Extra Credits: No Redeeming Value

[p1ne]

Amazing episode guys. Keep it up.

QTF. I love this series so much.

 

[abyssion1337]

I agree, GoW 2 and 3 quickly jumped the shark and devolved into tastelessness

 

[mptothedc]

I love you guys for championing what videogame storytelling has the potential to be. I'm passionately optimistic about the medium and honestly believe that it will one day be the best way to experience stories of every kind. It's videos like these that help that happen.

I agree with this but I also feel that Kratos was meant to kill Zeus. When Pandora told Kratos about hope she was referring to the weapon inside of him. With hope he broke back into superthisisspartakratoskickass-mode and pwned Zeus. I'm surprised you guys didn't touch on the fact that he killed himself to allow hope to restore the world. It is a story of redemption and Kratos was remorseful after seeking his vengeance.

Plus, after playing through 3 games, don't you just WANT TO kill Zeus already?!

 

[blackdwarf]

i never played the god of war serie. (and now all of you wish me to hell) but you have gave a great example what the 'hype' around a game can do to the series. you had a lot of players who didn't see the underlying story of part 1. they only saw a guy as you described kratos in the other 2 games. a mindlles killing machine. they devolpers heard that and thought that the players liked it because of that. because of that the last 2 games were only about killing without a good reason. and this happens more often then you think. just a minor part of the gamers sees things like underlying story. and when the devolpers seargh forums for the opinions of players. the will for the great part see people saying that the action is great and that kratos is baddass. and because the it is a company that wants money, they created what the buyers want and so you get games series like the god of war serie.

 

[theshadowcult]

That's why Vagrant Story, Final Fantasy VII and Legacy of kain are such goode stories. They actually tell meaningful stories about characters you can grow with and actually connect to.

EDIT: Responding to the post above, that is what happened to Devil May Cry as well.

 

[romxxii]

By the end of god of war 3 I actually loved how pointlessly brutal Kratos is. As somebody who had played neither of the previous games but merely understands the story fully I found the utter lack of remorse or message quite refreshing. Pretty much every main character in any other story I have ever heard has at least been endowed with some redeeming feature, but to play as an utter psycho who has only one very hard to achieve desire, who simply rips and tears through all obstructions to a meaningless end. Well thats just a laugh and a half. One of my favourite lines is near the start when Athena says "The war between the titans and the gods rages on, and the people suffer greatly" and Kratos responds "LET THEM SUFFER, the death of Zeus is all that matters". I just cant stop finding that hilarious every time I play through the game.

Can you imagine writing this? Its like by this third instalment the new lead designer realised his predecessor has pretty much created a situation where they could never go back to a sensible character arc or non-phycho motivations. So they just let it slide and made as much crazy violent smashing as possible.

TL;DR version: Massive Cathartic Potential.

 

[Ericb]

I just don't feel it's a game that was meant to stand up to analysis as a

literary work, nor should it be judged by those standards.

The beauty of a standard is that anything that fits its prerequisites can indeed be judged by it.

As a plot-driven and cutscene-extraordinaire game, the God of War series can and should be judged by literary standards as opposed to, say, culinary ones.

The fact that it doesn't really stand very high while judged as such does not excuse it from analysis.

I don't expect AC/DC to be Beethoven's fifth and I don't expect God of War to

be Ico. It works as what it is, not as an intellectual piece.

Then they should have gone the way of Serious Sam (which I like very much), where the seriousness applies strictly to the title, instead of going out of its way to tell a story with so many glaring holes in character development.

I love you guys for championing what videogame storytelling has the potential to be. I'm passionately optimistic about the medium and honestly believe that it will one day be the best way to experience stories of every kind. It's videos like these that help that happen.

Ditto. Yours is my favorite series, you guys.

Keep at it!

 

[ENKC]

I just don't feel it's a game that was meant to stand up to analysis as a

literary work, nor should it be judged by those standards.

The beauty of a standard is that anything that fits its prerequisites can indeed be judged by it.

As a plot-driven and cutscene-extraordinaire game, the God of War series can and should be judged by literary standards as opposed to, say, culinary ones.

The fact that it doesn't really stand very high while judged as such does not excuse it from analysis.

A culinary analysis of apples differs from a culinary analysis of oranges. One may as well analyse the fashion of the Cleveland Cavaliers in the same breath as the catwalks of Paris, since under the beauty of standards they both wear designer clothing.

 

[the D0rk One]

I think you're missing the point in both GOW II & III.

GOW II has all 3 Greek tragedy elements: the fall of Kratos (taken to a new level, a God this time, not a "mere" mortal Hero), caused by his misdeeds as the new god of war, and his own guilt defeating him when he accidentally kills Athena in the end.

Passing the hate focus from Ares to Zeus may seem childish, but it's common in human behavior to resent authority and responsibility for one's actions.

GOW III may forget all about this formula, but the "hope" and "forgiveness" elements aren't exposed at kindergarten level.

GOW III says that gods (and titans) know their worth and abilities, and that hope and having the courage to place yourself next to (or above) a god is the first step towards actual "godhood".

Killing Hercules (the older brother) and Zeus (the father) takes the narrative in a new direction. It talks about fighting for what you believe, even if your family & friends discourages you, and it's something many teenagers or even young adults relate to.

Kratos seemingly murders them all for the wrong reasons, but the ending scene may change that perception: all the Gods desperately want to suppress mankind's hope of ever being more than "mere mortals", but Kratos' mindless killing spree unknowingly prevents that, and his final act in the game may be regarded as his redeeming quality: sparing Athena despite her attitude towards restoring hope to humanity, and attempting to kill himself instead.

I think it's wrong to dismiss GOW II & III's narrative just because it follows slightly different directions. They might be considered "lower art" than the first one, but they also treat the same subject from a more contemporary point of view, and most importantly, they sift it all through a different moral filter, one better suited to the 21'st century's moral compass.

 

[DoctorObviously]

Something weird has happened this week, i just don't agree with any video posted on this site. Very strange.

First with Yahtzee slaging off a game i doubt he really played much by the sounds of it, and now this. But then, that might be because i love the God of War series for it's brutal violence and graphics. Call me shallow, but i did enjoy the story.

Maybe i can because i don't feel the need to over-analyse stuff. I played the game, and saw Kratos just go ape and destroy the world. But i rolled with it and very much enjoyed it.

The day i start to analyse everything to the point i can't enjoy anything is the day i'll throw myself off a cliff.

So you agree that ignorance is bliss then?

Actually, it is. When I'm writing my book, I hate it when I need to look for the small little details people are inevitably going to cry about. Can't people just enjoy something for what it is anymore? You don't need to overanalyze EVERYTHING you see in life.

 

[Swifteye]

Something weird has happened this week, i just don't agree with any video posted on this site. Very strange.

First with Yahtzee slaging off a game i doubt he really played much by the sounds of it, and now this. But then, that might be because i love the God of War series for it's brutal violence and graphics. Call me shallow, but i did enjoy the story.

Maybe i can because i don't feel the need to over-analyse stuff. I played the game, and saw Kratos just go ape and destroy the world. But i rolled with it and very much enjoyed it.

The day i start to analyse everything to the point i can't enjoy anything is the day i'll throw myself off a cliff.

So you agree that ignorance is bliss then?

Actually, it is. When I'm writing my book, I hate it when I need to look for the small little details people are inevitably going to cry about. Can't people just enjoy something for what it is anymore? You don't need to overanalyze EVERYTHING you see in life.

he he indeed. I to write and I don't over detail things either. I do it cause personally to much information at once makes it harder for me to read and understand what's happening. My friend who's into writing likes detail cramming cause that's how the pros want it. But for me I'd rather have just enough information to where I know the general situation and not be lost. It's rough writing a book and people always comment on the things you have a hard time noticing.

 

[Warforger]

Can someone tell me why no one sees that Kratos is most like Hercules? The whole "being tricked into killing your family" thing is ripped off from Hercules, Hercules was also the son of Zeus (I haven't played the game so I'm not sure), Hercules also was being attacked by one of the highest gods in Olympus Hera (in this case mainly Zeus) and he also went on a quest of redemption for killing his family. Why would you possibly expect a rip off with a few changes to tell a great story based off of Greek Mythology? If you wanted to read about a good story with a Kratos-like character go read Hercules.

GoW is an action game, best to just go kill the biggest things and throw the story out of the way because all your doing is a evil Hercules.

 

[nomad38]

very interesting lesson i never look at it that way

 

[Rocketboy13]

Wow...people play God of War for the storytelling...Seriously?

I once wrote a blog about how I liked "Halo" for the setting, saying it "was like James Cameron adapting and directing Larry Niven Ringworld for a mainstream audience". People thought I was crazy, that no one likes it for the story. I honestly don't really like the gameplay, it has failed to grow and adapt with each iteration, and the setting is really cool.

Same applies to God of War, I don't really like beat'm-up gameplay, it gets old quickly to me, but the graphics and voice acting and story are strong in God of War, and I like that. I thought Prometheus regenerating after having his guts pulled out in the second game was cool to watch.

 

[Russian_Assassin]

I loved the last scene because I played it on hard the first time and after 2 hours of trying to kill Zeus I finally got my revenge. To not spoil anything, I'll say this: I kept mashing the O button for 5 minutes.

Oh and a word to the guys behind Extra Credits: HOLY SHIT! I just found another show I will look forward to each week

 

[FeralDynasty]

was Chains of olympus left out because it wasn't part of the main franchise?

 

[FeralDynasty]

theres around 8 to 10 more of them on youtube under a different name, search Daniel Floyd and it should give results

 

[NaramSuen]

Another excellent video. I completely agree that we must demand a higher standard for story-telling in video games. I long for the day when story rather than graphics will be the driving force for games.

Keep up the awesome work!