Jimquisition: Booth Babes

verdestylo13

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Dec 25, 2011
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Why don't they show case Booth Men with a resemblance to the Game Character?
Would it be that hard to phone an agency to ask for a certain type of look?
Would it not be really neat to get a photo taken with either sex if they are identified with the game or product you like?

Booth babes might like their jobs they might not.... as they are not going to be kicked off the convention show floor any time soon at video game or car or electronic conventions and if we can get equally attractive men on the floor as well ... where is the problem. Eye Candy for ALL.
Attractive people have been used as spokespeople for years... Why now should it be banned now?
 

Mr F.

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Archangel357 said:
Mr F. said:
You are aware that MOSTLY we are agreed, right? Cause the example you gave of your friend (Or was it fiances friend? I cba reading up) who liked being a booth babe cause she is a gamer, well, none of us are arguing against that kind of crap. I even made a defence of cosplay and whatnot.

I am just wholly against women being paid to stand around wearing almost nothing, purely to be fucking eye candy. If they have a skill they are bringing, and they are not eye candy, then it is a totally different argument. As for anything else? Go re-read my original post and when you come up with a real argument against what I have said, get back to me.
Yeah, as a matter of fact, we would appear to be d'accord on most points. The one point on which we disagree, however, is the definition of "exploitation". Let's face it, there is a world of difference between getting paid for looking good, and getting paid for actually providing services in the sex industry: comparing booth babes to strippers or even prostitutes is like comparing a photo of a meal to a waiter or a cook. Not to mention that the line, as you yourself have alluded to, is blurry. Some of those girls may actually be interested in gaming, most of them probably don't mind being there as long as the cheque clears, and furthermore, there are differences in how those ladies dress up - at GamesCom a few years ago, Konami hired a bunch of Asian girls and put them in white and red kimonos. Hardly any skin except for some leg, nothing more than you would see on any classroom. Of course, there are companies like Razer at the other end of the spectrum, whose booth girls probably ARE actual strippers, and might as well be, for all they wear (the fact aside that they couldn't tell you the difference between a Naga and a Lachesis if their bloody lives depended on it).

Nuance. Context. That's what I'm asking for, and again, I think that we're mostly on the same page here. A pretty girl in an Elena Fisher costume at the Sony booth - cool. A pretty girl in a thong peddling case mods or keyboards - not so cool.
What grinds my gears is the notion - not necessary brought forward by yourself, but quite visible throughout this thread - that putting pretty girls ANYWHERE is tantamount to exploitation. Or that jobs based purely on looks are somehow worth less, less "real" even, than jobs based exclusively on physical strength or intelligence.

As Jim suggested, let's ask the ladies if they enjoy what they're doing. If half of them are disgusted by the notion of being ogled all day by sweaty WoW nerds, fine. Get rid of the lot. If one can conclusively prove that they do nothing as far as increasing business for their employers, the problem will solve itself. However, if the majority of them don't mind or even actively enjoy their jobs - then what is the problem here? Men like looking at pretty ladies. And even in the aforementioned cases of our gamer girl friend (with an MA in literature) working for Nintendo or my missus being hired because she speaks three languages fluently, there is ZERO chance of them getting hired if they looked like ogres.
My response will be short and academic. For two reasons. One being a lack of time, two being that I have spent about 8 hours reading shit by J Wolff and JS Mill. On the surface, I will agree with any of your arguments based on the harm principle and the works of JS Mill: To limit the freedoms of booth babes to do as they wish would be unjust as it goes against the harm principle; what they are doing can be seen to do no harm ergo it is not the right of the state (Or individuals) to prevent it. It goes into economics, these people are willing to do what they do for money ergo there job should exist.

However, once you start to look at utilitarianism from a broader perspective, you have to consider that it might be beneficial for society, regardless of the opinions of those being employed, to legislate against the existance of booth babes from a utilitarian point of view; if their existance can be shown to be damaging to women as a whole than it does not matter what their views are, their own freedoms should be rode roughshod for the benefit of society as a whole and the overall happiness of society.

Sure, this is authoriatrian in a degree (In a rather large degree) but there are arguments for authoritarian states with regards to freedom.

I am in the camp where there is a belief that for the benefit of society as a whole some freedoms should be limited or removed. I believe that regardless of the opinions of the booth babes (Or strippers, prostitutes and similar) they should no longer exist within a civilised society and their removal would not be negative whatsoever. In fact I would go so far as to say that their removal would eventually have far more positive effects for society than negative affects and from a utilitarian point of view this is all that matters, maximising happiness in the long term over happiness in the short term.

Sorry if that was overly academic. As I have said, been reading JS Mill and J Wolff all gorram day and it is all I am capable of thinking about right now. Plus I am somewhat of a utilitarian (Which gets me bad rap these days, apparently, but I no longer care) so the morals that particular philosophy impart have a large impact upon my world view.
 

Nexxis

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I don't particularly care for booth babes, but I don't mind them as long as they're portraying a character in a game and aren't just there to catch the eye of male customers. And seeing how most characters in game tend to be male, I think that the booth babes serve no other purpose than to be man magnets. I'd like to see them make more real-life renditions of characters. Hell, maybe even have them do little skits and performances to draw crowds, or have a "stage" set up that resembles an environment in the game. Less focus on sex appeal and more focus on fun.
 

Darmani

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Apr 26, 2010
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Look. dress them like they do at other trade shows to assuage your I'm going to cocktail club with the dudes/for work guilt. Otherwise just treat them like the prettified presenters they are and are practically endemic in all parts of our society (here's a surprise a restaurant with non-young not thin and not pretty nonfemale host; they exist, certainly but lets not kid ourselves). Guys, Gen Nintendo and the breadth of its journalists have nothing to either prove or gain "cleaning up" out image and what have you just reeks of inconfidence. If autoshows, carnivals, church car washes, sporting events, and political protests use and have women in states of undress to attract where is the "oh my god how am I condoning this" coming from but belief we have to prove something.

By all means clean up the actions. Act professional. Make sure nothing wrong is happening. Add some cabin bois or whatever for ten percent of the men and growing number of female journalists there.

But this large maudlin play about female presenters as some great shame... *sigh*

REALLY.

Its getting old. We can by rated Mature and have gotten laid, the complete unattainable allure of woman and the issue of not devaluing the lust/appreciation for her it kinda weird.
 

BehattedWanderer

Fell off the Alligator.
Jun 24, 2009
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Simple solution. We add professional cosplayers along side them, and add some Chippendales-type gentleman as well. Rehumanizing, dehumanizing, and actual product display. More jobs created, for both the models and costume creators, the fanboys and fangirls get their eye candy, and the product gets advertised. Maybe improve working conditions as well, help out a little bit more.
 

Overusedname

Emcee: the videogame video guy
Jun 26, 2012
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Let them work, feel free to criticize the practice, let your voice be heard, and listen to what the women themselves have to say. That's a very important part of this. These are still jobs that people get paid for. I personally think it is very stupid, and the lack of a male equivalent sends a horrible message to female gamers and women in the industry, but it's still a job. But it definitely does some harm to the entire mediums image. But it's up to the individual company I guess. I don't think it's as effective as they think it is though.

Arren Kae said:
I didn't watch the video.

B/c Jim's fat, I bet he'll pretend to be a feminist against booth babes in a desperate attempt to get pussy. Write me if I'm wrong.
Okay. You're pretty wrong. He's not against booth babes, and he's a genuine feminist.

He's also fucking married.
 

LazarusLongNL

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Oct 24, 2012
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Amazing show President Elect; Sterling!

A well balanced opinion with all sides taken in to account and a proper message to go along with it. This, is why i want to have your boothbabies....

You know if i could.....

Thanks for the show Jim!
 
Nov 24, 2010
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Gennadios said:
Booth Babes get hired through agencies, I'm pretty sure the gaming community hasn't heard from many of them is because they really don't care about gaming as a pastime.

It's a generalization of course. I'm sure there are attractive women out there that genuinely enjoy gaming. They'll always have a job at G4 though.
jeah but the "sexy" gamergirls are not there for your eyecandy. (And sadyl there are plenty of men whoch are too dumb tounderstand this.
I sometimes feel a little, well i dont know the appropriate word in english, uhm liek harassed.. i dont want to see half naked tits and asses everywhere and i am happy if i could avoid it.
this objektification of people, mostly women but also men is annoying and bad for the body image(i dont know if there are places in the exop where games for younger audiences are shown. and even if, you will be meeting this persons anyway. its a nice lesson to girls:this could be your job, to be stared because of your body and only because of your body, your mind and your personality are irrelevant. But i dont like this (super) modeling shit anyway. ) in tv and media it correlates with eating disorder and generell bady body images, i mean, hell, 50% of asked 11 year old healty and normal girls wanted to start dieting (survey in german, on mady by a youth-magazine) because they think they are fat... wtf is wrong here?
we show half children in our media that its iomprtantto be beauty for whoat-for others.. the model that wins the prize ist mostly too thin and that we ask why eating disorder and such shit prevails?

i think its a problem of society and the game expos doesnt stand in a vacuum..
it shows how women ale liked-beaty and displayed but not as a person but as candy.


and i think a hellot of men (might be the kind of men which rant about the possibility to date male charas if you male too (yeah, leasbians are okay, gay men not? eyecandy-factor again..) in ME and dragon age and start homphobic slurs online..)might feel very uncomforable at such a con if there were half naked musculuos men everywhere which try to interact or do like state alchemist Strong arm ^^


Maybe we ycould have acors and models wo arent half naked? maybe we yould have actors of all body images-but, okay, well most of the female chartesa are oversequelized and shallow and men come more often in all shapes and colours-but there is also this lame 30-jeahr-old-white-male-with-bronwn-or-black-hair.
(So at this point we coudl say-plz make more diverse characters, female (becaus there are much more less) and male. and let they be played by, hmn, maybe fitting fans or models and give them just normal clothes.
mix it, not 100% assn titties with little bit of clothing but diversity. maybe the next expo there will be a young lady croft with clothes and without monstertitties which can explain the game and play it with you. maybe you will stumble upon the masterchief in his armor which presents a trailer or there will be a big volus or sall volus or mario and luigi and link and zelda and and and... so much possibilities

diversity and love for the charakters > silly objectification and sexualisation for one audience-group lesser then 50%*



my beloved man hates half naked women if they areout on the street because he feeld friggin awkward because ist hard to him not to think about sex if someone is displaying his sekundar genitals.
and often he just want to walk the streets normaly without this. at this situation he has to deal with it, i have too. but there is this practice and its very..cheap i think. thats sad


(and - )its not that i donkt like pretty persons. i even wank or how you call this if its made by females. and use material. but this is my private time and i dont want this to be dragged out-and i dont want to watch people who acting.. well like in heat. (and i dont waht to meet such people or want to deal witch them because they think i could be one of these candygirls as well. )

well, its a complicated topic with many complicated words in it, so if there is something unreadable, plz ask then i try better. but then i need a dictionary.
 
Nov 24, 2010
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The Last Parade said:
Both Babes issue aside, one thing that annoyed me was the issue of cosplayers being harassed as well, these aren't professionals who are being paid to be there, they're people who love gaming and anime and have put effort into their look and paid their own money to be there
I think this
"lets display a few hot grrls for candy and tell them to act nice (even if the customer act like a prick) because, you know the customer is king and gets what (we think) he wants."
Is the problem. (And that THE customer doesnt exist.)
I see big problem in harassing cosplayers, but dont you think the implication-that harassing these booth babes is somewhat more okay because, well that is what they are there for(and they have to smile and shut up) is much more problematic?

And i think its bad publicity too. the girls are (sometimes) in a gross situation which gamers act like blergh-and this fuels predjudice against gamers("i worked at this con and, uah you dont now what i have seen there...") (which only want sex and violence, isnt it?)
And sexual harrasment is a big issue (for both sexes but women have, i think more problems but the harrassent made by women is often seen as less severe-but that isn the point now.
i find it sad that the harrassment might be a point which is somewhat implicated-if you work there, you will experience harrassment-and THIS shouldnt be...
but i think the fire is fueled becaue these girls are depicted as candy, flesh, whatever.

(and some, jeah, they need work and have to endure this... i dont know how much joung people are unempleyd, here in germany you get money from the state(not much but enough- hobby, forget it, bur living is okay)until you have work. but in the us?

I think some might even like this expos and videogames and this kind of work (without harrassment) but i think the most are professionals who play act.)
 

SpectacularWebHead

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Mortamus said:
The more I hear Jim's campaign pitches, the more I want to vote for him.

This needs to happen.

In relevance to the topic, instead of getting rid of Booth Babes, why not just have them wear something more professional and tone down the makeup? They keep their job and others don't have to feel uncomfortable.
Well, How about getting them to dress as female characters from the games they're supposed to attract people too? Why not hire "Booth Studs" to dress as male characters in the same way, thus providing some form of relevance to having eye-candy around your booth.

And then make them break-dance.
 

Kojiro ftt

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Apr 1, 2009
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So if you ban booth babes, what do you do when a female sales/marketing/engineer works a booth and happens to be hot? Or what if they hire people to cosplay in the booth? Where is the line? When is she no longer a representative that happens to be female, but a "booth babe" who should be escorted off the show floor?

Banning them is pointless. Let the public vote with their feet by avoiding booths that have offensively dressed women. They will get the point and join the 21st century eventually.
 

Mortamus

The Talking Dead
May 18, 2012
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SpectacularWebHead said:
Why not hire "Booth Studs" to dress as male characters in the same way, thus providing some form of relevance to having eye-candy around your booth.
I rather like this idea. Pretty fair, but then again, we may end up with a number of people complaining that they feel intimidated by a life-like Kratos growling at people.

And then make them break-dance.
Well, as long as this happening, it should be fun for everyone! I DEMAND BREAKDANCING CYCLOPS!
 

Mortamus

The Talking Dead
May 18, 2012
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Shiro No Uma said:
The Last Parade said:
Both Babes issue aside, one thing that annoyed me was the issue of cosplayers being harassed as well, these aren't professionals who are being paid to be there, they're people who love gaming and anime and have put effort into their look and paid their own money to be there
The big trade shows, E3, TGS, etc., are not really open to the public. You have to be part of the industry to attend, and if you don't have prof that you are you have to pay hundreds of dollars to get in. The show runners, sometimes part of the industry, set the clothing standards. Just lIke Disney Land, if you don't work there (if you aren't working at a both) they don't want you dressing up because it can cause confusion and look really unprofessional. I'm not about people getting harassed when they show passion for something by dressing up, but even some of the expos that anyone can attend have dress code rules that as attendees you must adhere to - sometimes just for insurance reasons.
Pretty much this. I appreciate a well built costume, and love seeing someone's hard work being shown off, but there is a time and place for it. That's why we have things like Dragon Con, Faires, etc. Such big trade shows generally aren't about such things, but the unveiling of new products. Someone who is only interested in the new technology may not want to see your fancy outfit, especially if it offends them.
 

Darmani

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Apr 26, 2010
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Booth Babe=/=Cosplayers

They are promoters there to work the floor and look good a presentable like the pharmaceutical reps sent to medical facilities and doctor's offices.

Again crackdown on the harassment, demand the attendees treat them like the professional models there to present a product they are. Drop the demeaning monniker in common game journalism parlance. Maybe ask the show runners to please have them dress in a way that isn't as discomforting to the men who apparently can't help themselves (this is already borderline). But its been my understanding quality booth babes are presenters of products hired for their looks and ability to present and sell this shit. They are not aliens, soiled doves, or your dirty little secret. Have them perform a function in presenting, hopefully pulling double duty, and make surethe showmanship is toned down or at least deniable under artistic license.

But there is no horror, issue, or shame in having the equivalent of cute hostesses or cheerleaders/waitresses at these events. Mind you the behavior and attitude THAT's worth a change but that's on the (prevailingly male) attendees.
 

Shiro No Uma

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Nov 10, 2009
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Mortamus said:
Shiro No Uma said:
The Last Parade said:
Both Babes issue aside, one thing that annoyed me was the issue of cosplayers being harassed as well, these aren't professionals who are being paid to be there, they're people who love gaming and anime and have put effort into their look and paid their own money to be there
The big trade shows, E3, TGS, etc., are not really open to the public. You have to be part of the industry to attend, and if you don't have prof that you are you have to pay hundreds of dollars to get in. The show runners, sometimes part of the industry, set the clothing standards. Just lIke Disney Land, if you don't work there (if you aren't working at a both) they don't want you dressing up because it can cause confusion and look really unprofessional. I'm not about people getting harassed when they show passion for something by dressing up, but even some of the expos that anyone can attend have dress code rules that as attendees you must adhere to - sometimes just for insurance reasons.
Pretty much this. I appreciate a well built costume, and love seeing someone's hard work being shown off, but there is a time and place for it. That's why we have things like Dragon Con, Faires, etc. Such big trade shows generally aren't about such things, but the unveiling of new products. Someone who is only interested in the new technology may not want to see your fancy outfit, especially if it offends them.
Exactly. Booth babes hired for the trade shows get costumes from the developers and publishers, who every they are promoting, and they are supposed to be there. Cosplayers really aren't welcome at the big trades, and never have been, by the show runners themselves. Honestly, developers and publishers alike at the last trade show I worked couldn't care less if someone put the time into making a costume, put it on and then were asked by the show runners to either change to street cloths or leave. It's not why they are there.
 

Zombiefish

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Sep 29, 2012
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Does anyone actually have an issue with making the booth babes dress in cosplay and gain basic knowledge about the game?

It seems a very simple solution that would benefit everyone.
 

Strazdas

Robots will replace your job
May 28, 2011
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Prostitution also gives work for many women. and yet many are objected to it.
Maybe we should bring back slavery, then everyone will have a job, whether they want it or not?

Also, booth babes are a very small part of modeling community, its not like your creating a second crysis here you know.

Kojiro ftt said:
So if you ban booth babes, what do you do when a female sales/marketing/engineer works a booth and happens to be hot? Or what if they hire people to cosplay in the booth? Where is the line? When is she no longer a representative that happens to be female, but a "booth babe" who should be escorted off the show floor?
A (hot) person is hired to represent a product by providing knowledge about it and optionally use a costume that represents your product - fine.
a (hot) person is hired to look hot in order to attract male (prime gamer consumer) to your booth just for looks - bad.
 

hooksashands

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Apr 11, 2010
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The reason no one asks booth babes what they think is because it's a stupid question with the same straightforward answer:
"This job is easy, I hope I get to keep it."

And that's pretty much it.

You're never going to find anybody who says "Yes, actually, I'd love to lose an opportunity for employment."
 

Something Amyss

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Dec 3, 2008
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Lyri said:
Oh come on now, you can't compare slaves to the modern booth babe and expect it to be taken seriously.
You just acknowledged you misinterpreted my last post. Please don't then do it again in this post.

I'm sorry, I probably should have read on, but this is a serious problem. I do not appreciate being repeatedly misrepresented.