In Regards to Wild West

Silentpony_v1legacy

Alleged Feather-Rustler
Jun 5, 2013
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CaitSeith said:
Fiz_The_Toaster said:
It has now turned into a place that some users feel that they can now get away with this behavior and consequences will not happen due to the lawlessness of the sub-forum.
Well, some people wanted it to be their own 4chan, so it's unsurprising this would eventually happen in an "everything goes" forum.
I never understood it. 4chan still exists, as does YouTube comments, and a thousand other chans and memeboards. Why did the Escapist need to pretend to be a chan, and why? Its like when a gas station has chairs and tables to sit and eat in. Its not a restaurant, its a place people go to piss and get a soda during a car trip.
So to the Escapist and chans. When people need to sit and eat, go to the Escapist. When you just need to take a piss, go to a chan.
 

RedRockRun

sneaky sneaky
Jul 23, 2009
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BreakfastMan said:
Nah, fuck that. REAL heroes go to /mu/, /x/, and /leftypol/.
Well /leftypol/ is a given for you, and /x/ seems like kind of a wild card.
>/mu/
Suddenly it all makes sense to me now. Yes, I think I understand you now.
 

Souplex

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Jul 29, 2008
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All the people who made the place awful can go to 4Chan since that's what they wanted. I just wanted to be rid of the channers.
 

CaitSeith

Formely Gone Gonzo
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Vendor-Lazarus said:
Marik2 said:
About 20-30 people aren't going to show up in the site.
Indeed.
I know that I won't be coming back here if the WW stays gone.
I'll just get my Yahtzee fix on youtube instead.
It's so tempting to bookmark this post just for that day...

...when suddenly someone shows here again!

 

Canadamus Prime

Robot in Disguise
Jun 17, 2009
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Baffle2 said:
Christ, I wish you'd just kept it if this was all the crying that I wasn't reading.

Never saw the place for it to be honest. Why does a website about games need a place where people can act like cocks? None of the other hobby forums I use seem to need one. Eh, maybe it says something about gamers.
Kinda sad when you think about it.
Silentpony said:
never understood it. 4chan still exists, as does YouTube comments, and a thousand other chans and memeboards. Why did the Escapist need to pretend to be a chan, and why? Its like when a gas station has chairs and tables to sit and eat in. Its not a restaurant, its a place people go to piss and get a soda during a car trip.
So to the Escapist and chans. When people need to sit and eat, go to the Escapist. When you just need to take a piss, go to a chan.
I believe I essentially said as much when WW was first created only not in so many words. If people want to shitpost isn't that what 4chan is for? 4chan or 8chan or whatever-chan?
 

Silentpony_v1legacy

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Souplex said:
All the people who made the place awful can go to 4Chan since that's what they wanted. I just wanted to be rid of the channers.
I never wanted them to leave the site, I just dont think the escapist needs to be a catch all site for everyone all the time.

Like I want to buy a new pair of sneakers, should the escapist have a shoes store subforum?
No, we have Amazon and the mall.

So to with chan memes and image board culture.
 

Johnlives

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Dec 6, 2009
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Drathnoxis said:
This is unacceptable! You had no right to do that on your own! This isn't the mod's site any more than it is anybody else's, the mods just ended up being the one's who were handed the keys when Defy stopped caring. The vote was in favour of keeping the WW open, there should have been community discussion and a revote before any action was taken! You just couldn't stand having a section of the site where you couldn't enforce your powers, just like you couldn't stand not being able to punish Epyc Wynn.

Edit: Also so much for that "April Fools" joke. Each part of it is coming true. First the site gets fixed, and now the WW is canned. I guess we can start expecting the draconian moderation next.

Fiz_The_Toaster said:
Hello all.

As some of you may have noticed, the Wild West sub-forum is no longer accessible. This is not a glitch, nothing Defy did, but something that we, as a moderation team, have decided to do, and this was something that was not done lightly nor without group consideration and discussion.
Yeah, yeah, we saw what "group consideration and discussion" looked like when Epyc Wynn's Pub Club was removed. It was a joke. Completely unprofessional with only a cursory amount of discussion. Not anything like the line we were fed at the time about how the decision was "not taken lightly" and the vote was "unanimous". I don't buy that this discussion was any more professional than the last.

At the very least make the WW visible, but disallow posts in it so that we can still view the old threads for posterity. There were A LOT of fun threads there, and I don't remember what they all were and you gave us no warning before you decided to shut the west down on a whim!
He's right you know.png

Fiz_The_Toaster said:
In the end, WW ended up being a place that wasn't fun
In your opinion. Some users did have fun.
Fiz_The_Toaster said:
I know I hardly went in there since it's the kind of place that doesn't interest me
So you never found it fun. How can you judge that it suddenly isn't?


Fiz_The_Toaster said:
and it was turning into a place where people felt they could get away with being assholes and go after users.
That's the point of a no rules space, they can do that if they want.


Fiz_The_Toaster said:
I went along with the users that wanted WW around since it was their call and not mine.
And now it is your (and associates) call?
 

BreakfastMan

Scandinavian Jawbreaker
Jul 22, 2010
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RedRockRun said:
/x/ seems like kind of a wild card.
I don't really talk about it on here that much, but yeah, I have a STRONG interest in all things paranormal/supernatural. X-Files and Coast to Coast AM had a pretty big impact on me when I first encountered them.
 

Fiz_The_Toaster

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The Lunatic said:
Fiz_The_Toaster said:
This isn't a power trip, this isn't an effort to control the site, nor is it some grand conspiracy to meddle in the affairs of user just for giggles or whatever. And, again, whether or not you choose to believe myself or any other mod is really your choice to make.
So, it's not a power trip despite the fact:
A. It's not what the community voted for.
B. It's not what the original staff of the site implemented.
C. It's doesn't appear to have any oversight from anyone above the mod team and Basement.
D. Was against things which were said in the past about WW by the current mod team and staff.
It's been pretty open that we're it and that we answer to the CM, and we've very much aware of that fact. As a matter of fact, Defy could just decide to shut this place down without warning and there isn't anything we can do about it.

As I have stated multiple times, due to what was going on in WW we revisited the issue and that was what we decided. You can dislike it all you like, but those are the facts.

Johnlives said:
Snipp'ed for length
Just because it's a space with no rules doesn't mean people can go in there and attack each other. It was originally intended for people to post random things that would otherwise get them modded for making topic-less threads. Those threads have gone down and the more vitriolic ones have gone up.

Sure, I've never liked WW, but my opinion doesn't matter nor did it influence anything since everyone in the mod team knew where I stood. But if people wanted a place to do whatever, then fine. Except, over time, it wasn't and we as a team decided to close it off for posting.

You can always take it up with the CM if you would like to voice your displeasure.
 

Sassafrass

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Vendor-Lazarus said:
I've still got the list of people who voted for or against the Wild West.
I have to ask.
Fucking why?
 

Ugicywapih

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May 15, 2014
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Fiz_The_Toaster said:
Just because it's a space with no rules doesn't mean people can go in there and attack each other.
Actually, it kind of does, that's the thing about there being no rules - untethered by mores of society, anyone is free to make an arse of themselves.
Fiz_The_Toaster said:
It was originally intended for people to post random things that would otherwise get them modded for making topic-less threads. Those threads have gone down and the more vitriolic ones have gone up.
That's an idea I fully support. And while I agree toxic, aggressive threads (mostly callouts) have been cropping up more often than back when WW was still young, the intended use of WW never stopped. So, why not give it an another chance as a low-moderation board with the former mini-CoC expanded with, for example, a rule against singling out any particular user through either their nickname or a description precise enough to individualize them in topics oriented, in significant part, towards personal assault (or just ban bullying if you want to, though that could lead to some worries among the userbase as it's broad and thus open to interpretation). It wouldn't be quite as rule-free as before, but admittedly, that has proven to be an issue, however it still seems to have some merit as there still seems to be room for sensible discussion (or just plain silly fun) that may well not have originated on the regular boards due to them being perceived as bound by excessively strict rules (regardless of how accurate that perception is), not to mention there's obviously some backlash about this whole thing, so maybe instead of killing Wild West it could be just sorta tamed a bit?
 

chocolate pickles

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StatusNil getting a warning for stating his opinion in a civil manner demonstrates just what is wrong with the site and it's moderation.
 

Arnoxthe1

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Dec 25, 2010
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Funny how saying what you feel without fear of reprisal is now a "4chan" thing, as if 4chan invented it.

As one of WW's biggest supporters, I don't even like 4chan. The forced anonymity and complete lack of a post archive is garbage. There's also issues with the rules.

I also find it funny how no one, mod or member, has answered my arguments and have decided they just wanna talk about things that don't actually mean anything.
 

The Lunatic

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Jun 3, 2010
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Fiz_The_Toaster said:
It's been pretty open that we're it and that we answer to the CM, and we've very much aware of that fact. As a matter of fact, Defy could just decide to shut this place down without warning and there isn't anything we can do about it.

As I have stated multiple times, due to what was going on in WW we revisited the issue and that was what we decided. You can dislike it all you like, but those are the facts.
Very well, but, you don't get the right to call it "Not a powertrip" when you response to the fact you've broken what the users voted on, and what was previous promised by the current staff is "Too bad if you don't like it".
 

Silentpony_v1legacy

Alleged Feather-Rustler
Jun 5, 2013
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Arnoxthe1 said:
Funny how saying what you feel without fear of reprisal is now a "4chan" thing, as if 4chan invented it.

As one of WW's biggest supporters, I don't even like 4chan. The forced anonymity and complete lack of a post archive is garbage. There's also issues with the rules.

I also find it funny how no one, mod or member, has answered my arguments and have decided they just wanna talk about things that don't actually mean anything.
Saying how you feel is different than threats and harassment.
"I like pie" is not the same as "I'll fucking kill anyone who doesn't like pie!" or "I hate MLP" is different that "Fucking pony fag cucks, kill yourself!"
They are not the same.

The 'free speech' forum just turned into a bunch of assholes threatening and harassing each other, it wasn't worth keeping.
And no one is saying you aren't free to say whatever you want. You fully 100%, just has to be within the guidelines of the website, or not. If not, face the consequences, and if you can't deal with said consequences then maybe this isn't the website to post on.
No one has taken away your freedom to say whatever you like, it just has consequences like it does in every aspect of real life.
 

Trunkage

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chocolate pickles said:
StatusNil getting a warning for stating his opinion in a civil manner demonstrates just what is wrong with the site and it's moderation.
You know this post my be the proof that WW was bad. 1. You didn't insult anyone 2. You actual made an argument. Thanks for adding something to the conversation.
As to your argument, I honestly got through half StatusNil's post before shutting it down. I have to read more to make an appropriate comment. You though, in this post, imply that the mods should change to suit your particular needs. I'm going to have to ask for evidence for change over everyone else.
 

Dr. Thrax

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Dec 5, 2011
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The Lunatic said:
Very well, but, you don't get the right to call it "Not a powertrip" when you response to the fact you've broken what the users voted on, and what was previous promised by the current staff is "Too bad if you don't like it".
Well.. sorry to say it, but too bad.
The mods and CM are the only ones "running" this place now, with Defy seemingly sitting on their thumbs and twiddling them. The shitty thing about making promises while running a place is that things change and sometimes promises have to be broken. That doesn't necessarily mean that they like having to break a promise, but sometimes it has to be done. And no matter what the mod team did - aside from just doing nothing - people would be crying "Power trip!" "Mod takeover!"

Making the Wild West lawless and utterly separated from all but 3 of the site's rules - one of which was introduced after the infamous Wynncident - was a mistake. I'd have been all for a relaxed moderation forum where people could have their image threads and whatnot that wasn't made to strictly adhere to the CoC but still had rules, but the WW was poorly executed and it allowed people to harass other users without reprisal, and they did.

Y'all were given a thing and abused it, so now you have no thing.
 

Elvis Starburst

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The Lunatic said:
Very well, but, you don't get the right to call it "Not a powertrip" when you response to the fact you've broken what the users voted on, and what was previous promised by the current staff is "Too bad if you don't like it".
Dr. Thrax said:
Well.. sorry to say it, but too bad.
The mods and CM are the only ones "running" this place now, with Defy seemingly sitting on their thumbs and twiddling them. The shitty thing about making promises while running a place is that things change and sometimes promises have to be broken. That doesn't necessarily mean that they like having to break a promise, but sometimes it has to be done. And no matter what the mod team did - aside from just doing nothing - people would be crying "Power trip!" "Mod takeover!"

Making the Wild West lawless and utterly separated from all but 3 of the site's rules - one of which was introduced after the infamous Wynncident - was a mistake. I'd have been all for a relaxed moderation forum where people could have their image threads and whatnot that wasn't made to strictly adhere to the CoC but still had rules, but the WW was poorly executed and it allowed people to harass other users without reprisal, and they did.

Y'all were given a thing and abused it, so now you have no thing.
Can I get an amen? Not the mention the fact that...

The Lunatic said:
A. [Snip]
B. It's not what the original staff of the site implemented.
C. [Snip]
D. [Snip]
... several times it's been noted that the mods or staff did not ask for the WW to be implemented, it was a 'higher power' as Noe describes it that put the WW in place. The mods didn't ask for it, so I think they can do whatever they want with it since they're essentially the ones in charge now
 

Silentpony_v1legacy

Alleged Feather-Rustler
Jun 5, 2013
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Dr. Thrax said:
The Lunatic said:
Very well, but, you don't get the right to call it "Not a powertrip" when you response to the fact you've broken what the users voted on, and what was previous promised by the current staff is "Too bad if you don't like it".
Well.. sorry to say it, but too bad.
The mods and CM are the only ones "running" this place now, with Defy seemingly sitting on their thumbs and twiddling them. The shitty thing about making promises while running a place is that things change and sometimes promises have to be broken. That doesn't necessarily mean that they like having to break a promise, but sometimes it has to be done. And no matter what the mod team did - aside from just doing nothing - people would be crying "Power trip!" "Mod takeover!"

Making the Wild West lawless and utterly separated from all but 3 of the site's rules - one of which was introduced after the infamous Wynncident - was a mistake. I'd have been all for a relaxed moderation forum where people could have their image threads and whatnot that wasn't made to strictly adhere to the CoC but still had rules, but the WW was poorly executed and it allowed people to harass other users without reprisal, and they did.

Y'all were given a thing and abused it, so now you have no thing.
And that is mic drop! Mods, you can go ahead and close down the thread, this was all that needed to be said, the Wild West is dead so it couldn't spread...bread.
 

Arnoxthe1

Elite Member
Dec 25, 2010
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Silentpony said:
Saying how you feel is different than threats and harassment.
"I like pie" is not the same as "I'll fucking kill anyone who doesn't like pie!" or "I hate MLP" is different that "Fucking pony fag cucks, kill yourself!"
They are not the same.
Some people don't know how to post without sounding like a 5-year-old. But these rules you guys are so in love with actually aren't gonna change that. The users themselves need to let the immature poster know that that kind of behavior isn't going to fly. As to harassment, I KNOW harassment. Actual harassment is dogging a user from one topic to the next, not contributing anything and just wanting to flame the other user. I've had extensive experience with this. I've actually had extensive experience with everything you people are talking about and then some.

Silentpony said:
The 'free speech' forum just turned into a bunch of assholes threatening and harassing each other,
No it didn't. I've been posting in WW a long time, and in my entire time there, I have never once been harassed. Not even slightly. I don't even think I was insulted. Furthermore, I've posted a lot of serious threads there and I never once got one of those "kill yourself" kind of responses. And I was one of the more abrasive posters! That leaves one of two possibilities.

1. Everyone is afraid of me.

or

2. There actually wasn't a problem at all and people here are too sensitive.

Silentpony said:
And no one is saying you aren't free to say whatever you want. You fully 100%, just has to be within the guidelines of the website, or not. If not, face the consequences, and if you can't deal with said consequences then maybe this isn't the website to post on.
No one has taken away your freedom to say whatever you like, it just has consequences like it does in every aspect of real life.
I hope you realize how ridiculous this sounds. "Oh, you're still totally free to say what you like. Just, you know, you'll get shot by the Escapist Gestapo if you do." That's not free speech. And no, I'm not arguing that Escapist has to allow us to say whatever we want. In fact, they have every right to just ban everyone for even the slightest thing. But I don't think that exactly makes for the best forum environment, do you?

So now I ask you the same questions I asked Gethsemani.

If some really can't learn to ignore a post, are they people who are really worth banishing the entire WW for? When does the responsibilities of the site team end and the responsibilities of the user begin? When is it no longer the site's fault concerning content that is posted? Is it really too unreasonable to expect a certain level of maturity out of our posters? Do we really need to be everybody's babysitter whenever others call them a mean name?