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Trunkage

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Alright, we got side tracked. Murder laws fail to protect people. Even if they ‘protects people’, it still fails plenty of people. Fact. In fact, I doubt they will ever be zero. So.. shouldn’t this get the same treatment? That we remove the law becuase it fails to protect people
 

Worgen

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Whatever, just wash your hands.
No I'm saying be careful with bringing in new laws when we can see what laws that weren't fully thought out are already causing.

As for only 1 how many other examples would you like how many are specifically needed?

It's 1 case but it impacted ~9 other women and their families.
Then Canada is just doomed. Yaniv clearly has the whole country under her boot heel. There is... no stopping her rampage, she will continue to ravage the countryside till none are left. She is an unstoppable monster. Canada had a nice run, but it clearly couldn't deal with a single trans woman who is crazy.
 
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TheMysteriousGX

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The point here is that there's an implicit assumption that minorities are something static and immovable - i.e. the minority could not become the majority, and thus could not ever become an oppressor. I'm glad you're not subscribed to that mode of thinking

edit: BTW there are no residency laws in Japan. If you are not Japanese, you can't vote.
...I don't really know where you were going with this, but like a lot of countries, citizens of Japan are the only ones that can vote. A white person can be a citizen of Japan, and thereby vote.
 

Dwarvenhobble

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Then Canada is just doomed. Yaniv clearly has the whole country under her boot heel. There is... no stopping her rampage, she will continue to ravage the countryside till none are left. She is an unstoppable monster. Canada had a nice run, but it clearly couldn't deal with a single trans woman who is crazy.
Well the $6,000 in damages so far seems to be stopping her luckily

Though she's now filed a 2nd suit against them for $12,000. Also she has lawsuits against a Gynaecologists office, 5 journalists 1 for property damage to her walking stick (cause by her hitting him over the head with it). A Beauty Pageant, Ricky Gervais (though as he's not a Canadian resident that's going about as well as you can imagine).

Oh and this is before new more lax laws get brought in.
 

Dwarvenhobble

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Alright, we got side tracked. Murder laws fail to protect people. Even if they ‘protects people’, it still fails plenty of people. Fact. In fact, I doubt they will ever be zero. So.. shouldn’t this get the same treatment? That we remove the law becuase it fails to protect people
So you're in favour of legalising murder?
 

Silvanus

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Except in Yanivs case where it's been implied Yaniv rang round places trying to get a wax and if a place said they could accommodate because they they had people who did work on male genitalia she put the said she'd get back to them and never did then called other places instead.

In the case of genital waxing services they are specialised due to differences in cock and balls v vagina.
How does any of this support the notion that the legal system isn't working as intended?

A guy asked for a known to be fairly religious baker to make a gay wedding cake, the store refused on religious grounds, he took them to the human rights court. They won, because as it turns out the guy is a known activist and was phoning round shops asking them to make a cake for a gay wedding and then when they said they would he'd say he'd check round a bit more and get back to them. He never got back to any of the ones who said they would if he wanted. Now to be clear I think the bakery was stupid and shouldn't be refusing something non specialised like that but it shows how activists / people looking to pick a fight will go round doing so due to the systems in place.

The unique factor is how easy it is to bring the litigations (as this goes through the courts differently to a normal lawsuit) and how kind of easy it is to just use identity and a bludgeon.
...but they failed. So, what, you want it to be harder to bring litigation in the first place? Its not enough that the litigation was unsuccessful; people shouldn't even be able to try, because a few people might abuse it?
 

Thaluikhain

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...but they failed. So, what, you want it to be harder to bring litigation in the first place? Its not enough that the litigation was unsuccessful; people shouldn't even be able to try, because a few people might abuse it?
Well, that logic has always been very popular with people when discussing changing laws for reporting or investigating rape.
 
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Iron

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...I don't really know where you were going with this, but like a lot of countries, citizens of Japan are the only ones that can vote. A white person can be a citizen of Japan, and thereby vote.
Residents can vote (in municipal elections) in a lot of countries.
Japan has birth citizenship, not land citizenship.
You can be denied visa and residency based on your political activities.
English Teachers - typically white men - make the bulk of this Caucasian foreign population.
 

Trunkage

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So you're in favour of legalising murder?
Im just using metric you used on a law you don't like and putting onto another law. I could have picked the war on drugs or fraud. It doesnt really matter

If all the laws that failed were abandoned like you proposed, we wouldn't have any laws. Laws failing people has been going on for such a long time.
 

Worgen

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Whatever, just wash your hands.
Well the $6,000 in damages so far seems to be stopping her luckily

Though she's now filed a 2nd suit against them for $12,000. Also she has lawsuits against a Gynaecologists office, 5 journalists 1 for property damage to her walking stick (cause by her hitting him over the head with it). A Beauty Pageant, Ricky Gervais (though as he's not a Canadian resident that's going about as well as you can imagine).

Oh and this is before new more lax laws get brought in.
Its too late, her power is too great. She has already conquered your legal system by filing lawsuits that she loses. Maybe if you have a TRUE HERO like Jordan Peterson to come and call her by the wrong gender, she will go away.
 

Kae

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Its too late, her power is too great. She has already conquered your legal system by filing lawsuits that she loses. Maybe if you have a TRUE HERO like Jordan Peterson to come and call her by the wrong gender, she will go away.
Dwarfio over there is British, making it more confusing that he's so obsessed with this person.
 

Worgen

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Whatever, just wash your hands.
Dwarfio over there is British, making it more confusing that he's so obsessed with this person.
Cause he knows how this goes. First she came for the dry cleaners and he did nothing, then she came for the salons and he did nothing, by the time she came for the British and she will come for them, there was no one left.
 
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Xprimentyl

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Didn't she?

Yaniv was exposed to be a huge racist before and part of the reason for the suits is suspected to be her hatred of people of a different racial background to herself. So Yaniv putting ~9 women from said ethnicities out of work for most of a year. Forcing 3 of them to even go so far as to take the stand and endure the bullshit that went down in the court house where the judges multiple times had to step in because Yaniv was more trying to attack their cultural beliefs rather than anything else. Then in the end it's only $2,000 each to those who actually went to the court and won against her?

Seems like ultimately she won there by helping harm or shut down businesses. Causing losses to the people and actually having some of them quit or being scared to carry on with their work lest they run into another Yaniv. Her victory wasn't legal it was a victory of the immoral (meaning her abusive actions).

The law generally exists to cover exceptions. Murderers are the exception in the general population. But there are laws to prevent it. To go with a lesser one drink driving, most people don't likely drink drive but laws exist to cover it to try and protect people.

Most Trans women won't throw a fit you're right. But a small minority will and the laws if not written right would actually help support their bullshit not prevent it.
No, her primary motive was not justice or to harm anyone (though she had no problem risking that very real potential); she wanted money. She wanted to get paid, hoping that the sensitive subject of gender identity relations would net her a quick, easy payout, and that's not what she got; she, in fact, got saddled with a $6,000 BILL she couldn't pay, the exact OPPOSITE of what she was going for. Those that suffered for her failed scheme were unfortunate collateral damage, i.e.: she'd have been happy as a lark had she won her suit and those salons and people in them weren't affected. If anything, her scheme has set the trans narrative BACK, and that hasn't stopped her, so clearly she cares little for human rights. The law is fine, but it can't always account for shitty individuals; we count on the judicial process to vet that kind of scum out.

That said, any number of non-human rights law can and have been exploited this way; it's the unfortunate nature of an overly litigious society wherein everyone is owed something and no one is accountable. The human rights laws you think are so sloppily written are just like any other; it's only sensitive because the issues it's broadened to encompass are a relatively new ones.
 

Dwarvenhobble

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How does any of this support the notion that the legal system isn't working as intended?
Simply because it's allowing other people to use it as a weapon. In this case a racist like Yaniv using it to attack and try to punish people she is prejudice against.


...but they failed. So, what, you want it to be harder to bring litigation in the first place? Its not enough that the litigation was unsuccessful; people shouldn't even be able to try, because a few people might abuse it?
Harm was still done. If their entire desire is to harm then they've not failed as long as it costs the opponents more than they make in damages.


Well, that logic has always been very popular with people when discussing changing laws for reporting or investigating rape.
You mean like the law that was being proposed at one point in the UK where the accused wouldn't be allowed the right to know the identity of their accuser until the court day itself thus not actually be able to easily prepare a defence or evidence to defend themselves?

Im just using metric you used on a law you don't like and putting onto another law. I could have picked the war on drugs or fraud. It doesnt really matter

If all the laws that failed were abandoned like you proposed, we wouldn't have any laws. Laws failing people has been going on for such a long time.
You mean the metric I put in where laws exist to make sure a minority of people can't keep causing harm.......... I think you failed to understand my metric lol.


You think laws had anything to do with that?
Who knows. Lot more people with the capacity to shoot back might have very much discouraged a number of actions lol.


Its too late, her power is too great. She has already conquered your legal system by filing lawsuits that she loses. Maybe if you have a TRUE HERO like Jordan Peterson to come and call her by the wrong gender, she will go away.
Doesn't matter if she loses when her goal is to cause harm or force settlements. Either she gets money or gets to cause more harm so for her it's a win win.


No, her primary motive was not justice or to harm anyone (though she had no problem risking that very real potential); she wanted money. She wanted to get paid, hoping that the sensitive subject of gender identity relations would net her a quick, easy payout, and that's not what she got; she, in fact, got saddled with a $6,000 BILL she couldn't pay, the exact OPPOSITE of what she was going for. Those that suffered for her failed scheme were unfortunate collateral damage, i.e.: she'd have been happy as a lark had she won her suit and those salons and people in them weren't affected. If anything, her scheme has set the trans narrative BACK, and that hasn't stopped her, so clearly she cares little for human rights. The law is fine, but it can't always account for shitty individuals; we count on the judicial process to vet that kind of scum out.

That said, any number of non-human rights law can and have been exploited this way; it's the unfortunate nature of an overly litigious society wherein everyone is owed something and no one is accountable. The human rights laws you think are so sloppily written are just like any other; it's only sensitive because the issues it's broadened to encompass are a relatively new ones.
She waddled with a $6,000 bill which she will try to convince some gullible fools to pay for her because oppression or she's a wronged activist.

Hell she might just get it covered by pushing people to settle with ton more of frivolous lawsuits against people.

Also again Yaniv has been found by some to be quite racist so her getting to cause harm might be seen as a win for Yaniv.


The Law is not fine if even when they won the Salon's ultimately lost out over it. The damages if they're lucky will cover legal fees at best and not lost earnings from being unable to operate or lost time due to having to deal with the bullshit lawsuit. Laws should be designed so they're not open to such easy abuse.
 

Worgen

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Whatever, just wash your hands.
Doesn't matter if she loses when her goal is to cause harm or force settlements. Either she gets money or gets to cause more harm so for her it's a win win.
I see you have accepted her legal brilliance and have already decided you will be a high priest in her cult of Yanivites. So you come to this board, to convince more of us to join her cult.

I'm going to give you a hint though. Don't go after a guy named Caleb or his girlfriend Ophelia, it won't end well for you.
 

Xprimentyl

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She waddled with a $6,000 bill which she will try to convince some gullible fools to pay for her because oppression or she's a wronged activist.

Hell she might just get it covered by pushing people to settle with ton more of frivolous lawsuits against people.

Also again Yaniv has been found by some to be quite racist so her getting to cause harm might be seen as a win for Yaniv.


The Law is not fine if even when they won the Salon's ultimately lost out over it. The damages if they're lucky will cover legal fees at best and not lost earnings from being unable to operate or lost time due to having to deal with the bullshit lawsuit. Laws should be designed so they're not open to such easy abuse.
Never once claimed Yaniv is a good person, was actually treated unfairly nor that she was using the law properly. Not disagreeing with anything you've said on that account. The issue is was it the law or the person at fault here. We could argue the issue lies with the judicial system that enforces the law, but to fault the law is to blame the bullet and not the guy who fired the gun.

My question is: what language (generically, not asking that you type out pages and pages of legalese) would you like to see that would "fix" the law for you? Again, human rights laws are not the only ones abused by overly litigious assholes seeking a payday, and in this case, the law got it right; Yaniv did NOT win her suits and, in fact, was ordered to pay something back.

Will you concede that there are similar problems with laws that award people for damages from, say, a small business? Perhaps the janitor neglected to put down a "Wet Floor" sign whilst mopping, and my elderly granny slips and breaks her hip? Is it not also feasible that I, an able-bodied young(ish) man might see that same wet floor with no sign, pretend to fall, suffer a minor bruise or contusion, then sue said small business? If they're tired up with me in courts for months or years and suffer losses, by your standard, doesn't that mean the law is improperly written? Point being, to say these newer, more inclusive human rights laws have language that's dramatically different from older, established ones is selective-sighted.

Two objective facts: no law is perfect and some people will be assholes; lumping the onus of responsibility on a group of people for the innate flaws of the rule of law is exclusionary, and in a time when people are discriminated against, from passive-aggressive denials of service to outright hate speech and violence, I, for one, am glad the imperfect law is there so when someone breaks it, they can be held accountable.
 

Dwarvenhobble

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I see you have accepted her legal brilliance and have already decided you will be a high priest in her cult of Yanivites. So you come to this board, to convince more of us to join her cult.

I'm going to give you a hint though. Don't go after a guy named Caleb or his girlfriend Ophelia, it won't end well for you.
Fine charge a head regardless. Just don't say you weren't warned when things come your way or the way of some-one you know.