Gamers? View on LGBT Essay

[Mallefunction]

Do you see fat gamers asking for fat characters they can play as?

Actually...

A friend of mine is a plus sized woman who doesn't want to play Skyrim until someone makes a mod for plus sized characters. So, it does happen. Not often mind, but it does.

This. I am not plus sized myself, but I like being able to change the body types so they look more like real people. Most games will only let you do a facial edit So you end up making an old croon with HUGE tits and it just looks weird as shit.

Also, people want to see others like themselves being the heroes. Why are Dreamworks movies so popular lately? Well their protagonists tend to be seen as unattractive, weird, fat, outcasts that somehow manage to save the day in the end. People like seeing the imperfect overcome because it gives them hope with their own lives.

 

[Mallefunction]

Do you see fat gamers asking for fat characters they can play as?

Actually...

A friend of mine is a plus sized woman who doesn't want to play Skyrim until someone makes a mod for plus sized characters. So, it does happen. Not often mind, but it does.

This. I am not plus sized myself, but I like being able to change the body types so they look more like real people. Most games will only let you do a facial edit So you end up making an old croon with HUGE tits and it just looks weird as shit.

Also, people want to see others like themselves being the heroes. Why are Dreamworks movies so popular lately? Well their protagonists tend to be seen as unattractive, weird, fat, outcasts that somehow manage to save the day in the end. People like seeing the imperfect overcome because it gives them hope with their own lives.

Changing the entire body model instead of only the face creates a huge array of problems. Animations need to be changed, all clothes and armor need to fit everyone, crouching needs to look good, interactions between characters... Some gays pull it off quite good, but I can imagine developers just thinking it's too much of a hassle...

I understand the hassle involved, but honestly, they should at least have one other option outside of the sexy default for both men and women. I'd like to play as my own sex more often in games, but they make them so...boobalicious that it's awkward for me so I end up picking 'male' more often than not.

 

[Mordereth]

Last month I made a thread Many gamers also used their post to point out either their favorite, or least favorite LGBT video game character. As this essay is about Gamers opinion, not specifics about games that feature LGBT. I will however, go into specifics about opinions I've seen, including opinions on LGBT characters that appear in games.

There's nothing for the however to counter (j'assume you meant to put something like "which I have elected to not include because-" somewhere in there). Just pointing it out.

Love the essay; we need more literature like this in circulation in as many places as there are to put it. I commend you.

Keep up the good work!

 

[klausaidon]

http://www.ibtimes.com/articles/256354/20111126/10-video-games-2011-ones-redefined-virtual.htm

Read the top 10 games of 2011. Then come back and post here how many games you found that represent a good heterosexual main character. As far as I know, a lot of them are asexual or give you the choice to f*ck whatever you want.
If ALL games in this top 10 featured heterosexual main characters flaunting their sexuality, fair representation would result in between 0.1 and 1 homosexual main characters, because homosexuality demographics are between 1 and 10 percent. But most games in this top 10 don't talk about sexuality...

Gears of War 3, Dominic is mourning the lose of his Wife. A relationship between Marcus and Anya is also hinted at.

Arkham City, Batman has always had a rocky relationship with Catwoman, and this is pointed out in game.

Uncharted 3, Although I never played Uncharted 3, or any of the Uncharted games, I do know that Drake has a love interest named Chloe Frazer.

Again, you misunderstand what the community wants. You are stereotyping Homosexuals, and assuming that all we care about is sex, and that we are all flaunting our sexuality 24/7. A good representation of a homosexual would not have them flaunting their sexuality, instead acting like a regular character that you would never assume is gay, and then subtle revealing their interest in a non-forceful way. And again, you assume we want every game to be LGBT friendly. Far from necessary. Seeing one game with a main queer character, that is handled perfectly, would be great. I keep saying this, but we want our "Samus" moment.

 

[conflictofinterests]

You rarely see games with men talking about how heterosexual they are. And why does it even bother the Gay community that they are underrepresented?
Should I make some characters gay just to appeal to them?
Should I add more black people to appeal to them?
Should I add more women, just to appeal to them?
Should I add transgender people, or more old people, or more loud 13 year olds to appeal to them?


I DEMAND THAT WE GET MORE OBESE NERDY MEN IN COMBAT ROLES, IT IS DISCRIMINATION AGAINST ME.

See, silly isn't it?

It's not so much about that as it's about giving credence to BEING LGBT. It's not an easy thing being asexual, as I know from personal experience, and the more media that gives the message that 1) It's perfectly fine and normal to be homosexual, bisexual, asexual, what have you and 2) It's as little a deal for you to be of that sexuality as it is for any particular straight person to be straight. This message is something that people figuring out who and what they are need to hear. "You're not alone and it's no big deal." I spent way too much of my life feeling like I was not only a freak, but abhorrent because of what does and doesn't turn me on to let other people go through that without a little help.

 

[Pyramid Head]

And the first comment is a troll coming from the woodwork. How nice.[/sarcasm]

LGBT in gaming is something i'm opened to, but it's a bit of a tightrope since you can't let the sexuality be the characters only defining mark, like Big Gay Al. But still, you're seeing more options and letting you control character sexuality, and it's a start.

 

[Angie7F]

We need to learn to be stay cool and be accepting of these setting, the way we would just watch movies with white american macho marines saving the day whenever there is a crisis.

You've got to be taking the piss, based on this comment. Hollywood is FAR more diverse than video games. So the notion that we should accept these things, just like Hollywood is kinda silly.

As such, I must say: Well played, forumite, well played.

I think you misinterpreted my point here, mate

I am not saying that all movies are white macho marines saving the day.
I do acknowledge the fact that Hollywood is trying to be more diverse.
When I say trying, I do mean "trying" because they haven't quite got it yet with all the Chinese, Korean and Japanese actors being used interchangeably, STILL.

But, what I am saying is, if we see something with a little bias, there is no need to immediately say "WE WANT DIVERSITY!"

For example, you go watch Transformers, and you see Josh Duhamell (spelling?) lead the troop. Why can't it be a Filipino or Latino? There are plenty of them in the military too.
But, its a pointless question to ask because it is easier to convey the message that this is a US military if you use a white dude.
Movies, games etc are essentially based on symbolism, and symbols are better understood when they are stereotypical and leaves no chance of misinterpretation. So, no offense taken. Much better to focus on the more important elements of the movie/　game/ whatever.

Same with the LGBT issue.
When the main objective is to play the game, and sexuality is not the key factor in the story line, then no need to complicate it with the character being gay or whatever else you want them to be.

With all of the above said, I would love to see a game where sexuality is a big key factor in the game story line.

 

[Something Amyss]

Wow. Good job missing the point of that guys argument.

Yes, I didn't say what you wanted to hear, so I missed his point.

Why does a characters sexual orientation matter.

If it doesn't matter, then why are so many people against it?

I'd like more black people in games, but I don't care.

Contradiction. You either want them or you don't care. You can want them, but not enough to complain, as you seem to, but you can't want them and not care.

 

[Something Amyss]

Lol, are you trolling me? I'm pro-gay, mind you.

Archie Bunker wasn't a racist.

As long as you do not even have your basic rights, how can you start ranting about 'not being represented in games'?!

I see. So it is your assertion that one cannot be concerned for both?

Because I'm having trouble seeing another scenario where one precludes the other.

For the record, my state does offer same-sex rights, as do several surrounding states. I've been a gay rights advocate since before I could vote or drive. So...where's the problem?

Yeah well it's your right and stuff and Freedom Of Religion so go on, discriminate against gays.
This seem like a REAL issue to me, instead of *omzgf my minority isn't represented in games*.

Again, it's either or.

I'm a self-diagnosed Asperger, omg, make the Jarl of Dawnstar an autist!

Get back to me when you're actually diagnosed. Self-diagnoses aren't valid.

I'm not doing this, so I don't see any reason why developers should mandatory include your precious minority in games.

Yeah, you're not doing it, so nobody else should! How dare people think and act different from you!



I do love the fact that dismissing your ridiculousness is somehow making this about "my" precious minorities.

I'm trying to be a human, an equal human, not one of the 'minorities' or 'majorities'.

Oh look, specious reasoning!

That's the same reasoning, actually, our politicians are using to deny gay rights. It's because of arguments like this gays are still getting the shit beat out of them, denied jobs, etc.

Congrats.

Maybe you should strive to become an equal and not try to get attention and love because you belong to a minority.

Followed by convenient assumption of people's motives!

Yeah, you should misinterpret one word out of context

No, I took it in a different direction. that's neither of the above. Try again.

and then bask in self-misery.

Please don't make shit up.

Maybe you should play modern games. To appeal to the US/UK and other whiny countries that are too afraid to see what is in their own pants, we are banning sex, genitals and all references to it. Inflicting huge psychological trauma's, making people very happy and excited to be able to wave around with a purple dildo in SR3.

Hmmmm...Interesting, but still a made-up argument.

I haven't seen a lot of genitals, romances, sex, wives and husbands in Skyrim, BF3 or MW3. If you are able to choose your own partner, and you can't choose to be gay/lesbian, well, that's a good argument. I fully support the option to be gay in all games where you can choose your own partner. But games haven't even entered a stage where they can create a good heterosexual couple. Games are too much seen as child toys or something, I guess. Demanding good gay representation when there isn't even good heterosexual representation doesn't make sense.

False assertion that people are somehow demanding more than what is afforded majorities....Check.

Next you're going to say the people who support more black characters want cheat codes to make black people invincible. What? You wouldn't make that argument? It's ridiculous?

...Exactly. And so is the notion that people are somehow asking for that which is not afforded in those games.

And as long as their are real, as in REALLY REAL, injustices and legal discrimination against gays, I would focus my energy there.

That's your right. But then, the two are not mutually exclusive. If you think, for example, that I'm going to magically make America a nation where gays are represented, you don't understand the legal and political procedures here. If you think one cannot do both, or that the action of saying " I'd like more gays in video games" will somehow take away from gay rights, then you're unrealistic and ridiculous.

You, sir, could be fighting for rape victims right now, or fighting starvation and AIDS in Africa. Does your response to me mean that you don't care about those issues? No. Does it mean that you do not spend time involved in those issues? Not by itself. I would not presume to know what you do in the rest of your time.

But if I were to use your argument as a model, I would be lecturing you on your stances on the above.

And then, after long posts misrepresenting what gay gamers want, I would complain about being misrepresented and taken " out of context."

Maybe you should worry about this guy.

Why?

I'm curious as to why you think Rick Perry is someone I should worry about. It can't be because you think he stands any chance at winning the Republican nomination, as he's polling in single digits.

It seems a little more pressing, a little more discriminating, a little more fucking retarded than (homo)sexuality being misrepresented in games.

Yep. A man with no chance of election, whose words are falling on deaf ears and being outright mocked, is a pressing matter. Oh, wait.

Your own logic, your own posting style would indicate him a waste of time, and that we would be better suited worrying about other people. And yet here you are, preaching the opposite.

By the way, I was excited to play the Gay Tony DLC for GTA IV.

"Some of my best friends are black people."

So we've got a game with 'gay' in the title, do you do know any mainstream/popular game that has 'heterosexual' or 'straight' in the title?

Oh, snap, son! That proves that gays are actually MORE represented than straights!

...What? It doesn't?

Then what was your point, exactly? That one game mentions homosexuality in the title, and others don't mention straights so...Straights don't exist? Surely, you're not trying to argue that the presence of the word "gay" in a title following up a game where you play a guy who has strictly female romantic interests, whose cousin wants to see "beeg amereecan teetees" at every opportunity, somehow counterbalances or proves a positive.

Or really...Anything.

 

[Olivia Faraday]

This is going to keep being an issue until it stops being an issue. When characters in media can be LGBT without anybody giving a crap, I swear, we'll stop hearing about it. But while people can try to whine that we're in a post-sexuality age all they want, the sheer amount of offended straight guys whining that Anders hit on them in Dragon Age 2 proves that we're not.

Why is there still a dialogue about this? Because there's still a dialogue about this, obviously. We don't hear nearly as much about racism as we used to. And why is that? Well, how many people wrote angry internet rants about Dragon Age 2's leading lady being black/hispanic as compared to how wrote about Anders coming onto them? In 1963 you can sure bet that it would have been a hot topic, but since nobody cares ... well, nobody cares.

When this stops being an issue, it'll stop being an issue. Simple as that. Gay inclusion isn't going anywhere -- thank god. You might as well get used to it instead of being offended while claiming not to be offended.

 

[Jaythulhu]

Just out of curiosity, why do you feel the need to call yourself a "Gaymer"? Why can't you just be a gamer like the rest of us? Why the need to single out your sexuality? I don't walk around referring to myself as a "straight Gamer". The only people who still give a shit about someone's sexuality in this day & age aren't worth wasting time on.

I'm sorry, but it's 2011, not 1011. Why does anyone still care about who fucks who? Don't we have real problems facing the entire damn planet we should all be trying to get on top of?

[Edit] forgot to mention, your essay was well thought out and well written, I enjoyed the read.

 

[klausaidon]

Just out of curiosity, why do you feel the need to call yourself a "Gaymer"? Why can't you just be a gamer like the rest of us? Why the need to single out your sexuality? I don't walk around referring to myself as a "straight Gamer". The only people who still give a shit about someone's sexuality in this day & age aren't worth wasting time on.

I'm sorry, but it's 2011, not 1011. Why does anyone still care about who fucks who? Don't we have real problems facing the entire damn planet we should all be trying to get on top of?

[Edit] forgot to mention, your essay was well thought out and well written, I enjoyed the read.

Because, sadly, it is still a issue. And so long as it is an issue, I'll stand loud and proud.

 

[klausaidon]

-Snip-

You still misunderstand my stance.
Samus moment, Samus moment, Samus moment, Samus moment.
I know games don't represent Heterosexual relationships all that well today, and that Homosexual relationships do have some representation as of late, which is great.
But there is still no, how should I put this, "cool" homosexual character. That sounds awkward, but it's my stance. And I'm not asking for better representation over heterosexual characters, hell I'm expecting less. Just one more step forward.