Critical Miss: Dragon Age: Destiny

[z3rostr1fe]

Trick is, don't take her with you when you get the Ashes. Leave her at camp, then when you come back she'll eventually confront you. Lie to the stupid cow and she'll believe you.

Status quo regained.

But... I need a healer!
I guess i'll be off packing up some pots then instead...

What, Leliana is your healer?

Do you mean Wynne?

...I stand corrected... Obviously, I needed to play DA:O again after I got bored in Orzammar last year...

 

[Forktongue]

Zevran appearing is a bug, Leliana isn't as far as I'm aware, as there's a post on the BioWare forums where David Gaider announces that they decide when someone is dead and when they reuse them (and it was in response to Leliana showing up).

I'd be interested in seeing that thread, do you know its title?. Not that I don't believe you, I'm just basing my comments off of threads regarding the upcoming patch and how much it focuses on fixing the DA:O save import function. A lot of people here keep mentioning this writer (Gaider?) who just decided to bring Lelianna back regardless of the choices made in the last game. I can only hope this writer is given less free reign in the future, maybe give him some time off to focus on his OTP fanfic. Bioware is better than that.

 

[Stevepinto3]

Gahh!!! Spoiler!!! :<

Now I know that Leilana will try and hinder me from gaining those things! And I need those ashes! Now I regret trying to finish up America Orzammar first!

Relax...

Spoiler

She only fights you if you try to do defile the ashes by pouring into them the blood of a dragon that has convinced a bunch of cultist villagers that it is the reincarnation of the holy prophet Andraste. No, REALLY.

 

[Canid117]

What kind of sick bastard kills Leliana anyway?

That's like kicking a French kitten.

It's the French part that did it for most people.

 

[Desert Tiger]

Trick is, don't take her with you when you get the Ashes. Leave her at camp, then when you come back she'll eventually confront you. Lie to the stupid cow and she'll believe you.

Status quo regained.

But... I need a healer!
I guess i'll be off packing up some pots then instead...

What, Leliana is your healer?

Do you mean Wynne?

If it makes you feel any better, she doesn't like it and you'll have to kill her if you take her too! ^_^

 

[Woodsey]

Zevran appearing is a bug, Leliana isn't as far as I'm aware, as there's a post on the BioWare forums where David Gaider announces that they decide when someone is dead and when they reuse them (and it was in response to Leliana showing up).

I'd be interested in seeing that thread, do you know its title?. Not that I don't believe you, I'm just basing my comments off of threads regarding the upcoming patch and how much it focuses on fixing the DA:O save import function. A lot of people here keep mentioning this writer (Gaider?) who just decided to bring Lelianna back regardless of the choices made in the last game. I can only hope this writer is given less free reign in the future, maybe give him some time off to focus on his OTP fanfic. Bioware is better than that.

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/9.274827-David-Gaider-says-Bioware-decides-what-dead-means-in-Dragon-Age-2?page=1

The only reasoning he can come up with is that if she was killed then she's now alive, and that it was totally intentional, they just haven't said how yet... Only that doesn't add up, since she appears for 30 seconds at the end with no mention of her possible death. Considering its such a massive problem, you'd think they'd at least mention it in people's games, if not offer the reason for how it came about yet.

I mean come on, if you killed Carth in KotOR then they just swapped him out for someone else in KotOR 2. There's no point giving people choices if you're going to fold on them completely so that you can go back on something.

And that doesn't fix my problem anyway: my Warden died, there's no mystery about his "disappearance" because he's where they buried him (unless they cremated him, can't remember now). And she should know anyway, she was banging him.

 

[secretsantaone]

Zevran appearing is a bug, Leliana isn't as far as I'm aware, as there's a post on the BioWare forums where David Gaider announces that they decide when someone is dead and when they reuse them (and it was in response to Leliana showing up).

I'd be interested in seeing that thread, do you know its title?. Not that I don't believe you, I'm just basing my comments off of threads regarding the upcoming patch and how much it focuses on fixing the DA:O save import function. A lot of people here keep mentioning this writer (Gaider?) who just decided to bring Lelianna back regardless of the choices made in the last game. I can only hope this writer is given less free reign in the future, maybe give him some time off to focus on his OTP fanfic. Bioware is better than that.

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/9.274827-David-Gaider-says-Bioware-decides-what-dead-means-in-Dragon-Age-2?page=1

The only reasoning he can come up with is that if she was killed then she's now alive, and that it was totally intentional, they just haven't said how yet... Only that doesn't add up, since she appears for 30 seconds at the end with no mention of her possible death. Considering its such a massive problem, you'd think they'd at least mention it in people's games, if not offer the reason for how it came about yet.

I mean come on, if you killed Carth in KotOR then they just swapped him out for someone else in KotOR 2. There's no point giving people choices if you're going to fold on them completely so that you can go back on something.

And that doesn't fix my problem anyway: my Warden died, there's no mystery about his "disappearance" because he's where they buried him (unless they cremated him, can't remember now). And she should know anyway, she was banging him.

I do like how when I made that thread most of the responses accused me of being a dragon age hater and being obsessed over minor plot holes, while as soon as a comic is made about it everyone suddenly agrees.

Strange that.

 

[Woodsey]

Zevran appearing is a bug, Leliana isn't as far as I'm aware, as there's a post on the BioWare forums where David Gaider announces that they decide when someone is dead and when they reuse them (and it was in response to Leliana showing up).

I'd be interested in seeing that thread, do you know its title?. Not that I don't believe you, I'm just basing my comments off of threads regarding the upcoming patch and how much it focuses on fixing the DA:O save import function. A lot of people here keep mentioning this writer (Gaider?) who just decided to bring Lelianna back regardless of the choices made in the last game. I can only hope this writer is given less free reign in the future, maybe give him some time off to focus on his OTP fanfic. Bioware is better than that.

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/9.274827-David-Gaider-says-Bioware-decides-what-dead-means-in-Dragon-Age-2?page=1

The only reasoning he can come up with is that if she was killed then she's now alive, and that it was totally intentional, they just haven't said how yet... Only that doesn't add up, since she appears for 30 seconds at the end with no mention of her possible death. Considering its such a massive problem, you'd think they'd at least mention it in people's games, if not offer the reason for how it came about yet.

I mean come on, if you killed Carth in KotOR then they just swapped him out for someone else in KotOR 2. There's no point giving people choices if you're going to fold on them completely so that you can go back on something.

And that doesn't fix my problem anyway: my Warden died, there's no mystery about his "disappearance" because he's where they buried him (unless they cremated him, can't remember now). And she should know anyway, she was banging him.

I do like how when I made that thread most of the responses accused me of being a dragon age hater and being obsessed over minor plot holes, while as soon as a comic is made about it everyone suddenly agrees.

Strange that.

Hey, I agreed with you mostly. I liked the game, but the seeming lack of consequences is quite shocking. I mean, there are major decisions in DA2 alone that don't affect anything, and then they're introducing the implementation of save files that are retconned anyway.

 

[rsvp42]

Hey, I agreed with you mostly. I liked the game, but the seeming lack of consequences is quite shocking. I mean, there are major decisions in DA2 alone that don't affect anything, and then they're introducing the implementation of save files that are retconned anyway.

Wait... what? This is news to me. I finished DA2 a couple nights ago and it seemed like there some pretty significant choices that affected what characters survived, ran off, etc. Hell, I even got crap from Aveline for selling her husband's shield. I dunno, seemed like there were a decent number of big choices.

Also, I had no clue Leliana could be killed in Origins. Then again, I rarely used her after I got Wynne. I needed those extra heals.

 

[Woodsey]

Hey, I agreed with you mostly. I liked the game, but the seeming lack of consequences is quite shocking. I mean, there are major decisions in DA2 alone that don't affect anything, and then they're introducing the implementation of save files that are retconned anyway.

Wait... what? This is news to me. I finished DA2 a couple nights ago and it seemed like there some pretty significant choices that affected what characters survived, ran off, etc. Hell, I even got crap from Aveline for selling her husband's shield. I dunno, seemed like there were a decent number of big choices.

Also, I had no clue Leliana could be killed in Origins. Then again, I rarely used her after I got Wynne. I needed those extra heals.

I was referring specifically to Anders, and how there's only one ending.

 

[rsvp42]

I was referring specifically to Anders, and how there's only one ending.

Ah. Never really did much in Awakenings, myself.

 

[Feylynn]

She technically died in Lothering in my first game, I never met her.
She broke in my second game, got her agreement to high and she broke cutting off all her dialog, quest, and ability to care that I defiled the ashes.
Third time she actually functioned and I managed to not hate her.

If they provide an official explanation, or short story, or flash back in future Dragon Age installments explaining what magic or luck allowed her to live, then I'll continue my initial response of "Fair enough, Wynn was dead, My Warden should have died but didn't thanks to Flemmeth, then thanks to her friends, then thanks to Morrigan."

In my game's case it could be as simple as, "Well of course she didn't bloody well wait around and die to the Darkspawn and fire!"
I think I'll choose to believe she waited long enough that my Hawke knew her, maybe helped her escape.

If people are going to be hard on bad writing, be hard where it's due, Leliana's DA1 DLC.
Big narrative "omg that was my journey I'll leave you to decide how it ended... Even though you already explicitly know that I didn't die, and she didn't die, and then I came with you, and then we killed her, and then I explained all this in as much text as it really needed."
__

Beyond all that, almost off topic really.
Cameos make the world go round.
I would have liked Dragon Age 2 significantly less if it weren't for Flemmeth, Alistair, Leliana, the Shale rumor in the Hanged Man, Zevran, Anders, Merril etc.
Amazingly enough they all lined up flawlessly with my DA1 game. Awakening and DA1 had more issues with themselves than DA2 did with consistency.

 

[ecoho]

ok there are a few things that need to be addressd.
1. in any game of that many choices there is always a "cannon" story which the developers agree on.
2.this is not even a real retcon. the decapitation animation is random for all enimies so she could have been rezed or saved by the ashes.
3.in the case of zevren hes and elf they do funky things............

in the long run they told you what they take as cannon (theyve said that the shepard thats cannon is male already btw) and people got butthurt cause in a small amount of play throughs they killed her.(a little more people killed zevren but like i said elves are weird like that)

 

[ace_of_something]

I think unofficially you're not allowed to complain about spoilers for a game that has been widely successful and been out for over a year you can't claim
"OMG Spoilers"

 

[The Wooster]

. Hilariously enough someone like Bethesda is allowed to get away with this every single time while their upcoming sequels are praised unendingly. Whereas when Bioware tries to pull this just once and suddenly you have everyone jumping on the hate train heh...not to say it isn't deserved - it is, they ultimately lowered their standards with this one. But double standards for the win every time I guess.

In our defense I don't think the strip had started last time Bethesda released a game. Trust me, if Skyrim is anything like Oblivion there'll be a few strips on that too.

 

[Elf Defiler Korgan]

Killing the French Bard and the crabby old lady in the first one over the ashes, was so much fun. I did have a boss to dispose of, but I took my time.

 

[Eponet]

Well, I suppose it's fortunate that the whole trailer for DA2 was named Destiny and the narrative within it was of how it's best to embrace it rather than fight it. *rolleyes*

and that it was advertised a spiritual sequel to Baldur's Gate, with Baldur's Gate II being filled with Wait, Edwin, didn't we kill you? or Xar? Aren't you dead?

 

[Soviet Heavy]

You can say what you will about Gaider standing up for his work, but that doesn't stop him from coming across as a jackass.
Bad ratings? Its all 4-Chans fault.
One heterosexual has an issue? He's a homophobe.
Concerns over how valid our choices are in the previous game? Fuck you I can do what I want with my story.

 

[Shamanic Rhythm]

Monty Python all the way.

You can say what you will about Gaider standing up for his work, but that doesn't stop him from coming across as a jackass.
Bad ratings? Its all 4-Chans fault.
One heterosexual has an issue? He's a homophobe.
Concerns over how valid our choices are in the previous game? Fuck you I can do what I want with my story.

1. There really was a serious amount of score bombing on the first day. Say what you will about Dragon Age II, but it's not worth a 1 out of 10. Most of the people posting that on day one had already made up their mind to hate it. That's what he was talking about. The consensus seems to have otherwise been that it's just mediocre, but not shockingly bad.
2. I'd like you to explain how you can spin 'I want an option that turns off gays in this game' in a way that is not incredibly disrespectful to homosexuals everywhere and comes across as massively homophobic. Because that's what he was demanding.
3. They did drop the ball on this one, I must say.