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Icehearted

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Maphysto said:
Does anybody actually respect David Cage anymore?
He's my new Molyneux.

I haven't played this game yet, but I've played the others, and I completely relate with how they felt about Omikron and Fahrenheit, though I hated Heavy Rain less than most I think. David seems to have fallen into a pit of pretentiousness, which is a shame, since the technology is there to see visions like his early work, especially Omikron, really become something spectacular. I haven't given up on him yet, but he's not making it easy.
 

Johnson McGee

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Nov 16, 2009
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I think I got much more enjoyment out of this game by watching the Two Best Friends play it as opposed to actually buying it myself.
 

wAriot

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Arslan Aladeen said:
I think it might be one of those cases where it's hard to separate the artist from the art. David Cage generally acts like he's the savior of storytelling in games and usually sounds like he hates the medium.
Sadly, he isn't the only one. Ever heard of Jennifer Hepler?

cricket chirps said:
Long in depth and preferably as impartial as possible explanations are welcomely invited to show me why this game, and apparently heavy rain, are suddenly being viewed as well...pieces of s#!* instead of rather different games that break out of the monotony we usually get.
Just because it's different doesn't mean it's good. These cinematic games could have been great, treading the fine line between games and movies. But their main point is the story, and if that is bad, then the whole game is bad. Honestly, until we get actually good writers in the industry, devs should just make games with good gameplay, and leave the story in a secondary plane. Most games (specially recent games) that have been praised for their story, I've personally found them at the level of fanfics, or worse.


OT: for once, I agree with Grey. I found that Heavy Rain was a very mediocre story; B:TS was just terrible, in many ways.
 

LazyAza

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May 28, 2008
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I've been watching Matt n Pat from Two Best Friends Play along with their friend Woolie play through the entire game and its been so good. Just constantly mocking the game and being angry at its stupidity and then the utter amazement when it seems to do something well and almost instantly fucks it up a moment later. David Cage just can't write or direct a proper story at all and so many of that games scenes are cringe-worthy bad.
 

Zipa

batlh bIHeghjaj.
Dec 19, 2010
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I watched Jesse Cox's playthrough of this and holy balls the writing is terrible. It is almost George Lucas terrible.

David needs to focus less on emoshuns and more on writing a good narrative.
 

Boogie Knight

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Oct 17, 2011
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I thought David Cage was ripping off Firestarter, but I suppose Carrie makes more sense in light of the remake which made the title character an up and coming Sith Lord.

Yes, I liked Heavy Rain, still kinda do. However, as a game it doesn't really work, but that's okay since it's all about telling a story interactiv- but the story has plot holes you could fly a stealth bomber through. It's almost Mass Effect-like how the reporter making it to where the boy is hidden leads to the shifty cop finding out where the dad is in the finale.
 

Maphysto

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Dec 11, 2010
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wAriot said:
Honestly, until we get actually good writers in the industry, devs should just make games with good gameplay, and leave the story in a secondary plane. Most games (specially recent games) that have been praised for their story, I've personally found them at the level of fanfics, or worse.
This post will be a bit of a derail, but I feel it's an important one; namely, to point out the difference between story and storytelling.

A mediocre or even outright bad story can sometimes be saved if it's presented in a fresh or engaging way. I think this is where video games really have a chance to shine, as they can involve the player in the story in ways that a book, movie or tv show simply can't.

A good example of this would be Bastion. The plot is very simple: an undisclosed disaster hits a nation, killing nearly everyone, and the player character must hack and slash his way through what's left of the world so he and the other survivors can find a better life. Hardly Pulitzer material, obviously, but it's the way the story is presented, through constant narration of the player's actions and surroundings, that make it memorable. Another good example is Shadow of the Colossus' minimalistic style of exposition, where it simply shows a brief cutscene at the beginning of the game explaining what the protagonist's motivation is, and leaves the rest for the player to deduce or imagine on his own.

To bring this back on topic, Cage's works are a prime example of games which fail to provide either new or refreshing stories, or engaging storytelling. His writing style could best be described as "David Cage goes through his DVD collection and picks a few to be derivative of", and the presentation is essentially just a long cutscene that the player occasionally has to press buttons in.

So, while I feel that Cage's goals and hopes for the videogame industry are noble, he's done more to set the industry back than move it forward. Couple that with his arrogance and he becomes pretty much anathema to games in my eyes.
 

Darth_Payn

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wAriot said:
Arslan Aladeen said:
I think it might be one of those cases where it's hard to separate the artist from the art. David Cage generally acts like he's the savior of storytelling in games and usually sounds like he hates the medium.
Sadly, he isn't the only one. Ever heard of Jennifer Hepler?
That name sort of sounds familiar. What's she worked on that I would know?

OT: Brilliant strip today, guys! And Erin in the fancy gown? Nice. More please.
 

stickmangrit

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May 30, 2008
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MrBaskerville said:
Pyrian said:
MrBaskerville said:
Hack writing = the pinnacle of videogame storytelling. :p
Well, comedies are the pinnacle of videogame storytelling. Other than, say, Portal, it's kind of a wasteland out there.
I agree that it's a wasteland, but i'd probably say Yakuza instead of Portal and i'd mention a couple of point'n click adventures (Broken Sword among others) but aside from that, it's pretty depressing.
i'd definitely add SpecOps: The Line to that list, as it genuinely accomplishes what Beyond seems to be failing so spectacularly to.
 

The Great JT

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Oct 6, 2008
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Mr. Cage, the only emotion you've inspired from me is apathy. Give yourself a round of applause and then go sit in the corner.
 

scorptatious

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May 14, 2009
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Pyrian said:
MrBaskerville said:
Hack writing = the pinnacle of videogame storytelling. :p
Well, comedies are the pinnacle of videogame storytelling. Other than, say, Portal, it's kind of a wasteland out there.
I don't know, while I do agree that most games don't have stellar writing, I still think there are plenty of games that have pretty decent writing. Of course, that all comes down to subjectivity for the most part I suppose. What appeals to me in a story might not appeal to you.

That being said, from what I've seen in BTS so far via Two Best Friends, the writing and characterization are pretty bad.
 

Mr Companion

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Jul 27, 2009
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Ruisu said:
So the game is written like shit. Don't really see what's so "hateable" about it.

But then again, I'm the kind of person that never hates anything in general entertainment.
Have you seen the whole story? Here are examples of things that all occupy the same game at once.

Cartoonishly humble homeless people
James Bond style Evil underwater Chinese ghost doom base
Cliched teenage angst complete with goth/punk look
Multiple attempted rape scenes
Delivering a baby
Native American demon and rituals
Getting shot while possessed hurts except all the times it doesn't
Dating
Ellen Page dressed in a schoolgirl outfit listed as "sexy" (David Cage DX)
Multiple creepy shower scenes (Oh David DX)
A gang of people who film themselves beating up homeless people for youtube???
Evil government conspiracy
Sequil bait ending

The game is also choc a bloc with messy storytelling and contradictions.
 

Foolery

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Jun 5, 2013
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What I don't get is why doesn't David Cage just use a game engine to make a movie. Just a movie. Not a game. Just a piece of cinema. That would make more sense to me.
 

caleb451

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Nov 19, 2010
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In almost every thread about Cage/Quantic Dream, I've never seen anyone mention Omikron: The Nomad Soul, their first title. I haven't finished it myself, but I think it's closer to an actual "game" than any of their later releases. Sure it's still got the tank driving controls, but the story is mostly kinda neat. Plus, it's got David Bowie.
 

Cmdr Keen

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Nov 1, 2013
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You blew your wad on the first panel. You could have removed the last two and the joke would have remained the same.

Awful, David Cage level storytelling right here. Is this what passes for a punchline now?
 

Dalisclock

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T said:
Fahrenheit was roughly one part brilliance to two parts nonsense
Wait, what are you using to measure that? I counted one part brilliance to ninety-nine parts nonsense.
Strangely enough, that's also the best way to describe gravity's rainbow. Though GR also involves all the scenes being in random order to boot.

There's the feeling in both that there's something really interesting going on. Too bad you can't figure out what it is.
 

Sheo_Dagana

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Aug 12, 2009
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Yep... this game is really silly. It's packed full of emotions all right - even though most of it is limited to crying and frustration - but there is nothing to the characters. You can throw all the emotion you want at me, but if I don't give a damn about the characters all that 'emotion' is just noise. Jodie has absolutely no personality outside of being an angry, sobbing mess, and the irony of this is that the entire game is a story about this one character. A wide miss.

The other characters weren't much to look at either. Dawkins was far less interesting than he could have been, Cole was equally boring, and the homeless were as stereotypical as they come. Ryan is probably the character that gets the most (read: any) development, which really isn't saying much.

I don't think that this game is terrible, aside from it's clunky controls and being visually buggy, I just feel like Quantic Dream completely missed the point behind the story that they themselves were trying to make.

I'll say this; the Navajo section was actually pretty cool to me. I would have liked the game a whole lot better if there had been more sections like that one.