Can Americans Make Anime?

[Nikolaz72]

"Can anyone outside of Japan make Anime?" is unequivocally "No."
Actually the answer is Unequivocally YES. Most Anime isn't even made In Japan anymore. Most anime is farmed out to Korean Sweat Shops. Heck Legend of Korra is even made by a Korean Sweat Shop run by Buster Bunny himself.

Anime is a Japaneese word for animation/cartoons.. Therefor, unless you are a Japaneese outside Japan, I really doubt you would be making anime's. It would just be, well.. Animation or Cartoons.

Incorrect.
Per a Dictionary
Anime is a style of animation originating in Japan that is characterized by stark colorful graphics depicting vibrant characters in action-filled plots often with fantastic or futuristic themes See here [http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/anime?show=0&t=1343660934].

Anime is a STYLE that originated in Japan but isn't done exclusively in Japan.

If I make an Edo Style Wood Block print it is a ukiyo-e? Yes it is because it is a particular Style and as long as I follow that style then there is no problem.

American Cartoons as an mature medium died long ago and because of that have a childish tone to them. American Cartoons are themselves a Style.

Your Dictionary is incorrect. Anime isnt a style. . . Saying its a style would mean that its a certain way of drawing, but there are tons of ways to draw and as far as I recall they are all named something different.

The term is up for interpretation, one of the interpretations (A huge generalization) being in an american dictionary doesnt prove much of anything.

Avatar is a western cartoon, made as if it was a Japaneese cartoon.

That being said this is pointless to be drawn into an arguement over. So im quitting before it gets further.

 

[RJ Dalton]

I've never seen Avatar or Korra, so I'm going to exempt it from any kind of statement I make in the following.

I've only ever used Anime to describe animation out of Japan and anything American made that imitates it is just that, an imitation. Most of the stuff that imitates anime is shit to me, because it doesn't really understand the culture that it's trying to imitate and it may get the outward appearance right, but it misses the fine details by leaps and bounds.
That's primarily the reason I haven't seen Avatar. It came around at a time when companies were trying to imitate anime and doing a shitty job. So I saw Avatar's animation and dismissed it as just another attempt to imitate anime. Of course, later I keep hearing people who agree with me about the quality of anime imitators actually saying Avatar was good, so I wonder what I missed, but not enough to actually go look up the show, because I really don't care for TV in general anymore, anime or otherwise.

But really, I wish animators would stop trying to imitate anime. I can understand being influenced by it and maybe even wanting to pay homage to it, but to imitate it like the format itself is automatically going to make your work better, or popular is a flawed kind of logic that can limit artistic creativity and originality. Anime has its high points, but its style and tropes aren't what make it good when it's good and, in fact, are sometimes what make it bad when it's bad. It isn't the perfect expression of the animated medium and should not be treated as such. I would much rather animators develop their own style and look to their projects.

 

[IncrediBurch]

The term "anime" is meant as a classification for cartoons made in japan. The art style, plot tropes, and other surface similarities aren't what identify cartoons as Anime or not.

There is one thing trait that is much more predominant in Anime than in US cartoons. This also goes for the difference in American comics from Japanese Comics (Manga). That is complete series plot arc with definitive endings and beginnings. This is the reason I find anime so much interesting than most American Cartoons and TV shows.

Largely, American TV programs (live action and animated) are written to be endless. Countless mini-arcs to keep the series alive until the viewership drops below profitable. In comparison, very few Anime or Manga series are written that way. Most have a definitive over-arcing plot that will lead to the series finale within a set time frame. Then, if a series is popular, the series may either receive a reboot series, spin-off series, sequel series, stand-alone movies or any combination of the afformentioned. Also, tons of merchandising works in to promote and perpetuate franchise profits well beyond a series conclusion.

Examples: Ruroni Kenshin/Samurai X, Ghost in the Shell, Dragon Ball.

Despite being long over, they still linger in fans minds and are still finding new audiences today.

I don't know how cultural differences play into these contrasting trends, or whether Anime series are more profitable than some of the most popular American shows that have ended.

 

[Gunjester]

Meh I don't think Anime is a label that should be strived for. In my opinion there is very little good anime.

You are entitled to your opinion. Granted, this isn't about striving for the label, it's for clarifying, as it doesn't really make sense. Though I suppose it'd be like how some people say fighting or sport video games aren't real video games. They are, and it's silly to say they're not.

Also, you need to look outside the mainstream anime for the jewels. Like the recent 'Fate/Zero' series that got very little attention despite it's amazing production, direction and art styles. Not to mention a more-than-decent storyline.

 

[AJax_21]

One thing The Legend of Korra has that anime has in spades.... A lackluster/rushed ending.

*sigh

Here's hoping the second part is better!

The show is great, don't get me wrong, but overall I don't really care if it isn't considered 'anime'.

Most definitely effing agreed. There's so much to ***** about the ending I don't where to begin. It blows my mind how much they dropped the ball with the ending. Korra undergoes no character development and learns bloody nothing, because hey instead of living with the consequences of having the rest of her powers taken away, the writers give her powers back in the most ass-pull deus ex machina I've ever seen. *Urgh*

Sorry for being off-topic but I love this series. Why did the ending had to suck so much?

 

[Scars Unseen]

As I asked someone before, which style of Japanese animation is anime? There are several.

And yet they all are distinct from anything western. You're missing the forest for the trees.

Let's see: either the characters will be chibi or realistic--never cartoony, except when realistic people suddenly change. Nothing will look like it's made in Flash, even if it is. There will be anime tropes, like sweat drops and red noses. Despite being Asian, they will not look Asian. The mouth animation will use flaps so that they can be synchronized with other languages. I could go on and on.

And, yes, most of this stuff is being aped by the American counterparts, but the problem is that the feel is just off. American culture and Japanese culture is just so different, and people don't think the same way.

I'd say you're seeing forests that don't exist. Or rather that you see one forest where there are several. As has been mentioned by others, there are anime out there that look nothing alike. Trying to group all Japanese animation is like trying to group all American animation. What do South Park, My Little Pony and The Incredibles have in common? They are all animated. And there are Japanese shows out there with diversity far beyond those shows.

 

[aattss]

I think that page 2 of the article gets a bit elitist, that perhaps some of your examples of American anime don't really match.

 

[Tony2077]

there is a different style when it comes to cartoons and anime. its not that crazy to group them together when some of the basic styles are the same.

 

[DuelLadyS]

It wouldn't seem correct to treat the entirety of any medium from any other culture with similar prejudice. We don't generalize all of British TV or Canadian webcomics. We don't lump together all of French music or Latin American food.

Sure we do. You don't go to Red Robin or Arby's if you want a Taco, do you? I've also sat in on more than one conversation about how British Top Gear is far better than US Top Gear.

I tend to gravitate toward British and Canadian comedy- they tend to possess the quick-witted dialog I love- the sort of thing where you almost have to watch it twice to catch the jokes. My brother loves Always Sunny in Philadelphia- I don't. Pooping the bed doesn't make me laugh.

Now, do I write off all American comedy? No- if I did, I've missed Pushing Daisies, which was an amazing show, driven by that very quick wordplay I adore. Similarly, my sister has taken to the Katy Brand show- which, despite its country of origin, jumps back to the silly slapstick that I just don't find very funny.

It's the same thing for anime. I tend to watch it becuase it's more mature than Spongebob- but not all of it is. I'd never begrudge a cool looking US production like Brave- or Korra- simply becuase it's not subtitled.

Long story short: Anime is from Japan. Good TV is from anywhere.

 

[DarkRyter]

Anime is a style, not bound by culture, in the same way that Third Person Omniscient Narration is a style.

No.

Anime is not a style.

 

[snave]

Yeah I pretty much agree with you fully. Not much else I can say.

Also this

As you raised this, I've never really understood why American television doesn't more often adopt the Japanese title card model.

I can think of only one recent series that has offhand, and that is Game of Thrones. It took the core idea of overviewing the driving themes that'll be used or introduced in the given episode (ie: the characters in a character-driven plot) and continually changing the intro a little to reflect the present state of the story. Of course, the two key differences here are that it focussed on places (story is setting-driven rather than plot-driven or character-driven; each setting represents an entire family and a kingdom) and came up with its own storyboard for the shots rather than just heavily borrowing or adapting from previous works like in your example video. End result? Critical acclaim. Funny that.

 

[Casual Shinji]

I feel like such an old fuck when saying this, but in my time it was simply called Japanese animation. And in conversations even now, I still don't use the term 'anime' or 'manga'. Probably because I don't want to come across as a massive geek at my age, but primarily because both terms are just the Japanese translation of the words 'animation' and 'comic'. So I'll just use those words instead.

In all honesty, I wish the term 'anime' would simply fucking vanish (atleast in the West). All it seems to do is uphold this ridgid design template of how something is supposed to look. The increase in anime-looking cartoons in America only supports this. Now, Avatar and Korra are the only two of these types of shows that have actual quality, but the way the character design seems hellbent on looking anime-ish always keeps it from being truly remarkable.

And Korra kinda sucked btw.

 

[ccggenius12]

Defining cartoons from Japan as Anime is the only thing that makes sense. I don't see anyone disputing that cartoons from Japan are anime, the only question is whether American animation can be called anime. The thing is, we can't elaborate the definition of anime beyond animation from Japan. Doraemon is nothing like Fist of the North Star, but they are both Anime. If you want to extend the definition to fit series from other nations, you must necessarily exclude some Japanese series that are currently considered anime, unless you intend for the word anime to be completely interchangeable with the word cartoon. Excluding currently included series does a disservice to everyone involved, and homogenizing the word is a huge waste of time. What possible reason do we need to be re-purposing existing words when there is already a perfectly functional word to convey our exact meaning?

 

[Not G. Ivingname]

Oh come on. Anyone can make anime. It's all in the presentation.

<youtube=bkP_sJty7EY>

Things I did not expect to see made with the Source Film maker, #1.

"Can anyone outside of Japan make Anime?" is unequivocally "No."
Actually the answer is Unequivocally YES. Most Anime isn't even made In Japan anymore. Most anime is farmed out to Korean Sweat Shops. Heck Legend of Korra is even made by a Korean Sweat Shop run by Buster Bunny himself.

Well, they aren't animation sweat shops any more. It is still cheaper to out source, but the South Koreans now are in better conditions, since the economy has been growing hugely, and happier workers make a better product.

And Legend of Korra's animation is a VERY good product.

I know it wasn't done by a North Korean animation studio, because the only one the country had (who made state propaganda almost exclusively, such as this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ujtp-70zQME ) closed down in 2007 because the government ran out of money to keep funding it.

 

[SnakeoilSage]

Yeah I pretty much agree with you fully. Not much else I can say.

Also this

I laughed pretty hard at this, especially when the Ranma 1/2 stuff appeared 'cause that show's almost 25 years old.

 

[MelasZepheos_v1legacy]

Anime is a style, not bound by culture, in the same way that Third Person Omniscient Narration is a style.

No.

Anime is not a style.

Would you care to elaborate?

Do you disagree that it is an artistic aesthetic developed in one country but not tied to it? Do you disagree that it is a way of telling stories that while having many influences of an Eastern culture can still be replicated by a non-Eastern storyteller?

Style in fiction is simply aspects of composition, the amalgamation of which results in a story. Which memes, which narration, which symbolism, which voice and tone all combine to create a finished whole. Whether the writer is Japanese or not, if the combination of all of the parts of the whole is indistinguishable from anime, then is it not anime?

And what about non-native Japanese who create works? So if a third generation Japanese-American who has never ever visited Japan decides to create an anime is it still an anime simply by dint of his genetic heritage? Or are you seriously suggesting that one culture cannot be understood and impact upon the storytelling of another?

It is interesting to note of Avatar the teacher of the martial arts advisor, Sifu Kisu, saw the first episode. This is Sifu Kisu's account of what happened next:

'He's always been suspect about kung fu and how it's portrayed in popular media. He watched the first three or four episodes - the boy in the iceberg - and he was teary eyed. He said, 'You did good. It represented martial arts in a very positive and beautiful light in terms of its restraint and its philosophy.'

Also, Kung Fu Panda is considered so good in China that they had official conferences about why they couldn't make movies that captured their own heritage so well.

When Western Developers make anime which is in fact better at capturing the source material than the Eastern Developers (or at least on a par with) where do you go from there?

 

[renegade7]

Apparently Avatar and Korra are not 'technically anime". How this works, I have no idea, but I have consulted with several Otakus and Japanophiles on the subject and that is apparently the final ruling. Apparently they mix in some American-style animation, which according to the neckbeards who passed that verdict means that there is a slightly stronger focus on artistic realism than in "true anime".

It sure looks like anime though, so that's enough for me. Plus they're both damn good shows that you would be an idiot to not watch simply because they fall short of some technicality required to 'truly be anime'.

It even factors in American media's unrealistic depictions of girls and young women. Seriously, look at Korra and try to tell me that girl is 16.

 

[Frylock72]

Anime is only useful as a term when it describes animated works that come from Japan. Why? Because it doesn't mean something different than the word "animation." It's the same word. The only reason it is widely known outside of Japan is because Japanese animation became popular outside of Japan. If German cartoons had become wildly popular, we'd be using the German word for cartoon to describe animated works from that country.

Hell, it's only barely adequate to describe Japanese animations, because it's not like all anime are one genre. Your article doesn't even describe anime; it describes a subtype of anime known as shonen. Try to apply your description to a show like Grave of the Fireflies and you will see that you may not understand Japanese animation as much as you think you do. What about Shoujo? Where would Azamanga Daioh fit into your article? Do you think that all anime looks the same? Does Berserk look closer to Bleach than it does Batman: Year One?

There's also the fact that anime has an entirely different culture surrounding it than American cartoons do. There's jokes, stereotypes, storylines, character types, etc. There's things that Japan just does in their shows that we don't do, and the reverse is true as well. We can't make 'anime' because a lot of us don't know about Japanese culture and why they do certain things. It's the same as us bagging on New Jersey, or how we dislike puns. Our trend towards inserting love stories into things, or any period culture like the 80s, or 90s.

The picture used for this article was Legend of Korra, and while the animation was done for that in Korea, none of the writing was. That was all over here. There are only artistic similarities to anime, nothing more.

 

[Zero=Interrupt]

No, because this:

"the term "anime" refers only to animation created by a Japanese animation team, produced in Japan, and developed for a Japanese audience, then obviously the answer to the question "Can anyone outside of Japan make Anime?" is unequivocally "No."

So there you go.

Americans can make western animation. They can make it for adults, they can make it for kids, and about anything they want. They can even make it look like anime, but it won't be Anime. There is nothing wrong with that.

There are a thousand cultural references and nuances in art, plot, voice acting, and writing style that make a good anime uniquely Japanese. When you walk down a street in Japan, and immerse yourself in the culture and language, you'll start to see the connections to what's on the screen. You won't get that in an American-made clone, because it's been written by someone not from there. You'll get something American flavored (or French, or Polish, or the other places animation also comes from). Again, not a bad thing, but it's not Anime and will never be.

Take Warehouse 13, or, better yet, Firefly. Punchy and entertaining, and generally well-written and shot. Now animate it. There you go.

You want an example of particularly excellent western animation? Batman: The Animated Series, when it first started off. More recently, Avatar (both series, are pretty great) Tron; Uprising. None of these are Anime (nor should they be called so) all are excellent animations. All have distinctly western flavor (yes, even Avatar).

 

[Active Schizophrenic]

I don't really like how they used Korra as an example instead of Avatar: The Last Airbender. If all I knew about american animation was Korra I would be disappointed because Korra is a steaming pile of dog shit.