New Splinter Cell: Less Stealth, More Accessible

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robert022614

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Dec 1, 2009
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i have to say this is sort of killing splinter cell for me. the stealth was one of if not THE best part of splinter cell to me. How many games can you run around and shoot people?!? and splinter cell was actually well put together as a stealth game :( gotta say dont think im going to get it.
 

Georgie_Leech

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Nov 10, 2009
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BOO. I've played the demo, and the lack of stealth was awful. They even gave Fisher that wierd habit of regenerating wounds like Wolverine. I liked the previous games because of the stealth (gasp). I didn't want another third-person shooter. I wanted a stealth game.
 

Marmal4de

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Apr 4, 2010
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I was dissapointed with the lack of stealth elements but it's overall a good game if you don't insist on seing it as another Splinter Cell game and judge it on it's own merit as an action-stealth hybrid.
The Iraq level was completely out of place though, I have no idea what they were thinking when they threw that in.
 

JEBWrench

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Apr 23, 2009
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Sketchy said:
Jah, wasn't Splinter Cell first on Xbox? I thought the PC and PS2 versions came later. I know the PS2 version did.

Anyway, I think the new direction is fantastic. It's how I'd have played the old games if I could. I mean, I've never been much for the slow stealth, I'm just not that patient.

I can understand how people who loved that might be disappointed, and I loved the old games too, but I just think it's a good evolution.
You are correct, comrade.

The console versions even controlled better than the PC version, which was hair-pullingly awkward.
 

revjay

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Nov 19, 2007
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If this shit keeps up I'm going to be sitting in a corner rocking back and forth, muttering 'thief 4 won't fail me, thief 4 won't fail me'. All I want is my slow cumbersome stealth play. I remember fondly hiding in the dark in chaos rising and thief 1-3 literally holding my breath hoping to not be caught by the nearby guards or whatever thing was nearby.

I want to play this game because I'm a fan of the series but ubisoft will have to come up with another back asswards drm scheme than always on internet before I'll even buy the 360 version of anything they make.
 

chainsaw Killer

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Feb 22, 2010
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I'd say the Mass Effect 2 comparison is not the best one.
If they took out the crew members and made you play alone, that would be a good comparison.
Stealth was not a small part of the Game like ... item management in ME2, it was all its about.
But it doesnt really matter, I'm not going to buy a Game with the Ubisoft drm event if they are releasing a new Splinter Cell and Prince of Persia ...
 

Legion

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Oct 2, 2008
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You should probably point out when doing articles such as these what country the release dates are. In the USA it's out today, Europe doesn't get it until Friday and other places no doubt have their own ones too.

This kind of thing happens a little too often to be fair, a lot of assumptions are that the readers are American; even an article about a British 14 year old on Facebook said he spent almost $1400 rather than £800.
 

Outright Villainy

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Well from what I've seen the stealth is still therre, it's just faster and messier. I'm not too put off by that, sometimes waiting around in the shadows gets a little boring. That said, they should always include the option to be meticulous about stealth, why not give people more options?
 

Sixties Spidey

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Jan 24, 2008
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LiquidGrape said:
Seems they'll follow the same path of Mass Effect 2.

"We need more sales in the frat boy contingency. Remove some or most of that ridiculous substance and replace it with fanservice and/or dumbed-down game mechanics."
How was Mass Effect 2 dumbed down? The interface for ME1 was fucking terrible. ME2's interface was better.

Either way, I was never able to get into Splinter Cell, so hey, Conviction will be my way in the franchise, and my gateway to play the past four games in the series.
 

Sixties Spidey

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Georgie_Leech said:
BOO. I've played the demo, and the lack of stealth was awful. They even gave Fisher that wierd habit of regenerating wounds like Wolverine. I liked the previous games because of the stealth (gasp). I didn't want another third-person shooter. I wanted a stealth game.
It is still a stealth game. It's still there. You probably weren't playing the game properly.
 

ClunkiestTurtle

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Andy Chalk said:
New Splinter Cell: Less Stealth, More Accessible

In an effort to make it more accessible, Max Beland of Ubisoft Montreal says the studio decided that the best way to improve the stealth gameplay in Splinter Cell:Conviction was to get rid of the stealth gameplay in Splinter Cell: Conviction.
Therefore making this game not Splinter Cell at all....

what is it with publishers and developers being to lazy to think up new ip's and so just rehash a franchise in a totally different style making it nothing like a sequel.

Playing the demo i thought it was an alright game but the fact that the title was prefixed by the words "splinter cell" made it dive way below my expectations and feel like a awful an awkward sequel to some of my favourite games rather then being just the average to slightly above average title i probably would think it to be if it didn't have the burden of its predecessors.

Surely this just makes their problem worse as if people are always thinking the series is inaccessible before then new players are still going to be reluctant to jump on board now 4 games in and fans will be be reluctant to buy a game that's essentially chucked out everything that made them love the game to begin with. Whats so hard about making a new ip that would be more accessible to newer run and gun style players while keeping Splinter Cell how it is or even make a spin off in set in the same universe.

For me this game seems to be the game the creators of the Bourne conspiracy wanted to make but while getting the general feel of the one man killing machine better then in the bourne game it still for me at least had the same massive gaping flaw. You're not really doing any of the cool action yourself, i think theres a difference to making a game accessible and having it just do everything for you, and i think this is the point where i get off the Splinter Cell express.
 

Distorted Stu

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Sep 22, 2009
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I prefered being a ninja in the shadows. Not some Drake/Pheonix wanna be.

CHEST HIGH WALLS & BOXES.. EVERYWHERE

When they bring back the light/sound sensor as well as the sticky shockers, lock picks & am able to knock/whistle il concider buying another Splinter Cell game. Its the stealth that made the player think, plan and think tactics. Now, its just a basic run and gun.
 

Chaossebba

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Aug 11, 2008
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Jaredin said:
Its like taking...the shooting out of MW2?
MW3 will be a politics simulator where you have to prevent the nukes from being used through diplomacy.

Anyway, this is good news for me since im not much of a stealth person. My usual line of thought:
"1. Do i have a gun? -> Yes = BANGBANGBANGBANGBANGBANGBANG. No = Turn game off"
 

Leroy Frederick

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Jan 27, 2009
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Like Resident Evil 4 (it's first foray into the Gears of war perspective, or did that come out after?) I think this has to be considered a different experience from other Splinter Cell's if it plays how it looks.

However regardless of how it sells, it doesn't mean people don't want to play proper stealth games or classic perspective/paced adventure horror games like previous RE's.
 

dthree

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Jun 13, 2008
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I remember penny arcade saying a similar thing about Prince of Persia 2. In fact when went back to search for the post, I found this interesting comment:

"So they listened to the people who didn't like their game and totally fucked those of us who loved it. Thanks Ubi, you know a lot of people really hate all the sneaking around in Splinter Cell. Why don't you give Sam a dual Uzis and a rocket launcher?"

Full post here: http://www.penny-arcade.com/2004/12/3/
 

LornMind

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Dec 27, 2008
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After playing with the demo and having played the first and second games, I liked the direction they took things. Stealth is very fun, and Splinter Cell was almost unflinching in it's stealth mechanics, but this greater degree of freedom I think gives you the option to go stealth or go loud.

I mean, I can only speak from the perspective of the demo since I don't have the game yet, but it didn't seem like it was preventing you from being stealthy, only encouraging it. Sam is fast and deadly, but he's just a dude, and he dies VERY fast. You can't really run and gun all that much because your accuracy wanes rather pathetically and rushing a guy that can see you running at him while he brandishes a gun is great way to kill yourself. The action opened up, and you get combat high's now, but I still felt that the game deliberately paced me and tugged back on the leash whenever I got seriously injured to remind me: you're not indestructible, just very agile.

I disliked how heavily Sam ran in the first two games: this man is in top physical condition and is wearing a suit DESIGNED to make him more stealthy, not some black tank that can barely fucking run. "Grandmother" indeed. The game feels more fluid, but I still think that the stealth is there, it's just coupled with more "Oh shit" or "Holy crap!" moments than in the first games.

It's a bit more like the Splinter Cell novels now, come to think.

I like the direction the series took, especially since I wasn't too interested in Double Agent.
 

Cucipher

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Tdc2182 said:
Cucipher said:
Andy Chalk said:
Wow! This is terrible journalism!

This is not news. This is an opinion piece. An unsubstantiated, unqualified, subjective piece of writing. If that was what was intended, then that's cool! But dont for the love of god call it news.

Who is the writer to claim what is and is not a "true" stealth game?

I really enjoy most of the content created by the Escapist but since when did sweeping generalisation and opinions become part of a news article? That's for comments surely?!?

I had to go back and check if it was the same guy who wrote the article about the kid who spent all the money on Farmville/Facebook - and indeed it was! Another article full of unwanted, unnecessary and finger-wagging opinions. Andy Chalk - either you need to get funnier and get a review column or check back and see what the definition of "news" is.

I for one am looking forward to the game, and I have enjoyed stealth titles for years. Obviously there will be controversy when things are changed, but games have to evolve and improve through experimentation just like anything else. Who says stealth has to be a game of tiny steps? Can this new approach not lead to some excellent developments in the genre in years to come?
You don't read much news, do you?
Good point. :) Thankfully no Fox here so there's still hope.
 

Georgie_Leech

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buy teh haloz said:
Georgie_Leech said:
BOO. I've played the demo, and the lack of stealth was awful. They even gave Fisher that wierd habit of regenerating wounds like Wolverine. I liked the previous games because of the stealth (gasp). I didn't want another third-person shooter. I wanted a stealth game.
It is still a stealth game. It's still there. You probably weren't playing the game properly.
When the demo opens with a scenario interrogating someone violently in front of a witness, forces you to kill one of two guards to get into the building, gives you that odd health regeneration thing (or very temporary damage), and gives you that ability to tag a bunch of targets for easy death, no, I didn't see much stealth. Part of it being a stealth game is that the point is to not be seen. The demo could be beaten by taking cover and shooting everybody; I tried and succeded. In the other Splinter Cells, it was actually possible to make it through the levels without leaving a trace of your existence, but not so in this one so far.
 

INF1NIT3 D00M

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My post is really long.
Okay, I've played the game's co-op campaign with my friend, and personally I think it's a great experience. I NEVER felt like a spy in Double Agent or any of the other games. I spent more time trying and re-trying than I spent playing, and it was almost never fun. I'd be sneaking through a base and then a guard would flick a light on and shoot me in the face. Cue restart of whole mission, and a long loading screen. NOT FUN. I specifically remember some guards that would pseudo-spawn in when i went to certain areas. Enter area near tent: Guard comes out; Wait 15 minutes after re-loading for guard to appear: No guard; Walk past, thinking it's safe then: SUPRISE! GUARD!. Now in Conviction, this is okay; just jump into shadow, or shoot the guard, or melee-kill him, or flashbang, or whatever comes to mind. In Double Agent, that guard always meant alert being raised, instant death, or a detection-game over. Now call me impatient, call me not-in-the-spirit-of-stealth, but when I set up a cunning infiltration plan only for it to be royally screwed over, I'd much rather be able to fix my fuckups on the fly rather than re-loading and trying to perfectly re-create 30 minutes of progress. I also hated the method of doing things in Double Agent, and it made me want to drop stealth games altogether. Opening a door in Double Agent, or any Splinter Cell game before Conviction, became a complex and flow-breaking ordeal. Walk up to door, Press A, HOLD A, Now you have three options. Option 1: Smash door open REALLY LOUDLY (Like any good spy would), Option 2: Open door while making normal door-opening sounds, or Option 3: Open door silently, as fast or as slow as you want. That means that just to open ONE door requires 3 button presses (technically 4 if you did option 3, because you have to press the stick forward to make him move forward and push the door with him. I suppose if you wanted to only open the door halfway and leave it there, this would be a welcome design choice). That's A, then D-pad right (or left) twice while holding A. And pulling out your emp+pistol/assault rifle was fun too. Point Sam in the right direction, hit X, wait for him to comprehend the action, give the game a second to switch camera angles, wait for him to pull out his pistol, aim, then you can shoot an enemy in the head to kill him, or in the body to lose the game. Everything just took so long to do I got bored while doing it. Stashing bodies is the best example of how I felt about the games. Hiding bodies is realistic, but it's complicated and time-consuming and instead of making you feel good about being undetected, it makes you feel bad about killing someone in the name of secrecy. I feel that ditching the overly complicated door-opening mechanics and overall retarded controls were a step in the right direction for Splinter Cell. Now most actions require a contextual button press and take little time. Now instead of getting shot while trying to navigate a menu to open a door, one press automatically chooses the 'open the door quietly' option and another button chooses 'make lots of noise, get detected quickly, and destroy the door'. Now I can kill a guard, disappear into shadows, and use the other guard's confusion to take them out or escape. If my plan to sneak through the room fails, I can hide, re-evaluate, and continue playing, rather than having to restart. I get that many people feel that the faster pace ruins their fun. I myself was baffled at the exclusion of the option to hide bodies, and a few bits required killing, but I don't think the direction taken is a bad one. No longer do I feel like a cow trying to escape a meat packing plant, I feel like a badass infiltrating an enemy base. I think that this could be the start of a middle ground between the classic "Hardcore" stealth of Thief or older Splinter Cells, and straight up tactical shooters like Rainbow Six Vegas. If you like the old version of Splinter Cell, good for you. However, I'd really hate to see negative feedback kill this new streamlined stealth gameplay.

And on a related note, why are some of you "Hardcore" Splinter Cell veterans so diametrically opposed to killing the guards? It's my understanding that a lot of the guys we're supposed to be getting past are all hardened killers, most of them being terrorists bent on murdering innocents. Every time I've been spotted they've killed me on sight. Now, shooting a Rent-A-Cop is just in bad taste, and killing in an embassy isn't an option for obvious reasons, but how exactly is is better for me to leave the actual terrorist guards alive? Surely once I've gotten whatever I wanted from the base they'd be fired for incompetence or killed, why go through the red tape? And by leaving a base full of terrorists alive you may feel stealthier, but IMO you're just letting another batch of career criminals move on to the next terrorist cell or drug ring. Dead men tell no tales, surely there's no proof you're there if none of the guards are alive to talk about it? Now the terrorists might get spooked if they suddenly realize a base-load of their guys just fell off the face of the earth, but by then it's not really my department. If that's what keeps them from pulling off their plan, then haven't I actually done what we set out to do? Stop terrorists from... terrorizing people? I've never felt bad about neutralizing a guard, and I almost always do so in order to lessen my chances of being detected (I REALLY hate it when a guard patrols up right behind me without me realizing). So... Yeah. That's all I really had to say.
So if you just want to know my thoughts on Conviction and don't care for my justifications, I thought it was awesome and way better than the other Splinter Cells I've played. I don't think the stealth is gone or lessened, rather it's just been retooled to be a lot more smooth. Oh, and the Co-op Campaign is really fun. I haven't really mentioned what the game itself plays like, but anyone who's played it knows, and anyone who hasnt will either find out by playing or doesnt want to play it at all. Which is a shame, because they're missing out.
 

INF1NIT3 D00M

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Tdc2182 said:
Andy Chalk said:
Marik2 said:
The stealth is still there, just faster.
I dunno. That's a LOT of killing for a stealth game.
I agree. It has kind of betrayed it's roots a bit. Also, from what I have seen, it rewards you too much for using run and gun technique, even on its hardest difficulty. And you use the Mark and Execute more than you actually manually aim.
Wait a minute there, buck-o. You mean YOU used the Mark and Execute more than you manually aimed. Don't blame the game for your lack of patience or aiming skill. The button is there, but no one FORCES you to use it. They don't even bug you about it. I played the entire co-op campaign with my buddy, and between us we used the 'Execute' part of Mark and Execute a total of about 3 times between the both of us for the whole campaign. No gun in the game is accurate past 2 shots, and your character can take maybe 3 or 4 hits before he straight up dies on normal. I can't remember a single time Run And Gun worked for me and my partner. And trust me, we TRIED. Getting shot due to a lack of stealth and retrying is frustrating, and often led to us trying to go too fast to make up for lost progress, and that would lead to worse fails. How you choose to play the game is EVERYTHING. I don't know what strategy YOU used, but that isn't the only way to play. Don't forget that. IMO, playing with ONLY manual aiming and more CQB kills than gun kills is ENTIRELY POSSIBLE, if more challenging. The word "Accessible" doesnt always mean "Casual". All it means is that YOU can get through your way, and I got through it my way. There's more options, increasing what strategies you have access to. See that? More options = ACCESS to more strategies = more ACCESSibility. There's only less stealth in the game if you USE less stealth in the game. It's become more forgiving for fuckups, what's wrong with that? If you don't want forgiveness, you can just reload a checkpoint every time you're detected.
And to everyone holding up the demo as proof that the game sucks, no demo has ever perfectly encapsulated gameplay. It's just as ignorant to say the game is bad because of the demo as it is to say it's bad without ever even seeing so much as a screenshot. The demo doesnt have much of the freedom of the full game. I tried multiple times to get through without killing, but it's made to show off the Mark and Execute, so that's not an option. To haters of that variety, I'd urge you to play the full game before resuming your cries of "it's not boring enough!" or whatever you have against a perfectly good game. At the end of the day, we ALL agree it's beter than ET for the Atari...