Does Being Politically Incorrect Makes You A Bigot?

[Saelune]

No but it might make you a jerk. I've known a few people who used it as an excuse to just be a douche.

This. I tend to find it's always the people that embrace this label are always super confrontational and shit. They're also people that claim they're "telling it like it is"

No. You can't tell it like it is, because you haven't a fucking clue how it is. No one fucking does, I really wish people in general would pull their head out of their ass and realize most of their opinions aren't based on sound judgement. You don't know shit, I don't know shit, no one knows anything. Shit is very complex and ain't nobody got time for that.

I don't think saying controversial things alone makes someone a racist or a bigot or a sexist or ableist or whatever the fuck. In my opinion those things require one thing: Hate in a person's heart nothing more and nothing less.

ya know, it's like the people that see a transgendered person and not want to use the preferred pronouns... which hey, I get the frustration beyond transphobia since I hop on Twitter and it's one thing to want to use They as your pronoun, but some people are flat out making up words. Someone wanted to be called "zhr" I am not making that up. How the fuck do you even pronounce that?

That bullshit aside though, I'm more than happy to just call a person whatever gender they want to be, use whatever pronoun (though granted I'll probably fuck it up)... Is that me being PC? I don't think it is. That's me just being polite and friendly. I don't feel like calling someone their preferred gender affects me in any way what so-ever and it's such a small thing to do that'll make a person feel welcome.

...That is unless the person is making up shit like "zhr" cause then, ya know, fuck off. You're making up shit. There is not even a fucking vowel in that word.

You could like...talk to them about it, instead of just getting mad and telling them what they are.

They're just a random person I saw on Twitter. a single person. Not representive of everyone. and I wouldnt ask them because Unlike 90% of people I don't harass strangers I disagree with on there... mostly. I occasionally I fuck up this rule... I just block and move on. Nothing fruitful can come from that conversation, and I'm relatively sure that person wouldn't want to be my friend anyway... so ya know, I just leave 'em alone. No sense in giving somebody a bad day.

But C'mon Saelune, I'll call anybody what they want to be called when I see this person making up words with no vowels for pronouns that's the point where I start feeling like they're taking the piss. And it's not just a piss at me, it's a piss on actual transfolks that have a hard enough time as it is with the pronoun thing. That's what annoys me. This is just my opinion of course, but I don't feel It's an unreasonable one to have.

I mean hell, if one is going to make up a word can it at least be one I can figure out how to pronounce by looking at it?

Why cant something come of the discussion? Maybe nothing will, but maybe something will, you cannot really know until it happens, and even then, not all ripples are obvious.

Maybe they are taking the piss...but maybe they arent. I know firsthand the difficulties of being trans, and thats WHY I am willing to atleast humor it. Maybe there is something they are going through that I just cannot understand. Maybe they are just finding themselves. Its taken me a long time to understand as much about myself and my gender as I do now, and I still feel lost and confused on who I really am.

Never tell someone else how they feel. Even if they should not logically feel that way, they feel how they feel. Its like punching someone and saying "Oh that didnt hurt" when they say ow. I have very sensitive skin, and bruise easily, but still my brother, my very strong brother will punch me and say that did not hurt, but it did. And it only pisses me off.

Cause theres one thing to engage discussion on a message board, Twitter to me is like having the window open of your house. You pick your neighbors in a following list. echange pleasentrys and jokes. Maybe you do serious topics with people you considering twitterfriends.

But you don't want some random douchebag yelling in through the window "Brah? Why not a real word?" as if I'm really entitled to an answer. I don't always do the best job of it, but I don't wanna be that guy... I don't need to know that badly.

And it is an issue that I... cautiously say matters a bit to me as well though I'm not comfortable sharing it at the moment. Haven't sorted out my own feelings and all that jazz.

Also Re: Feelings, I don't disagree. Pricisely why I believe it's sometimes to just block and give people a wide berth... I actually am somebody who believes how someone feels matters, perhaps even more than facts. I know it's very popular these days for the kids to go "Oh fuck your feelings", but since humans are emotional beings that feels counter intuitive.

but... it's also not a big deal I blocked zhr. I block people on Twitter for like... no reason. Most of the time it's people that don't even know me.

I dont like blocking people. I have 0 people blocked here. But I dont use twitter.

The block button is your best friend. Use it. Abuse it. Life is too short.

Edit: I only have 2 people on my Escapist ignore list, and that's because every time they've been mean to me.

but... it's also not a big deal I blocked zhr. I block people on Twitter for like... no reason. Most of the time it's people that don't even know me.

Are you Hideki Kamiya?

who?

As much as my opponents here like to paint me as some sort of intolerant, anti-free speech SJW monster, I value exposing myself to opposing ideas and views. I wont improve by hiding away from those who disagree, and they wont change if I let them do that either. If people dont want to listen and pretend everything is ok, sometimes you have to pull their fingers out of their ears and make them listen.

Too many times in history have people been so willing to block out things that make them uncomfortable, but they need to be made uncomfortable, because they need to see what is wrong with the world so it can be made right.

I mean I'm less likely to do it on a messageboard and reddit than I am Twitter. Twitter is the open window in your house, message boards are like community centers. I'll go into the community center and shoot the breeze, but I'm not tolerating someone yelling static I don't want to hear into my house, I'll shut the window.

Cause lets be honest, it's not mentally healthy to entertain every argument.

Well, between that post and now, I again got punished for daring to not lock myself in an echo chamber. Perhaps I will atleast give one a test drive at this point.

 

[DudeistBelieve]

No but it might make you a jerk. I've known a few people who used it as an excuse to just be a douche.

This. I tend to find it's always the people that embrace this label are always super confrontational and shit. They're also people that claim they're "telling it like it is"

No. You can't tell it like it is, because you haven't a fucking clue how it is. No one fucking does, I really wish people in general would pull their head out of their ass and realize most of their opinions aren't based on sound judgement. You don't know shit, I don't know shit, no one knows anything. Shit is very complex and ain't nobody got time for that.

I don't think saying controversial things alone makes someone a racist or a bigot or a sexist or ableist or whatever the fuck. In my opinion those things require one thing: Hate in a person's heart nothing more and nothing less.

ya know, it's like the people that see a transgendered person and not want to use the preferred pronouns... which hey, I get the frustration beyond transphobia since I hop on Twitter and it's one thing to want to use They as your pronoun, but some people are flat out making up words. Someone wanted to be called "zhr" I am not making that up. How the fuck do you even pronounce that?

That bullshit aside though, I'm more than happy to just call a person whatever gender they want to be, use whatever pronoun (though granted I'll probably fuck it up)... Is that me being PC? I don't think it is. That's me just being polite and friendly. I don't feel like calling someone their preferred gender affects me in any way what so-ever and it's such a small thing to do that'll make a person feel welcome.

...That is unless the person is making up shit like "zhr" cause then, ya know, fuck off. You're making up shit. There is not even a fucking vowel in that word.

You could like...talk to them about it, instead of just getting mad and telling them what they are.

They're just a random person I saw on Twitter. a single person. Not representive of everyone. and I wouldnt ask them because Unlike 90% of people I don't harass strangers I disagree with on there... mostly. I occasionally I fuck up this rule... I just block and move on. Nothing fruitful can come from that conversation, and I'm relatively sure that person wouldn't want to be my friend anyway... so ya know, I just leave 'em alone. No sense in giving somebody a bad day.

But C'mon Saelune, I'll call anybody what they want to be called when I see this person making up words with no vowels for pronouns that's the point where I start feeling like they're taking the piss. And it's not just a piss at me, it's a piss on actual transfolks that have a hard enough time as it is with the pronoun thing. That's what annoys me. This is just my opinion of course, but I don't feel It's an unreasonable one to have.

I mean hell, if one is going to make up a word can it at least be one I can figure out how to pronounce by looking at it?

Why cant something come of the discussion? Maybe nothing will, but maybe something will, you cannot really know until it happens, and even then, not all ripples are obvious.

Maybe they are taking the piss...but maybe they arent. I know firsthand the difficulties of being trans, and thats WHY I am willing to atleast humor it. Maybe there is something they are going through that I just cannot understand. Maybe they are just finding themselves. Its taken me a long time to understand as much about myself and my gender as I do now, and I still feel lost and confused on who I really am.

Never tell someone else how they feel. Even if they should not logically feel that way, they feel how they feel. Its like punching someone and saying "Oh that didnt hurt" when they say ow. I have very sensitive skin, and bruise easily, but still my brother, my very strong brother will punch me and say that did not hurt, but it did. And it only pisses me off.

Cause theres one thing to engage discussion on a message board, Twitter to me is like having the window open of your house. You pick your neighbors in a following list. echange pleasentrys and jokes. Maybe you do serious topics with people you considering twitterfriends.

But you don't want some random douchebag yelling in through the window "Brah? Why not a real word?" as if I'm really entitled to an answer. I don't always do the best job of it, but I don't wanna be that guy... I don't need to know that badly.

And it is an issue that I... cautiously say matters a bit to me as well though I'm not comfortable sharing it at the moment. Haven't sorted out my own feelings and all that jazz.

Also Re: Feelings, I don't disagree. Pricisely why I believe it's sometimes to just block and give people a wide berth... I actually am somebody who believes how someone feels matters, perhaps even more than facts. I know it's very popular these days for the kids to go "Oh fuck your feelings", but since humans are emotional beings that feels counter intuitive.

but... it's also not a big deal I blocked zhr. I block people on Twitter for like... no reason. Most of the time it's people that don't even know me.

I dont like blocking people. I have 0 people blocked here. But I dont use twitter.

The block button is your best friend. Use it. Abuse it. Life is too short.

Edit: I only have 2 people on my Escapist ignore list, and that's because every time they've been mean to me.

but... it's also not a big deal I blocked zhr. I block people on Twitter for like... no reason. Most of the time it's people that don't even know me.

Are you Hideki Kamiya?

who?

As much as my opponents here like to paint me as some sort of intolerant, anti-free speech SJW monster, I value exposing myself to opposing ideas and views. I wont improve by hiding away from those who disagree, and they wont change if I let them do that either. If people dont want to listen and pretend everything is ok, sometimes you have to pull their fingers out of their ears and make them listen.

Too many times in history have people been so willing to block out things that make them uncomfortable, but they need to be made uncomfortable, because they need to see what is wrong with the world so it can be made right.

I mean I'm less likely to do it on a messageboard and reddit than I am Twitter. Twitter is the open window in your house, message boards are like community centers. I'll go into the community center and shoot the breeze, but I'm not tolerating someone yelling static I don't want to hear into my house, I'll shut the window.

Cause lets be honest, it's not mentally healthy to entertain every argument.

Well, between that post and now, I again got punished for daring to not lock myself in an echo chamber. Perhaps I will atleast give one a test drive at this point.

Legit the best thing I do for myself is once I'm sick of a discussion and I don't feel I'm getting anything out of it? I just start deleting the replies in my inbox without even looking at them. Take care of yourself, Saelune

 

[MrCalavera_v1legacy]

No.

Sometimes bigots like to use "being politically incorrect" as a shield, though.

That being said i don't like PC. It can be really obnoxious when used by zealots, and it usually amounts to putting a facade in front of a problem, rather than fixing it. Then it's just a Potemkin village set up before bigotry.
And when it starts crumbling, and some people feel like they don't need to act PC anymore, it results in a terrific backlash, as we could observe not so long ago.

 

[Zhukov]

Nah.

It can make you a douche though, depending on whether or not you're any good at it.

Being a bigot who claims their bigotry is just political incorrectness makes you a bigot.

 

[springheeljack]

I think it's just a vacuous term that holds no meaning anymore.

 

[KissingSunlight]

I wish I could just leave it with that question without adding any context. To avoid having this post getting modded for low content, I'll add some context.

I was noticing that conservatives and liberals were describing Donald Trump's controversial comments differently. People who were for Trump described them as being "politically incorrect" while liberals against Trump were calling them "racist".

So, does being politically incorrect makes you a bigot?

No that's a weird thing to take away from it. It's just that it's easy for people to defend racist comments by just calling them politically incorrect

Ummm, no. I do have a deeper takeaway about the election than that. Like I said, I wanted to ask the question without mentioning Donald Trump or the election. The question concerning the line between being politically incorrect and bigotry was something that interested me. I was curious to see what the responses would be from other people.

 

[Tsun Tzu]

Nope.

Being a bigot certainly makes you a bit bigoted though.

 

[Secondhand Revenant]

I wish I could just leave it with that question without adding any context. To avoid having this post getting modded for low content, I'll add some context.

I was noticing that conservatives and liberals were describing Donald Trump's controversial comments differently. People who were for Trump described them as being "politically incorrect" while liberals against Trump were calling them "racist".

So, does being politically incorrect makes you a bigot?

No that's a weird thing to take away from it. It's just that it's easy for people to defend racist comments by just calling them politically incorrect

Ummm, no. I do have a deeper takeaway about the election than that. Like I said, I wanted to ask the question without mentioning Donald Trump or the election. The question concerning the line between being politically incorrect and bigotry was something that interested me. I was curious to see what the responses would be from other people.

Not the elections, I mean such an exchange where one calls it 'politically incorrect' and the other calls it 'racist'. It's more like racist statements tend to be politically incorrect anyways. It's easy enough for people to just deflect with 'You just don't like that it's politically incorrect' when someone says a statement is racist.

 

[Silvanus]

Political correctness is primarily just a manner of speaking or presenting yourself in such a way as to consciously avoid causing offence. There are perfectly understandable reasons for not speaking in a politically correct manner (not least of which is that it's difficult to watch what you say at all times).

Bigotry, on the other hand, is an underlying attitude, and the term indicates something much more extreme-- genuine prejudice or hatred.

Donald Trump's language goes deep into the latter category. It's not that he just doesn't watch what he says; he intentionally accuses entire demographics of unsubstantiated crimes, and uses slurs based on peoples' innate characteristics. That is above and beyond. He is as open about his prejudice and hatred towards various minorities as he can be; he is explicit.

Describing such as mere "political incorrectness" is just a belated tactic to understate how hateful he is being. It's a tactic the tabloids are very well versed in: print slander, and then claim that disagreement is just political correctness.

 

[Phasmal]

I don't know.

I mean, aside from internet dudes trying to be edgy, I've only met two people who described themselves as "politically incorrect".
They were both bigots, using it as an excuse to avoid being challenged on their bigotry, but I can't really judge just from those two.
It's not something I tend to run into in real life. Most people attempt to have basic manners and politeness. It's strange how that can be spun into a negative, but hey.

I think it can run from "I don't make any effort to consider others when speaking" to "I actively am trying to offend people for attention" all the way up to "Hey guess who is a massive racist, spoiler alert: it me".

But I am an evil SJW, so I'm obviously just biased or triggered or whatever the kids are saying these days.

 

[Level 7 Dragon]

I don't know.

I mean, aside from internet dudes trying to be edgy, I've only met two people who described themselves as "politically incorrect".
They were both bigots, using it as an excuse to avoid being challenged on their bigotry, but I can't really judge just from those two.
It's not something I tend to run into in real life. Most people attempt to have basic manners and politeness. It's strange how that can be spun into a negative, but hey.

I think it can run from "I don't make any effort to consider others when speaking" to "I actively am trying to offend people for attention" all the way up to "Hey guess who is a massive racist, spoiler alert: it me".

But I am an evil SJW, so I'm obviously just biased or triggered or whatever the kids are saying these days.

It largely depends on your attitude to shock humour. Yahtzee (I accidentaly typed Trump because I am sick of hearing about him all the time) does employ sexist and ableist language to provoke a reaction, however after watching all of his podcasts, I never raised a thought of him being against equality or wellbeing of marginalised demographics.

Shock humour is like acupuncture, if you don't know what you are doing, you will end up hurting people. Shock is about crossing the taboo for a short while, just long enough to make the person laugh.

Edit: No, you arn't an evil SJW. You are a loving, yet condecending parent of this forum.

 

[Phasmal]

It largely depends on your attitude to shock humour. Yahtzee (I accidentaly typed Trump because I am sick of hearing about him all the time) does employ sexist and ableist language to provoke a reaction, however after watching all of his podcasts, I never raised a thought of him being against equality or wellbeing of marginalised demographics.

Shock humour is like acupuncture, if you don't know what you are doing, you will end up hurting people. Shock is about crossing the taboo for a short while, just long enough to make the person laugh.

Edit: No, you arn't an evil SJW. You are a loving, yet condecending parent of this forum.

Cool, condescending parent is usually the tone I'm going for, I'm glad that comes across.

Back on topic- I didn't even think about shock humour in my first post, to be honest.

I think most people aren't skilled enough to pull it off well. I think a simple guideline should be if an actual bigot was listening to you do you think they would think you were making fun of them or agreeing with them? If the latter, ya dun goofed.
And also, I think it's generally a phase most people go through, sort of "Oh look what I can say!" kind of thing that most people grow out of (or, very rarely when they're good at it- make a career of).

I do think the whole fuss over "PC" is very much an internet problem. Most people don't think of things like that in real life. They just try not to upset people, and if they do, they generally change the behaviour, rather than going mental about censoring themselves. Personally, I don't think "is this PC/un-PC to say?" ever.

 

[RaikuFA]

I do think the whole fuss over "PC" is very much an internet problem. Most people don't think of things like that in real life. They just try not to upset people, and if they do, they generally change the behaviour, rather than going mental about censoring themselves. Personally, I don't think "is this PC/un-PC to say?" ever.

I think it's a mix of the internet (particularly social media) and college campuses. The main people I see acting like jackasses are college aged kids. Still too young to know the consequences of their actions.

 

[KissingSunlight]

I want to thank everyone who have posted. I would have done it sooner, but I was blown away by how many people responded in the first 24 hours.

The reason I don't like to give my opinion in the OP is to avoid ninja-ing someone else's opinion on the subject. Like this one...

Yes.

Give me one argument that is "politically incorrect" and not "racist/sexist/whatever". I will find hint of discrimination.

People in recent years having throwing out accusations of bigotry for any slight verbal or written misstep regarding political correctness. It become such a casual thing to do that these terms have become meaningless. Someone could be politically incorrect. For example, a white person saying the word "nigga", without being racist. That white person could be quoting a rap lyric. Yet, someone would still complain that the white person is still racist for saying that word regardless of context.

It was heartening to see people say that doing something bigoted makes you a bigot. However, most of the people saying that are the ones who usually guilty of throwing around accusation of bigotry too casually.

My take: Being politically incorrect doesn't make you a bigot. Context matters. We need to stop trying to police other people's language. If you personally find what someone said offensive, then express it. Stop trying to censor other people, because someone somewhere might find what that person said to be offensive.

 

[Thaluikhain]

My take: Being politically incorrect doesn't make you a bigot. Context matters. We need to stop trying to police other people's language. If you personally find what someone said offensive, then express it. Stop trying to censor other people, because someone somewhere might find what that person said to be offensive.

As repeated ad nauseam, calling someone out on something they've said is not censorship.

 

[bastardofmelbourne]

I don't know.

I mean, aside from internet dudes trying to be edgy, I've only met two people who described themselves as "politically incorrect".
They were both bigots, using it as an excuse to avoid being challenged on their bigotry, but I can't really judge just from those two.
It's not something I tend to run into in real life. Most people attempt to have basic manners and politeness. It's strange how that can be spun into a negative, but hey.

I think it can run from "I don't make any effort to consider others when speaking" to "I actively am trying to offend people for attention" all the way up to "Hey guess who is a massive racist, spoiler alert: it me".

But I am an evil SJW, so I'm obviously just biased or triggered or whatever the kids are saying these days.

Well, if you've ever seen Borat, you've got an idea of what it looks like to make politically incorrect humour.

It's really common amongst comedians. Comedians tread this fine line between saying something that is outrageously funny and saying something that gets people outraged. Most commentary over political (in)correctness happens in the context of someone making a joke that didn't go down as well as it should have.

Trump is not politically incorrect. Being politically incorrect just means that you don't veil your criticism in polite language. Trump doesn't veil his criticism in anything because what he says isn't actually criticism; it's just a font of irrational non-sequiturs designed to push people's buttons and get people paying attention to him.

 

[Phasmal]

Well, if you've ever seen Borat, you've got an idea of what it looks like to make politically incorrect humour.

It's really common amongst comedians. Comedians tread this fine line between saying something that is outrageously funny and saying something that gets people outraged. Most commentary over political (in)correctness happens in the context of someone making a joke that didn't go down as well as it should have.

Trump is not politically incorrect. Being politically incorrect just means that you don't veil your criticism in polite language. Trump doesn't veil his criticism in anything because what he says isn't actually criticism; it's just a font of irrational non-sequiturs designed to push people's buttons and get people paying attention to him.

Jeez. I haven't thought of Borat in forever. I went to see it with a friend when it came out. My friend thought it was a date. That's not relevant for the conversation I just think it's funny (because, y'know, that's romantic). I kinda got bored of the film halfway through.

That's why I said in my other post that I wasn't really talking about politically incorrect humour, because it's not really my thing. (Personally I find it too predictable. What are they gonna say? The most offensive thing they can. Yawn. That's just my opinion though.)

Recently my only real life experience with people talking about PC culture is a few elderly relatives exploding at mostly fake news about how millennials need everything to be PC.

 

[Level 7 Dragon]

Well, if you've ever seen Borat, you've got an idea of what it looks like to make politically incorrect humour.

It's really common amongst comedians. Comedians tread this fine line between saying something that is outrageously funny and saying something that gets people outraged. Most commentary over political (in)correctness happens in the context of someone making a joke that didn't go down as well as it should have.

Trump is not politically incorrect. Being politically incorrect just means that you don't veil your criticism in polite language. Trump doesn't veil his criticism in anything because what he says isn't actually criticism; it's just a font of irrational non-sequiturs designed to push people's buttons and get people paying attention to him.

In all fairness, Borat did seem rather racist to me, considering that I do know quite a few Kazakhs IRL. The film portrayed the culture as a bunch of inbred reactionaries, removed from reality. Maybe it's just me, but it did rub me the wrong way.

 

[balladbird]

Maybe I missed the point of it, since I saw it so long ago, but wasn't the point of the Borat character to show people at their worst? Like, those were real people reacting to the character, and he seemed to be trying to see how hard it was to get them to agree with terrible things? I saw a Your Movie Sucks review that explored it a while back, though I'm so far removed from the movie I couldn't say anything for sure.

 

[KissingSunlight]

Maybe I missed the point of it, since I saw it so long ago, but wasn't the point of the Borat character to show people at their worst? Like, those were real people reacting to the character, and he seemed to be trying to see how hard it was to get them to agree with terrible things? I saw a Your Movie Sucks review that explored it a while back, though I'm so far removed from the movie I couldn't say anything for sure.

A lot of people thought that the real person who were nodding in agreement with Borat were racist. However, anyone who have been in the real world knows that a person will nod or say "yeah" just to get rid of a person that they don't want to deal with. That was my impression when I saw those scenes.

I really hated how overhyped that movie was. Especially from people who was using that movie as proof that Americans were racist.