Michael Pachter Predicts Wii U Failure

MrHide-Patten

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It will earn Nintendo enough profit to buy Africa I predict, because I oh so want it to fail. Nintendo need a good kick up the butt. They've got the cash to invest in something different for games, but they blow it all on developing Consoles with Gimmicks labeled as innovation.

I never get what I want. I sort of Envy peoples blind faith is such horseshit.
 

Gatx

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medv4380 said:
The guy has no cred on this issue. He was overly critical of the Wii when it came out so it's no surprise he's critical of the Wii U. Now if he was an analyst who has a track record of getting market predictions correct then what he says would matter. I'd get a better view of what it would do if I asked a 100 people randomly how many units they think the Wii U will sell in its first week.
Well wasn't the Wii's success because of how it caught on with "casual" and non-gamers? The Wii U isn't targeting audience though, it's going for the hardcore, but of course the general hardcore gamers already have PS3s and 360s at this point, so yeah.

And while Pachter's predictions aren't always or even usually correct, at least he's still knowledgeable and experienced enough to make educated forecasts from a financial standpoint.
 

Overusedname

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Lunar Templar said:
o.o?

who is this idiot and why should i care what he says?
I could explain to you his origins, but honestly, it's not going to answer the second part of your question.

He has no credentials in this industry and has never made a correct economic prediction.
 

ZippyDSMlee

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Trishbot said:
ZippyDSMlee said:
WII U dose not play GC games.
No, but it plays Wii games.
At least. I would be much happier with the WIIU if it did GC games, in HD, oh well at least the emulator works for the most part.


Sadly I am the pessimistic/half empty type I just do not see the good in the WIIU unlike the WII which I highly supported, least till the industry started not supporting it properly..
 

SenseOfTumour

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All I could think after reading 'Michael Pachter' was...

'Can I buy shares in Nintendo before the Wii U launches?'

I'm assuming someone pays this guy to spew out nonsensical drivel at seemingly random moments?

I mean hell, a magic 8 ball would get it right SOME of the time just out of basic probability.

I predict all three consoles will do quite well, there, I called it!
 

rob_simple

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People still seem to be under the illusion that the Wii was a success. In terms of sales, yes, but as far as gaming goes everyone I know stopped playing it after a couple of months and from what I've read on forums (mainly this one) most people now only use it for the VC or to play Gamecube games.

Do we have a price on the WiiU yet, by the way? Because I honestly don't see anyone other than the aforementioned Nintendo fanboys forking out large sums for a controller the main benefits of which are only accessed when playing with other people.

The Wii was new and exciting with a low price tag, which is the only reason it attracted a new customer base; that same customer base will have little to no renewed interest in a similarly shallow gimmick box.
 

Casual Shinji

Should've gone before we left.
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Whether it's going to fail or not is anyone's guess, but Pachter is right about the Wii U being a solution that searches for a problem. It's adding functionality and innovation where none is needed at all, and which will only end up creating a disjointed gaming experience.
 

medv4380

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Gatx said:
medv4380 said:
The guy has no cred on this issue. He was overly critical of the Wii when it came out so it's no surprise he's critical of the Wii U. Now if he was an analyst who has a track record of getting market predictions correct then what he says would matter. I'd get a better view of what it would do if I asked a 100 people randomly how many units they think the Wii U will sell in its first week.
Well wasn't the Wii's success because of how it caught on with "casual" and non-gamers? The Wii U isn't targeting audience though, it's going for the hardcore, but of course the general hardcore gamers already have PS3s and 360s at this point, so yeah.

And while Pachter's predictions aren't always or even usually correct, at least he's still knowledgeable and experienced enough to make educated forecasts from a financial standpoint.
Hard Core gamers also already have had a PS2, PS, NES, SNES, N64, GC, Genesis, 32x, Saturn, and it didn't stop them from buying the next console. So owning a PS3 or a 360 won't be much of a factor in choosing or not choosing the next console.

The "Hyper" success of the Wii is almost certainly attributed to Casual Gamers. By "Hyper" I mean the 30 to 40 million units that have sold far above the PS3 and 360 market. That still leaves them with nearly 50 to 60 million hard core gamers who bought the system. This assumes that the 22 million who bought the Wii Fit were all "Casual" gamers, and many of you here know that that wasn't the case.

The problem with saying that the success of the Wii was based on Casual gamers is that it is always backed up with anecdotal evidence. Real evidence would be based on age analysis and game sale analysis. You'd ask gamers of all system what they considered themselves to be "casual" or "hard core" and work out the percentages and prove who had more and by how much.

All Michael Pachter did was prove that he isn't an actual analyst. He should have facts and data to back up his claim. Otherwise he's no better then a random person giving you a single guess on what will happen. But that's the "expert analyst" market for you. A bunch of confidence men running around pushing their opinions as facts about the future when they've really done nothing to show why their opinions should have weight.
 

AzrealMaximillion

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CriticKitten said:
AzrealMaximillion said:
-insert overused counterarguments here-
You keep saying you're "beating" my argument, yet here's the core problem:

The only way to PROVE that you're correct will be if the console doesn't sell. Which can't be proven.

So you're wasting your time trying to "prove" that it will fail when you have no actual way of knowing. Sorry to let you down, but no, I'm not going to bother going through your tired, overused arguments point by point. That got boring around the fifteen time I did it in the past. Not to mention you're being a rude little child, to boot. So, fine. You can have your little "victory" here, since winning the argument was more important than having a civil discussion.

But don't worry, I'll add you to my list of "doubters". And then in a few years, when the console's had time to sell, we'll resume this little discussion. And hey, if you end up being right, you can look forward to my apology a few years from now. Or you can look forward to looking like a complete arse.

Either way, the difference between you and me is that I recognize that this argument isn't ever going to go anywhere. There is no way to "prove" it will/won't sell. You can keep arguing with yourself if it humors you, darling, but I won't. I look forward to your heartfelt apology a few years from now, assuming you aren't banned by then of course.
Sadly, you proved nothing for your argument and decided to back out. You got called out and didn't like it. Sorry you felt that way, I thought that a healthy debate was an opportunity for both sides to learn. Instead I found that you, like a lot of other who talk out of their ass on these forums, decided to do nothing but bring up more sidetracking points to argue (horribly) instead of actually defending your original point. I hope you backing out of the debate makes you happy. Try not to argue with people if you're not going to bother to check your own facts and defend your points intelligently without bowing out. Good day to you.
 

AzrealMaximillion

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medv4380 said:
AzrealMaximillion said:
I'll be honest, I did pull the 5 max games out of my ass as an estimate, but for you to combat me with a number that has no link attached to it is hilarious.

You're also forgoing a couple of factors.
1. Your attach rate does not differentiate the difference between core Wii gamers and non core Wii gamers, so by default your attach rate for casual gamers on the Wii is inflated.
2.Most casual gamers do not buy 3rd party games on the Wii, too many of them flopped because of the casual market for anyone to say otherwise. With the Wii's hardware sales even games like Zack and Wiki as well as MadWorld should have sold enough to profit, but they didn't because Nintendo marketed vigorously towards casual gamers. Hell, the PS2's sales numbers make it the KING console of sleeper hits. A lot of sleeper hit games on the PS2 sold enough to garner the Greatest Hits tag just because of how many units the PS2 sold. Case and point, Shadow of the Colossus and God Hand both sold well and in today's gaming market would have no business doing so on the Wii.
Just go to VGChartz.com and look it up, and critizing Nintendo on 3rd party support because "Casual" gamers don't buy 3rd party games is just bull. Nintendo has had more then just "issues" with 3rd parties since the N64. 3rd party titles don't sell on any Nintendo Consoles because they don't work hard to get them First or Exclusive. Your argument against them with 3rd parties isn't a Wii issue but a Nintendo Issue.
"Look it up on VGChartz"...You mean the same VGChartz that regularly has to fix their info because the NPD Group's numbers prove them wrong? Yeah, no thanks. And yes Nintendo has had issues with 3rd party support for a while, difference is this time the Wii was marketed to casuals specifically. The N64 wasn't marketed this way and neither was the Gamecube. And 3rd party publishers did try damn hard to sell their games on the Wii. I remember seeing a large amount of ads on TV, online, and at the movies for MadWorld and House of the Dead Overkill. Both games flopped regardless. Nintendo needs to back off of the casual market targeting because a lot of 3rd party games on the Wii flopped due to it. It's not just a Nintendo problem. This was a Wii marketing issue. At least 3rd part games had a chance at selling on the N64 and Gamecube
 

Aiddon_v1legacy

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-gets out a bucket of popcorn- It's always fun seeing Escapist idiots twist themselves into pretzels just so they can disguise their bashing of Nintendo as legitimate arguments.

Anyway, it's just Pachter sulking again. He comes off as bitter whenever he mentions Nintendo as they proved that something different in the industry can WORK and even be a runaway success. Also, it's hard to take him seriously when he blatantly insults Nintendo fans by saying they'd buy a cardboard box as long it plays Mario. Real classy Mike.
 

medv4380

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Feb 26, 2010
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AzrealMaximillion said:
"Look it up on VGChartz"...You mean the same VGChartz that regularly has to fix their info because the NPD Group's numbers prove them wrong? Yeah, no thanks. And yes Nintendo has had issues with 3rd party support for a while, difference is this time the Wii was marketed to casuals specifically. The N64 wasn't marketed this way and neither was the Gamecube. And 3rd party publishers did try damn hard to sell their games on the Wii. I remember seeing a large amount of ads on TV, online, and at the movies for MadWorld and House of the Dead Overkill. Both games flopped regardless. Nintendo needs to back off of the casual market targeting because a lot of 3rd party games on the Wii flopped due to it. It's not just a Nintendo problem. This was a Wii marketing issue. At least 3rd part games had a chance at selling on the N64 and Gamecube
You'd actually try to use two Sega titles to prove your point? HotD Overkill was a bad game and didn't sell well on the PS3. Try a 3rd party developer like BioWare or Bathesda. Oh wait they don't even try to make games for the Wii, but wait BioWare is at least putting a game on the Wii U. You could have tried using a game like Skylanders but that would have proved you wrong. The vast majority of 3rd party titles on the Wii are not triple A titles. Mostly due to Nintendos choice to not go the HD route until the Wii U, and that they have been a bit abusive to 3rd parties in the past.
 

Overusedname

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rob_simple said:
People still seem to be under the illusion that the Wii was a success. In terms of sales, yes, but as far as gaming goes everyone I know stopped playing it after a couple of months and from what I've read on forums (mainly this one) most people now only use it for the VC or to play Gamecube games.

Do we have a price on the WiiU yet, by the way? Because I honestly don't see anyone other than the aforementioned Nintendo fanboys forking out large sums for a controller the main benefits of which are only accessed when playing with other people.

The Wii was new and exciting with a low price tag, which is the only reason it attracted a new customer base; that same customer base will have little to no renewed interest in a similarly shallow gimmick box.
I can completely see where your coming from, and I think a lot of people did just abandon it but...well, I didn't, and I know a few others who didn't. It didn't market it's ultimate successes enough.

Here's my Wii library (off the top of my head, anyway)

Smash bros. Brawl
No More Heroes
No More Heroes 2
Tales of Symphonia 2: Dawn of the New World (I played the whole thing on Co-op)
Metroid Prime 3 Corruption
Zelda: Twilight Princess
Super Mario Galaxy
Super Mario Galaxy 2
Fire Emblem Radiant Dawn
Donkey Kong Country Returns
New Super Mario Bros. Wii
Epic Mickey
Xenoblade
Cave Story

Now, I don't know how many games per console the average person has, but I loved every single one of those games. And that seems like a long list to me. And I missed out on several games I wanted to try for the console just for financial reasons.

I DO agree that the Wii lost in terms of software sales, I'm just saying it didn't deserve to. Maybe Wii U will have better Marketing all around, Cause there were a lot of great, somewhat obscure titles for Wii that got pushed to the wayside.
 

Strazdas

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A industry analsy that didnt go all crazy when it comes to the dead horse that is nintendo? this is news. seriuosly, when did we see anything good come out of nintendo? 10 years ago? This is going to be like the Vita, but with blind fanbase.

Now, I don't know how many games per console the average person has
according to Raptr: 7 for PC, 18 for PS3 and 50 for Xbox. Now this takes into account people with 0s (dont have the system) so the actual numbers are actually higher. Also the PC numbers are low because obviuosly most PC gamers got steam, and it already provides the services Raptr does so little of them use it.
 

-|-

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Overusedname said:
Now, I don't know how many games per console the average person has, but I loved every single one of those games. And that seems like a long list to me. And I missed out on several games I wanted to try for the console just for financial reasons.

I DO agree that the Wii lost in terms of software sales, I'm just saying it didn't deserve to. Maybe Wii U will have better Marketing all around, Cause there were a lot of great, somewhat obscure titles for Wii that got pushed to the wayside.
I'm probably not typical, but I'm the kind of gamer that publishers and developers love. I buy a quite a few games; basically anything that looks half decent in a genre I like; mostly pre-ordered from amazon so I don't have to drive to the shops. Last year was a good year, so I probably bought about 20 or so - I'm not indiscriminate, but I've got a reasonably well paid job so can afford to buy any game I want when it comes out.

I used to mainly prefer Nintendo simply because of the first party games; but by about mid 2008 there just weren't enough of them for me to play; so I got myself a PS3 and on the shelf the wii went. I know this is purely anecdotal, but I've heard similar tales from enough people to believe that this effect is significant in the console market. I can't prove this obviously - but that's why I think Mr Pacther is right in this case.