Jimquisition: Xbox 360 and PS3 Are Just Very Crap PCs

[Joccaren]

Why I have always used PCs:
Anything a console can do, it can do - and probably better.
More reliability
For me it is cheaper overall [I buy about 50 games each cycle, and that adds up to $500 more I'd pay for using a console]
Much faster loading times
Much better graphics
Much less lag
More variety of games
Ability to fix problems developers are too lazy to
Mods


At the start of each console cycle, I can kinda see where some people are coming from in buying a console: Familiarity, cheaper for them and they don't have to have a basic knowledge of how to use a screwdriver.

As the cycles go on though, I have to agree with Jim. I've seen a lot of comments in previous discussions like this: "I know when I put a disk in, its going to work", "PCs crash and have errors all the time. Consoles don't and are more reliable", "I don't have to put up with bull**** DRM".
This has changed over time.
Skyrim for PS3 anyone? For a lot of people, when they put it in their console, it didn't just work.
RROD anyone? Killed your Xbox, and you couldn't do anything about it because you weren't able to open it up and toy around trying to fix it.
Online passes anyone? They've hit console games too. Not quite DRM level, but we aren't the only ones getting ripped off in that department.

With the reducing prices of PC parts, what will have to be increasing prices for consoles and the loss of key console features - I'm not seeing there being any advantages to consoles after another couple of generations.
Will they die out? Probably not, same as PC hasn't died out 30 years after people announced its funeral.
Will it be as popular? Again, probably not.
For the home entertainment system I'm seeing that swapping over to I-pads and tablets as they are currently part fad and part useful, becoming powerful enough to play most basic games and versatile enough to do a fair bit of stuff, small enough to be more portable than a console and they come without the need for peripherals like a TV, monitor, M&K, Controller or anything else.
I'm not sure what place consoles will hold then, and I don't really think its possible to know. If consoles don't play to their strong points though, I'm seeing more than a few people switch away from them. Only time will tell what the future holds though.

if you don't need or want a 27" IPS LED monitor for ?500

Hell, you can even get them for around $300. Not sure about 27" [Haven't checked size], but 2560*1440, LED, S-IPS. Everything about PC gaming is becoming cheaper all the time - if you know where to look.

 

[n19h7m4r3]

if you don't need or want a 27" IPS LED monitor for ?500

Hell, you can even get them for around $300. Not sure about 27" [Haven't checked size], but 2560*1440, LED, S-IPS. Everything about PC gaming is becoming cheaper all the time - if you know where to look.

Very very true, every year things get cheaper and cheaper and performance goes up.

 

[itsthesheppy]

Look, I enjoy PC gaming from time to time, but to say you can't think of anything that makes consoles better than PCs in any way? How about the fact that when I install a $50 game on my PC, it more often then not requires me to spend 1-3 hours getting the damn thing to run on my stupid PC because whatever they used doesn't conform to my sound/video/processor of choice.

Because of the boring conformity, at least I know my games will be compatible with my 360 or PS3. And yes, I love mods, but I can at least see this as being a benefit to boring old console gaming.

People keep saying stuff like this, but it's either total crap or I'm the luckiest man alive, because I've not had a single issue with a game on any of my PCs which wasn't solved in the time it took to download a patch or update my graphics card drivers(hint: that isn't a long time at all).

A solid 80% of the issues people have with PC gaming are severe cases of PEBKAC.

I gotta back this up. Even when I have to update drivers or download patches, I typically find it much easier and quicker to do on a PC. The age of buying an XBOX game, popping it in and playing immediately are long gone.

 

[Fusioncode9]

A controversial topic that isn't just trolling for views. Bobby should take some notes.

 

[Aesthetical Quietus]

Um...pcs are expensive and require upgrades to the pc itself to play new games. They are still a bigger hassle. That outweighs anything a pc can do as most gamers wont spend 15000 dollars to have higher definition graphics that add fuck all to the game itself.

First, PCs don't require upgrades to play new games unless you have really old hardware. (Remember that you don't have to have the settings on maximum). Secondly, I hope you meant $1500, rigs that can handle current gen at max and most future games at pretty close to max are around this range. You can go higher of course but there's no point if you are just playing games.

On topic, that'd be because consoles are essentially crappy PCs (the 360 has practically all the hardware (with the exception of a unified shading architecture*), of a 2007ish desktop), more so than in older generations. I didn't agree with the first few points, but overall I enjoyed it and some good points were made.

*Something that has now been adapted into PCs for a long while.

 

[Stegofreak]

For me, the one big advantage console gaming gives me, it the ability to just login and play. I used to do a lot more PC gaming than I do now and, admittedly, I often think about going back but every time I hit the same bloody login issue.

It all began with Battlefield 2142, probably the first game I clocked over 100 hours online on. I stopped playing for a few months and when I went back EA had switched the login method for the game and suggested that I switch over to the new way when I tried to log in. After attempting to do so it informed me that my account had already been automatically switched over. I tried logging in a few times with no success, so I contacted EA about it and got little more than conformation that the account existed in the new format and that I should reset the password to gain access (something I'd already tried only to be told that there was no account attached to the email even though I know I used it and any attempt to create a new account was greeted with a message saying that that email was already in use.)

Then, just a few weeks ago, I decided to go back and play a bit of WoW. After downloading a 10GB thing that I didn't pay much attention to, I was once more informed of a new login system, so I went about creating an account and attempted to attach my old WoW account to it, again to no avail. Oddly enough, if I run WoW I can use my old login before getting a prompt to attach it to the other account. Again that account is stuck in limbo at the moment because of stupid login changes.

Further to that annoyance, I decided that I needed my MMORPG fix and tried to go back to Guild Wars to find my account had been blocked and could only be restored once I provided the codes for all the expansions that I had attached to the account.

These experiences have really clouded my view of PC gaming. At least if I turn on my PS3 I can access my games, my Netflix, Music Unlimited, PlayStation Home or whatever without any issues.


P.S. I'm just posting this as a personal perspective and not claiming it's a rampant issue.

 

[GAunderrated]

Um...pcs are expensive and require upgrades to the pc itself to play new games. They are still a bigger hassle. That outweighs anything a pc can do as most gamers wont spend 15000 dollars to have higher definition graphics that add fuck all to the game itself.

You are so right!

That's why there's only ever been one console ever made. And it's also why new versions of existing consoles never come out! Because they're so wonderful that they just never go out of date, and they never have to be replaced or upgraded to a new version! That's why you can go out and buy brand new games and just pop them right into your NES.

But hey, even console hardware gets old, right? And you don't want the hassle of buying a new computer that may not run your games. But that's the best part about consoles: even if you buy a new console, no matter what kind of console it is, all of your old console games will still work on it just fine!

Now if you'll excuse me, I'm going to grab my copy of Perfect Dark for the N64 and stick it into my Wii. I can't wait to play!

I have to disagree with you on this. Are you implying that if I were to buy all the parts and give them to a non-tech savvy person, they would be able to build it for me? (hint: They actually can't).

Uh, assuming you bought them all the parts? Yes, yes they can. There's tutorials all over the internet, especially on YouTube (some of which are pretty great quality, showing you step by step what to do and precisely which parts go where).

I myself am living proof of this. I'd never built a computer or taken one apart in my entire life, but my old computer was dying and I needed a new computer, and my friends assured me that it would be cheapest to build my own. A friend of mine helped pick out the parts to order, and with their encouragement, I looked up some tutorials and I built it. It's the computer I'm using right now in fact. And it runs fine, never had any complications. It was really much simpler than the days when I played with my Legos, because everything had a very clearly indicated place on the motherboard and was shaped uniquely enough that I knew where to pop the parts in, and precisely which way to pop them in.

So unless your "non-tech savvy person" is too stupid to click the play button on a YouTube video, yeah, they can probably put the basic parts of a computer together. It's just not as dramatically hard as you're making it out to be any more. If you're throwing together something complex (liquid cooled or whatnot), then yes that takes some experience, but most basic gaming rigs (such as the one I'm using now) can be built with little to no experience in computer building at all.

I'm disagreeing with the comparison to legos and building a PC. Besides the point, youtubing a guide isn't the first option everybody goes to (I asked my friend) and without those guides, with JUST the manuals supplied, you will be lost which is why I'm saying that the advantage is towards consoles if someone doesn't know what they're doing.

Again, I don't think assembling the pieces are hard at all, it is the wiring that gets annoying for beginners. I don't know what newer computers are like, but it is very possible to fry your graphics card/motherboard outright if you have a inadequate power supply. I would also like to point out that unless you are using the EXACT parts on a youtube tutorial, there will be some things that can be fairly different, namely the biggest one is the single rail PSU vs multi-rail.

I tend to get tired of tech savvy people trying to speak for the "non-tech savvy people". My father knew nothing about computers and was mostly a construction/car guy but wanted to try computers one day because one of his friends told him how cool they are. He knew nothing about them and I gave him all the parts and the motherboard manual that comes with it, which actually tells you with diagrams where every piece goes. It took him about 2 hours to get it going his first time and 2 years later hes a bigger Tech Nerd than I am.

Now I know this doesn't account for every single person in the world but really we shouldn't be making excuses for the lazy. Anyone with a working brain and a little time can assemble a computer if they are under 55 years.

 

[GAunderrated]

For me, the one big advantage console gaming gives me, it the ability to just login and play. I used to do a lot more PC gaming than I do now and, admittedly, I often think about going back but every time I hit the same bloody login issue.

I'd have to call that into question to be honest. I own both a nice PC rig and all other consoles and consoles (with exception to the wii) are never just plug and play anymore. I just think you block out the negatives like how people block out advertisements now. Let me give you my personal example to refute this claim (not saying you are wrong but that you probably don't notice it).

Skyrim first came out I bought it on PC and my friend let me try it on the Ps3 for a little experiment. Steam let me download/install it in 15 minutes.

That is a bit of time to wait but when I put the skyrim disc in my Ps3 it said it required a firmware update to play the game. Alright its not that bad so 15 minutes it downloads the update since PSN network is kinda slow but wait now I have to wait 5 more minutes for it to install it. Alright so its taking a bit longer but no loss. I play skyrim for about 30 minutes and the game crashes on ps3 and my save file is corrupted.

On the PC version I made a few tweeks that took all of 3 minutes to look up on steam forums and apply to not have any problems for over 200 hours. The Ps3 version I got 30 minutes in after 20 minutes of waiting to install/download updates and gave it back to my friend who had the same issue and had to wait 2 weeks for bethesda to fix the issue.

PC overall time for ME is 15 minutes with tweaks is total of 18 minutes
Ps3 overall time for ME is 20 minutes with waiting for fix is 2 weeks and 20 minutes

Now this is just one example and I love my PC and all my consoles, but in my own personal experience everytime I have to put in a online pass, wait for firmware updates and installation, or just game breaking issues waiting for developer to fix, the console isn't a plug and play anymore for me.

Edit: sorry for double post.

 

[Stegofreak]

Believe me, I know what you mean. I tried to play Grand Turismo 5 the other day and had to download 17 updates because I made the mistake of deleting it to make room for other games over the last few months.

My issue wasn't so much with the login times as it was with the updating of various login systems making it nigh on impossible for me, as a returning PC gamer, to play the games that I wanted.

 

[GAunderrated]

Believe me, I know what you mean. I tried to play Grand Turismo 5 the other day and had to download 17 updates because I made the mistake of deleting it to make room for other games over the last few months.

My issue wasn't so much with the login times as it was with the updating of various login systems making it nigh on impossible for me, as a returning PC gamer, to play the games that I wanted.

If possible i'd love you to elaborate on updating of various login systems. I use mostly steam and GOG so i'm not sure what login systems you are referring too.

 

[Stegofreak]

If possible i'd love you to elaborate on updating of various login systems. I use mostly steam and GOG so i'm not sure what login systems you are referring too.

My apologies, prior to the Origin account EA were using a system (we're talking 2006) whereby you logged in with a username and password. This was later, during a period I wasn't playing, updated to an email/password login which screwed up everything for my account and I lost quite an number of hours of gaming as a result. I've had the same issue occur when World of Warcraft switched from in game login to battlenet login.

As I stated in my first post though, I've no reason to see them as anything other that my own terrible luck.

 

[GAunderrated]

If possible i'd love you to elaborate on updating of various login systems. I use mostly steam and GOG so i'm not sure what login systems you are referring too.

My apologies, prior to the Origin account EA were using a system (we're talking 2006) whereby you logged in with a username and password. This was later, during a period I wasn't playing, updated to an email/password login which screwed up everything for my account and I lost quite an number of hours of gaming as a result. I've had the same issue occur when World of Warcraft switched from in game login to battlenet login.

As I stated in my first post though, I've no reason to see them as anything other that my own terrible luck.

Ah I see what you mean now. Yes EA download manager (now origin) had/still has many problems similar to GFWL. I can't speak on WoW since i've never played it but it sounds like you were a PC gamer around 2006 when it was still quite a pain and not as streamlined. If you ever decide to give it a shot again you will notice that it has become a lot more streamlined and not as many problems as 6 years ago.

5 years ago I was telling my clanmates how much I hate steam because of a massive crashing and synching issue but now I swear by their great service because of how much they have improved with over 160 games purchased.

Consoles are still a great product in their own right but like Jim, I can't help but notice the more bloatware (appropriate term i believe) they put between me putting the disc in the console and just playing, the more I don't want to go through the hassle.

Kinda off a small tangent but a decent example for me is seeing the new xbox interface where all these ads for services and other crap I don't care about clog up the screen and I have to use the search function to find games I want. I have to search to FIND GAMES on a dedicated gaming console because its so filled with crap.

 

[Stegofreak]

Kinda off a small tangent but a decent example for me is seeing the new xbox interface where all these ads for services and other crap I don't care about clog up the screen and I have to use the search function to find games I want. I have to search to FIND GAMES on a dedicated gaming console because its so filled with crap.

Totally agree. That's one of the reason's I decided not to replace my 360 when it packed in.

 

[Andy Shandy]

Can't we all just get along?

*reads all previous posts up til now*

It seems not.

Anyway, the reason that I'm mainly a console gamer is that I started off as a console gamer all those years ago and never cared enough to game on the PC, besides maybe Football Manager amongst a couple of others. My laptop does everything that I need it to do, so I continue to game on consoles for now.

 

[TK421]

I agree with what he says, but I can think of a reason to have a console.
I like to game with my friends, LAN party style, but that is impossible with PCs because they are inconvenient to move and cost a small fortune. Whereas with my PS3, I can just unplug 2 cables, stuff it in a small duffle bag, and i'm ready to go (plus it only cost me $300).

 

[TK421]

I tend to get tired of tech savvy people trying to speak for the "non-tech savvy people". My father knew nothing about computers and was mostly a construction/car guy but wanted to try computers one day because one of his friends told him how cool they are. He knew nothing about them and I gave him all the parts and the motherboard manual that comes with it, which actually tells you with diagrams where every piece goes. It took him about 2 hours to get it going his first time and 2 years later hes a bigger Tech Nerd than I am.

Now I know this doesn't account for every single person in the world but really we shouldn't be making excuses for the lazy. Anyone with a working brain and a little time can assemble a computer if they are under 55 years.

Eh... I don't know how true that is. We had an old IBM when I was a kid and I was writing games on it by the time I was five, but I can't seem to understand how to properly assemble a PC even with all of the help available online.

 

[GAunderrated]

I tend to get tired of tech savvy people trying to speak for the "non-tech savvy people". My father knew nothing about computers and was mostly a construction/car guy but wanted to try computers one day because one of his friends told him how cool they are. He knew nothing about them and I gave him all the parts and the motherboard manual that comes with it, which actually tells you with diagrams where every piece goes. It took him about 2 hours to get it going his first time and 2 years later hes a bigger Tech Nerd than I am.

Now I know this doesn't account for every single person in the world but really we shouldn't be making excuses for the lazy. Anyone with a working brain and a little time can assemble a computer if they are under 55 years.

Eh... I don't know how true that is. We had an old IBM when I was a kid and I was writing games on it by the time I was five, but I can't seem to understand how to properly assemble a PC even with all of the help available online.

See if this helps my friend. This is the video that I showed my friend for him to set it up. He said he had to stop it one piece at a time. If all else fails the motherboard manual shows where each piece is supposed to go.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9smMOm60gkU