It's only sexist when Men do it?

[mandaforever]

It's true. Men get called on being sexist at even the slightest provocation but women don't. But then if you add up all the disparities, Women are probably still way out ahead in the race to be the most discriminated against.

Please note I am not in any way saying that women should get to cut off anyone's penis and laugh about it.

well you summed up my opinion pretty much. Women have been discriminated against for hundreds to thousands of years, and women in MY opinion are WAY more discriminated against than men (I have experienced discrimination weekly to monthly as a woman, but nothing like what happened to this poor guy) so when this kind of stuff happens, yes it is awful, but people must understand the sheer amounts of sexism and violence women face all the time. This does NOT make it ok to cut off a guy's dick then be happy about it as that is messed up. I'm just saying this stuff happens, and has happened to women many, many times, and maybe that's why this happened.

 

[Dags90]

4: People in general, the whole of society tend to accept sexism a lot more easily when it is directed at men, but very quickly snap when it turns the other way. Equality is about being the same in the eyes of the law and society, not superior, not about getting better treatment. Yes, people are the problem, but the general attitude of said problematic people is to let this slide by when it is directed against men.

This forum tends to do the opposite. It latches on to every "man bites dog" story that makes headlines about gender equality. There was a thread about a Russian man who was held against his will and raped by a woman, but I've never once seen a thread about the horrors experienced by the the millions of women and girls who are trafficked for the purpose of sexual slavery worldwide.

I would say it's generally the opposite. The moment a man is attacked sexually by a woman, it's front line news because it's so different from the norm.

 

[mandaforever]

Dude is right and I think a talk show that makes fun of women getting hurt is the right thing to do.

um. WHAT.

no,

an eye for an eye does not apply in this situation.

 

[drisky]

isnt that the Distressed watcher? Aka the amazing athiest?

meh, he has his moments. this is one of those few moments.

When I first saw him on that guy with the glasses I said the something but the other way around, (I knew him as atheist first)

And yes gender double standards are much prevalent the big difference being people take unfairness to more women seriously, and any man who complains is considered a "pussy". Stuff like women's workplace rights will be fixed on a legal level eventually, but seems all double standards against males are on a purely social level, so its up to both genders to see any double standards and call them out.

It figures a Big Bang Theory actress is the only smart woman in the room on that show.

The wife from King of Queens didn't want to be a part of it, saying there was only one thing that would justify what she did, referring to rape. And she didn't make qualifiers like, "I don't want to be a buzz kill".

 

[Death_Korps_Kommissar]

I don't watch much of TAA anymore but I saw that video and he pretty much hits the nail on the head.
Also for people hating on the Iran thing, I used to have a great picture on womens education there post and pre the Islamic revolution but sadly I can't find it :/

 

[Flamingpenguin]

It's because feminist movements, while some claim to be pro-equality, are only really pro-equality for women.

So basically, Orwell's "All animals are created equal, but some animals are more equal than others."

I totally support this. Feminism is largely unacceptable as it (seriously, wtf.) is sexist against men. A group that I hope destroys itself.

 

[Burck]

OP video makes a good point.

I've seen this kind of stuff, and most of you probably have as well. Either way, let me give my two cents on this phenomenon.

I want to start by making the caveat that OP's video is using anecdotal evidence. On this video alone we cannot conclude that the issue brought to light is at all pandemic. We also would need to find out how often sexism targets men versus how often it targets women. There may be such studies, but as a simple forum goer, I have no extensive knowledge of the subject. My conclusions are made only on my studies and observations on the matter up to and including my first year of college. Take it as you will.

That aside, I'll move on to my thoughts regarding this phenomenon.

Feminism was an intense fight to empower the female sex and unrestrain themselves from the restrictive ideals of patriarchal society.

When women joined this fight, it forced them to no longer just tolerate the standards of patriarchal society and stand up for their sex. They had to fight.

I think its reasonable for me to make an intuitive claim that this was a scary time for women. Would they dare oppose patriarchal standards and risk losing distancing themselves from men? This would especially be difficult in the case that they were close with some men.

The human psychological process of flight or fight is a powerful one, and in order to convince the mind that it is worth taking the risk to fight, one must have a powerful motivation. In war, soldiers may start afraid and neutral towards their enemy, but once sufficiently motivated to fight back, become highly aggressive and hateful towards their enemy.

While I don't mean to imply that all (or many) feminists hate as an inspiration, some did.

As of now, feminism has won the fight for voting and birth control (and others? I don't know that much more on the subject.), but still has faces the challenge of consistently equal pay, abortion (let's not go further down that rabbit hole in this thread please), and other domestic issues.

----Moving on to the story currently at hand.-------TL;DReaders- start here.---

Sexist jokes on both sides exist. Stereotypes still exist and are well known, but people generally try to deny their existence when they feel it would help them to appear tolerant.

(Inferred from a study that has showed a similar phenomenon with race and stereotypes- over time, minorities stereotypical traits became less negative and participants in the studies became more reluctant to admit they knew these stereotypes).

Sexist jokes and stereotypes still come up in public conversations and tend to create tension despite the fact that they are taboo/not PC.

Such jokes and stereotypes bring polarized reactions- either laughter or utter disgust. As such, whenever people try discuss why people make these jokes, people generally rush to the conclusion that the joke is either offensive or harmless. Ultimately, the sexes both squabble over the matter until it disappears behind other current events.

The root of the problem, as I see it, is that political correctness (not saying something purely because its unaccepted) is a band-aid solution. It stops people from openly insulting each other in many circumstances, but doesn't do anything to resolve the underlying tension.

In the US where I live, we never actually work to resolve the tension between our sexes. We just tend to censor ourselves and consider that good enough.

-----Conclusions------

At this point in time, I think that most men AND women can't have an effective discussion about the paradigm between the genders. Both sexes need to critically access their OWN sex for quite some time before they can meet together and effectively resolve the paradigm between the two.

That being said, yes- Sharon's words in this video were just as divisive as any other sexist joke. I would also conclude that AmazingAtheist's (guy in video) statement that "this is why I can't take feminism seriously" is melodramatic.

Issues just like those in the video are just petty arguments.

 

[Catchy Slogan]

You can call yourself a feminist, but that doesn't make you one. Much like I can call myself a lamppost, but that doesn't make it so.

So this guy takes a few brain dead morons and tars hundreds of thousands of people with the same brush? And because of this he just 'can't take feminism seriously'? Then I can't take him seriously if that is the narrow minded assumption he is making.

I know, why don't we take PETA as an example and then bash all vegetarians and animal rights activists because PETA have done some stupid shit in the past!

I in no way condone what these women are saying. It isn't right to do that to anybody, man or woman, and is akin to GBH in my books. It is not something to be ridiculed or laughed at.

But this prick can go fuck himself.

 

[yohlazy]

I kind of agree I have experienced this before

 

[Laura Wiebe]

As a female, I find this incredibly disgusting. I have had very few problems with being female and must agree that the feminist movement has moved into the "FemiNazi" movement. We got our rights, now we should shut up and find some other people to help like orphans or refugees.

However there are physical differences that must be acknowledged and respected, I am not as strong as my guy-friends but have other talents. However that in no way means girls can be strong or guys can't do things women are generally better at. Just realize that it may not be my specific talent.

Society sucks, I gave up on them ages ago, but as in any movement there are lots of radicals, there are Christians blowing up abortion clinics and many of us do not believe that that is any way to deal with things. There are also Canadians, Americans, Brits etc. (take your pick)we do not like and we condemn but they still make the news and that is what outsiders percieve us as.

 

[infinity_turtles]

Wow... so apparently you guys are all closet racists?

If he had said all extremist islamics are mysogonysts, he might have a point as that is to some extent what the religion preaches. But saying that's the truth about Iran wouldn't be too much different than me saying all Americans hate gays in reference to many Christian extremists who protest gay rights. Oh, and they're all warmongers. Sure, perhaps a majority of Iranians are Islamic, and perhaps a majority of them feel stoning women to death is ok, but there's also going to be a significant number of people who realise it's wrong. Putting all Iranians under the one blanket title of "mysogynists" is just wrong and racist. Th

See, they said Iran, not Iranians. So it'd be more like saying America is intolerant of gays, since our policies currently are. Maybe add in a moving in the right direction for accuracy's sake though, what with DADT having been repealed and more states legalizing gay marriage. I have no clue what percentage of Iranians are truly misogynists, but the country's policies certainly are. So, basically, I think you're jumping to conclusions based on what you think they meant, rather than what they actually said. I'd probably do the same if someone said that about America though, as interpreting a statement about a country as encompassing it's citizens just seems natural when directed towards myself.

On the topic of the video... It always annoys me when Amazing Atheist takes a stance I fervently agree with, as the dude is kind of a douche. A lot of the icons of the modern feminism movement are scary as hell, as are a lot of the things their groups lobby for. And things they've lobbied for and gotten passed.

 

[psyks]

He makes some interesting points, but he seems like he has a bit of a victim complex. "Do men have no rights?"

I think true feminists and humanists would respect women too much to support this sort of behaviour. But the change has to come from women. His premise is the dichotomy of men aren't allowed to mock women, but women are allowed to mock men. Logically this is because there is no unilateral culture shared between men and women. Therefore he should be appealing to women specifically to stand up andmake a change on their side of that dichotomy.

 

[Jonesy911]

It's somewhat ironic that he drops some racism about Iran

Not really racism. What he's saying is that most people would expect to see men treating women like this in Iran or other places where women are oppressed before they'd expect to see it in America. Basically, he's comparing America's double standards to Iran's and pointing out how similar they are.

You really have to watch a LOT of this guys videos to understand his logic and way of expressing ideas. Fortunately I've been watching him for about 3 years now.

 

[aei_haruko]

It's somewhat ironic that he drops some racism about Iran

not really... have you seen what people do to women in Iran? Like they get raped for leaving the house without a male excort.
And i agree, I want equality with the sexes, not this crap being tolerated.
I like him, so much.
And as for a final point, I guess carlin was right, RAPE IS NOW FUNNY!!!!!!
*high fives*

 

[InsanityMan]

I'm going to say it right now, white men are probably one of the most oppressed people.
Sure, that sounds pathetic, and like I'M racist, and sexist, but that's the thing. Let me give you an example.

One night, there's a white male comedian, he jokes about white people, but vaguely jokes about Chinese people, and they throw tomatoes.

The next night, there's a black one. He all out jokes about white people, and Chinese people, and everyone laughs.

The difference there is what? It's okay since he's black? You can replace white with male, black with female, etc, and it would still hold up.

Look, I get it, white males were EXTREMELY racist, and sexist, from when women existed, and from when we discovered black people, to around...After the sixties. Then, the majority of us started settling down, and since then, we've been better. We should stop being punished for something we did CENTURIES ago.

Also, when I think of crazy feminists saying all men are bad, I think "Even Martin Luther King Jr.? My goddamned hero? Even Gandhi? Even Jesus, or Buddha, if they really existed?"

 

[Jonesy911]

that dude needs to sort his life out and get a shag stupid fat moron lmao

...Said the random guy on the internet. I assure you, the guy in the video is doing just fine.

 

[SuperNova221]

Every time he takes the time out to talk seriously about a topic I usually agree 100% with him, this is no exception. I've been annoyed by the exact same thing for a fairly long time, yes, there are sensible feminists that actually go for equality, but the overwhelming majority that I meet go for this double standard, and the worst thing is that I meet lots of men who seem to acknowledge and accept that there's a double standard, but still, aparnetly knowingly, decide to aim for a double standard where women should be held above men.

Just a rambly post, not going to bother reading over or editting it. If it doesn't make sense, deal with it.

 

[Alexi089]

Here's the whole video, plus their appauling excuse for an apology, for anyone who's interested:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VKgwczruOSQ

My short answer to your question would be: 'only an incredibly stupid man or woman takes the view that only men can be sexist'.

I think the more important point to this incident is that a group of people should not be allowed to publicly humiliate anyone like that; and make light of a serious crime without being made to face up to what they've done. Personally, I think Sharon Osbourne and the rest of them should have their network contracts either permeantly cancelled or at least suspended until they have made an in-person apology to the victim of that crime (assuming he'll accept it). Even so, Sharon at least (seeing as she made the most jokes) should certainly be fined or recieve some serious financial penalty for her behaviour. At least Sara Gilbert had enough decency to eventually point out the sexism and severity of what they were doing; and she appeared to show some discomfort with the way the issue was being handled around 2:26 in the video. She took her sweet time getting there though, and she still felt comfortable enough to laugh along with them at some points; so she should certainly be made to apologise properly.

For anyone who disagrees, I'd suggest they look at the case where Russel Brand and Jonathan Ross left an insulting answerphone message on Andrew Sachs' voicemail (stating that Russel had slept with his grand daughter and laughing). Both were dropped by the BBC, and both were made to apologise properly and sincerely for what they'd done. That was a comparatively smaller crime, in my opinion; given that his daughter wasn't mutilated or put through a terrible event against her will.

What I really can't believe is that Sharon and co's apology was deemed acceptable. The woman on the far left didn't make a single apologetic word; she just made excuses for herself and her co- presenters. Sharon didn't even have the nerve to look at the camera when she 'apologised' (while laughing); she didn't apologise to the victim directly at all; she didn't even seem to acknowledge that making fun of it was deplorable. The rest said nothing apologetic.

My two cents is that people shouldn't be allowed to simply walk away when they make insulting racist, sexist or plain malicious remarks about anyone regardless of their gender or race. The more often stupid and immature people are made to face up to their behaviour, the sooner we can have proper equality.

For anyone who makes the argument: 'it was just a joke!?' or 'men have done worse to women before and still do in other countries':

a) You're plain fucking stupid if you think mutilation is acceptable to joke about: Imagine (I assume the majority who make this argument will be women who can't relate to a male victim, so I'll use a female example) if you were Katie Piper, after her acid attack in 2008. Imagine you knew you were going to be permenatly disfigured for the rest of your life (and subject to the inevitable staring and possible judgement of insensitive strangers); you'd just lost your career, you'd been through all that agony of waiting while acid dissolved your face whilst doctors attempted to figure out what acid had been used before they could treat you. Then you had to undergo 40 surgical operations to correct your injuries as much as possible, and you'd have to wear a plastic mask to shape and maintain moisture in the healing tissue for 23 hours a day... Then someone came along one day on their television show and 'just thought it'd be funny to say...'.
Even if that guy's penis can be reconstructed, you can guarantee he'll have to undergo a similar number of operations to get there; plus equal psychological trauma.

b) If a specific person had wronged you, take it up with them; not with completely innocent people of the same gender. (And you're plain fucking stupid)

 

[Jake0fTrades]

I've been preaching this message for a loooooooong time. So far it hasn't gone through.

 

[Lamppenkeyboard]

It's somewhat ironic that he drops some racism about Iran

Yeah they should take it easy about Iran's treatment of the female sex.