the industry fairly represents is amnesiac orphans who are forced to make thier own clothes with random pieces of fabric they pull from dumpsters because they spend all thier money on hair gel.

I agree with you to an extent, that the male protagonists are usually under that "ideal" type character model, but there is truth in the majority of the time female characters are only put in to be sexy and usually have little other purpose.

Though, for some reason that doesn't bother me, and neither does the lack of clothing most female NPCs tend to have. However, it should be noted that the gaming population is and has been evolving to include increasing amounts of female players, so there will definitely be charges of sexism in the name of being raving feminists. I think the cries that the gaming industry shouldn't try to cater to a female playerbase because it's too small is becoming a void argument. They don't need to change the way games are or mess with the masculinity of them by making them more female friendly. But I really don't see the harm in making a female character a playable option in more games, because if you don't choose the female then the game doesn't change you at all and it would have no affect on you, but it adds a nice option for women. That's just my thoughts on it though.

I think that this arguement devalues the female character in general. It shouldn't matter if they are wearing dental floss or a full janitor outfit. I think that alot of gamers have been giving the female character the short end of the stick when it comes to thier actual worth even when they aren't the PC. Where would Mario be without the princess? Or Link without Zelda? I think that there tends to be this feminist outcry that somehow women are portrayed as weak in these games and then you add the sex appeal and the shit hits the fan. I am not saying all games are like this (DOA extreme volleyball for an example of objectifying women) but it is the gaming equivalant of porn. Another favorite is Ivy with her dental floss of an outfit and huge rack yet she is a strong character. Just as strong as Rock or Voldo. It seems silly that we are judging them based on thier body and clothes and not that they are being portrayed as being stuck in a kitchen barefoot and pregnant. You know the important stuff.

 

[Flishiz]

The DA:O argument is severely invalidated, seeing as you can go to a brothel and bone 2 of your female followers.

 

[DracoSuave]

The DA:O argument is severely invalidated, seeing as you can go to a brothel and bone 2 of your female followers.

DA:O isn't being gender specific about it. That brothel is, how do we say... gender-agnostic, you can have either or both, and as for the followers thing, you can bone 2 of your male followers. Or be boned by. Or...

...whatever.


The point is DA:O isn't sexist about how it does it.

 

[Mr.Black]

This thread is just so the OP can score brownie points with the ladies.

 

[Archetypal_Maniac]

The DA:O argument is severely invalidated, seeing as you can go to a brothel and bone 2 of your female followers.

You can go to a brothel and have intercourse with: Men and Women.

As a male you can have sex with:

Morrigan (woman)
Leliana (woman)
Zevran (male)

As a female you can have sex with:
Alistair (male)
Zevran (male)
Leliana (woman)

So this is a perfect for my argument, it covers every spectrum. Gay, Lesbian, straight. Just not the dog.

 

[Archemetis]

I think many female gamers just want games that have real female CHARACTERS, not just annoying bitches with oversized breasts, or naive lolitas...with oversized breasts.
And maybe some unicorns.

A Charlie the Unicorn game methinks

Would the goal be to try and keep your kidneys?
Or would the overall goal be to eventually lose your kidneys?
Or maybe your kidneys have been stolen prior to the opening level and the job of the player is endure the mind-bending crazy that is the Charlie the Unicorn universe in order to retrieve said Kidneys?

The possibilities are ENDLESS.

 

[Rusty pumpkin]

my only point for this topic, assuming that the many responses to this have covered everything from here to the moon, is that there are girls who like halo 3, left 4 dead, etc. and the problem is, no one seems to know why the play these games. well, i have a guess actually, they like the same andrenaline fueled thrill of owning people repeatedly. (and dont say this never happened to you, we've all had the moment when, while getting pissed at the current leet killer person, we find out their a girl.)

 

[DracoSuave]

Borderlands: A sex filled shooter, where the player shoots skags to unlock pictures of HAWT GURLS.
L4D2: Pretty much me as a guy teaching women not to talk back yah.

I seem to have missed all the sex in Borderlands...so did the chicks I usually play it with. Also, at which point in L4D2, exactly, does anyone instruct Rochelle to, um, talk back? I'm glad we all have an internet in which we can post our opinions, but...I guess I just don't see where you're coming from.

The sarcasm went far, far over your head.

Is that Samuel L Jackson dressed as Naruto!?!

That.

Is.

Halarious.

 

[The Heik]

Recently, as in the past year Iv'e come across so many articles that amplify the fact that:
Games are designed for MEN! Games are marketed to MEN! Theres no games aimed at girls! Now wait just a minute, aimed at girls? What the hell does a girl want in a game? Guys like guns and cars and sports, games about guns, cars and sports sell well. What do girls like? Exactly, these articles state that girls are pretty much ignored, but I have yet to see one of them put forward an idea that they would like to see in game form.

The people who make games are genuinly interested in building games, and the majority are men. Why should they take 4 years of their life, a sack of cash and their companies credibility to go out of their way and produce a game they are not INTERESTED in?

The thing that ticks me off the most is this marketing bullshit, games are marketed to men with use of SEXY GIRLS! BULLSHIT! I call bullshit on that, I don't know who thought this up, the huge population of male gamers are just gamers to get a cheap thrill! Which I think is strange, check out MW2, selling like hot cakes not a boob in sight. Bunch of pervs we are eh guys? Let's check out my current games:

Borderlands: A sex filled shooter, where the player shoots skags to unlock pictures of HAWT GURLS.

Dragon Age: Origins: An RPG where killing dragons allows us to dominate girls! And make them cook us dinner too!

CS:S Zombie mod: FWAAAR CHECK OUT TEH BEWBS ON THOSE DEAD GURLZ.

L4D2: Pretty much me as a guy teaching women not to talk back yah.

Heres the inside scoop, boobs, great love em, make me smile whatever, but, and you might wanna strap yourself in for this one, I didn't spend 2 fucking grand on a gaming PC to get kicks out of jiggly wiggly boobies ok? So stop sticking this god damn label on my head that I am sort of friggin sexist, pervo because I bought a game that has a vuluptuous female character in it, it's offensive, more offensive than the girls in the games. That's not to say all games are innocent, that's just to say I, and many others like me are not guilty. If you lasses are truly into your games, then get building and show us immature boys how it's done.

I completely and totally agree with Maniac here. This type of marketing is to grab the attention of those 14 year old pubescent boys, to whom the promise of boobies, to quote Yahtzee here, is like offering a bacon cheeseburger to a starving wolf. Not only that but it is exactly those 14 year old boys who shouldn't be playing these kinds of games, because their mind hasn't fully developed, leading these images to stamp the idea of women being a sexual object into their little under-aged hormone-driven brains. There's a reason why the ESRB gives ratings on games, so YOU, the parent of these kids, don't let them play this, so that we can FINALLY end this vicious circle of gender-inequality.

p.s. On a side note I am writing an essay about a topic along the lines of this, regarding violence in video games. I'll update this post once I've gotten the essay online

 

[Iron Mal]

This is a case of 'I'd like to see you do better', if all of these alleged 'male orriented' games are so bad (and provably so) then how about a few pointers on how we could improve them?

Most games tend to be centred around things such as guns, explosions and cars not because they are stereotypically male oriented things but because these are the things that make interesting games (if we were to examine the clich'e list of 'female things' then we would probably find that most, if not all, of them wouldn't be anywhere near being interesting ideas for a game).

This will probably sound sexist but hear me out, anyone else remember the speech from Hellboy II about how you can't ask a woman what they want, you just have to know? This feels like a case of that, making an assumption about what a female audience would appreciate often results in us being labelled sexist but then again asking what said audience would want to see is just as bad.

 

[lazy_bum]

You know, I have only been here for one day, but I am quite surprised by this thread.
From what I have seen so far, the moderators are very good about banning people who are rude in any way, but perhaps too much so. (I'm thinking of a time somebody went on probation for posting a "facepalm".) So why is it that this blatant misogynist rant is going unchecked? I personally find this very offensive (though I am a heterosexual man). Gender roles vary widely from society to society, and saying that games only target men because they feature guns, cars, and explosions prominently is just stupid. You are not being funny, you are being ignorant, sexist, and acting like a testosterone filled twat. Again, I have only been here for one day, but I feel that it is perfectly reasonable for me to tell you to fuck off.

I think you take things abit seriously. alot of that was satirical. though he does have a point as well about how the industry in general is portrayed.

 

[lacktheknack]

<link=http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/95221-Ninja-Gaiden-Sigma-2-Director-Every-Man-Loves-Tits>It's all Team Ninja's <link=http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/93860-Oh-Japan-Boobs-Used-As-Marketing-For-Ninja-Gaiden-Sigma-2>fault, <link=http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/92841-Ninja-Gaiden-Sigma-2-Has-Less-Gore-More-Girls>you know.

 

[Joshimodo]

Does the game appeal to men? Sexist.

Does the game stay away from videogame women clichés? Sexist.

Does the game contain a woman? Aimed at men, blatantly sexist.

Does the game feature a woman just so it can say it has a woman in it, mainly to avoid accusations of sexism? Sexist.

 

[Bofus Teefus]

The sarcasm went far, far over your head.

Yeah, he clarified in a later post, but seriously, with some of the threads that we've had lately, can you really blame me for thinking he was serious?

....and your avatar = win.