I left my girlfriend so I would never have to play another JRPG...

[Glademaster_v1legacy]

Problem 4: Thanks a link to a pointless period in Japanese history. Just so you don't feel left out I will also link to something completely off top and related here [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cake].

Actually the Edo Period reference goes along perfectly with the point he was trying to make. Apparently you didn't read the wiki article.

The more you know...

Actually I see the point he is trying to make and I read the wiki article and it is still irrelevant. Quoting a period of history that is over by at least a hundred years is stupid as we've moved on and so have the Japanese. So apparently you didn't see what I was getting at or that the guy is just a troll.

*Whooooshh*

Sorry, you're still missing the point if you think the link was irrelevant to his joke. No matter though. This thread is just a troll pit anyway.

Yes the thread is a troll pit and if you think the link is relevant then fair enough but I don't think it is for the fact that JRPGs have changed and are changing. So that is why it is unrelevant if they had stayed the same then yes it would be but they haven't stayed 100% the same so it's not.

Also This is person explained it better and in a more concise way than I did.

OP should know that the japanese do not refuse to change or advance.
as I recall, they're one of the leading nations in robotics.
holding on to traditions and 'not advancing' are not the same thing.

.

 

[fogmike]

Wiser words have never been spoken.

They have.

Now if you will excuse me, I shall bounce up and down on my bed in anticipation of Final Fantasy XIII.

See? Anyway, screw OP, I have found things to love and things to hate in all FFs I have played. That's 1, 2, III, IV, VI, VII, VIII, IX, X, X-2, XII, Revenant Wings. Not missing many.

 

[ryai458]

maybe if we march round his wall of text seven times it will all come crumbling down..

 

[Del-Toro]

I stopped taking you seriously as soon as you called him "The Odin". Also, having an art degree doesn't make you an expert on story telling, that is left to the people who write stories, not the ones who paint pictures and assume they are smart because of their worthless diploma.

 

[MiracleOfSound]

Apparently Tidus has an Art Degree too.

 

[Lord Mountbatten Reborn]

The only JRPGs I have ever liked are Earthbound and Mother 3, for obvious reasons. They count right?

By the way, love the way you put "Art Degree" in capital letters. I completely trust and feel everything is validated by your opinion now. Art: serious business.

how does having arts degree make him know more about a story? or make him better than us? im sick of this troll.

And his art degree. I feel so out of my league. It's a truly humbling piece of paper to behold.

 

[boholikeu]

Yes the thread is a troll pit and if you think the link is relevant then fair enough but I don't think it is for the fact that JRPGs have changed and are changing. So that is why it is unrelevant if they had stayed the same then yes it would be but they haven't stayed 100% the same so it's not.

Also This is person explained it better and in a more concise way than I did.

OP should know that the japanese do not refuse to change or advance.
as I recall, they're one of the leading nations in robotics.
holding on to traditions and 'not advancing' are not the same thing.

.

Hm, now we're bordering on a somewhat worthwhile discussion. Maybe we can salvage this thread a bit.

You're right that JRPGs haven't stayed exactly the same these last 10 years, but in terms of storytelling (which is supposed to be JRPGs strong point) I really haven't seen all that much advancement since the FF7 era. Most still rely on the old cinematic/dungeon crawl separation of story and gameplay, and it just bugs me to see JRPGs stagnate when other genres (even FPS games) have found much more effective ways to tell their narratives. Playing Portal or Bioshock is a much different experience from playing the original Half-Life 10 years ago, but outside of the Persona series (and maybe The World Ends With You) I can't really say the same for that many JRPGs.

Also, just as an aside, the whole robotics thing is hardly proof that the Japanese welcome change. Perhaps they are quick to adopt new technology, but I can tell you from first-hand experience that the gamer culture here in Japan is pretty resistant to trying new mechanics, actually. Of course, I'm just a foreigner in Japan. What do I know? Let's see what a Japanese developer has to say on the subject:

I just can't understand why Japanese gamers are so reluctant to play networked games. I find overseas players to be more curious ? they go towards what they think looks, sounds or feels fun by themselves. In Japan, I have the feeling users are just waiting for us to guide, to feed them with fun things.

...

A lot of Japanese developers have pretty much given up, and just focus on making games for Japan. They don't think they can make games that will sell anywhere else. So this trend, this "game development isolationism," I think is very troubling. I'm concerned about what will happen to the industry in Japan...

I think Western developers borrowed and learned from Japanese developers all those years when Japan was ahead. They built on that and just blazed ahead on their own. There's so many new, creative, inventive games coming out in the west. Games like Gears (of War) and Halo built on the past but just take everything to the next level...

...

People say that RPGs are popular in Japan, but really it's the Dragon Quest and Final Fantasy series that do well. There aren't really any other big RPG series besides those two, that do really well, anyway.

So I think that if this trend continues, Japanese developers will just rely on those few big franchises. Japanese developers have to explore new territory, carve out new genres, try to make games that have universal appeal.

 

[Dimbo_Sama]

Yeah, I lost interest after you said RPGs aren't a legitimate form of storytelling.

I have just two words to say to that, Planescape Torment

 

[SnootyEnglishman]

Are you also an English major because it seems you used more words than needed to say "I don't like JRPG's". Oh and just because you have a degree does not mean you are better then everyone and also you have no authority on anything either you totalitarian asswipe.

 

[wolfgamesstudios]

play kingdom hearts, tell me what you think. the first one, forthe ps2, all others are shit

 

[GideonB]

Are you also an English major because it seems you used more words than needed to say "I don't like JRPG's". Oh and just because you have a degree does not mean you are better then everyone and also you have no authority on anything either you totalitarian asswipe.

I agree with this person. Also you shouldn't have dumped your gf for that. Infidelity completely understandable but not because of a fucking addiction to playing JRPG's. That's just stupid. I find JRPG's boring but still fun (except FF7. I hated that game when I first played it. Boring and the characters were like emopussyholes)

 

[ChaosGenesis]

So I'm thinking you should just send that off to a publisher and once it's a novel, I'll consider reading it all. For now I just skimmed the headers.

RE: Problem One: I won't argue that RPG aren't the best medium for storytelling... and that's because books are. However (good) RPG's are great means of creating a tale and the best part is that most allow the player to choose the story instead of just one linear script that you have no choice in the matter.

RE: Problem Two: If we're talking about JRPGs then sure. I don't play them. But if we're talking about just straight up RPGs... you must just be playing the crappy ones.

RE: Problem Three: Agree completely.

RE: Problem Four: Again. I don't play JRPGs. I'll take your word for it.

That is all.

 

[Zayren]

Guys, this guy isn't serious. No way he can be.

Trust me, I'm a whale biologist.

 

[Glademaster_v1legacy]

Spoiler

Yes the thread is a troll pit and if you think the link is relevant then fair enough but I don't think it is for the fact that JRPGs have changed and are changing. So that is why it is unrelevant if they had stayed the same then yes it would be but they haven't stayed 100% the same so it's not.

Also This is person explained it better and in a more concise way than I did.

OP should know that the japanese do not refuse to change or advance.
as I recall, they're one of the leading nations in robotics.
holding on to traditions and 'not advancing' are not the same thing.

.

Hm, now we're bordering on a somewhat worthwhile discussion. Maybe we can salvage this thread a bit.

You're right that JRPGs haven't stayed exactly the same these last 10 years, but in terms of storytelling (which is supposed to be JRPGs strong point) I really haven't seen all that much advancement since the FF7 era. Most still rely on the old cinematic/dungeon crawl separation of story and gameplay, and it just bugs me to see JRPGs stagnate when other genres (even FPS games) have found much more effective ways to tell their narratives. Playing Portal or Bioshock is a much different experience from playing the original Half-Life 10 years ago, but outside of the Persona series (and maybe The World Ends With You) I can't really say the same for that many JRPGs.

Also, just as an aside, the whole robotics thing is hardly proof that the Japanese welcome change. Perhaps they are quick to adopt new technology, but I can tell you from first-hand experience that the gamer culture here in Japan is pretty resistant to trying new mechanics, actually. Of course, I'm just a foreigner in Japan. What do I know? Let's see what a Japanese developer has to say on the subject:

I just can't understand why Japanese gamers are so reluctant to play networked games. I find overseas players to be more curious ? they go towards what they think looks, sounds or feels fun by themselves. In Japan, I have the feeling users are just waiting for us to guide, to feed them with fun things.

...

A lot of Japanese developers have pretty much given up, and just focus on making games for Japan. They don't think they can make games that will sell anywhere else. So this trend, this "game development isolationism," I think is very troubling. I'm concerned about what will happen to the industry in Japan...

I think Western developers borrowed and learned from Japanese developers all those years when Japan was ahead. They built on that and just blazed ahead on their own. There's so many new, creative, inventive games coming out in the west. Games like Gears (of War) and Halo built on the past but just take everything to the next level...

...

People say that RPGs are popular in Japan, but really it's the Dragon Quest and Final Fantasy series that do well. There aren't really any other big RPG series besides those two, that do really well, anyway.

So I think that if this trend continues, Japanese developers will just rely on those few big franchises. Japanese developers have to explore new territory, carve out new genres, try to make games that have universal appeal.

Yes that may be true and yes I know some Japanse gamers are like that but because some are it turns into a social disease and becomes what you have quoted. Which as it's said in the post there is a will to change and what for it by devs and I'm sure some gamers but it's like Blizzard wanting to change and a few players would welcome it but the other several million defend the way it is. Even Wada[footnote]if you are big into gaming news or read news on this site you'd know this if not I've supplied link here [http://www.destructoid.com/final-fantasy-xiii-might-be-last-true-final-fantasy-159676.phtml][/footnote] wants to move on and change things and shake it up a bit by letting devs outside of Japan make FF games. I do see where you are coming from the will is there to do it and there is a want to have it by some people but the people who want it aren't plentyful and hungry enough.

Also is it not fair to say a fair few of Western people rather WRPGs because of the style? It is and stories are very similar this isn't just a problem with JRPG games. I think all games need some more original or new storys or plot devices as a lot of things are stagnating.

Is not fair to say the same about the Halo series and CoD series at this point in the West as FPS are starting to go the way with the JRPG story which I do agree with what you say on that matter. Now I know the guy mentions Halo advancing but it hasn't really advanced a lot since day 1 in fact I belive Halo and Gears use backwards mechanics that continue into online play such as weapon pick ups which is fine for single player but doesn't work in multiplayer unless it is L4Desque as in co op campaigns.

On the topic of Western Games. WRPGs especially Bioware and Bethesda ones have stagnated horribly of late. Oblivion was basically the same as Morrowind with less content!!! I liked Oblivion and it did bring some new things to the table but it cut out Medium Armor, Spears and all the variety of the weapons in Marksmanship skill. I have to call it on that. See even though they have stagnated a bit it is a formula that works for them which persoannly I think everyone has slipped into a comfort zone.

 

[Zefar]

Kinda fun to see people nag about the random encounters. You guys do know this was used because of the limitation of the consoles right?

Lately I have seen games that have monsters on the screen and when they touch you, you head into combat.

Combat wise wRPG are not that much different. For example Kotor, you pause the game when entering a combat, give 3 orders, let the character do them, pause it and give another 3 orders. You repeat this in every battle you encounter too.
NeverWinter Nights uses the same system if I'm not.


Most FF games used the Turn based system but the faster your character was the quicker he could hit again. This got more visible with Haste on them from FF7 and up.

Story wise for me, the game offer a rather unique taste that wRPG lacks. wRPGs are almost always boring to play. As in, very few times you will actually laugh at things. So they go serious with the game. jRPGs doesn't seems to do this. Some games actually try to throw in a lot of fun parts.

The one I'm playing for the moment is Tales of Abyss. Good lord this game rocks.

Story? Similar type of Bioshock but much much bigger and better. Better than any other story I found so far.
Likable characters? Totally, though one character in particular changes so much that he's an entirely different guy at the end. I'd love to see wRPG do something like this other than "Oh I'm gonna be Evil/Good now"
Combat? Beats wRPG at least. It's not turnbased but active combat with lots of skills that you can use.
Exploration? You got a world map, you can explore towns, you got an upper world and an underworld and then you have these extra dungeons to play around in.
Voice actors? Japanese = Good, English = Rumors are they are horrible.

Honestly, it's the best jRPG I ever played. Combat could be a bit slow in the start, but once you crank up that Agi things gets smoother.

Knowing people here, you won't last 5 minutes with the English voice actors but you can always try.
Do know that the story just won't be instantly told right away.

 

[AWAR]

TOO LONG, DID NOT READ

Im just kiddin' I agree with most of the points you made but the way you present them is somewhat awkward..
To my mind JRPGs and animes are almost the same to this:

 

[EliteFreq]

JRPGs don't equal RPGs. I love JRPGs but not in the same way as Western RPGs, I expect them to be innovative in different ways, but still being the same thing we're used to.

 

[JdaS]

Now, I only have one question. Why on earth was PayJ567 put on probation (2nd post). Other than stating the obvious I saw nothing reprehensible about it.

 

[Hussmann54]

I will now count how many times you've failed in convincing me.

just elitist with an Art Degree

I have an Art Degree

I have an Art Degree.

before I had my Art Degree

And as someone with an Art Degree

One of the most important parts of getting my Art Degree

and remember that I have an Art Degree.

me and my Art Degree.

8 times. I will now proceed to substitute the words "Art Degree" with "Explosive Diahoreea" for the sake of getting at least some entertainment out of this complete waste of time.

hehehe
I just tried that, I almost had an Art Degree from laughing so much XD

Thats makes two of us...... that was great.... helped me turn around a mediocre day. Thank ye kindly, good sir.

 

[Laxman9292]

All I got from the Wall O' Text is that trolls are studying Art now...

What makes a JRPG a JRPG exactly? Is is turn-based combat? Ambiguous girly characters? What are their defining characterstics?

Dragon Age masterfully hid all of the dice-rolling and number crunching from you, except for the damage numbers that pop up. It does a great job of presenting 'live action' combat while still being largely turn based under the hood. It also tells a great story.

Dragon Age is by no means a JRPG just thought i would let you know. It is about as WRPG as you can get in fact.
And JRPGs are those mostly made in Japan and have artwork similar to Japanese art (Manga and other such styles) and filled with aspects of Japanese culture (ridiculously dressed and ambiguously male/female characters) Turn-based is also a good indicator, although it is not strictly JRPG territory