Jimquisition: Welcoming A Digital Future

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The White Hunter

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Oct 19, 2011
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CardinalPiggles said:
SkarKrow said:
Issue: What about console sources? If the major hardware companies go digital only we will pretty much have prices dictated to you. Frankly, who the fuck wants to pay £55 for Bodycount because the publisher said so and SCEE don't give a fuck about us?

EDIT: Before I'm told to get a PC instead, I simply can't afford to get my PC up to snuff and won't be able to for a good 3 or 4 years. So yeah.
Simply don't buy the game, passively boycott any game/franchise/developer/publisher that sells their mediocre shit at extreme prices. This is why I am choosing not to buy Mass Effect 3, because it will not be on Steam and I don't like EA/Origin or even Bioware anymore.
Oh I agree absolutely, I didn't want bodycount (the demo was awful) but it served as the most immediate example to come to mind. I won't pay a stupid price for a game even if it's one I do want. I'm not buying anything from EA until they cut out most of their bullshit, I'll pick up the new SSX when I see it for £10 preowned and refuse to pay for the pass and play with real flesh people in the same room instead. I'm also not buying the Darkness 2 simply because it's another £40 game that lasts 6 hours.

As for Mass Effect 3? 2 bored the hell out of me, and Dragon Age 2 sucked, so yeah, it's a no-go for me.
 

Squidbulb

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SkarKrow said:
Issue: What about console sources? If the major hardware companies go digital only we will pretty much have prices dictated to you. Frankly, who the fuck wants to pay £55 for Bodycount because the publisher said so and SCEE don't give a fuck about us?
Then it will sell poorly and the publisher will be forced to lower the price. I'm pretty sure publishers aren't dumb enough to believe we'll pay any price.
 

Techno Squidgy

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TheKasp said:
Kumagawa Misogi said:
We are approaching the end of increasing computer power now and will probably max it inside the decade.

An example of a technology dead end you say? in atmosphere manned flight speed.

1903 wright brothers first powered manned flight speed 6.82mph

1967 North American X-15 4,519mph

64 years difference between the two and yet 45 years later NO progress.
You are wrong. Several months ago scientists found out a way to store so much data without increasing our storage devices in size that it was unthinkable of. Hundreds of terrabyte. The same goes for processing power and everything, we are not even close to what can be reached in computing technology.
I think they're having problems on the processing aspect at the moment, but it has been a while since I looked into it. They can't cool processors fast enough any more with current designs. I believe there was something about turning processors from flat things into what is essentially an array of blades to make cooling easier, but I struggle to recall and cannae be fecked to look it up.
 

The White Hunter

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Oct 19, 2011
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Squidbulb said:
SkarKrow said:
Issue: What about console sources? If the major hardware companies go digital only we will pretty much have prices dictated to you. Frankly, who the fuck wants to pay £55 for Bodycount because the publisher said so and SCEE don't give a fuck about us?
Then it will sell poorly and the publisher will be forced to lower the price. I'm pretty sure publishers aren't dumb enough to believe we'll pay any price.
You'd think but some of the prices for games on the EU PSN are simply obscene at release. Nor do they drop within a reasonable time, alot of games at launch on the PSN are £54.99 on the store but £34.99 on Amazon. Even games that have been out a number of years suffer from the issue, Darksiders recently launched on the PSN for £12 when I got my copy a year ago for £8 on disc.

I'd hope they would, but they won't, not for a very long time. EA, Activision, THQ, Ubisoft, they're all dinosaurs and they need to start to understand that sometimes what they offer just isn't worth the price.
 

viranimus

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Nov 20, 2009
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You know Jim, your not exactly wrong. Yes digital distribution can be a good thing. It has that potential to destroy the existing model that has so many problems. That is not the problem. Not at all.

The problem is that in destroying the current industry model you are willingly giving the publishers enough power to compensate and that compensation comes in the form willingly allowing them to take away consumer rights as they utilize digital distribution as a mean to destroy the used market. Now I have discussed this enough times, but apparently it bears repeating. Giving away ownership rights, allowing publishers/developers to hoard all the money from gaming by turning it into a subscription rather than a product is NOT a good thing. It does not matter how it is spun. It does not matter how many positives you can illustrate. It is a bad thing. Yes obviously it hurts the consumer by killing off used/rental markets and we are already seeing that death happen because of how much people have already accepted digital distribution. But it does not end there and this is the painfully truth filled nugget that people want you to not pay attention to because it destroys the counter argument. It literally takes an entire industry and eliminates thousands upon thousands of jobs, between gamestop employees that act as the publishers intended target, to the collateral damage of Shippers, warehouse, physical production, public advertisement, general retail such as target and walmart who stock games (as with no physical games to sell thats a large portion of stock that gets sold daily, so less need for someone to be working that counter, and you can get by with 2 on staff rather than 4) Gamefly would be eradicated as well as a painful chunk out of local businesses still trying to operate under media rental and sooo much more.

People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both.
Even here this is something that has so much bearing on this situation. Trying to provide the industry security at all the patently false claim that used/piracy/rental markets are all killing the industry by ensuring the money goes to those producing the games we all know and love is NEVER going to give the industry security. It simply cant. Its not possible. You cannot force security into something that either was not in jeopardy, or its problems stem from other underlying internal issues. YOU DONT FIX PROBLEMS BY ZERG RUSHING THEM WITH MONEY! So allowing the profits from a game to be forcefully redirected you wont see some glorious proliferation of that studios performance. Allowing digital distribution to subjugate rights does not cure the disease. Its an example of killing the disease by killing the patient. And when it is all said and done? The industry will be no more healthy (and arguably less healthy) than it is today, yet, in the process people willingly gave up value in the products they were buying, they allowed sub industries to be raped and obliterated, they allowed those who are already more than wealthy enough to use that wealth to eliminate fair and equitable competition. Gutting the variety of options one has to obtain their desired media.

Jim, I think we all understand. your clearly an apple fanboy. Youve made it abundantly clear you adore apple as well as their structure. But tell me Jim, Even though you can buy the stuff you want without having to buy junk you dont, what happens when your tastes change. What happens when you look back on digital purchases you made that make you think, My god, was I on drugs when I decided to buy that? Did I ever really Like that? What is your recourse? Can you sell that embarrassing track out of your list? Do you even have a method to? Yet, even if when you purchased it, even if you bought it on sale, you bought it based on the sale price of a physical comparative that intrinsically has less than half the value. Example. A typical CD runs 12-15 USD. Typically a music CD will house 10-15 music tracks. So just giving a rough estimate, that breaks down to 1$ per track. Much like apples lauded pricing structure. However, you paid 1$ for that track with literally half the value already extracted because part of the value is if you do not like it , you can get some of your value back in trade/sell. So you gladly accepted the base rate of the physical model, with literally half the features extracted. The exact same model holds true with games. Now ask, what benefits does apple receive because of this model? As the service becomes more pervasive do you see the track prices go down? Do you see the removal of apples withholding of the right to suspend your account without reason or recompense? Do you see a better product in any way shape or form? No. But what you do see is more restrictions being placed on what sort of content can be purchased. You see more restrictions on how when where that content can be used. You see apple dictating how its service is used from front to back regardless if its a feature someone was using or not. You see Apple with the freedom to hold your content hostage if they wanted to do so.

So why would anyone willingly promote giving the people putting content in your hands the freedom to do this? They have laws for this. THIS is racketeering and should only be viewed as such. Today its "you keep your content so long as you behave the way we want you to behave", and where will we be a decade from now in this fully digital distribution world? "If you buy this content, you are buying a license that we guarantee for 1 year. We will still charge you the same amount as we did yesterday, but you will have to repay that amount once a year if you expect to continue accessing the license we gave you" And before anyone says anything without actually thinking about this Go check the Origin EULA, Find the provision that dictates that your license can be revoked at any time EA Origin decides to retire content. Its literally racketeering. So the real question at this end is, why is it that the DoJ isnt busting down doors in Redwood city, seizing content, instead of doing it in Hong Kong or New Zealand? Simply put, it is already happening, and it will continue to happen as long as people with more money than sense continue to voluntarily waive their own rights in favor of irresponsible instant gratification.

Honestly I cant get the analogy out of my head. Its almost akin to if the government decided to outlaw sex, in exchange of free access to porn and masturbation as an equal alternative. Thats how people need to start viewing this matter, because that is in essence much closer to the reality than what people with a vested interest in you believing what they tell you is.

So lets not use the same typical argument of "Steam would never do that, they would not piss off their consumers like that" because that argument is simply not valid. We SEE how this is done. Its not some instantaneous switch that gets flicked thus pissing everyone off. Its a slow methodical transition that by the time you notice whats happened its already too late. A decade ago did anyone think it was a realistic possibility for games to be transitioned to a "pay to win" model? Yet after a decade of DRM>DLC>Project 10$> Cutting out content for used buyers> DLC functioning as Pay 2 win.we are starting to see its presence more and more frequently. It can happen, it does happen, It WILL happen, just on such a gradual slope. These are people using foresight. The real problem above all others is that we as consumers, do not use foresight at all.

TL;DR
You know. Honestly I do not oppose digital distribution. It is a great thing for the industry. Last night, I downloaded and installed Civ V in 25 minutes. Literally less time than it would take for me to drive to a physical store and back to purchase a retail copy at roughly about the same cost, with less hassle involved all around. Thats the direction that the industry needs to go. However, We are stopped at progression, and we will continue to remain stopped in that progression until the matter of games being turned into a subscription rather than a product, and exchanging ownership for licensing is resolved. Until all digital property is protected in the same manner as all physical property we CANNOT adopt an industry wide digital distribution platform. If we do, all we accomplish is trading individual freedom the promise of security against a threat that does not actually exist and history has shown us, that simply does not work. And why? All because the people pushing for this know that the MEMEMEMEMEMEMEME crowd has no idea what fiscal responsibility is, Does not care about how their actions will impact everyone, Just so long as you ca give them what they want, they will blindly pay whatever price you ask and wont even care if didnt even give them the same thing as the physical alternative. There is nothing wrong with serving that niche. The problem arises when there are so many of them adopting these illogical practices that it creates a commercial standard operating procedure so as if there are people with enough wits about them to realize the impact of their purchases it wont matter because there will be no alternative.

So Jim. Please. Stop. You of all people being a part of the industry that these people would potentially love to destroy too, should really be more careful in the direction you try to sway public opinion. Its incredibly irresponsible, and uncharacteristically devoid of forethought on the subject. So please lets not go off stopping just short of calling non adopters luddites simply because they do not want to adopt a model that hurts themselves, the industry and ALL commerce as a whole. If you want the industry to get behind digital distribution? Im all for that. But make absolutely certain that the bullshit manipulations in place are completely worked out BEFORE you try to push in that direction, or else you are duping people into trading one theoretical set of problems for a different set of actual problems with infinitely worse effects.
 

Grunt_Man11

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You can try to con me into seeing digital distribution as a totally good thing all you want, but I'm not buying it.

Why? Because digital distribution alienates, and possibly flat-out discriminates, against people who don't have, and often can't get, high speed internet!

For example, back when Blizzard released the 4.0 pre-release patch for World of Warcraft: Cataclysm. The patch was a little over 1 gig in size. It took me two days to download that patch!

Yes that includes the times I had to stop the download so other members of my family could use the internet for e-mail and such. It still counts. I even had it downloading overnight it still took that long to download.

Here's something else too. All that happened before I was forced to downgrade to 1.5 DSL because I had to move.

Imagine how nightmarish downloading a full game would be? The blu-ray disc is getting an upgrade which will increase it's storage space to around 135 gigs. Imagine trying to download a 135 gig game.

If digital distribution becomes the only means of buying games, then a good number of people will be left out simply because of where they live.

"You're not willing to cram yourself into some dinky apartment in big city #1456? Then no games and movies for you! Go tip a cow, you hick!"

Let's not forget about what would happen if all those "evil brick and mortar stores" were forced out of business. Thousands of jobs going bye-bye. Have you seen how things are? The last thing the world needs right now is more job losses!

(You may now thank god for me, Jimmy.)
 

Gunner 51

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Snipermanic said:
God, where is that pink guy with the bent nose and cigar from? That's going to keep me up all night unless I remember
Allow me to answer your question and spare you a sleepless night.
That is Cyril Sneer from the show The Racoons.

Hope this lets you avoid a sleepless night.
 

Elate

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SkarKrow said:
Elate said:
SkarKrow said:
-snip-
I see what you're saying but I don't buy a £40 game every month. I can't afford to do that either, I'm living off the bare minimum student loan for the next 3 years so yeah I seriously can't afford it. Know how many games I've bought since september? 1. MGS HD collection for £20 thanks to vouchers for Xmas.

When I stop being a poor student then maybe I can afford to upgrade my shit. When I say I can't afford any upgrade I mean it.
Well that's fair enough, I bought my PC before I was a student, but even some people I know (y'know the lucky ones with massive loans) spend stupid amounts on console games.. hell one guy even bought a 3DS for one game. I wept.
 

Metalrocks

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Grunt_Man11 said:
You can try to con me into seeing digital distribution as a totally good thing all you want, but I'm not buying it.

Why? Because digital distribution alienates, and possibly flat-out discriminates, against people who don't have, and often can't get, high speed internet!

For example, back when Blizzard released the 4.0 pre-release patch for World of Warcraft: Cataclysm. The patch was a little over 1 gig in size. It took me two days to download that patch!

Yes that includes the times I had to stop the download so other members of my family could use the internet for e-mail and such. It still counts. I even had it downloading overnight it still took that long to download.

Here's something else too. All that happened before I was forced to downgrade to 1.5 DSL because I had to move.

Imagine how nightmarish downloading a full game would be? The blu-ray disc is getting an upgrade which will increase it's storage space to around 135 gigs. Imagine trying to download a 135 gig game.

If digital distribution becomes the only means of buying games, then a good number of people will be left out simply because of where they live.

"You're not willing to cram yourself into some dinky apartment in big city #1456? Then no games and movies for you! Go tip a cow, you hick!"

Let's not forget about what would happen if all those "evil brick and mortar stores" were forced out of business. Thousands of jobs going bye-bye. Have you seen how things are? The last thing the world needs right now is more job losses!

(You may now thank god for me, Jimmy.)
i agree with you. downloading huge files takes time. wile you can install it from a disc in a few minutes. i still hope that in future you still can buy retail games form a shop and not only online.
 

Fenix7

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Haven't watched the video yet (am at work atm) but I just had to applaud you for using the Alien Ant Farm logo! (unless it was a coincidence, that is)

Also, now that I am commenting on a Jimquisition video anyway, I might as well post what I had wanted to say for ages. I liked the Destructoid-era Jimquisition a lot better. I'm not saying these new videos are bad, I'm just saying that the random, unfocused, very unprofessional and rant-ish videos of that era were much more enjoyable. I know you probably can't go back to the microphone-throwing, sonic-humping days back now that you've a contract with the Escapist, but I just wanted to let you know, Mr. Sterling. IF you read these threads.
 

The White Hunter

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Oct 19, 2011
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Elate said:
SkarKrow said:
Elate said:
SkarKrow said:
-snip-
I see what you're saying but I don't buy a £40 game every month. I can't afford to do that either, I'm living off the bare minimum student loan for the next 3 years so yeah I seriously can't afford it. Know how many games I've bought since september? 1. MGS HD collection for £20 thanks to vouchers for Xmas.

When I stop being a poor student then maybe I can afford to upgrade my shit. When I say I can't afford any upgrade I mean it.
Well that's fair enough, I bought my PC before I was a student, but even some people I know (y'know the lucky ones with massive loans) spend stupid amounts on console games.. hell one guy even bought a 3DS for one game. I wept.
Still waiting on the 3DS tbh, I'll pick one up when it has a pokemon game to justify the expense with stealing hundreds of hours of my life. Though it is starting to flesh out in terms of it's library.

I do prefer the lazy luxury of just chucking the disc in the console though, but I acknowledge the advantages of the PC, I use it for emulators and makings videos alot.
 

Duskflamer

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TheKasp said:
For the infrastructure: We'll see. I hope for everyone that they get at least the same internet I have and I can't understand why the US is so far behind...
In my mind, there's two pretty clear reasons. First, take a look at this:


You see how the eastern part of the united states is pretty populated, and then slightly left of center the population is a lot sparser? This is the biggest thing holding US infrastructure back, there are many areas, particularly in the midwest, where the amount of investment needed to lay down wire has a very very small return. The best internet in the US is in high-population eastern cities, where there's plenty of opportunity for return. If the US wanted to focus on its infrastructure this could be dealt with, but that leads into the second point.

The US is beyond broke. Despite our standard of living, despite how involved we are in foreign wars, we are $17 TRILLION in debt. Among all other things, this means that the US government itself cannot afford to invest in infrastructure, we can barely keep existing infrastructure repaired if that, new infrastructure is something we can't afford as a nation, and since the low-density areas of the country don't provide as much of a return, ISP companies aren't likely to make investments of their own out there.

You compare this to European nations that have smaller total area with higher average population densities, and you can see why Europe has much better infrastructure (not just internet, but also trains and buses etc.) than the US does.
 

wooty

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Aug 1, 2009
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If digital gaming can find an alternative to the "always online" situation, then I might sway my opinion towards it.
 

irishda

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I'd rather not be forced to keep my products down to whatever size constraint my hard drive will allow. Not to mention you'll lose everything when whatever device is storing your digital products breaks, or the server goes down, or the company goes under. Physical hard copies are real things that can carry the product for as long as it exists, while digital copies are too dependent on too many variables; the servers, your computer, the company, your account, security issues. Not to mention you don't even own the item in question you bought, while a DVD or game disc has to be physically taken from you in order for the company to repossess it.

(The number 5 entry on [link: http://www.cracked.com/article_19683_6-terrifying-user-agreements-youve-probably-accepted.html] this cracked article[/link] from yesterday better explains it.)

There's too many advantages to owning a physical object for them to disappear in the "digital era".
 

Atmos Duality

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So long as there are significant fixed costs and marketing to be done, the Publisher will always have a role.

So the question becomes: "How large of a role will they have?"
Starting out, the digital age is quite scary, not because we don't know how it works but because it begins with the Publisher having nearly all the cards.

They will begin by enticing customers into using their system, let them purchase some titles, and then slowly squeeze them by requesting more and more from them. Limited installs. Activity periods. Demanding increasingly pervasive access to your computer for "Their securities/marketing".
And if you don't play nice, they take all those games you paid near-retail-price away from you.

Without some securities for the customer, these systems become "The Eternal Rental" in practice, not just on paper.
 

Furtled

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There's already people looking for alternatives, the Extra Credits indie fund is one and I know devs in the UK are looking into the legal issues behind setting up publishing co-operatives so more of them could try something like the Double Fine kickstarter.

I'm old and still buy boxes where possible, but I'm no Luddite; digital is definitely where things are going, and like Jim said mobile's already shown that smaller devs can compete with the big names far easier in the digital space. Sure we might end up with less big AAA titles, but given that most of those sorts of things are either sequels (CoD, GoW, Battlefield, FIFA, Final Fantasy etc.) or funded by deep pocketed nerds (Kingdoms of Amalur), that's not necessarily a bad thing for games in general.

There's also a massive potential for extra revenue for the publishers/devs, digital as standard makes the physical items a scarcity, meaning they can wait to see the reaction on a game and release limited physical copies for prices well above the standard to sell to hardcore fans (or old types like me). If memory serves there's a good number of bands that already do that sort of thing and do well with it.

The only thing that really concerns me is what terms these digital services would have, if I can keep a DRM free copy of the game on my own machine it's all cool; if it's a case that (larger publishers especially) try and follow the old-school DRM laden model with EULAs that give them total power over my games, then I'm going to be far more reluctant to give up my boxes.

Mind all of this is only really valid for countries with good levels of high speed broadband (and countries where data isn't capped/metered). Any move into digital only is going to rely on Telecomms and ISPs playing fair with customers, governments investing in infrastructure, and things like ongoing net neutrality. Promoting a game worldwide using the internet is easy enough, actually distributing it needs a lot more bandwidth.
 

Something Amyss

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kiri2tsubasa said:
Exactly, this is a problem that people keep glossing over. Where I live for $60.00 a month you get 5 gig internet cap. For over $100 a month you get unlimited no cap internet. So if the PC market, and it seems to be going this way goes to a pure digital distribution model, then people like me will be ignored because we suffer due to internet caps. The only other way for us to game is by consoles since you can play them without being connected to the internet.
Holy crap? Five gigs? I'm feeling lucky now, with Comcast.

Which I shouldn't have to. The cap is there to prevent them from having to install better infrastructure, which cots them money. That's dirty pool.

But still, there are a lot of bad caps about the country right now, which will make gaming either impractical or prohibitively expensive (Some of the "limitless" plans are more expensive than even the one you mentioned).

And console gaming may switch more to a DD model.

RandV80 said:
While digital distribution co-exists with physical retail I don't know if it can really change the price, or at the very least not without digital having a good market share for 5-10 years.
iTunes didn't have to do this. Hell, there were multiple, viable DD models a long time ago. all of them cheaper than retail.

As long as publishers still need retailers to sell physical copies of the games, the retailers will have the clout to enforce an equal selling price across all platforms.
Just like iTunes. Hell, kust like game prices are universal cross-platform.

I'd say this falls apart under scrutiny, but I don't even think you need to say "under scrutiny" in this case.

Force them to sell at a higher cost than digital and it likely won't be long until Gamestop goes down the Blockbuster road, and I don't think publishers are ready to throw them under the bus just yet.
Well, yes. Obviously, especially Gamestop. You know, the same Gamestop who makes their money by selling used games at almost retail prices? They're SO going to go the "Blockbuster" route.

But I have to strongly disagree with the Steam sales not counting, why wouldn't they?
Primarily, because unlike the iTunes model Jim was using, they're temporary. Even the most comprehensive sales aren't a viable price break model. Apples and oranges, chum.

While they can't sell new games cheaper because they're still tied in with retailers, once the game is no longer new and leaves retail shelves then digital has full control to use creative pricing practices, and the consumer whens big time... assuming they had the patience to wait a while for the games.
I get the feeling, however, we're talking about two different things. However, what you are saying is untrue: Steam has had discounted pricing on new titles, including Saints Row the Third. I think Fable 3 was another one discounted at or right after launch, and there have even been pre-order discounts. So obviously, they aren't tied in with retailers. At least, not in any way that relates to the above.

If they're tied in for any reason, it's more likely that it's due to the companies wanting to eat the profit. Occam's Razor: Straight up greed, or some retailer marketing conspiracy that requires multiple steps?
 

NinjaUmbreon

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Nurb said:
What happens if say, in 10-15 years, Steam or Valve is out of business, do you still have your library of games that can be installed and played without needing steam servers to be up? Is this library completely dependent on a company being in business in order to have anything to show for it when you get older? If so, people may realize they've flushed their money down the toilet
Valve has said that if Steam goes down, they will send an unlock update that would allow people to play their games without steam. They even claim that it works. So if that happens we'll just have to wait and see.
 

Strazdas

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May 28, 2011
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RoseArch said:
Sorry, Jim, but it isn't quite that simple. A fully digital future is a dire one indeed, because I doubt that even in fifty years, the entire world will have access to an internet that allows them to download gigabytes upon gigabytes. Or to hardware that will store that amount. Cloud gaming? Again, requires a good internet and constant internet connection. As it stands, gaming will have to go the way of music where the market is half hard copy and half digital. That is a good future.
A large portion, while not yet a majority, of the world already can do that. if anything piracy is the best proof. people there download terabites of information in billions of copies. we have the technology. we have the ability. what we need is old dinosaur ISPs to get their heads out of they other ends and start updating the cables.
as for storage. a 100 dollar hard drive can store 1000-2000 gygabites and the number is rising very fast. we have already beaten the dollar/gb that of a empty dvd drives. direct download is cheaper for both parties.
SkarKrow said:
Issue: What about console sources? If the major hardware companies go digital only we will pretty much have prices dictated to you. Frankly, who the fuck wants to pay £55 for Bodycount because the publisher said so and SCEE don't give a fuck about us?

EDIT: Before I'm told to get a PC instead, I simply can't afford to get my PC up to snuff and won't be able to for a good 3 or 4 years. So yeah.
sell your console + your console games
for the moeny you get buy a PC + same games on PC (which is cheaper due to variuos distributors like steam).
you are already good enough to play all the games out atm. may not be on max graphics, then again your console wasnt providing such graphics anyway.
the only problem is console-exclusive games. but lets face it, there isnt that many of them.
esperandote said:
I don't understand something. Why developers can develope games on their own to be published digitally but cant develope a game on their own to be distributed physically by a publisher, pay them for that and keep the IP?
because no publisher would ever agree to that. they want either full control or your IP is dead.
Kumagawa Misogi said:
An example of a technology dead end you say? in atmosphere manned flight speed.

1903 wright brothers first powered manned flight speed 6.82mph

1967 North American X-15 4,519mph

64 years difference between the two and yet 45 years later NO progress.
your example doesnt work. speed of flight is limited to power of engine and resistance of air. computer processing power is only limited in how much ahrdware you put into it. as we approach time where magnetic levitating inside microschemes are becoming reality, we will be able to put more and more hardware into smaller machines. computing power is nowhere close to a deadend. infact we already have a millino times faster computer - our brain. some say that this is a deadend of computing power. if it is, at the current trend (each year computing power doubles) we are still hundreds of years from it.


kiri2tsubasa said:
Exactly, this is a problem that people keep glossing over. Where I live for $60.00 a month you get 5 gig internet cap. For over $100 a month you get unlimited no cap internet. So if the PC market, and it seems to be going this way goes to a pure digital distribution model, then people like me will be ignored because we suffer due to internet caps. The only other way for us to game is by consoles since you can play them without being connected to the internet.
You seriuosly need to beat the shit out of your internet service providers.
we have caps here. at 15 dollars a month you get a 100gb cap. at 20 dollars a month you get a 500 gb cap. at 25 dollars a month you get unlimited. if you are loyal (read: with the company for 3 years) you get unlimited for 15 dollars a month. If you are only playing online games though you got nothing to worry about. usually internet games wouldnt run a 1gb even if left online 24/7. the trouble for you is to actually download the game, as they gotten to 16 gb nowdays.
 

The White Hunter

Basment Abomination
Oct 19, 2011
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Strazdas said:
RoseArch said:
Sorry, Jim, but it isn't quite that simple. A fully digital future is a dire one indeed, because I doubt that even in fifty years, the entire world will have access to an internet that allows them to download gigabytes upon gigabytes. Or to hardware that will store that amount. Cloud gaming? Again, requires a good internet and constant internet connection. As it stands, gaming will have to go the way of music where the market is half hard copy and half digital. That is a good future.
A large portion, while not yet a majority, of the world already can do that. if anything piracy is the best proof. people there download terabites of information in billions of copies. we have the technology. we have the ability. what we need is old dinosaur ISPs to get their heads out of they other ends and start updating the cables.
as for storage. a 100 dollar hard drive can store 1000-2000 gygabites and the number is rising very fast. we have already beaten the dollar/gb that of a empty dvd drives. direct download is cheaper for both parties.
SkarKrow said:
Issue: What about console sources? If the major hardware companies go digital only we will pretty much have prices dictated to you. Frankly, who the fuck wants to pay £55 for Bodycount because the publisher said so and SCEE don't give a fuck about us?

EDIT: Before I'm told to get a PC instead, I simply can't afford to get my PC up to snuff and won't be able to for a good 3 or 4 years. So yeah.
sell your console + your console games
for the moeny you get buy a PC + same games on PC (which is cheaper due to variuos distributors like steam).
you are already good enough to play all the games out atm. may not be on max graphics, then again your console wasnt providing such graphics anyway.
the only problem is console-exclusive games. but lets face it, there isnt that many of them.
esperandote said:
I don't understand something. Why developers can develope games on their own to be published digitally but cant develope a game on their own to be distributed physically by a publisher, pay them for that and keep the IP?
because no publisher would ever agree to that. they want either full control or your IP is dead.
Kumagawa Misogi said:
An example of a technology dead end you say? in atmosphere manned flight speed.

1903 wright brothers first powered manned flight speed 6.82mph

1967 North American X-15 4,519mph

64 years difference between the two and yet 45 years later NO progress.
your example doesnt work. speed of flight is limited to power of engine and resistance of air. computer processing power is only limited in how much ahrdware you put into it. as we approach time where magnetic levitating inside microschemes are becoming reality, we will be able to put more and more hardware into smaller machines. computing power is nowhere close to a deadend. infact we already have a millino times faster computer - our brain. some say that this is a deadend of computing power. if it is, at the current trend (each year computing power doubles) we are still hundreds of years from it.


kiri2tsubasa said:
Exactly, this is a problem that people keep glossing over. Where I live for $60.00 a month you get 5 gig internet cap. For over $100 a month you get unlimited no cap internet. So if the PC market, and it seems to be going this way goes to a pure digital distribution model, then people like me will be ignored because we suffer due to internet caps. The only other way for us to game is by consoles since you can play them without being connected to the internet.
You seriuosly need to beat the shit out of your internet service providers.
we have caps here. at 15 dollars a month you get a 100gb cap. at 20 dollars a month you get a 500 gb cap. at 25 dollars a month you get unlimited. if you are loyal (read: with the company for 3 years) you get unlimited for 15 dollars a month. If you are only playing online games though you got nothing to worry about. usually internet games wouldnt run a 1gb even if left online 24/7. the trouble for you is to actually download the game, as they gotten to 16 gb nowdays.
Have I had this before? I have haven't I?

I don't have money, I don't have that many games as is, I trade them in for credit more often than not, I'm living on tiny student loans and nothing else, I can't afford to have enough games to trade in frankly.

Also, there are a significant number of console exclusive games but I won't bother to list them.