Corvid-19 and its impact (name edit)

[Agema]

They say the coronavirus caused the recent stock market crash; but it's more likely to be the oil war's fault.

No, it's coronavirus. The oil war started after the stock markets began to crumble and there's no good reason for an oil price war with lower prices to cause such widespread damage: after all, it's actually to make a lot of things cheaper (except perhaps in a few countries where damage may occur because oil companies collapse by being too expensive, such as North America).

 

[CaitSeith]

They say the coronavirus caused the recent stock market crash; but it's more likely to be the oil war's fault.

No, it's coronavirus. The oil war started after the stock markets began to crumble and there's no good reason for an oil price war with lower prices to cause such widespread damage: after all, it's actually to make a lot of things cheaper (except perhaps in a few countries where damage may occur because oil companies collapse by being too expensive, such as North America).

Cheaper things scare investors off, and scared investors is what makes stocks collapse.

 

[crimson5pheonix]

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It's both. It's very interconnected. The coronavirus is of course affecting global trade as planes and ships aren't setting out and some countries are shutting down in fear of the disease, which was driving oil demand low. The oil war is creating a glut of oil on top of that which is bad for a whole host of businesses investors like to invest in. It helps plastics and other end user industries, but it hurts the companies involved in shale oil drilling and fracking, which tend to be small companies that will likely go under because of this.

This is just a host of panics resulting in investors pulling out of several industries spooking other investors into pulling out of everything everywhere and the markets crashing as a result.

 

[tstorm823]

This is just a host of panics resulting in investors pulling out of several industries spooking other investors into pulling out of everything everywhere and the markets crashing as a result.

I believe this is one of the situations where calling them "investors" with the condescending quotation marks is justified.

 

[crimson5pheonix]

This is just a host of panics resulting in investors pulling out of several industries spooking other investors into pulling out of everything everywhere and the markets crashing as a result.

I believe this is one of the situations where calling them "investors" with the condescending quotation marks is justified.

It always is. But yes, it's the people looking to make a buck first and foremost, with no care about the company itself. Granted that's like 99% of the money in the stock markets, but still.

 

[Kwak]

Given the ferret-on-speed nature of stockmarkets and the power of fear and imagination to destroy real-world value, can stock trading be halted during crises? Like what if everyone just said that whatever the value of the stock was yesterday, that's what it will be until this thing is over?

 

[Agema]

Given the ferret-on-speed nature of stockmarkets and the power of fear and imagination to destroy real-world value, can stock trading be halted during crises?

Yep. The stock market can be shut down, and has been even quite recently. 9/11 caused the US stock markets to shut down for about a week I think, and there was a halt in 2008 when the financial crash kicked in. I guess there could be other forms of controls put in place, but whether the legislation exists in various jurisdictions I can't say.

These days they also have automatic triggers that temporarily halt trading in case of particularly large, sudden falls so everyone can take stock (if you'll forgive the pun) and make sure it's not rampant panic or algorithms.

 

[Seanchaidh]

Weird how when the rubber meets the road, the answer to a crisis is typically not to let the market work its supposed magic but to avoid the market "working" at all.

 

[tstorm823]

Weird how when the rubber meets the road, the answer to a crisis is typically not to let the market work its supposed magic but to avoid the market "working" at all.

As it turns out, a crisis is exactly the situation you want decisive, centralized action.

 

[Agema]

As it turns out, a crisis is exactly the situation you want decisive, centralized action.

Well, Trump sure has sounded decisive about getting that wall built in response to covid19, and he decisively put someone else in charge of doing something. And Congress are shortly about to decisively take a recess.

 

[Silvanus]

Weird how when the rubber meets the road, the answer to a crisis is typically not to let the market work its supposed magic but to avoid the market "working" at all.

Very strange indeed.

Strange, also, how the UK's Conservatives have (in today's virus-combating budget announcements) discovered that high levels of spending actually can stimulate economic growth and lessen the impact of recession. It's almost as if the long years of austerity weren't actually necessary to combat the deficit after all.

 

[Saint of M]

The biggest threat involving this whole issue won?t be the virus itself, but how the human race has responded to it. The threat of infection could have been minimized greatly if everyone stopped traveling, but who?s going to do that right? Now we are issuing state of emergencies at the first cases of infection, and the greater public is approaching full batshit mode where you can?t even find hand sanitizer, Lysol wipes or toilet paper in the store, all while it still hasn?t reached most places.

How much will people lose their shit when it does?

 

[CaitSeith]

Things seem to be pretty bad in Italy. It spread under their noses and now, with over 10,000 cases, the hospitals are out of beds and there isn't enough medical equipment to treat all the severe cases. It's pretty much worst case scenario for that country.

 

[Agema]

Things seem to be pretty bad in Italy. It spread under their noses and now, with over 10,000 cases, the hospitals are out of beds and there isn't enough medical equipment to treat all the severe cases. It's pretty much worst case scenario for that country.

What happened to Italy could have been dozens of countries, my own included. Part of it is dumb bad luck - a few cases go unnoticed in the wrong way and that's that.

Germany really has its shit together. It's got quick and plentiful testing capability and lots of ITU capacity. Over 1000 cases and just 3 deaths.

* * *

I just want to note that when you really want your government to offer a feeling they know what do and have it hand, Trump's uneven speech included a howler that had to be promptly corrected. Meanwhile in my country, the government manages to approximately sat the right things whilst never convincing many they will deal with it. Ugh.

 

[Marik2]

I wish I had money to buy cheap stocks and wait until they go back up in price once the virus has died down.

 

[BrawlMan]

MOAR corona stupidity.


Old news, but Michigan has two cases of corona. One in Oakland County (the dude came back from Italy) & the other in Wayne County. I live in the Oakland district, but not close to where the person lives. Everybody stay safe and use common sense.

 

[tstorm823]

I've been making jokes all day because the supermarket was wiped out of toilet paper, hand sanitizer, and the self-serve bakery donuts that everyone sticks their hands into. For the record, I don't think there are any confirmed cases within 50 miles of me.

 

[Saint of M]

I don't have to get up at 7 in the morning on Sunday for a while. The leaders of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints (LDS, Mormons) have announced no church meetings due to Corona Virus.

Also another thing near and dear to my heart, Special Olympics in at least Northern California has been canceled due to it.

SO things that have been canceled
COncerts
COnventions
The Nation of Italy
Church
Special Olympics
People's good senses

 

[Terminal Blue]

The threat of infection could have been minimized greatly if everyone stopped traveling, but who?s going to do that right? Now we are issuing state of emergencies at the first cases of infection, and the greater public is approaching full batshit mode where you can?t even find hand sanitizer, Lysol wipes or toilet paper in the store, all while it still hasn?t reached most places.

I think there's a very good argument that most countries aren't doing enough.

Trying to limit travel was never really going to be effective, because as we've seen once the virus gets into a population it is going to spread. It may take several months to get there, but it will get there eventually. It's likely already present in most countries in the world, probably carried by people who might not even be showing symptoms.

The actual reason people shouldn't travel is because, if the virus gets worse, they might end up stuck somewhere.

But people absolutely should be warned early on in the outbreak, because people need to make plans. People have to cancel their flights, people have to make concrete plans for what they will do if they or their relatives get sick. How will people get by if they have to self-isolate? Will someone be able to home-nurse an elderly or severely ill person if there are no hospital beds available?

Decisive action and guidance early on in the outbreak can make an absolutely huge difference down the line. In a lot of countries, that just hasn't happened.

 

[Chimpzy_v1legacy]

Update from Belgium here. So far we're at around 400 infections and 3 confirmed fatalities.

Yesterday evening our government announced countrywide preventative mesures effective immediately until April 3rd, including:

- All schools are closed until up to and including the Easter holidays, except universities and colleges.
- All sports, entertainment and other public events are cancelled.
- All bars, clubs and restaurants are closed
- All stores are closed, except those selling essentials such as food, medication, fuel.
- Law enforcement has been authorized to shut down and fine any transgressions.
- People are greatly encouraged to stay indoors and work from home wherever possible.

Not a fullblown lockdown like Italy. You can already see the effects tho. Country is effectively shut down. There is noticeably less traffic on the roads. Lots of stores staying dark. I'm in the food distribution sector, one of the few that hasn't ground to a halt. Quite the opposite, demand has skyrocketed. Lots of people in panic mode are raiding supermarkets for food, toilet paper and other necessities. So at least I still get to work. Silver lining?