If A Random Girl Walks Up and Punches You Would You Hit Her Back?

[Nemesis729]

I don't think I'd ever really be able to hit a girl, Sexist? Maybe. But I would just feel like an asshole, unless a girl come at me with a knife I wouldn't hit her... Though if she just came up and started wailing on me I would push her away.

Believe it or not it probably wouldn't even be legal to hit her back. Guy or girl, self defence rarely covers punching someone.

 

[Garyn Dakari]

I'd follow her and try and find out why she hit me. I doubt I'd ever hit her though, even if she hit me several times. I'd just block her attacks, and get away.

 

[SonOfVoorhees]

Yep. Would smack her straight in the face. Why would you let another person smack you for no reason and get away with it? No one has a right to hit anyway, and if they do, expect a retaliation.

 

[Mstrswrd]

I'd ask her what the fuck was going on and why she hit me, then I'd tell her to fuck off. If she hit me a second time, then damn right I'd hit her back.

I was going to say I'd hit her back, but then I read this, and it seemed more realistic. So, yeah, this.

 

[Creator002]

Not at first, I wouldn't. I'd ask her what the bloody hell her goddamn problem was. If she hit me a second time, then I'd say physical retaliation is deserved.
Then again, I'd do the same if a guy had hit me.

 

[Jabberwock xeno]

I would be willing to punch her back, but I would probably just stand there for a few moments wondering why the hell that just happened.

EDIT#4: Ninja'd by pretty much everybody

 

[Eynimeb]

The whole debate could be simplified.

You cannot give a large group of human beings the privilige to hurt others without fear of retribution, without expecting many in that group of humans to start abusing it.

In western society, women, regardless of their relative size and strength, have that privilige. Therefore many will abuse it. The enablers are unintelligent and/or bigoted men and women who will either jump to conclusions, or not care at all about justice and merely see an opportunity to show off in a socially acceptable way. I have seen groups of boys do it too - pick a fight and then call in their parents when their target dares strike back. The enablers here were parents who support their children's bullying, no matter what.

It has nothing to do with what's between people's legs, and everything to do with what's between their ears.

Being smaller and weaker should not shield a person from consequences to their actions. However, there are many people, both male and female, who care nothing for justice or equality. Modern day girlpower combined with old fashioned chivalry results in women feeling both empowered enough to attack, and protected enough to not fear consequences.

Men may have to put up with this injustice for a while, as women had to/have to put up with other injusices for much longer, but the current balance of morals won't last. In the end, women will have to accept full equality, with all the responsibility for one's own actions that come with it, or the resentment and frustration going around today will become mainstream cynicism, and that will hurt the feminist movement.

Men should also keep in mind that the ability to get someone in trouble by publicly pretending to be assaulted in no way helps against actual attackers. Unlike a woman screaming rape after attacking a guy in public, actual attackers/rapists will make sure there are no witnesses, making it her word against his, and very hard to get a conviction. In the Netherlands, police estimate 60% of claims of rape and sexual assault by girls age 12-18 are false (though only 20% of charges), and they are becoming increasingly cynical. Feminists have started calling on women to not make false claims, because they tie up police resources, preventing them from working on *real* cases.

edit: specified age of girls regarding suspected false charges

 

[Kyrinn]

Always good to see people with no understanding whatsoever of the reality of rape.

In the US, the arrest rate for rape is 25% (compared to 79% for murder, and 51% for aggravated assault).
[link]http://www.cbsnews.com/2100-500690_162-5590118.html[/link]

In the UK, 1% of all rape victims see their rapist convicted (allowing for unreported rapes, reports not leading to prosecutions, and prosecutions not leading to convictions).
[link]http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/markeaston/2008/07/rape_a_complex_crime.html[/link]

And the average sentence for rape in the US is 117 months, while the average time actually served is 65 months (56% of the sentence). So 57 years... no.
[link]http://bjs.ojp.usdoj.gov/content/pub/pdf/PSATSFV.PDF[/link]

I'm pretty sure both of us were embellishing our points. Mine being that this woman is crazy and I'd most likely make things worse for myself by hitting/grabing her. I really don't think 57 years was meant to be anything near an accurate sentence either.

 

[fenrizz]

The whole debate could be simplified.

You cannot give a large group of human beings the privilige to hurt others without fear of retribution, without expecting many in that group of humans to start abusing it.

In western society, women, regardless of their relative size and strength, have that privilige. Therefore many will abuse it. The enablers are unintelligent and/or bigoted men and women who will either jump to conclusions, or not care at all about justice and merely see an opportunity to show off in a socially acceptable way. I have seen groups of boys do it too - pick a fight and then call in their parents when their target dares strike back. The enablers here were parents who support their children's bullying, no matter what.

It has nothing to do with what's between people's legs, and everything to do with what's between their ears.

Being smaller and weaker should not shield a person from consequences to their actions. However, there are many people, both male and female, who care nothing for justice or equality. Modern day girlpower combined with old fashioned chivalry results in women feeling both empowered enough to attack, and protected enough to not fear consequences.

Men may have to put up with this injustice for a while, as women had to/have to put up with other injusices for much longer, but the current balance of morals won't last. In the end, women will have to accept full equality, with all the responsibility for one's own actions that come with it, or the resentment and frustration going around today will become mainstream cynicism, and that will hurt the feminist movement.

Men should also keep in mind that the ability to get someone in trouble by publicly pretending to be assaulted in no way helps against actual attackers. Unlike a woman screaming rape after attacking a guy in public, actual attackers/rapists will make sure there are no witnesses, making it her word against his, and very hard to get a conviction. In the Netherlands, police estimate 60% of claims of rape and sexual assault by women are false (though only 20% of charges), and they are becoming increasingly cynical. Feminists have started calling on women to not make false claims, because they tie up police resources, preventing them from working on *real* cases.

I must give praise to this well thought out and well written response.

You touch upon very important issues in todays society, that ought to be debated more.
I have a feeling that this thread would look very different if this was the opening post.

Sorry for the short reply, but typing on a iPad is no fun at all.

 

[higgs20]

yep, 'don't throw a punch unless you're willing to take one' is a rule that's not gender specific.

 

[Deathlord665]

Of course i would, fuck that *****

 

[esperandote]

1st punch i would be, WTF?
2nd punch i would twist her arm.

 

[agrajagthetesty]

Always good to see people with no understanding whatsoever of the reality of rape.

In the US, the arrest rate for rape is 25% (compared to 79% for murder, and 51% for aggravated assault).
[link]http://www.cbsnews.com/2100-500690_162-5590118.html[/link]

In the UK, 1% of all rape victims see their rapist convicted (allowing for unreported rapes, reports not leading to prosecutions, and prosecutions not leading to convictions).
[link]http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/markeaston/2008/07/rape_a_complex_crime.html[/link]

And the average sentence for rape in the US is 117 months, while the average time actually served is 65 months (56% of the sentence). So 57 years... no.
[link]http://bjs.ojp.usdoj.gov/content/pub/pdf/PSATSFV.PDF[/link]

I'm pretty sure both of us were embellishing our points. Mine being that this woman is crazy and I'd most likely make things worse for myself by hitting/grabing her. I really don't think 57 years was meant to be anything near an accurate sentence either.

Yes, I do understand that. It's just that the amount of bullshit I see being said about rape is ridiculous, and today I happened to feel like pushing back. I realise that I made the conversation a lot more serious than either of you probably meant it to be - but your "embellishments", in a culture that is so incredibly misinformed about rape, are unhelpful.

If you'd simply said that hitting back would make things worse, that would have been fine, because gender-neutral and not promoting misinformation. But your comment did promote misinformation - namely, that women falsely accuse men of rape willy-nilly, and that it's easy to get results when accusing people of rape ("I'd almost certainly end up defending myself in court").

But, to the extent that I knew that your comments were meant humorously but responded seriously anyway, and that I happened to pick on you when there's any number of people out there propagating false ideas about rape, many of them worse, I apologise. I'd always appreciate less false ideas being spread about rape though - exaggerated tone or not. Thanks for being civil.

 

[Right Hook]

This Thread is for the guys to answer but ladies feel free to answer as well. Personally i would hit a girl if she walked up to me and punched me in the face if I didn't know her.

I'd wonder what horrible thing I'd done to this poor girl, it's not like the punch would bother me, no disrespect but I can shrug off a punch from most people like it is nothing. The fact that she is willing to punch me like this means that this is clearly a girl worth having a conversation with.

 

[agrajagthetesty]

In the Netherlands, police estimate 60% of claims of rape and sexual assault by women are false (though only 20% of charges)

Holy shit, please provide a source for that at once. The literature I've read says that false reports are more in the range of 2-8% (and, indeed, that police bias can be a significant factor in inflating the numbers):
[link]http://www.ndaa.org/pdf/the_voice_vol_3_no_1_2009.pdf[/link]

 

[guitarsniper]

Step Back
Block
Sankyo

Done

 

[Eynimeb]

In the Netherlands, police estimate 60% of claims of rape and sexual assault by women are false (though only 20% of charges)

Holy shit, please provide a source for that at once. The literature I've read says that false reports are more in the range of 2-8% (and, indeed, that police bias can be a significant factor in inflating the numbers):
[link]http://www.ndaa.org/pdf/the_voice_vol_3_no_1_2009.pdf[/link]

It's in Dutch. There are other articles on the phenomenon, but this is the only one that mentions numbers. It applies specifically to girls 12-18. When you go to the police to report a crime, they first tell you that pressing false charges is a crime. Half the girls choose not to press charges after the standard speech. Of the charges they do press, 20% ends up either admitting she lied, or the police suspect she lied, but they usually err on the side of caution in favor of the girl.

http://www.volkskrant.nl/vk/nl/2686/Binnenland/article/detail/1856828/2011/03/08/Veel-aangiften-van-zedenmisdrijven-blijken-vals.dhtml

This article goes into more depth on the motivations but offers no 'hard' figures:

http://www.websitevoordepolitie.nl/archief/minderjarige-meisjes-en-aangiften-van-zedenmisdrijven-1211.html

One of my sisters once pressed false rape charges against a man she barely knew, hoping she'd get bumped up the social housing list and get an appartment quicker. All the women she and her mother mentioned it to supported her. So it's very likely that it happens more often.

In the Netherlands a third of all reported crimes are suspected to be lies.
http://www.sleutelstad.nl/nieuws/archief/2011/04/politie-aantal-valse-aangiften-enorm-probleem

Obviously, getting this information directly, and neatly sorted, from the police is pretty much impossible for a host of reasons.

 

[FantomOmega]

Depends, if she caught me off guard I might end up backhanding her with a closed FIST out of reflex before I knew what hit me, if she walked up to me and I saw her coming there's no way I wouldn't tell if my pissed off ex want to clock me one but if I have never seen the girl before I wouldn't be expecting to get hit and will DEMAND a reasonable explanation as to why I was attacked or get sued, if said REASON was about mistaken identity I will guilt her (if she looks good) into a date and provide a sympathetic shoulder to sleep on the morning after... in the same bed... you can't get any more obvious than that!

 

[BytByte]

Depending on how much it hurt, man or woman, I would either probably either be too much in pain to respond, or laugh uncontrollably. Probably a combination of the two.

 

[agrajagthetesty]

Holy shit, please provide a source for that at once. The literature I've read says that false reports are more in the range of 2-8% (and, indeed, that police bias can be a significant factor in inflating the numbers):
[link]http://www.ndaa.org/pdf/the_voice_vol_3_no_1_2009.pdf[/link]

It's in Dutch. There are other articles on the phenomenon, but this is the only one that mentions numbers. It applies specifically to girls 12-18. When you go to the police to report a crime, they first tell you that pressing false charges is a crime. Half the girls choose not to press charges after the standard speech. Of the charges they do press, 20% ends up either admitting she lied, or the police suspect she lied, but they usually err on the side of caution in favor of the girl.

http://www.volkskrant.nl/vk/nl/2686/Binnenland/article/detail/1856828/2011/03/08/Veel-aangiften-van-zedenmisdrijven-blijken-vals.dhtml

This article goes into more depth on the motivations but offers no 'hard' figures:

http://www.websitevoordepolitie.nl/archief/minderjarige-meisjes-en-aangiften-van-zedenmisdrijven-1211.html

One of my sisters once pressed false rape charges against a man she barely knew, hoping she'd get bumped up the social housing list and get an appartment quicker. All the women she and her mother mentioned it to supported her. So it's very likely that it happens more often.

In the Netherlands a third of all reported crimes are suspected to be lies.
http://www.sleutelstad.nl/nieuws/archief/2011/04/politie-aantal-valse-aangiften-enorm-probleem

Obviously, getting this information directly, and neatly sorted, from the police is pretty much impossible for a host of reasons.

Ok, well unfortunately I can't read Dutch, so I won't be able to go over the sources directly. Thank you for providing more details about them, though - I'll make a few points in response to what you've said.

First, like I said, investigations from outside the police have demonstrated significant bias in their methodologies (for example, classifying unsubstantiated reports under the "false" heading), so I'd hesitate before trusting police stats that haven't been investigated.

Second, if the numbers refer only to teenage girls, it would have been better for you to specify that in your original post, rather than saying "claims of rape and sexual assault by women". (I may have misunderstood the situation here since I can't read your original source; forgive me if so.)

Third, somebody recanting or choosing not to press charges does not automatically mean that their report was false, especially if the complainant's decision is made directly after an intimidating speech implying doubt over their claim. This issue is actually addressed in the study I linked to: "many victims will recant when faced with apparent skepticism on the part of the investigator [...] Yet such a recantation does not necessarily mean that the original report was false" (on page 2).

And fourth, anecdotal claims aren't scientific, so your story about your sister and assertion that "it's very likely that it happens more often" don't count as valid evidence.

EDIT: Grammar fix.