Do all women like jerks? No (a rant)

[Sarah Frazier]

Myths, just plain myths. Being an asshole does not = alpha male behavior. Why do people always confuse being an asshole with cockiness (confidence). I'm a nice guy, but i'm confident. I walk into a room large and confident. That's what a women notices. Just like if a girl walks into a room with grace and an air of confidence i'll notice that.

That's another thing I wonder too when it gets to be this early in the morning... What's the difference between being an ass and being assertive? For me it's the manner of approach. The ass will say and do things knowing it'll bother people and get them attention (but in some cases they see no connection with their actions and the reactions of others) while someone who's assertive will act in a way people will notice but not always just to benefit their own agenda.

To simplify the thought process before I fall asleep: Walking into a room and shouting obscenities will get attention for being bold and obnoxious. Walking into a room and shouting a greeting will get attention for being bold and obnoxious too, but still more approachable than the first option.

 

[RhombusHatesYou]

What's the difference between being an ass and being assertive?

The all important '-ertive'.

 

[LostTimeLady]

Thank you, Muchas Gracias, Merci Bucket and the like for this thread.

I'm in total agreement (or as total as you can cos it's not your own opinion) with what's been said here.

Womean are people. We're not all the same. Yay! Someone said it! (Not that I haven't been saying it for yonks but hay!)

Not that I'm here to fan the flames but also I just find it interesting as well that these sorts of sweeping generalisations are made about women but never men. Ah, one day there will be equality when both men and women will be equally generalised (JOKE).

As a final note though to all those disheartened sensitive types who think they'll never get the girl:

The jerks aren't the guys girls stay with forever. You will eventually get a girl who treats you like her Prince and so just make sure you treat that special women you find like a princess. Then you'll have her forever.
(See I'm all for the equality!)

 

[Aulleas123]

Yes, many of you probably have met awful women in your lives. Maybe they were rude to you when you were just trying to be chivalrous, maybe they treated you like a combined butler and atm. Maybe you got stuck in the friend zone while they dated someone who you could see was never going to treat them right. I am not denying that these women exist, I've even met some of them. I don't think I'm one of them, and for the most part my friends aren't either.

First off, I'm a guy, and I think that it's wonderful that you and your friends say that they're not that kind of woman. However, in my experience, I have witnessed hundreds of women (yes, hundreds) who say just that same thing. They say they're not interested in 'jerks' and that they 'want someone who can empathize' but when it really comes down to it, women will go after the guys with the best looks (according to their standards, of course) and the most confidence. I'm not meaning to assume that you're a liar, it's just a claim that I've heard from way too many women to take seriously.

I've found that when men and women talk about potential partners, relationships, and sex, we all become politicians. We all spew the same BS to total strangers in the expectation to be more socially acceptable.

Look, I get it. You're frustrated with our viewpoint of women because of our lack of ability with dealing with women (mine especially), I sympathize. But instead of being frustrated, use our stereotype to get just the kind of guy you want by not being the stereotype. If you are truly honest about what you say you are (i.e. looking for a guy with confidence who isn't a tool) then you'll definitely find your guy. You might have to look a little, but if you act the way you do and find that guy who makes you happy, then the heavens will open and all candy and goodness will come forth from Babylon and Zion and all will enjoy the happiness and wonder of true love; and really, it's your combined happiness that should matter most, not our idiotic assumptions about that pesky other gender.

(Ok, apologies for that last bit, both for the weird bit and the assumption that you are single and haven't already had your candy and goodness)

 

[jamesworkshop]

Thank you, Muchas Gracias, Merci Bucket and the like for this thread.

I'm in total agreement (or as total as you can cos it's not your own opinion) with what's been said here.

Womean are people. We're not all the same. Yay! Someone said it! (Not that I haven't been saying it for yonks but hay!)

Not that I'm here to fan the flames but also I just find it interesting as well that these sorts of sweeping generalisations are made about women but never men. Ah, one day there will be equality when both men and women will be equally generalised (JOKE).

As a final note though to all those disheartened sensitive types who think they'll never get the girl:

The jerks aren't the guys girls stay with forever. You will eventually get a girl who treats you like her Prince and so just make sure you treat that special women you find like a princess. Then you'll have her forever.
(See I'm all for the equality!)

For the topic I don't really care

I'm sorry but

http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&biw=1259&bih=841&q=do+all+men+like+sluts&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&oq=

http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&pwst=1&biw=1276&bih=841&&sa=X&ei=5WQ5TbLMGcWYhQe616GOCg&ved=0CBYQvwUoAQ&q=guys+scared+of+independent+women&spell=1

http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&biw=1259&bih=841&q=do+all+men+like+skinny+women&aq=0m&aqi=g-m1g-v1&aql=&oq=all+men+like+s

Can you really honestly say that you believe that in reguards to the dating arena their are no generalisations about men.

 

[Isalan]

Kudos on a very well put together post.

Incidentally, I'll be contacting the Oxford English Dictionary in an attempet to get the word "Vagenda" introduced. My life is not going to be complete til that word is officially part of the english language.

 

[floppylobster]

I completely agree with the OP. I would only add -

Girls like jerks because it angers them to be belittled. And that anger gets confused with a sexual impulse and it turns them on. Are you liking me yet OP?

(It's a joke you see, I'm being a jerk and expecting to be liked).

Only it doesn't work because most girls don't like jerks. They like who they like. And those guys they like can be jerks to them and the girls will be a little more forgiving toward them because they like them (over someone they're not attracted to). It's a little give and take, a testing of boundaries to see if they're compatible, to see if they can stand up to them, to see if they're a suitable partner. Too much of a jerk and she may find her self-respect defeats her attraction and dump him. Too little and she may find him weak and unchallenging and leave him (but maybe that's what she's after).

Anyway, my point is - to people who actually believe this stereotype - it may look from the outside that a guy is being a jerk to a girl. But most of the time the girl is letting him be a jerk to her. And when she's sick of it, she'll stand up for herself or let him know he's gone too far. You don't see the 24:7 of real relationships so while it looks like he's 'treating her mean'. In most long terms relationships, there's a whole lot more going on.

I can be a jerk to my girlfriend. The fact that she puts up with me being a jerk proves to me she likes me. The fact that I don't abuse that kindness lets me know I respect her. It's never a perfect balance but really when is it? I can be a jerk to my cat too. And my cat can be a jerk to me. Same with my friends. All relationships have a give and take. Really we're all jerks sometimes, so to say all girls like jerks is true. But if you were to say they only like jerks? Well then you're just being a jerk.

 

[Dogstile]

Ok, their are a few things I agree with here, first off.

One thing that my experiences of women have taught me is that it's near impossible to produce a blueprint for all women any more detailed than 'has a vagina and breasts' and sometimes even that's not entirely accurate.

I'm still surprised a forum such as this one still does this, considering it's members praise themselves for the intelligence often actually, its odd.

Yes I do have some friends who date guys that treat them like princesses, and I have friends who date guys that treat them like dirt.

What people don't seem to understand is if a girl goes out with a guy that treats them like shit, then they probably aren't the girl for them as they don't match. I swear people when talking about these girls are just forcing their feelings.

(love, intimacy and sexytime).

hehe, sexytime

I personally do not want to date a guy who does everything for me, pays for every meal, insists on carrying everything for me, buys gifts for me all the time, calls me every half hour and constantly worries about whether or not I'm okay. I'm a woman, not an invalid.

Agreed, guys on here who are reading this, take note. Be nice, be caring. Don't however, treat her like she needs you to do everything to her. Personal experience tells me that girls get tired of it fast, depending on the girl.

I'm sick of seeing people appearing on this forum with an axe to grind about how they'll never find a woman because they're not horrible enough for women to be attracted to them.

Also, if one of these people are reading this, here's a hint. You're not that nice or perfect if you've come onto a forum full of people you've never met to ***** about the other half of the species.

Your rant was sorely needed, this forum is getting ridiculous with relationship threads.

 

[minimacker]

*Rubs chin*
So chivalry is a complete turn-off?

I did not know that.

 

[RaphaelsRedemption]

*Rubs chin*
So chivalry is a complete turn-off?

I did not know that.

Not for me. I like chivalry.

But not coddling... there is a difference!

 

[SL33TBL1ND]

While I certainly agree with you on the fact that not all women like to date jerks, all the ones that I've met like to date jerks.

 

[Vladu]

Beautiful.

And, at the same time, not at all gratifying.
I've sifted through the OP's novel and the first two pages, and I still feel the need to say this:

Bravo, but because of your kin's ( or...well...sex's ) OTHER members, because of my being a general dick to anyone who is a dick because I see no point in not being a decent person ( and getting seriously pissed off at obnoxious fellows and ladies), I'm not buying any of this until it actually smacks me in the face in real life.

 

[TenSecondHero]

I read the original post, but nothing after that.

I just felt the need to thank you for writing this. I completely agree with you about being equals in a relationship. My last girlfriend left me because she felt I didn't dote on her enough. I'm a very loving person, but I need some time on my own sometimes.

I wish more people thought like you, frankly. That goes for men and women. The whole gender bashing thing needs to stop. I often feel like we're back in primary school when we thought girls had rabies. It's ridiculous. There are nice girls, and there are nice guys, and then there are the bad eggs. The thing with a box of eggs though is that you have plenty to choose from. If you get a bad one, you move on until you find the one that's right for you.

Kudos for taking the time to explain your opinions with rational thought rather than the usual tirade of 'WTF!? UZ WIMMEN AIN'T ALL EVIL, YO!', or if you're in the male camp 'THEZ BITCHEZ R ALL SLUTZ N SHIT, YO!'.

Yeah.

 

[Ickorus]

Awesome post, im pretty sure it comes from when people are teenagers most girls aren't dating and the ones that do tend to be going out with the popular guys (who are often jerks) so the average guy asks out a non-dating girl and when they get turned down they lump them in the 'only dates jerks' catagory despite the girl not dating anyone.

If that makes sense at all.

 

[LightspeedJack]

massive beasty snip

There are womens on this forum?

On topic I feel your pain, it annoys me when girls say, "Why are all boys assholes." No you just date assholes.

Halfway through reading this I started thinking about Sandwhiches. I can't think why...

 

[inflamessoilwork]

I want a guy who has his own friends, life and interests outside of our relationship, and who doesn't constantly need me there to support him.

Sooooo, how about we grab a pint? haha

In all seriousness though, thanks for putting this up. The "Why nice guys finish last" trend on here was starting to become irritating.

 

[Sweedie]

I'm not sure if others see it this way too, but I've come to consider "Attractiveness" as a completly separate personality trait, rather than a combination of other traits. Atleast it seems to be that way in men. An attractive guy isn't attractive because of his looks, because he treats people a certain way or whatever.

He's attractive because he's...attractive.

It seems to me that while women say they are looking for certain traits in men and what have you, it all still seems to boil down to them looking for these traits IN ADDITION to the guy being attractive. And pretty much all women seem to respond the same way to the attractiveness trait.

This theory is strengthened by the existance of "players" and different kinds of guys who always have women wanting them. The fact that these guys are different is what makes me believe in the existance of attractiveness as a separate trait.

However, the main reason guys tend to think the way they do about women (they all like jerks etc) is mainly due to the existance of "players". One guy could have 10-20 women (AT LEAST) waiting for him to become single, while others won't even have women looking their way. It's mainly fueled by jealously and a lack of understanding.

 

[Gigano]

I'm sure a majority of women would prefer a partner with a certain measure of self-confidence and outward assertion, which (need) have nothing to do with being a "jerk".

Of course, there are all kinds of individual preferences in terms of partners and romancing styles, but it would probably not be an unfair assumption that assertive men - with the biologically imprinted perceived ability to father and protect strong off-spring - show up on the radars of more potential partners, just like assertive women - with the right biologically imprinted "hourglass" proportion of curves ideal to bearing offspring - are likely to do in reverse.

Being out-going and assertive is inevitably a psychological boon - a better outset for being noticed - and while more "jerks" than "nice guys" might possess these traits (correlation), there's no link to the negative behaviour also exhibited by "jerks" (causality). And ultimately individual preferences - which can modify or completely superceed the biological outsets - is what matter when looking for a partner, or being looked at by one.