Draw Harley Quinn Naked, Killing Herself, To Win DC Artist Contest

[Redlin5_v1legacy]

Sometimes I wonder why I'm not up to date with the comic world. Then shitstorms like this happen and I remember.

I think I'll just watch this one from the sidelines and let this thread revolve around me.

 

[Mahoshonen]

It's not the sexism flag that bugs me, but the 'lol suicide' part. This shit is no joke and if DC wants to make light of it, then they can get fucked

 

[Darth_Payn]

Keep it classy, DiDio!

Seriously, someone fire him.

I may not be entirely clear on the DC entertainment hierarchy, but I thought DiDio and Jim Lee are CO-publishers, and Geoff Johns, a living example of the Promoted Fanboy trope, is Chief Creative Officer, which sounds like he outranks Publisher. If anyone has the power to fire DiDio, it sounds like Johns.

OT: Well, this is a fine way to start my Monday. Open up The Escapist and I read "Draw Harley Quinn Killing Herself & Naked, Get A Job at DC Comics!" I understand how people would be offended by that, what with how Harley changed when the Nu52 began, but I can see also it's TOTALLY in character for Quinn. Why? Because she's a MAD PERSON! Drawing humor from death and other dark subject matter is her and the Joker's shtick! Although, the Joker as seen in the Death of The Family crossover wasn't funny at all, just pure High Octane Nightmare Fuel. But with her Puddin' possibly pushing up daisies now, it looks like Harley doesn't have much reason to keep going. I will save my outrage for how this looks in an actual drawing, when it happens.

 

[Towels]

BTW if you consider this 'sexualized', ask any paramedic who was called to a real naked female suicide how turned on they were by the dead blue body they found. I think not much.

...yeah, I also wouldn't recommend doing that unless you want to get punched.

About the nudity: I'm told that suicide victims try to find the most comfortable setting so they can go through with it. Harley's rather much an exhibitionist, so it wouldn't surprise me that she's comfortable naked. With how manic and obsessive Harley is, this all seems very much in line with her character.

So why bring such emphasis to her nude suicide? Well, its the elephant in the room. Yes, it is supposed to be shocking. Depicting suicides are MEANT to be shocking. I'd say sexualizing it would accomplish that goal nicely. Its like Baroque artwork. I'm not saying its pleasant, and I definitely don't want to see it, but I can see the artistic value.

EDIT: You know what? I sound too much like a fraking know-it-all writing this crap. I guess I'm just not that moved by this, trying to give meaning to my pointless observation. *sigh*

 

[Hagi]

I'd take a look at yourself first before feeling dejected and disgusted by the rest of humanity.

Ironically, you probably wouldn't. You certainly seem fine with jumping to a bunch of conclusions about my motivations, even though you don't know me at all.

So take your own advice, and look to yourself before you start accusing me of leaping to conclusions, because that makes you both an ass AND a hypocrite.

I have looked at myself. I'm not doing anything that's just causing me to feel bad about myself and others.

You, by your own admission, are. That's not an assumption, that's not jumping to conclusions. That's just going on the information you yourself provided. You say you end up feeling depressed and emotionally drained. You say you end up feeling disgusted and dejected by humanity. Your words, not mine.

And all because you start turning this matter into a wrong before it even is one.

But nothing wrong has happened yet. Certainly, your fears may come to pass. Or they may not, we don't know. But nothing has happened yet, so all you're doing right now, making yourself feel depressed, emotionally drained and feeling disgusted and dejected by humanity is of your own doing. Others aren't doing this to you, you should't look at them. You should look at yourself, you're making yourself feel this way for perceiving wrongs were none have happened yet.

 

[The Deadpool]

Not what it says.

Context is your friend. The first three pannels are all comically overblown and failing attempts at suicide (lughting won't strike, crocs ignore her, whale won't bite down).

If you want to take two sentences out of the whole page and act as if they exist in a vaccum you will certainly get a different impression of what they want.

So?

So figuring out what the writer meant is likely part of the contest.

Which means giving you the answer before you try would be stupid.

That just means the fault

The fault is with the people who rage for no god damned reason.

So, you are a mind-reader!

"If I were to hazard a guess" would be the key phrase there.

Less mind reading, more ACTUAL reading.

Because US superhero-comics (and especially DC lately) have a bad track-record of it.

And THERE right there is exactly YOUR problem.

You come in EXPECTING them to be doing something wrong. This isn't coming from anything on the pge. It is your own, personal prejudice against them clouding your judgement.

If a pathological liar says the sky is blue, will you suddenly say it's pink? Then why are you denouncing them for THIS because of their past transgressions when THIS in and of itself isn't a problem.

Don't worry, you aren't alone. Bet most of the people complaining are on the same boat.

 

[The Deadpool]

This isn't art. This is DC. Align expectations accordingly.

Yup, definetely more than one person...

DC's previous actions do not make this one inherently a problem. You read naked and see sexualized because YOU want to, not because of anything THEY said.

 

[DementedSheep]

What he hell DC? The first 3 are overblown loony toon like fail suicide attempt so it's humour at least but the last one has no funny element to it and the fact that they are specifically requiring her to be naked (yes she?s in bath but she isn?t actually having a bath, she is committing suicide and they didn't specify there had to be water which is required if she is coming suicide that way) makes it sound like they want fucked up suicide cheesecake. That said they might not and just have been incredibly stupid with the wording. They MAY pick one as the winner which isn't fanservicy and I think people should hold on the outrage until then at least but this whole thing just seem in very bad taste.

I?m not against depictions of suicide though I do think its tasteless to have that as a competition, I?m not against horrific things happening to characters in general and I?m not against cheesecake though it will put me off a comic pretty quickly if it?s too central and they break scenes for it. However combining suicide and cheesecake in the same scene is disgusting.

 

[Henson]

The outcry on this contest rather reminds me of the Tomb Raider outcry over the PR person's comments about "you'll want to protect Lara" (totally not an actual quote). The statement raised some eyebrows (to say the least), but when we got to the final product, we found that it wasn't executed nearly as badly as people were fearing.

The same seems to be the case here. I understand how people would be wary about the extra use of the word 'naked' (though I don't agree), but until we see the 4-panel layout that DC goes with, or get detailed clarification by DC that indicates otherwise, the outcry seems to be jumping the gun.

It could end up being a sexualized or objectified or just plain tasteless rendition. It could also be a case where DC simply used one too many words. We just don't know right now.

 

[Madame_Lawliet]

..The fuck?

I... I... what?

I'm not overstating this here, I am genuinely speechless, what in the hell is DC thinking?
I don't get it, what's the joke here, what am I missing? Is this supposed to be some kind of pitch black humor? Is it part of some kind of ARG where they're intentionally making themselves look like ass hats? Is it all just a method of generating traffic through controversy? WHAT IS THIS?

 

[Denizen]

Contest collaborator Jimmy Palmiotti allegedly claimed [https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BTfctlICIAALbQx.png:large] that the comic was intended to be "Chuck Jones loony toons humor style."

It's funny how when I read the original article that's what I was thinking of. Everyone else assumed the worst. It's like all the people complaining are ironically the horribly depressing people applying the worst possible context where it wasn't there.

And now I know why we can't have dark humor anymore.

I miss when people took things in context and could laugh.

 

[MrGalactus]

Didio is trying sooo haaard to make everything edgy and grimdark these days. Seriously, it's like the DC editors want to alienate fans and for people to hate them since the New52 started. I mean, they must know this isn't something Harley would be doing, so they must be doing it on purpose to get a response from people. 34edgy8me, DC

 

[Lieju]

Context is your friend.

Oh, I agree with that.

Which means giving you the answer before you try would be stupid.

But I need the practise! I need to actively try to be stupid to mask my magnificent intelligence to fit in with the rest of the humanity.

And THERE right there is exactly YOUR problem.

You come in EXPECTING them to be doing something wrong. This isn't coming from anything on the pge. It is your own, personal prejudice against them clouding your judgement.

If a pathological liar says the sky is blue, will you suddenly say it's pink? Then why are you denouncing them for THIS because of their past transgressions when THIS in and of itself isn't a problem.

Don't worry, you aren't alone. Bet most of the people complaining are on the same boat.

And what, exactly, are you assuming is my problem with this?
Have I said anything about it being sexist or misogynistic?

My criticism for this contest is that it was badly and confusingly worded, in bad taste, and dumb. (And that it doesn't actually tell them much about the actual skill of the artist, but we all know they aren't really going to offer the winner a job)

Maybe you are seeing things and motivations that aren't there?

 

[Paradoxrifts]

Breaking news: When people go to art school is highly likely they'll be forced to draw nude female models. Call the authorities.

Actually, you've just missed the entire point of the discussion. Nudity itself was never the issue.

Nice knee-jerk.

That's complete rubbish, and to prove with a simple question.

Is there anyone here, who has already commented thus far, who is on record complaining about the way Bioshock Infinite glorified suicide? If this is truly more about the issue of suicide then anything else, where is all the condemnation by the writers over at Irrational Games?



Here I'll even jog your memories with a Youtube link. Which I've hidden behind the spoiler tag below because the spoilers don't get any bigger than the video I'm about to post.

Spoiler

There's the two main characters of the game killing and erasing themselves from existence, Donnie Darko style.​

 

[Paradoxrifts]

Breaking news: When people go to art school is highly likely they'll be forced to draw nude female models. Call the authorities.

Actually, you've just missed the entire point of the discussion. Nudity itself was never the issue.

Nice knee-jerk.

That's complete rubbish, and to prove with a simple question.

Is there anyone here, who has already commented thus far, who is on record complaining about the way Bioshock Infinite glorified suicide? If this is truly more about the issue of suicide then anything else, where is all the condemnation by the writers over at Irrational Games?



Here I'll even jog your memories with a Youtube link. Which I've hidden behind the spoiler tag below because the spoilers don't get any bigger than the video I'm about to post.

Spoiler

There's the two main characters of the game killing and erasing themselves from existence, Donnie Darko style.​

Suicide wasn't the issue either.

In fact, I specifically said "Suicide and nudity are fine in comics." You'd know if you read what you reply to.

So offensive content is completely fine? I mean, so long as you don't personally find it offensive that is, right?

 

[sweetylnumb]

What he hell DC? The first 3 are overblown loony toon like fail suicide attempt so it's humour at least but the last one has no funny element to it and the fact that they are specifically requiring her to be naked (yes she?s in bath but she isn?t actually having a bath, she is committing suicide and they didn't specify there had to be water which is required if she is coming suicide that way) makes it sound like they want fucked up suicide cheesecake. That said they might not and just have been incredibly stupid with the wording. They MAY pick one as the winner which isn't fanservicy and I think people should hold on the outrage until then at least but this whole thing just seem in very bad taste.

I?m not against depictions of suicide though I do think its tasteless to have that as a competition, I?m not against horrific things happening to characters in general nor I?m not against cheesecake though it will put me off a comic pretty quickly if it?s too central and they break scenes for it. However combing suicide and cheesecake in the same scene is disgusting.

I just love how some dudes are like well durr shes in a bath she has to be naked. Yes. But she doesn't HAVE to be in a bath. She could be on a roof. Or in a pool. OR ANYTHING ELSE. They deliberately decided that she had to be naked to commit suicide.

 

[Paradoxrifts]

Breaking news: When people go to art school is highly likely they'll be forced to draw nude female models. Call the authorities.

Actually, you've just missed the entire point of the discussion. Nudity itself was never the issue.

Nice knee-jerk.

That's complete rubbish, and to prove with a simple question.

Is there anyone here, who has already commented thus far, who is on record complaining about the way Bioshock Infinite glorified suicide? If this is truly more about the issue of suicide then anything else, where is all the condemnation by the writers over at Irrational Games?



Here I'll even jog your memories with a Youtube link. Which I've hidden behind the spoiler tag below because the spoilers don't get any bigger than the video I'm about to post.

Spoiler

There's the two main characters of the game killing and erasing themselves from existence, Donnie Darko style.​

Suicide wasn't the issue either.

In fact, I specifically said "Suicide and nudity are fine in comics." You'd know if you read what you reply to.

So offensive content is completely fine? I mean, so long as you don't personally find it offensive that is, right?

So now it is offensive? Interesting that your argument changes tact to be as contrary as possible. It's almost like you don't actually know what you are talking about and have no vested interest in the topic, but are simply entering a debate. There should be a word to describe that sort of behavior.

At this stage of the proceedings, are you really resorting to attacking the messenger?

Earlier you wanted evidence that nobody blink an eyelid if it were a man. Well, there it is. One multimillion dollar gaming experience, which you ought to have played by now, and to be frank it wasn't like I was hard-pressed to find an examples of a good-looking men with plenty of sex appeal killing themselves onscreen. Romeo & Juliet. Titanic. Donnie Darko. The Hunger Games. Armageddon. Looper. The list goes on and on, but I think that's a sufficient sampling for this discussion.

Women fucking love them some male disposability. This is not open for interpretation. This is readily apparent fact. From the helpless schmucks and mooks who appear briefly in one guise or another to serve only has traction on the male hero's ascent to worth, to hero's own final selfless act of suicide, there is plenty of media out there that tell men that their lives are less important then those of their women. Now I'll grant you that none of these male characters were naked. But all of them were sexually desirable in an open mainstream way that Harley Quinn could never be. Irregardless of how she was drawn. Whether she was drawn clothed or naked. Whether she was drawn happy or unhappy. Bathtub, or no bathtub.

And you want to object to a contest to see who can draw a four-panel gag strip that features a comic book character that most people on the street wouldn't even know the name of? On the off chance that somebody out there might draw something nasty and submit it to DC?

Well, I got news for you, Rule 34. They're already doing it. They're doing it hard.

 

[Jumplion]

I find it surprising how people are focusing on the wrong aspect of this thing.

We shouldn't be arguing about the logistics of the suicide (whether she's naked, whether it's in character, etc...)

We should be talking about why the hell are they asking the public to draw this in the first place.

If Harley Quinn attempting to commit suicide is such an important part of her character development and the overall story in the comic, why are they divulging resources and letting everyone else handle that aspect of the story? Marketing, sure, that's an obvious answer, but I find it curious and the whole thing just reeks of sexualizing suicide. It's not whether or not it's an in-character action, it's whether or not they should take a supposedly important aspect of a character that they are making and just shove it out so that someone else can do it. To me, it speaks of little respect for the actual character or integrity in making the damn comic in the first place.

 

[Racecarlock]

Are you sure this isn't a god damn creepypasta?

 

[McMarbles]

Keep it classy, DiDio!

Seriously, someone fire him.

Seriously. Why is this guy still employed? Are sales really up that much?