No I didn't. The Wild West was the place to call people fags, cucks, cunts, you name it. That was the point.vallorn said:
In Regards to Wild West
- Thread starter Fiz_The_Toaster
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It's no use arguing with these folks. They seem to feel that your opinion only matters if you reply to posts. Sort of like how they thought I was absent as a CM because I didn't join their circlejerk arguments about the moderators they enjoyed bashing despite being online daily to read them.Silentpony said:
Aw, man. I just logged on to post a thread in the subforum; it's a shame to see it go.
Oh well, it was nothing but a vanilla 4Chan anyways. Maybe Reddit can service our whimsical needs.
Oh well, it was nothing but a vanilla 4Chan anyways. Maybe Reddit can service our whimsical needs.
Yeah, heaven forbid the community expects the people in charge to actually engage with them and address long-ignored problems in a transparent manner rather than doing the exact same things as led to the decline and countless members of the community get sick of it and leave because of. What a foolish notion, that people would expect new leadership was capable of doing better than the failures of the past.n0e said:
You do pick up on how the same problems commented on then are still problems commented on in this very thread, yes? Even have new people here trying to propose the same solutions as before still getting ignored. The problems never went away and were never addressed for what they are, and it seem every time people complain about it, it either resulted in ignoring at best, or people getting strikes or bans at worst. An antagonistic relationship between users and moderation/management that was feed and fostered.
Also, about "these folks", you may feel they think your opinion only matters if you reply to posts, but at least that is still better than ignoring both opinions and posts altogether. People can really only get away with the whole "invisible leader" thing when things are going well. When there is problems, and oh boy were and are there problems, then the lack of visibility is seen as either a sign of failure to address problems, a sign of condoning the problems themselves, or a sign of fear of the upset population. The community wanted leadership, not a new "boss".
Perhaps it would be better if you stop trying to join an antagonistic pissing contest with people upset they are not seeing improvements in how things are run, or seeing their concerns addressed or even acknowledged. Regardless how justified in being dismissive of them you may be, it makes you look very petty coming from a place of previous authority that was unsuccessful. Like a former plant manager coming onto the factory floor and screaming at the janitor for why the company is dying.
Now, would we be able to get back to the topic itself? Or the immediate consequence of the topic regarding the recent community backlash to the decision?
MC1980 said:
I'm not sure how either of you missed his point unless you're purposely trying to do so. It's really, really simple.SolidState said:
You are responsible for what you post.[footnote]generalized[/footnote]
If you break the rules for "reasons", you still broke the rules and have no right to complain if you get whacked for it.
"They baited me" - doesn't matter
"They were passive-aggressive" - doesn't matter
"They broke the rules first" - doesn't matter
"They were mean" - doesn't matter
"They made me angry" - doesn't matter
"My dog ate my homework" - doesn't matter
People need to grow up and be accountable for what they post. If you are tempted to make a post that breaks the rules, here's three easy steps to avoid getting whacked:
1. Stand up
2. Step away from your computer
3. Go do literally anything else for 5 minutes
Why is it almost every time I see you post nowadays, you're whining about the userbase and how "petulant" they are? I get that some people have brought up some pretty spurious claims here, but I thought you'd be above those.n0e said:
You're certainly not winning any points here, man.
I'm getting serious whiplash here.Basement Cat said:
Are you guys totalitarian gits with itchy finger triggers or not?
Also, thank you? Legitimately wasn't expecting that. Does this mean I can throw on a risque avatar too? Maybe some jiggly anime baps or bums?
Also also, I will make a point to avoid mentioning the post in question's sincerity and how I actually do deserve that one warning. I will not mention that at all. Not one bit.
Not even gonna snip this, just. Dude. yes there's some of that, there's always some of that on the internet, but there's problems so deep rooted on this site in the community, the philosophy of moderation, the way many mods interact with the users (or, don't) that just brushing everything aside as "whining" just continues those everlasting issues which have caused the site's population to become regarded as one of the most toxic and worst moderated places on the internet.n0e said:
Really? Projecting from what? You _do_ know what that term means, right?LostGryphon said:
Like you, I choose to post when and where I wish to. My reason for posting should never be based on your demand of seeing me do so, like my demand for your response simply isn't there either. You either choose to or choose not to respond. Either way, your choice. So, why can't it be the same for me? Why must I comply with the demands of others when and where I talk to them about something? How dare I respond and defend the very people who volunteer their time and effort from a bunch of people who spend more time complaining about those who do their best to keep the place as drama free as possible than actually stopping themselves from creating it? If you'll notice, I'm responding to those who are trashing on the moderators for doing their job simply because they didn't agree with how it was done, despite the fact that they have no say in how it's managed.
It's a fascinating web of falsehoods you folks are creating and laughable if you think it's based in any form on reality.
[edit] It's been just over 1 year since I stopped working at Defy and managed community operations. I speak to you now as a normal member, as anyone else is here. My main issue and the reason why I seem to be focused on certain topics over others is that I know the volunteers here bust their butts to keep the place civil and as spam free as they are capable of doing with the resources they have. I defend them because I know what it's like and feel I'm in a position that I can speak my mind against those who always give them crap about doing their job in the face of dealing with people who expect respect while not giving any in return. It annoys me that certain members of the community seem to relish in this drama perpetuate it with topics such as this one.
There is a problem that is poisoning the site and killing it. You were in charge and were expected to actually address such problems.n0e said:
Your attitude is like a burger-flipper being expected to actually flip the burgers and getting upset at the customers who just want their food and are voicing their concerns.
Telling those people "no" doesn't solve the problems. And it is a sad irony when one of the solutions proposed was for you to tell the toxic passive-aggressive clique of users people keep complaining about "no" instead.
On the contrary, my attitude is like the guy behind the person screaming at the burger-flipper for doing their job, but not at the expectation of the customer causing a scene and telling them to stop being an ass to the employee. If you re-read my posts, maybe you'll see that pattern.runic knight said:
The problem I have isn't with the site team. In fact, I'm sure most, if not all of them, mean very well. The problem I've been yelling about is that some of the rules in the CoC are leftover garbage. The site team have their marching orders. It's the marching orders themselves though that are the problem.n0e said:
I think what people are saying here is that they feel the site team are creating their own problems as they could change the rules and make it much easier on not just the users but themselves as well, but they actively choose not to. And then when we complain, we're seen as whiners. Problem-makers.
No, you were the flipper. You were the only one with the power to do changes, so in the analogy you were the only one able to make the burgers. And right now, you are in the middle of the restaurant right now, screaming at customers, calling them petulant, and generally acting like they should be grateful for you having done nothing to fix the problems and refusing to hear the complaints for what they are actually saying.n0e said:
There are clear problems that need to be fixed. They were ignored and they continue. It serves no benefit to attack and blame the people trying to come the only person with authority and power to do anything, as though them complaining to the proper authority is the wrong thing for them to do.
What else do you expect them to do? Shut up and be silent as the site burns? Or leave, as many, many did and still do? Neither is a solution to those who want things to improve. And since others have no power to actually fix things, that leaves those in charge the only ones who can. Thus the targets of people's complaints by the design of the system itself.
Saying "no" is not fixing a problem, and it not being respected as an answer when it solves nothing is entirely predictable.
That ties us back to the thread itself, the closing the WW, and the community response. It was a unilaterial management decision unpopular with the community itself outside of a small collective of people who were part of the cause for it being shut down in the first place. It was giving into the antics of those who abuse the rules to make the problems worse to get what they wanted (the WW closed), while not addressing the problem itself being the people making things worse. It is feeding the problem and ignoring the source.
I get you don't like people telling you how to do your business, but when you fail or are failing, why would you think people will be quiet as their community is dying? They, unlike those actively hastening the destruction of the site by being the toxic passive-aggressive problem that has been ignored for years, don't want to see it die in such a state and thus voice concerns and criticism because of the failures to fix it.
But, there's a difference between complaining and what some are doing here. Do you honestly feel that berating the moderators will have any positive impact on any issue you may have? Do you think that it's acceptable to break the site code by spamming the living hell out of a forum as a way of demonstrating that it can, instead of merely sending a message saying "hey, I discovered this flaw, perhaps you should fix it."
You're complaining to the employee about policies created by the corporate administration. To be fair, the rules were originally going to be updated annually to reflect the constant change in how the community functions and converses, but that fell through when my contract expired.
Also, while you may view some of what is included in the CoC as garbage, you may want to understand that there are specific reasons why each of them was there to begin with. Those policies weren't added just "because" but instead they were added from previous experience (some very recently to the update) when dealing with individual members who enjoyed skirting the rules to post their bullshit. I won't name names, but I'm sure anyone who ever spoke to me knows who I refer to.
You're complaining to the employee about policies created by the corporate administration. To be fair, the rules were originally going to be updated annually to reflect the constant change in how the community functions and converses, but that fell through when my contract expired.
Also, while you may view some of what is included in the CoC as garbage, you may want to understand that there are specific reasons why each of them was there to begin with. Those policies weren't added just "because" but instead they were added from previous experience (some very recently to the update) when dealing with individual members who enjoyed skirting the rules to post their bullshit. I won't name names, but I'm sure anyone who ever spoke to me knows who I refer to.