Console Shooters No Longer Innovate, Says Original GoldenEye Director

Atmos Duality

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Experimental said:
I can think of these examples on innovation:

Battlefield 1942

Deus Ex

Call of Duty 2

Crysis

Ok, not all of them are recently, but they are post Golden eye, and somehow they put a lot of innovations in their formulas, that were duplicated over and over in other PC titles and Consoles.
Crysis was just Farcry with amazing graphics and some suit powers we had already seen in Tribes.
Hardly what I would call "innovative", though arguably better presented.

Also, nix Battlefield 1942. Command and Conquer: Renegade did that same exact concept first, and in some ways better.

OT: No kidding shooters are no longer innovative. They're the only genre that's had nonstop AAA attention since their inception.
 

teh_Canape

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Experimental said:
I can think of these examples on innovation:

Battlefield 1942

Deus Ex

Call of Duty 2

Crysis

Ok, not all of them are recently, but they are post Golden eye, and somehow they put a lot of innovations in their formulas, that were duplicated over and over in other PC titles and Consoles.
forgot Zeno Clash bro, not only because it's got a pretty original setting, but also because it gives a twist to the genre =P
 

sooperman

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Feb 11, 2009
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If there is one person in the world who gets to comment on the innovation of console shooters, it's this guy. Opening and closing doors does not seem like a monumental task, but I've yet to play another shooter that let you.

Console shooters may not be spicing it up too much, but the way I see it, they don't have to. People are buying and it works, right? Halo innovated about all it needed to for this generation of players.

If the doors get cut out of the Wii remake, I will laugh and then cry and then laugh again. :-/
 

Delusibeta

Reachin' out...
Mar 7, 2010
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Honestly? The only recent FPS that was PC exclusive I can think of is ARMA 2, it was so realistic that it makes Call of Duty look like Guitar Hero. I hated it, since I always got killed from half a kilometer away. He could, of course, be thinking of the STALKER/Cryostatus sub-genre of Eastern European survival games, which are mostly from a first person perspective.
 

SalamanderJoe

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I do agree to a point. Console shooters have pretty much the same control scheme, and multiplayer modes. Medal of Honour is a prime example.
 

mjc0961

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Nov 30, 2009
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Coming from the guy who made another N64 shooter that played fairly poorly (hello N64 controller you are terrible for shooters), it's hard to take him seriously. Especially since, which recent PC FPS was innovative exactly? The PC version of Modern Warfare 2? Or maybe it'll be the upcoming PC version of Black Ops.

sooperman said:
If there is one person in the world who gets to comment on the innovation of console shooters, it's this guy. Opening and closing doors does not seem like a monumental task, but I've yet to play another shooter that let you.
Doors? So he copied something Doom did on PC years before. That's hardly innovative at all.
 

Something Amyss

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SantoUno said:
That's funny, last time I remember almost EVERY FPS released in the past couple years have been multiplatform. So it doesn't matter if they are innovative or not, none of them can be claimed as PC or console shooters. Therefore neither platform has had an innovative FPS to itself.

There, can we stop it with the separation between the two ?
But then...How would we look down on those other guys?
 

Logan Westbrook

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Feb 21, 2008
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teh_Canape said:
forgot Zeno Clash bro, not only because it's got a pretty original setting, but also because it gives a twist to the genre =P
True enough, my bad, chap.
 

ThatJagoGuy

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Surely innovation can only go so far before you break genre entirely. I mean, Killer7 had FPS elements, and the recent Fallouts are FPS if you choose to play it that way. I'd say in this respect, they're innovating just fine.

If this little critique of gaming was consigned to the FPS genre in the strictest sense, then there's not a great deal of weight to the argument. They're not innovating in groundbreaking ways, but they're progressing nicely. The single player COD:MW2 was the best game I'd played in ages until Fable 3. The genre is not so much inhibited by a lack of creativity, as the confines of the genre classification itself. This guy is just talking for the sake of it if you ask me.

I would love a Steam platform on Xbox though. I want to play The Ship again... :D

SalamanderJoe said:
I do agree to a point. Console shooters have pretty much the same control scheme, and multiplayer modes. Medal of Honour is a prime example.
What's wrong with having the same control scheme? If it works, it works. I think you'll find PC FPS controls have used the WASD/Mouse as a basic template for longer than consoles have even had dual analogues.
 

Danpascooch

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Apr 16, 2009
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He's one of the few people I'm okay with hearing say this, after all, Goldeneye MADE Console shooters
 

Onyx Oblivion

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Sep 9, 2008
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Then what the fuck is Vanquish?

Show me another shooter with high speed rock-star knee slides that you can chain into badass flip kicks.
 

CrystalShadow

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mjc0961 said:
Coming from the guy who made another N64 shooter that played fairly poorly (hello N64 controller you are terrible for shooters)
Which would that be then?

Considering the only N64 shooters I can think of he was involved in were Goldeneye and Perfect Dark, and they both play about the same, I don't see where you get the 'bad' controls from.
Then again, I always played them with control scheme 2.1 (which is using 2 N64 controllers at the same time. - A dual analog setup)

Keep in mind the playstation dual analog controller didn't exist until 1997, so goldeneye predates it's existence.
By that token, the N64 was in fact orders of magnitude better than any previous or competing console controller.
(That no longer applies for perfect dark, but whatever. Goldeneye and Perfect Dark have almost identical controls.)

Unless you've been playing with damaged controllers (not unlikely, since the major flaw was how easily the analog sticks wore out), I fail to see how the N64 controllers are any worse for shooters than the controllers of any other console.

To be blunt, while there are newer games with better controls, one thing I found particularly striking was how absolutely atrociously bad the controls on Perfect Dark Zero (Xbox360) were compared to Perfect Dark on the N64.

Perfect Dark Zero plays like trying to manuever through congealed molasses, while the original does in fact respond very well. (at least, it does when I use one of the dual controller configurations and turn off auto-aim).

But whatever. Opinions vary of course. Altough I am curious what games you're referring to, and what you use as a point of comparison...
 

Bobzer77

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Kalezian said:
DTWolfwood said:
Celtic_Kerr said:
DTWolfwood said:
You know they can probably call it innovation if they gave Console Shooters a Prone option. XD
You mean Medal of Honor?
clarification, in multiplayer.

Call of Duty?



but Im agreeing with you, I am fucking tired of not being able to lay prone as a sniper in games like Bad Company.

"OHHH SO REALISTIC, JUST LIKE IN REAL LIFE HOW WE CANT LIE DOWN!"

makes me skip most shooters on the console now.
Well the reason they do that is because some people are too butthurt to accept that camping is a legitimate strategy.

I'm a pc gamer and while I agree that there is more innovation on the pc than on consoles I don't really think it's in fps's. TF2 and Zeno Clash are great examples and there are plenty other more obscure titles but most of the aaa titles are exactly the same.

Personally the next pc fps I'm waiting for is Battlefield 3.

So long as it's just Battlefield 2 with better graphics.

Oh and fps's like Arma and if you want to include the project reality mod for bf2 are games with no comparison on consoles.
 

thahat

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CrystalShadow said:
mjc0961 said:
Coming from the guy who made another N64 shooter that played fairly poorly (hello N64 controller you are terrible for shooters)
snip!
conquers bad furday was also on n64. god i had a lot of fun with that game, and i dont remember its controlls to ahve been bad. actualy quite good for that day and age even.. so n64 unsuitable for shooters? no. i think you hit it right o nthe head with perfect dark and goldeneye.
 

Dan E

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Ah, GoldenEye my childhood in a nutshell. From the pieces I can remember it was the game to have. I do know what he means with almost zero innovation. But my question to him is what would he do to "innovate" the current FPS genre as it is today? I think you can only do so much with a game where all you do is shoot and interact with the environment in a first-person perspective.