Musical Ignorance

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aww yea

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macacos2 said:
aww yea said:
macacos2 said:
SystemUpdate said:
electronia..
I'm sorry if you think a bunch of random bass and bleeps made by a computer software operated by some kid is actual music.
Its as much music as anything else.
It isn't. Real music is made by composers who actually spend years of their lives studying music itself at an Academy and mastering the instruments required to reproduce the sound of perfection along with criativity.

Remember the time people actually spent months perfecting only the lyrics for their songs, and not just a couple hours?

I really doubt you do because you probably weren't even born yet.
And you think electronic producers dont? Here's a little information, most good electronic artists play multiple instruments, know music theory to beyond degree level, have mastered the programs required to produce and master a track (which all songs need anyway but most artists dont do themselves because they dont have the expertise) and often create custom equipment to use live. Are you aware that producers spend months creating their songs? The good ones at least. There are shit and lazy artists in all genres.

Your favourite song could've been entirely produced, no real instruments, all on computer and you probably wouldn't even notice (this happens more than you would expect) It's no less music. Bands often have reasons to do so, the members still make the melodies and whatnot, but for whatever reason they could use production programs to make. Meshuggah used programed their drums for one album because of distance. The man can still play it, is that any less valid?

Does adding effects make music less valid? More scope to play with tonality and make melodies you might not of been able to play yourself?
 

SendMeNoodz84

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macacos2 said:
SystemUpdate said:
electronia..
I'm sorry if you think a bunch of random bass and bleeps made by a computer software operated by some kid is actual music.

Thanks for your heads up, I'll ask my bf to bash his dick against a table so I can record the sound it makes, remix it a bit and call it a track

Oh, and if you don't like it you're closed minded.
Music is the purposeful arrangement of sound and silence, therefore as dissonant as a song may be, it's still music. If you deny that it doesn't make you closed minded, it makes you ignorant.
 

NotSoNimble

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Prophetic Heresy said:
HardkorSB said:
It's a funny situation really:
The gamers on this site will immediately tell you that the media's portrait (or the general popular opinion) of a gamer is wrong every time you say anything bad about them (especially when it comes to the whole violence thing), telling the people to do some actual research instead just blindly believing what they've been told, yet they take a genre like rap and dismiss it because of what they see in the media.
How does that work?

Also:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iWa4UpajKTc
Nobody is as open-minded as they tell other people they are and the only people who are act like weirdos. Like this guy:

NotSoNimble said:
Prophetic Heresy said:
NotSoNimble said:
I will stop saying 'I don't like rap' when I hear rap I like.

I hear what you're saying. But I don't think I throw the words hate around that much.
But if you don't like rap, it's not like you're looking for things to prove yourself wrong.


Here is an example for you:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=125j6-Gt67k
Yeah, I don't find anything to like with what you linked. The monotone ramblings of a mush mouth do nothing for me.
I can give you credit for at least trying to listen to it, but it seems like you spent your time thinking up how you were going to badmouth the song instead of listening to it.
I spent my time listening to what was linked. I didn't like it, and stated why.
 

The Diabolical Biz

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Xhoyl said:
NotSoNimble said:
I will stop saying 'I don't like rap' when I hear rap I like.

I hear what you're saying. But I don't think I throw the words hate around that much.
Exactly. Not only that, but according to the definition of music from my music theory teacher, rap isn't music at all. In the sense that it's more like a poem with some kind of beat in the background. Except without the "poem" part, and just words as far as I've heard. Not trying to be a stick in the mud, but I have to say I agree with him. Someone wants to change my mind, show me a rap song that actually brings any sort of emotion to the table.
Try this:
OT: I agree entirely. It seems that some people here think that blanket statements only apply to stuff they like: 'All rap sucks, hey, HEY, don't try and make a point here. WHADDAYA MEAN YOU DON'T LIKE METAL?! You clearly haven't listened to any and know nothing about music.'

Yeah, flawed.

EDIT:
macacos2 said:
It isn't. Real music is made by composers who actually spend years of their lives studying music itself at an Academy and mastering the instruments required to reproduce the sound of perfection along with criativity.

Remember the time people actually spent months perfecting only the lyrics for their songs, and not just a couple hours?

I really doubt you do because you probably weren't even born yet.
Do you understand electronic music? You have to study for years to understand how to make anything near professional standard, and spend months equalising tracks, selecting and changing effects etc. I'm not going to argue that some artists throw out 5 minute produced garbage but a lot of people have their freakin' degree, and actually put a lot of work, similar to that of Classical composers (note here, I don't like electronica, but I can appreciate the hard work that goes into it - Classical Music and Hip-Hop are what I listen to the most), into their compositions. People never seem to remember that in the old days, 99.9% of what was out there was instantly forgettable garbage too.
 

Xhoyl

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kcjerith said:
Xhoyl said:
NotSoNimble said:
I will stop saying 'I don't like rap' when I hear rap I like.

I hear what you're saying. But I don't think I throw the words hate around that much.
Exactly. Not only that, but according to the definition of music from my music theory teacher, rap isn't music at all. In the sense that it's more like a poem with some kind of beat in the background. Except without the "poem" part, and just words as far as I've heard. Not trying to be a stick in the mud, but I have to say I agree with him. Someone wants to change my mind, show me a rap song that actually brings any sort of emotion to the table.
My I present Immortal Technique.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5pqiqrnZE44

If you don't like rap that is fine, your musical taste are you own. However, I think it is a bit myopic to claim that all rap lyrics lack emotion.
I didn't say all lacked it, just that I had not yet found any that didn't. Also, I don't find my emotion in lyrics, as I've mentioned in a previous post, I find it in melody and accompaniment. I like music to wash over me and take me to a place unlike the world around me. Lyrics just usually don't hit that sweet spot for me.
 

enzilewulf

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Jun 19, 2009
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Prophetic Heresy said:
HardkorSB said:
It's a funny situation really:
The gamers on this site will immediately tell you that the media's portrait (or the general popular opinion) of a gamer is wrong every time you say anything bad about them (especially when it comes to the whole violence thing), telling the people to do some actual research instead just blindly believing what they've been told, yet they take a genre like rap and dismiss it because of what they see in the media.
How does that work?

Also:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iWa4UpajKTc
Nobody is as open-minded as they tell other people they are and the only people who are act like weirdos. Like this guy:

NotSoNimble said:
Prophetic Heresy said:
NotSoNimble said:
I will stop saying 'I don't like rap' when I hear rap I like.

I hear what you're saying. But I don't think I throw the words hate around that much.
But if you don't like rap, it's not like you're looking for things to prove yourself wrong.


Here is an example for you:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=125j6-Gt67k
Yeah, I don't find anything to like with what you linked. The monotone ramblings of a mush mouth do nothing for me.
I can give you credit for at least trying to listen to it, but it seems like you spent your time thinking up how you were going to badmouth the song instead of listening to it.
I like this guy^ he isn't one of the hardcore rock snobs.
 

Guitarmasterx7

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Mar 16, 2009
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Have you ever considered that sometimes people dislike genres at least partially because of the lack of talent involved? I mean I'll admit there are probably exceptions (though I've never experienced any firsthand, so that's more obligatory than genuine) but at the end of the day, regardless of personal opinion, almost anyone can do this.
It takes legitimate talent to do even one part of this
 

Imperioratorex Caprae

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May 15, 2010
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I don't usually hate on genre's myself, I do give credit where credit is due. As a musician myself, I can't deny the talent of some artists even though I can't stand their music. What gets me is that people can be considered artists even though they:

A. don't write their own music
B. don't play an instrument
C. can't sing, but rather are autotuned by recording software
D. are just a stage performance and possibly even lip-synching live
E. steal beats/samples from other artists or outright rip off the melody and call it their own

(any of those or all of the above can be used when describing a LOT of pop musicians)

That crap bothers me to no end. Cookie cutter musical acts put out by major record labels or other corporations targeting a demographic (kids mostly) bothers me because it cheapens music and more or less skews kids view of what good music is.

EDIT: Also, if you're going to really give an example of good or talented rappers/hip hop artists, Outkast is a great example. Andre and BigBoi are both extremely musically talented individuals.

BTW, most of the music I listen to regularly is around the metal or grunge persuasion and Nine Inch Nails (I consider Trent Reznor to have his own genre)
 

dex-dex

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Oct 20, 2009
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well I despise country because I had to listen to it for eight hours straight every time I worked which was four days a week!
FOR TWO YEARS!!!!
and it was not even good to listen to. I felt like I was in the country and when I left the kitchen I thought I would see horses outside.

and I don't hate Justin Bieber. His music is just something I would not listen to.
 

teebeeohh

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my Problem with justin bieber is that i don't think he makes music because he likes making music, he does it to make money. Yes every musician has bills to pay but when somebody is obviously more interested in making money then making art or entertaining me it pisses me off.
 

teqrevisited

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I only disregard music if I think it sounds awful. That is only my opinion.

I know that something isn't inherently bad just because I don't like it, the problem is that in the majority of music-based arguments the people that rage over it think their own opinions are factual and will blindly defend to the death their divine points of view.
 

sergnb

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NotSoNimble said:
I will stop saying 'I don't like rap' when I hear rap I like.

I hear what you're saying. But I don't think I throw the words hate around that much.
Travel in time to the 80's and early 90's.
Listen to the current rap movement.
?????
PROFIT!
 

Cowabungaa

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TestECull said:
...You mean the guys that sung Californication?
Yeppers, they were pretty much nothing like the Peppers you hear today. A lot more funk influences and plenty of songs with rapping in it, songs like this one:

A defining characteristic is overuse of autotune, synthetic instruments, and lyrics that mean absolutely bloody nothing. A prime example is anything by Lady Gaga.
Pretty vague, seeing as for example R&B uses both of those things. Electro and club music as well, though "club" is pretty vague in it's own right. Over here at least, it's mostly music like this that gets the label "pop":
Not exactly like Lady Gaga hm, thankfully. Though dammit I love Poker Face...

I think I prefer your use of "Other". I wouldn't know what to label Adelle as except pop music.
 

Jasper Jeffs

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macacos2 said:
It isn't. Real music is made by composers who actually spend years of their lives studying music itself at an Academy and mastering the instruments required to reproduce the sound of perfection along with criativity.

Remember the time people actually spent months perfecting only the lyrics for their songs, and not just a couple hours?

I really doubt you do because you probably weren't even born yet.
I lol'd. Oh wait you're serious? That's both sad and amusing.

OT: There are tons of people on the Escapist that do exactly that, particularly with Hip Hop. It seems people like to express their distaste for rap, however expressing it only reveals their ignorance. People act like the genre of their choice doesn't have a shit mainstream representation as well, I'm not saying rap doesn't, mainstream rap sucks, but so does mainstream Rock or Metal. I chose not to judge genres by their mainstream representation because I'm not a fucking moron.
 

William MacKay

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Oct 26, 2010
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NotSoNimble said:
I will stop saying 'I don't like rap' when I hear rap I like.

I hear what you're saying. But I don't think I throw the words hate around that much.
listen to Biggie.

the only musical artists i will say i hate is Justin Bieber. not because i think he's a talentless piece of hell-crap but because people decided 'this is good, but autotune it a little.' and then like someone on a diet eating chocolate, they can handle a little bit... maybe a little bit more then ten minutes later theyre autotuning the pizza delivery guy over the doorbell-intercom. i think that Bieber could be good if he decided to sing about other stuff, more mature stuff and smash the autotuner.
 

Obsideo

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macacos2 said:
aww yea said:
macacos2 said:
SystemUpdate said:
electronia..
I'm sorry if you think a bunch of random bass and bleeps made by a computer software operated by some kid is actual music.
Its as much music as anything else.
It isn't. Real music is made by composers who actually spend years of their lives studying music itself at an Academy and mastering the instruments required to reproduce the sound of perfection along with criativity.

Remember the time people actually spent months perfecting only the lyrics for their songs, and not just a couple hours?

I really doubt you do because you probably weren't even born yet.

<youtube=UOuxTQpxawc>


He spent 300 hours on this track alone.

Also with electronica you have to work with every instrument in the song as well as mix/master it, which is a lot different from learning a song on, say, the guitar and then playing it in a studio.

I'm not saying that guitarists or non-electronic artists have no talent of course, that'd be stupid, but making this music isn't just hitting "record" and punching a keyboard.
 

HardkorSB

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Guitarmasterx7 said:
Have you ever considered that sometimes people dislike genres at least partially because of the lack of talent involved? I mean I'll admit there are probably exceptions (though I've never experienced any firsthand, so that's more obligatory than genuine) but at the end of the day, regardless of personal opinion, almost anyone can do this.
Really?
OK then, make a song that will make millions of people run to the dancefloor whenever it plays.
I dare you. After all, almost anyone can do that.
Or are you one of the few who can't?
 

Dr. wonderful

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Dec 31, 2009
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I pretty much listen to what ever tickle my bone.

From Rap to Classical, it dosen't fucking matter and Lady Gaga is pretty damn it.

(I just wanted to say the last part)

Anyway, I favorite songs from every genre, yes even Heavy metal.
 

NotSoNimble

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sergnb said:
NotSoNimble said:
I will stop saying 'I don't like rap' when I hear rap I like.

I hear what you're saying. But I don't think I throw the words hate around that much.
Travel in time to the 80's and early 90's.
Listen to the current rap movement.
?????
PROFIT!
I had to live it once, I have no desire to live it again. If anyone wants to send me a link to some 'great rap' I'd listen to it. But if you want to give me shit if I don't like it, don't waste my time please.