Modern Warfare 3 Ditches Commando Perk

[Lev The Red]

something that bothered me about cod was people's outright hatred of juggernaut and stopping power. i will admit that they, like commando pro, need tradeoffs.

juggernaut: ok, you can take more dammage before dying, but you take movement and mobility penalties as a result of your extra armor. maybe you even cary less reserve ammo.

stopping power: your bullets deal more dammage, but you have fewer of them, they're less accurate, don't penetrate all the way through walls or people, and you cant combine it with deep impact.

the key to making a good but fair perk is adding tradeoffs. that's is the problem with perks like commando, juggernaut, stopping power, and second chance; there was too much reward without any penalties.

 

[CorinthianRed]

I like the sound of that. I hate how I'd shoot someone down, think they died carry on running but by the time ive turned back at them to finish them off in their stupid last chance position they've gunned me down completely. Frustrating to say the least.

You're idea sounds good, put it to IW, if that is they even include the perk. It wasn't in MW2 or MW1 was it?
[/quote][/quote]

No, but last stand was in it. Final Stand too, but it was a deathstreak, so it feels a little more reasonable than last stand.
Though to be honest, I've never had a problem with last stand.
The only problem really in modern warfare 2 & black ops is balance.
MW2 had danger close, it was lame. Black ops has Flak Jacket, I dislike it too.
Those two perks should only exist if the other one is there to balance it out. Though it would just be easier to leave both out all together and make explosives more effective than in Black ops, but less effective than in MW2.

 

[CorinthianRed]

I'd be happy if they just removed second chance because it's overused and it only helps the bad players get an extra chance to kill, good players can stay on their feet. Maybe also not make your player run like an asthmatic, I can see marathon letting your character run non-stop but when it's not equipped you can only run ten feet before your character takes what I assume to be a smoke break.

I don't think second chance should be taken out, but it needs to be severely tweaked.
Lets say I shoot someone using second chance, what should happen is that he drops and I get points for a kill.
And this is how second chance would kick in, it would work like it does for slowly dying enemies in campaign. You know how they look dead for a moment and take a good long time to pull out their pistol. But by the time they do pull out their pistol, I am already somewhere else long gone w/ my 100 points for a 'kill' I am certain I got and the second chance user would need a team mate to get him up.
Second Chance shouldn't be a chance at stupid instantaneous revenge, but a second chance to get back into the game for the incredibly unlucky, and the ridiculously stupid.
Also, putting someone into second chance should count towards a kill streak...Although when I think about it, I see how that could be used for boosting.

No, but last stand was in COD4 & MW2. Final Stand saw light in MW2, but it was a deathstreak, so it feels a little more reasonable than last stand, but do hate final stand more than I hate last stand and second chance combined. >.<
I like the sound of that. I hate how I'd shoot someone down, think they died carry on running but by the time ive turned back at them to finish them off in their stupid last chance position they've gunned me down completely. Frustrating to say the least.

You're idea sounds good, put it to IW, if that is they even include the perk. It wasn't in MW2 or MW1 was it?
Remove it from free-for-all. I think that covers it, tell me if I missed anything obvious.

No, but last stand was in COD4 & MW2. Final Stand saw light in MW2, but it was a deathstreak, so it feels a little more reasonable than last stand, but do hate final stand more than I hate last stand and second chance combined. >.<
I like the sound of that. I hate how I'd shoot someone down, think they died carry on running but by the time ive turned back at them to finish them off in their stupid last chance position they've gunned me down completely. Frustrating to say the least.

 

[Gunner 51]

Because barebones sucks, not enough people play that mode to make match making work properly for me, and none of my friends play it because they'd rather sit back and camp (idiots). Also, you have to unlock the mode, so when you're trying to prestige as fast as possible, you generally don't care about the modes that only unlock after a while. In addition barebones doesn't give the most points and experience. So I'm sitting around trying to figure out the max points per hours played and barebones doesn't fit.

People like the perks system, it adds variety. It just sucks when the devs can't seem to balance them properly.

At Longboardfan: I think this can be remedied by allocating more XP per kill/win on Barebones. After all, this will be a suitable award for showing raw skill and not relying upon kill-streaks and perks. When the Prestige-rs catch on, this will hopefully solve your problem with not enough people playing.

At MiracleOfSound: I'll admit, I do like the perks because like you said - they add variety to the game. But balancing them all to be equal, that's going to take a long time. But then again, I don't think the developers will be able to please everyone no matter what they do.

 

[MASTACHIEFPWN]

They should only give you one perk-
Sprint faster, or sprint infinantly.

 

[X10J]

Nooooooo!!! Now I'll be falling to my death every 90 seconds!

 

[gmaverick019_v1legacy]

Get rid of any permutations of quick scoping and I'm a relatively happy man. Can't even begin to properly express how much hate is reserved for that.

Also noob-tubing.

noob tubing just needs to be reworked..it should be more of a "support" add-on, not a splash damage instant kill that is faster and better than any grenade you can carry.

they either need to make it so you have to "charge" it for a second, with it wobbling around so it isn't 100% accurate, or decrease it's damage significantly.

OT: this is a major plus...however i'm still not sold on it, come back to me when its 20-30 dollars, and then we'll talk (Which wont be for nearly 5-6 years seeing as how expensive the first two modern warfares still are on steam)

 

[CaptainKoala]

I dunno, these would-be ninjas sound hilarious. Almost enough to make me want to play.

It was horrible The 'ninjas' are like 30% faster than you, and they can lunge like 10 feet just to knife you, even if you've shot him first.

 

[MetallicaRulez0]

Now we just need them to remove Grenade Launchers and Last Stand and this game might not suck scrotum.

We already know Sniping will be improved from Black Ops, since Infinity Ward and Robert Bowling in particular aren't complete asshats like Treyarch. They understand that MW2 sniping was fun and rewarded skill. I await the horde of idiots yelling about "quickscoping is a glitch hur derp!".

 

[Hatchet90]

If they got rid of grenades, or maybe put them in a three kill streak perk. I think the games would be 100 times better.

 

[Ruedyn]

Now just need to make sure juggernaught, ghost pro and second chance dont make a reappearance.

I've seen some of your posts and I just want to know, where the hell is your avatar from?

OT: why did MW3 choose to ditch this one first, when there are many, many, MANY more people pissed at second chance?

 

[Bad Jim]

Flak Jacket - nerf people can take rpgs at direct O.O.

A good way to balance the game is to have counters. Flack Jacket counters noobtubing. It is balanced by the fact that it is less useful if your opponents are not noobtubing. This is a good way of keeping the noobtube in check because it doesn't prevent people having fun with it.

What the game needs is more perks that counter cheap strategies eg:

Knife jacket
Temporary invincibility on spawning.
A shot can only kill you if you are not a full health. (close quarter snipers)

If one particular strategy really grinds your gears you can then do something about it.

 

[LeQuack_Is_Back]

Ok, a little late for my tastes, but ok.
I still want to see the balance situation on the actual guns before I buy though. And the last few games have screwed that up, to varying degrees. Honestly, some of these just seem like a matter of "Didn't think about it" ->
"Let's make an SMG that's a 3-hit kill at all ranges! (making LMG's and AR's obsolete)"

"Let's give all the guns the same damn fire rate and damage, except for 2, then act surprised when everybody only uses them!"

"Let's make an SMG so accurate that you can snipe with rapid fire on it!"

Granted, 2 of those have been addressed, because Treyarch does try to fix things.

I don't know why the bother to put so many guns in the game.... then make roughly half of them inferior to other guns.

 

[Doctor Glocktor]

Finally. What in the hell made them think that it was a good idea in the first place?

 

[spartan231490]

Now just need to make sure juggernaught, ghost pro and second chance dont make a reappearance.

There's nothing wrong with ghost or commando. Second chance and Juggernaut though, really should never have been even tried. Really, what about that even resembles balance. But second chance probably will make the cut, just like commando doesn't and for the same reason, a design team that caves to whining fans just because the fans who like the perk aren't as vocal.

Running classes weren't OP in MW2. If you don't believe me, run a marathon lightweight class with dual rangers. It's the same thing but you get 4 shots not one. I can't begin to understand why people have such problem with tac-knifers. Yeah it's annoying, but it's one of the easiest things to counter, just equip a shotgun. It's a lot easier to counter than say, nube-tubers and danger close. Or quick-scoping. Or a marathon, light-weight with the UMP. Or akimbo P90s.

 

[Doctor Glocktor]

Now just need to make sure juggernaught, ghost pro and second chance dont make a reappearance.

There's nothing wrong with ghost or commando. Second chance and Juggernaut though, really should never have been even tried. Really, what about that even resembles balance. But second chance probably will make the cut, just like commando doesn't and for the same reason, a design team that caves to whining fans just because the fans who like the perk aren't as vocal.

If theres so much of an outcry from the fans that they want it removed, that means the devs fucked up, not the players.

 

[spartan231490]

So let me get this straight. People found something that worked for them and then whingers got it removed. It killed me so nerf it. I have nothing but utter disdain.


Captcha would agree that this view is also "Hobson's choice"

Um, you do realize that commando gave you invincibility frames, in which you quite literally teleported towards other people, right?

It didn't make you invincible. I have never failed to kill someone trying to commando me with the shotgun, unless I fired off-target.

At Versuvius: you have now discovered how CoD fans work, what will you do next? No really, this is pretty much how cod fans work, if it kills them, it's OP, because they couldn't possibly have just been beaten, the other guy had to cheat.

I mean, I like cod games, they're a blast, but 90% of the time when the developers cave to the raving fans they make a stupid decision that further imbalances the game. Really, the only perk in MW2 or Black ops that i would count as OP would be second chance. Admittedly, Flak jacket pro was OP when I was playing black jacket, but that was supposed to be a mistake or something, so I'm not going to count that. Yet, despite this, everyone complains about scavanger, and hardline, and ghost, and SoH, and Hacker, ect. The thing I thought was hilarious, is that on the black ops forum you would see a thread about how OP ghost was because none of the other blue perks were any good, and then you would see a thread about how OP Hardline pro(a blue perk) was, and the same people were posting on both. Meanwhile, scavenger is actually the best blue perk in the game, it was hilarious to watch. and then the nerfed hardline pro, making it completely worthless. Further imbalancing the game. and they never touched second chance. Ah, that game just pisses me off. It had so much potential, and every single patch just made it worse and worse and worse.

sorry for the rant.

 

[spartan231490]

Now just need to make sure juggernaught, ghost pro and second chance dont make a reappearance.

There's nothing wrong with ghost or commando. Second chance and Juggernaut though, really should never have been even tried. Really, what about that even resembles balance. But second chance probably will make the cut, just like commando doesn't and for the same reason, a design team that caves to whining fans just because the fans who like the perk aren't as vocal.

If theres so much of an outcry from the fans that they want it removed, that means the devs fucked up, not the players.

sure it does. and if everybody thinks slavery is ok, they're right too. Really, that's the worst argument I've ever heard. The old adage: "If everyone jumped off a bridge, would you do it?" is pretty accurate in this case. The developers have been educated and experienced in the field, and spent months developing the game. Just because the fans don't like it, doesn't mean that they are right about it being OP, or unbalanced, it just means that they don't like it. and just because they don't like it, doesn't mean that they disliked the effect it had on the game. People may dislike being tac-knifed in MW2, but I'm pretty sure that no one wants MW3 to be a game where every single person uses the same weapons, the same perks, and the same playstyle. It would get pretty fucking boring really quick.

Now, I'm not saying that devs never make a mistake, I'm just saying that level of outcry has nothing to do with the accuracy of the statement. At one point, every person on earth thought it was flat, that didn't make any of them right. If the devs made a mistake, it rarely has anything to do with the number of players complaining about it. In MW2, there was a rock glitch on Afghan that was fixed literally the day after me and most of my friends found out about it. and we played that game every single day, for hours. If the devs are wrong, they usually notice it very soon after it's pointed out. If they look at it, and decide that it's balanced, than no matter how many gamers complain, it's a pretty good chance that it's not OP.

However, if they cave just to make those gamers happy anyway, even though they are wrong, they diminish the experience, because the original state(in this case the presence of a perk) was put in the game for a reason. If they take it out just because gamers are whining and for no other reason, than that need remains unfulfilled, diminishing the experience.

 

[Calcium]

What always confounds me is how people are quick to complain about Juggernaut and yet have no complaint for Stopping Power. I get the impression they're just upset there was a perk to counter their one-shot/burst kill guns.

I feel like one of the few people to be annoyed that they removed it for Modern Warfare 2. Either have both extra damage or extra health perks or have neither.

Anyway, they can keep Commando and Stopping Power for all I care as long as they give me a Thumper that shoots flash grenades.

 

[Doctor Glocktor]

Now just need to make sure juggernaught, ghost pro and second chance dont make a reappearance.

There's nothing wrong with ghost or commando. Second chance and Juggernaut though, really should never have been even tried. Really, what about that even resembles balance. But second chance probably will make the cut, just like commando doesn't and for the same reason, a design team that caves to whining fans just because the fans who like the perk aren't as vocal.

If theres so much of an outcry from the fans that they want it removed, that means the devs fucked up, not the players.

sure it does. and if everybody thinks slavery is ok, they're right too. Really, that's the worst argument I've ever heard. The old adage: "If everyone jumped off a bridge, would you do it?" is pretty accurate in this case. The developers have been educated and experienced in the field, and spent months developing the game. Just because the fans don't like it, doesn't mean that they are right about it being OP, or unbalanced, it just means that they don't like it. and just because they don't like it, doesn't mean that they disliked the effect it had on the game. People may dislike being tac-knifed in MW2, but I'm pretty sure that no one wants MW3 to be a game where every single person uses the same weapons, the same perks, and the same playstyle. It would get pretty fucking boring really quick.

Now, I'm not saying that devs never make a mistake, I'm just saying that level of outcry has nothing to do with the accuracy of the statement. At one point, every person on earth thought it was flat, that didn't make any of them right. If the devs made a mistake, it rarely has anything to do with the number of players complaining about it. In MW2, there was a rock glitch on Afghan that was fixed literally the day after me and most of my friends found out about it. and we played that game every single day, for hours. If the devs are wrong, they usually notice it very soon after it's pointed out. If they look at it, and decide that it's balanced, than no matter how many gamers complain, it's a pretty good chance that it's not OP.

However, if they cave just to make those gamers happy anyway, even though they are wrong, they diminish the experience, because the original state(in this case the presence of a perk) was put in the game for a reason. If they take it out just because gamers are whining and for no other reason, than that need remains unfulfilled, diminishing the experience.

First off, did you actually just fucking compare slavery to removing an overpowered ability in a video game? Wow. Seriously.

And two, if the devs are so sure that the perk was a good idea, why aren't they sticking to their guns and keeping commando in the game? It was there throughout all of MW2. Why not keep it now, as it 'enriches' (LOL) the experience?

Besides, didn't one of the lead devs just say he welcomes negative feedback? Well he got it, and reacted to it.

And people are already using the same weapons, the same perks, all that shit. Have you even played CoD?