New Overwatch Hero Is a Response to Body-Type Diversity Criticism
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To be fair to Rufus, since Street Fighter 2 there was fun with stereotypes. Even Japan had Honda who is a mix of Kabuki actor with sumo wrestler who fighted in a bath house. The faces of america (Ken and Guile) were heroic. Rufus was the missing stereotype.The Wooster said:Cool character design. Good job, Blizzard. And now, because it seems like this topic requires it. Some angry typing.
ARHGHALBLARGH BLARGBAHRBLAGH SJKWS ABWLKGHABLAGH! AHRGHLAGHFS? AHRLGHALGHABLAGRHGLGHARGHKOTSAJHAKU LAHGFJL!
Try Bob from Tekken. He's not even a joke character like Rufus Street Fighter. He's just a kung fu badass who happens to be fat.Lotet said:Yeah, it is somewhat depressing that the only fat guy with agency who isn't a bandit, thug, Peter Griffin or some such I can think of is Coop from Megas XLR. Though that's to be expected, fat people are bad and should feel bad so they can become better, normal people.inmunitas said:
And even still, he is pretty badass. Learned Kung-Fu watching TV (Sharingan?), practiced the moves on China, is one of the world warriors and has a pretty hot girlfriend. Not bad for a joke.
BTW. I am brazilian. My representative is Blanka (guy who turned monster in Amazon). Our general reaction to him? Well...
You can accuse Capcom and other companies of making light of other countries. But damn it, at least they put said countries on the map, They begin to exist. "Oh, Resident Evil 5, so racist..." "That the kid from Guyana is racist. Well, which other games bothered to go to Africa? Heck, how many times the word "Guyana" was written in Game Forums before? You can criticize the portray, but at least they have balls to write stories in unsafe to "sensitive" topics.
Final words. Not a fan of the character concept or design. But people are happy with her, so she is fine.
As long it is adding, okay. Not replacing.
Anyone ever play Fantasy Star for the game cube? No tokens there! There was a scale body modifier so when you finished with the character you then decided how tall/short fat/skinny by sliding a bar up/down right/left.
I personally think it is a very cool design. My only criticism is that the hair color doesn't seem to mesh well with the rest of the character. I have seen people call it a bit too "Tumblr" and I can see that but I don't think we can properly judge it until we see the characters personality in game. If she turns out to just be a misandry based feminist then I will be the first to straight out call it pandering to the Tumblr crowd. I just hope they will have a recolor without the middle schoolgirl dye job.
HAWT.
I won't be playing Overwatch unless I get it as a gift or all my friends beg me to buy it myself. That said, I like most of the character designs, including Zarya. Not only from a "u need moar duhversateeez" point of view but because I've got a thing for strong women personally. They don't get much representation, even when it's appropriate to the character. Pictures of Tifa always make me think, "SHE's a martial arts badass?? Those soft shoulders look more like a cosplayer!" After so many Barbie dolls I think it's great to see an actual female powerhouse. Even if she does fall straight into another stereotype, namely the huge Russian, we can't criticize too harshly without criticizing all the other characters. An angry dwarf with a hammer and an accent? A talking gorilla? Noboby's ever done THAT before......
I won't be playing Overwatch unless I get it as a gift or all my friends beg me to buy it myself. That said, I like most of the character designs, including Zarya. Not only from a "u need moar duhversateeez" point of view but because I've got a thing for strong women personally. They don't get much representation, even when it's appropriate to the character. Pictures of Tifa always make me think, "SHE's a martial arts badass?? Those soft shoulders look more like a cosplayer!" After so many Barbie dolls I think it's great to see an actual female powerhouse. Even if she does fall straight into another stereotype, namely the huge Russian, we can't criticize too harshly without criticizing all the other characters. An angry dwarf with a hammer and an accent? A talking gorilla? Noboby's ever done THAT before......
Hey look it's Vi with a gun. Seriously. They didn't even change her color scheme. Just beefed her a little bit. Zayra is literally Vi from League of Legends with particle cannon.
" I am heavy weapons gal, and THIS is my weapon. She weighs 150 kilograms and fires condensed plasma beams in 20 continuous streams per minute. It costs *cough* *cough* thousand dollars to fire this gun, for twelve seconds."
OT: I look forward to another FPS game that I will inexplicably play despite being terrible at it.
ALTERNATIVELY: Winston is the closest we'll get to a black character, because racist undertones of an ape that thinks it's people. He even shares the first name with the token black guy from Ghostbusters.
OT: I look forward to another FPS game that I will inexplicably play despite being terrible at it.
Dude, you can't put a token black person in something wherein violence will be occurring to everyone, everyone knows that they'd just die first. Besides, then Blizzard would have to deal with people saying they're racist because they've put one black character in, which players are encouraged to kill with the overwhelmingly white cast.Ukomba said:
ALTERNATIVELY: Winston is the closest we'll get to a black character, because racist undertones of an ape that thinks it's people. He even shares the first name with the token black guy from Ghostbusters.
Don't you mean Fetch?lordmardok said:
Or maybe you meant Anya Stroud?
Or perhaps you meant Kerrigan?
No offense, but you can find hundreds of girls that look like Vi (many that predate her) if you just google "Cyberpunk Girl".
That being said, I'm not seeing the similarities other than hair color and having a scar. In which case, I guess Siegried from Soul Calibur and Seifer from Final Fantasy are the spitting image of each other.
I'm as anti-SJW as you can be, and I greiviously lament that it is their incessant hectoring that has spurred this change. Because, actually, I'd much rather the company had come to these conclusions themselves.
You see, as much as I can't stand the imposing zealots who make up the ranks of Social Justice Warriors, I do actually appreciate diversity. And in a game like this, there's really no reason not to represent as many different shapes, shades, and sizes as possible. And, in fact, this is the way toward diversity: companies not being kowtowed into censoring their current characters, or bowing to pressure to restrict the types of bodies women are 'allowed' to have in games (no tits, no hips, no thighs, etc); but instead, through encouragement, having them experiment and introduce as much diversity to character design as possible - but always through their choice.
So although I don't like how this has come about, I do like the diversity in character design. It keeps things fresh.
You see, as much as I can't stand the imposing zealots who make up the ranks of Social Justice Warriors, I do actually appreciate diversity. And in a game like this, there's really no reason not to represent as many different shapes, shades, and sizes as possible. And, in fact, this is the way toward diversity: companies not being kowtowed into censoring their current characters, or bowing to pressure to restrict the types of bodies women are 'allowed' to have in games (no tits, no hips, no thighs, etc); but instead, through encouragement, having them experiment and introduce as much diversity to character design as possible - but always through their choice.
So although I don't like how this has come about, I do like the diversity in character design. It keeps things fresh.
The shape of the shoulders seems a little bit wonky when she flexes and her traps are looking kind of small for someone her size in poses where they shouldn't (could be the armor though). Other than that, pretty good overall and I like the powerlifting belt looking acessory that goes over the armor. It makes very little sense but it's a nice touch to show where they drew inspiration from. As a powerlifting fan, I'm happy with it.
Also they called her Zarya, like the first module of the ISS to go into space, because they feel like they're trying something new perhaps. Pretty cool detail there. Let's hope they give the character a fun personality.
Also they called her Zarya, like the first module of the ISS to go into space, because they feel like they're trying something new perhaps. Pretty cool detail there. Let's hope they give the character a fun personality.
I think the design is sound and the look is solid- hopefully this is appealing to people who like muscular women.
I don't personally like the look, and would never play her, however.
I don't personally like the look, and would never play her, however.
*Is a direct response to these critics*
Is it really?
Anyway if its so or not. tbh I couldn't care less... I'm honestly not interested in Overwatch and there are some people out there who like that body type. Some dudes and gals have the strong woman fetish, which is alright.
Just as I have the petite girl, thin, small or flat chest preference.
But its not a "response" or something anyone should take as hurr durr serious business "politics" in video games. Good that they did, its their game, the devs have decided and the market decides. Its always fair, glad they did, good for em. *clap* *clap*
Is it really?
Anyway if its so or not. tbh I couldn't care less... I'm honestly not interested in Overwatch and there are some people out there who like that body type. Some dudes and gals have the strong woman fetish, which is alright.
Just as I have the petite girl, thin, small or flat chest preference.
But its not a "response" or something anyone should take as hurr durr serious business "politics" in video games. Good that they did, its their game, the devs have decided and the market decides. Its always fair, glad they did, good for em. *clap* *clap*
The fact that people are turning right around and start bitching about how she's just another stereotype just shows that trying to give any ground to the gender-terrorists is just stupid. These people will never be happy. You put tough, strong women in games and its instantly: "She's just a man with boobs". You put women with larger bodies in games and its instantly "Why is her face so pretty still?". Now this is wrong because she's Russian? Seriously?
I mean, I want to see a design for a female character that they approve of. Are there any concrete examples of a female character that is done right?
I mean, I want to see a design for a female character that they approve of. Are there any concrete examples of a female character that is done right?
Oh... I thought they made this character because they genuinely wanted to, not because they thought they had to. That kinda puts a damper on things. I liked the character when I first saw her, but now I see it as pandering to an audience that is now complaining that she isn't good enough.
EDIT: For those who forgot, this is a game with a super-intelligent, genetically engineered gorilla. Does a Russian ex-bodybuilder really seem that unreasonable in this game?
EDIT: For those who forgot, this is a game with a super-intelligent, genetically engineered gorilla. Does a Russian ex-bodybuilder really seem that unreasonable in this game?
You know, another way to look at this announcement is that they were making the character from the get go, and the PR division saw revealing this character as a way to try to win people over or something given the current climate. Has everyone received it well....well of course not, but should anyone be surprised by that. =\
Anywho I just genuinely like the character.
Anywho I just genuinely like the character.
Thank you for saving me from posting a less coherent version of all of that. You earn a Awesome Award for doing Awesome. =DCaramel Frappe said:
You know the people who were asking for different body types and the people complaining about Zarya are mostly different people, right?Aetrion said:
Bob: I think I'll have a roast beef sandwich.Bocaj2000 said:
Alice: I'd be happier if you had the chicken sandwich.
Bob: Okay. Chicken it is!
Chris: Curse you, Alice, for forcing Bob to eat chicken!
Seriously, Blizzard has said repeatedly that they want to provide diversity. The idea that they are somehow being strong armed into doing it is just bonkers.
Uh, you do realize the people here (on this site) that were posting about their disappointment with the roster at the original announcement have been largely supportive and glad for this character right? I was there for the original announcement threads, I even posted in some, and all the people I remember criticizing the roster are the ones posting about liking this character. The ones calling her a "man with boobs" seem to coming from the other side of the aisle, i.e. the people that aren't happy with Blizzard pandering to the SJW crowd.Aetrion said:
Also, gender-terrorists? Really? That's the most ridiculous hyperbole I've seen since that intel tweet that compared GG to ISIS. I am saving that for next time I need to prove a point about how the "SJWs" and "anti-SJWs" have basically become twisted reflections of each other.
I like it c: I don't really intend to play a lot of Overwatch but I do like the designs.
If I do have criticism about character designs, it's not so much going to be "look at this one game that objectifies women, or this one game that has no women," it's more a general criticism of games as a whole, and of course more specifically the ones where character design is a core concept. There's nothing wrong with any individual game having nothing but T&A or where all the characters are 20-something white guys with the same build or whatever. Arguably it might be kind of bad design depending on the game.
The issue is more an overall one where a lotta game designers default to certain things, probably without thinking about it, maybe intentionally, I don't know. It's really more bad/lazy design I think, than actual racism, sexism, etc. Hell it happens with fantasy races too, 99% of "elven" races are Tolkienesque archer waifs with a connection to nature. YAWN And certainly a lot of it is based on what they think will sell. And cribbing from popular games of the past.
Personally I like a good story and something new and interesting. And some varied visual designs to look at. I suspect a lot of the "feminism" arguments about games really boil down to, being sexy isn't the only way a woman can be (or look) strong or interesting. I'm all for more kickass old ladies and genuinely chunky guys.
Maybe it's because people are weird about visuals and games all get the Hollywood effect - we only want to watch attractive people so the protagonist has to be hot or at least young and generic.
If I do have criticism about character designs, it's not so much going to be "look at this one game that objectifies women, or this one game that has no women," it's more a general criticism of games as a whole, and of course more specifically the ones where character design is a core concept. There's nothing wrong with any individual game having nothing but T&A or where all the characters are 20-something white guys with the same build or whatever. Arguably it might be kind of bad design depending on the game.
The issue is more an overall one where a lotta game designers default to certain things, probably without thinking about it, maybe intentionally, I don't know. It's really more bad/lazy design I think, than actual racism, sexism, etc. Hell it happens with fantasy races too, 99% of "elven" races are Tolkienesque archer waifs with a connection to nature. YAWN And certainly a lot of it is based on what they think will sell. And cribbing from popular games of the past.
Personally I like a good story and something new and interesting. And some varied visual designs to look at. I suspect a lot of the "feminism" arguments about games really boil down to, being sexy isn't the only way a woman can be (or look) strong or interesting. I'm all for more kickass old ladies and genuinely chunky guys.
Maybe it's because people are weird about visuals and games all get the Hollywood effect - we only want to watch attractive people so the protagonist has to be hot or at least young and generic.
Terrorism - The use of violence or threats to coerce people for a political agenda.ensouls said:
How does this not fit when basically their entire MO is "Do what we want or we will collectively accuse you of being a racist, sexist evil person to threaten your employment and public image" ?
Also hello false dichotomy. Just because I'm against people using these kinds of tactics to stifle public discourse and coerce people to their side doesn't mean I define myself by my dislike of them or am part of some movement. I just want people to stop listening to people who use threats to get their way and are never going to be satisfied anyways.