If someone is a post-op transsexual, are they obligated to tell the person they are pursuing/dating?

Something Amyss

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FolkLikePanda said:
True, but when I find that they used to be a bloke then all of the things that makes them a woman go out of the window for me and I would be annoyed at them for not telling me that they were a bloke.
Of course, to them, they are not a "bloke."

So basically, you're not only condemning them for your mentality once, but on two counts.

And fair enough it may not be fair on them having to tell everyone they have an interest in that they used to be a man but it isn't fair on the person they get intimate if that person doesn't know they're an ex-man.
How is it not fair to them? Clearly, they can be happy with this person.

Mortai Gravesend said:
Considering the incredibly obvious ulterior motives behind that bill I'm not surprised they'd do such a thing =/
That seems to be the way these things work, though.
 

Something Amyss

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Matthew94 said:
The key difference is that the black person was born black and accepts that.
Well, no.

One, you're assuming he accepts that. Two, the problem is still with the claim of dishonesty, and letting someone assume you're not black really isn't that different from letting people assume you're not trans.

Sorry.
 

Endersgate1321

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You know they dont need to tell them right away but before they have sex. I think you have the right to know who your sleeping with and take things from there.
 

FolkLikePanda

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Zachary Amaranth said:
FolkLikePanda said:
True, but when I find that they used to be a bloke then all of the things that makes them a woman go out of the window for me and I would be annoyed at them for not telling me that they were a bloke.
Of course, to them, they are not a "bloke."

So basically, you're not only condemning them for your mentality once, but on two counts.

And fair enough it may not be fair on them having to tell everyone they have an interest in that they used to be a man but it isn't fair on the person they get intimate if that person doesn't know they're an ex-man.
How is it not fair to them? Clearly, they can be happy with this person.
If someone is ok with going out with a transsexual then fair play to them. I haven't got anything against people who would go out with transsexuals, in fact I haven't got anything against transsexuals. Except one thing, and that is I would not go out with one or have any sort of intimacy with them, I don't find it attractive and to me that person is still a man. Sorry if they get offended but they would have offened me for kissing me or doing anything else and not telling me they used to be a man beforehand.
 

D Moness

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TheDarkestDerp said:
Pertaining to post-op transexuals- As the saying goes "If it looks like a duck, waddles like a duck and quacks like a duck, what are you fucking worried about? For practical purposes it's a duck. Be happy and carry on."
For a second my mind saw it as "you're fucking a duck" >.> I think i need some sleep.

Innegativeion said:
Think of it this way; someone starts making a loaf of bread, by reading a recipe. They have a dough mix set up, but someone puts in a lot of sugar and butter and some other ingredients. When the bread comes out, it's a cake. It tastes like cake, it has the consistency of cake etc. Would you call it a bread loaf, though, because the original instructions said it was so, even though said instructions are no longer adhered to?
I so love this, I am gonna remember this analogy(making me hungry though and i already snacked a bit).

nekoali said:
People in general need to stop treating this is as some horrible secret... It just happens that some people's minds and bodies don't match up. Treating it like a shameful disgusting thing is what leads to all the problems. Of course, I don't expect those attitudes to change overnight...
In a perfect world it wouldn't matter to anyone. Such a shame that it still is for many people. As seen on this forum many people will keep seeing and referring to the gender a transgender never was(if/when they find out).

/edit fixed quote
 

Jodah

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Even from a practical perspective if they are pursuing a long time relationship, potentially marriage, yes because if the person they are pursuing wants to have children...well then it ain't gunna work is it?
 

Woodsey

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I'd say yes.

I'm fine with saying they're a man or woman, but in certain situations they have to accept that they're going to need the suffix of '- who used to be a woman or man'.
 

Lady Larunai

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Matthew94 said:
lisadagz said:
Actually, something that's occurred to me is that a lot of people are saying that some people don't feel comfortable about transsexuals and so transpeople are obligated to tell everyone, even if it's a one night stand, because their potential distaste of the matter would mean that they may then choose not to date/sleep with them.

I'm not entirely sure if I think this is a good or a bad argument but I'd just like to put this out there:

If a black person picks up a white person at a bar, and the white person is blind, do you think the black person should say "Oh, by the way, I'm black," out of respect for the possibility that the white person may be racist so that the racist person knows what they're getting into and can back out?

It just seems to me that transphobia is tolerated more than other kinds of prejudice, and I know it's more complex than just being born a certain colour or even with a certain kind of sexuality but it still stems from being born in a certain body with an opposing sense of self.
The key difference is that the black person was born black and accepts that.

If the black person had all the pigment removed from their skin and said they felt they were born "white" then that would be a 1/2 decent comparison.

2 words... Michael Jackson
 

Lady Larunai

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Hammeroj said:
Uh, yeah.

But I do have a question. Having not seen a post-op transsexual, do they look... Convincing? I mean, it's one thing if I'm not told and then get scared bald after I see them naked, and it's another thing if I could only ever find it out way later.
It varies, some you wouldnt know from your own girlfriend, others, just depends really, no two girls are the same
 

Something Amyss

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Matthew94 said:
It isn't exactly the dishonesty is what people in the thread seem pout off by, it's the dishonesty of the person not to reveal they think they are a different gender and have went through surgery to try and "fix" this and then hid the fact from the person.
But by the same standards of honesty, one should disclose their colour to a perspective partner who couldn't otherwise tell.

Sorry.

FolkLikePanda said:
If someone is ok with going out with a transsexual then fair play to them. I haven't got anything against people who would go out with transsexuals, in fact I haven't got anything against transsexuals. Except one thing, and that is I would not go out with one or have any sort of intimacy with them, I don't find it attractive and to me that person is still a man. Sorry if they get offended but they would have offened me for kissing me or doing anything else and not telling me they used to be a man beforehand.
Right, you don't have any problem with transsexuals, except for an extremely bigoted and hurtful view of them. Gotcha.
 

Helmholtz Watson

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Zachary Amaranth said:
Matthew94 said:
It isn't exactly the dishonesty is what people in the thread seem pout off by, it's the dishonesty of the person not to reveal they think they are a different gender and have went through surgery to try and "fix" this and then hid the fact from the person.
But by the same standards of honesty, one should disclose their colour to a perspective partner who couldn't otherwise tell.

Sorry.

FolkLikePanda said:
If someone is ok with going out with a transsexual then fair play to them. I haven't got anything against people who would go out with transsexuals, in fact I haven't got anything against transsexuals. Except one thing, and that is I would not go out with one or have any sort of intimacy with them, I don't find it attractive and to me that person is still a man. Sorry if they get offended but they would have offened me for kissing me or doing anything else and not telling me they used to be a man beforehand.
Right, you don't have any problem with transsexuals, except for an extremely bigoted and hurtful view of them. Gotcha.
Please tell me how FolkLikePanda is a bigot.
 

Bradeck

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Zachary Amaranth said:
Matthew94 said:
It isn't exactly the dishonesty is what people in the thread seem pout off by, it's the dishonesty of the person not to reveal they think they are a different gender and have went through surgery to try and "fix" this and then hid the fact from the person.
But by the same standards of honesty, one should disclose their colour to a perspective partner who couldn't otherwise tell.

Sorry.

FolkLikePanda said:
If someone is ok with going out with a transsexual then fair play to them. I haven't got anything against people who would go out with transsexuals, in fact I haven't got anything against transsexuals. Except one thing, and that is I would not go out with one or have any sort of intimacy with them, I don't find it attractive and to me that person is still a man. Sorry if they get offended but they would have offened me for kissing me or doing anything else and not telling me they used to be a man beforehand.
Right, you don't have any problem with transsexuals, except for an extremely bigoted and hurtful view of them. Gotcha.
That quote isn't the least bit bigoted. He never say's he thinks he's better, or that he hates them, or that they are less than human. He simply said he's not attracted to them. Perfectly legal opinion. See, this is the fucking problem with these flame bait threads. They ask an intentionally incendiary topic, "Should Catholics be able to rape young boys?" in order to get high reply counts. Maybe for a badge, I don't know. More likely driven by a sick need for attention. But inevitably, someone comes into the thread, expresses an opinion, and is immediately nuked, and I mean nuked, for voicing said opinion, so that they must immediately defend themselves against the strawman, rather then defend their point.

You just now called him a bigot for his statement. Now, you didn't refute his point, nor did you offer any contradictory argument. You simply attacked his character in such a terrible way that it leaves him no option but to respond in an equally harsh manner, or be possibly viewed as a bigot.

For instance, I was recently compared to Hitler for saying aloud that America should stop trying to coddle the emotions of Muslim activist groups. For voicing an opinion, I was compared to the greatest murderer and villain the world has ever known. In an instant, my whole argument was abandoned, and I had to defend why I was NOT Hitler.

This is not how to argue folks. We can't have a meaningful discussion by calling each other bigots or brown shirts. You need to listen and respect, not condemn or judge. Voice your opinion, support that opinion with fact. Leave passion at the door, it will only weaken your argument. Can we please be a little more civil? Thank you.
 

game-lover

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YES.

Even a fling is debatable, but I'll concede and say it's not necessary providing you'll never see them again.

But for a long term relationship? You'd best believe someone needs to tell! That is a really terrible secret to keep. And it's not a good basis for a relationship to stand on. And what'll you do if they find out?

Some secrets are always buried true but this is one that's not likely. I mean, take into account everyone this person grew up with who saw them pre op and knew them pre op. It's probably gonna get out and then there's probably hell to pay.
 

Treeinthewoods

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Zachary Amaranth said:
Matthew94 said:
It isn't exactly the dishonesty is what people in the thread seem pout off by, it's the dishonesty of the person not to reveal they think they are a different gender and have went through surgery to try and "fix" this and then hid the fact from the person.
But by the same standards of honesty, one should disclose their colour to a perspective partner who couldn't otherwise tell.

Sorry.

FolkLikePanda said:
If someone is ok with going out with a transsexual then fair play to them. I haven't got anything against people who would go out with transsexuals, in fact I haven't got anything against transsexuals. Except one thing, and that is I would not go out with one or have any sort of intimacy with them, I don't find it attractive and to me that person is still a man. Sorry if they get offended but they would have offened me for kissing me or doing anything else and not telling me they used to be a man beforehand.
Right, you don't have any problem with transsexuals, except for an extremely bigoted and hurtful view of them. Gotcha.
I am supportive of civil rights an treat all people professionally and respectfully, but I'm not sexually attracted to a particular race, body type or other such physical trait. By your logic everybody but the most promiscuous of pansexuals are bigots.
 

KelsieKatt

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lisadagz said:
If a black person picks up a white person at a bar, and the white person is blind, do you think the black person should say "Oh, by the way, I'm black," out of respect for the possibility that the white person may be racist so that the racist person knows what they're getting into and can back out?
This is not meant as an intent to criticize your example at all.

I just have to say that this is one of the most hilariously entertaining things I have read all day.

I was just thinking about the practical implications of a 'racist' blind person, considering that blind people have never seen color or have any understanding of it. In particular I'm imagining how entertaining it would be to have such a conversation.

---

Black Person: By the way, I just thought you might like to know that I'm black, in case you have a problem with black people.

Blind Person: I hear people mention this whole 'black' thing all the time, but I have no idea what they're talking about.

Black Person: Well, it means I have brown skin.

Blind Person: So... wait..? Black is brown now?! What does that even mean?

Black Person: It's just a figure of speech, black is black, but in this case it's brown. There's white people who are more of a light beige color and various other mixes in between too.

Blind Person: So every color is another color based on completely random intervals and I don't even know what these colors mean to begin with, but now you're telling me it doesn't matter because it's a figure of speech... You know what..? Forget it. You people make no damn sense, I'm leaving.

---

Hm... You know... this could be the answer to solving racism problems permanently! We just stab everyone's eyes out from birth. It's so stupid it's brilliant. (Kidding of course, nobody freak out!)
 

Sonic Doctor

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Endersgate1321 said:
You know they dont need to tell them right away but before they have sex. I think you have the right to know who your sleeping with and take things from there.
It is still dishonest and selfish to wait until before sex to tell the guy. You probably didn't see my earlier posts in this thread, so I will repeat what I said in them.

Let's say that "she" waits three months and then she tells him about it because they finally decided to have sex, and she decided to tell him before hand like you(and many others have said).

Well, that's a problem, because this guy has spent three months in that relationship with "her", he's been a complete gentleman and has taken her out many times and paid for everything. Then he finds out that naturally, "she" is really a he, which rightfully so, he goes ballistic and breaks up with "her", because he is into real girls, and doesn't consider "her" real, because it really is just a bunch of cosmetic surgery that is covering "her" up.

Because "she" waited three months to tell him, he wasted three months of dating time and money that he could have used on a natural girl in a relationship that could actually go somewhere.

Now for a new spin I think is quite appropriate.

I would consider what "she" did as fraud. She deceived him, by not telling him the truth. Why would "she" not tell him the truth. Some people have said that "she" most likely doesn't consider herself to be a man anymore, but that doesn't remove the fact that she still has the memory of being a man. "She" knows she use to be a man.

So, she would have to be crazy not to realize that a vast majority of men would turn her down if she outright said she use to be a man. In reality, that really has to be the reason that "she" wouldn't want to tell a man the truth. So, she is intentionally deceived him, because there was a chance he would turn her down. She intentionally wasted three months of his life(getting the relationship she was wanting) and benefited from his generosity believing he was dating a nice girl and paid for many things for "her".

That is fraud: An intentional deception made for personal gain.