Nintendo Likely to Go Software Only, Says Zynga Board Member

[Epona]

You weren't JUST talking about the 3DS which BTW is just another gimmick. People want good, NORMAL games on the 3DS and most could care less about it's gimmick. Same can be said about the Wii and the WiiU.

Since a lot of people are using the word "gimmick" like it's a bad thing, let me take the time to enumerate a lot of different gimmicks that have come about specifically during the video game era (c. 1960- ) in rough chronological order:

-Arcade Gaming
-Local/Hotseat Multiplayer
-Trackballs
-Joysticks/Analogue Sticks
-Steering Wheel Controllers
-Input Buttons
-Light Guns
-Home Console Gaming
-Detachable/Interchangeable Controllers
-Game Cartridges/Interchangeable Games
-8-bit games
-Game Packaging/Manuals/Misc. Swag
-16-bit games
-Splitscreen Multiplayer
-Multiple Save Files
-Handheld Gaming
-32-bit games
-Music Players
-Disk formats
-Memory Cards
-Rumble
-LAN/Network Multiplayer
-3D (Polygonal) Games
-64-bit games
-Backwards Compatibility
-Microphones/Cameras (Add-ons/Peripherals)
-DVD Players
-Gyroscopes/Accelerometers
-"HD" Gaming
-Online Matchmaking
-Blu-Ray Players
-Movie Streaming
-Social Hubs
-Achievements
-Motion Controls
-DLC/Digital Downloads


Also, you do need to define what a "normal" game is, since the market is *gasp* always changing. If the market remained static, we might as well still be playing games like [a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spacewar!"]Spacewar![/a] and [a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tennis_for_Two"]Tennis for Two[/a] on monochromatic displays on college mainframes designed specifically to play those games, since they were some of the first video games to ever actually exist.

It's true that not all gimmicks are bad but motion control had it's chance and here we are 6 years later, it has not convinced most people. Motion control is a backstep if you consider accuracy to be important.

Normal games are games that use a time tested, accurate controller and a viewing method that is natural to everyone who is not blind. 3D is unnatural, some people can't even see the effect and others get terrible headaches. Further, the 3DS is not well designed to use it's own gimmick, it simply doesn't have the battery life to make it practical to play with the 3D on all the time.

 

[Epona]

SNIP

You forgot to mention analogue sticks. I'm not that old, but even I remember when Nintendo released the N64 with an analogue stick. PSX fanboys were convinced that it was a stupid idea, and that the good old D-pad was all we needed to play games. Then Sony released the Dualshock controller, and all of a sudden analogue sticks became the medium standard.

Which is why I'm so confused about why the Wii U controller is such a bad thing. It has a touchscreen, and the DS has already shown that a touchscreen can offer control potential way beyond what an analogue stick could ever hope to offer. Just playing Metroid Hunters on the DS was enough to convince me that console shooters could perhaps one day have the precision of PC shooters. So why is it a bad thing that Nintendo have included that option for the Wii U?

BS, I had been gaming for 15 years when the N64 came out and I never heard anyone complain about the analog stick. I heard people complain about the shape of the N64 controller, but not the stick. Most people were very impressed with it.

 

[Epona]

So, what do you define as a time tested accurate controller? Because if you say the modern PS3/360 model, then I'm going to call bullshit and say that they pale in comparison to the hardcore beauty that is the original Mega Drive controller.

Accurate, as in, when I push a button or move a stick, it always responds properly. Motion controls can be misread, that doesn't happen with a traditional controller unless it is malfunctioning. You press X, it doesn't think you pressed Triangle. You push left, it doesn't think you meant right.

Yes, modern controllers are more accurate than motion controls.

Everything about gaming is unnatural, what with it being a technological medium. And one handed people can't play fighting games. Some people are just unlucky enough to not be able to get the most out of a hobby, for whatever reason. That's just the way these things go...

This is just retarded and there is no rational response to it.

Whoop-de-doo. You knew some people who were impressed by the analogue stick. Good for you. As for me, I remember people saying that it was a badly designed wobbly thing that would lead to all games being uncontrollable 3D (3D polygons being another gimmick of the time) messes, and it totally sucked compared to a mouse and keyboard anyway.

It's not like there was this big anti-analog movement though. Motion controls are pretty universally hated and people steer clear of them when they can.

 

[AzrealMaximillion]

Saying the Wii was never meant to be for core gamers isn't really a defence.

I'm pretty sure you missed my double negative.

They flopped because Nintendo doesn't help let people know what 3rd party games are on their console like the other companies do for their platforms.

Wait... what? It's the publisher's job to advertise the game. (Still, Nintendo do advertise third-party games on the Nintendo Channel, among other outlets.) The closest you'll get to the console manufacturer doing the ad campaign is when, as an example, Microsoft give Electronic Arts some money so that Xbox 360 will be the most prominent platform in the ads. Like, "OUT NOW ON XBOX 360! (Also PC and PlayStation 3.)"

The actual problem is two-fold. Firstly, traditional Nintendo gamers (those of us who've stuck around since the PlayStation was released) don't buy a lot of third party games, and when "we" do it's important to have brand recognition.... making it hard for new IPs like MadWorld and No More Heroes to get the attention they need. Secondly, the advertising machine is kind of broken in that the games that need it the least get it the most, so a new and conceptually risky IP simply won't get any ad money from its publisher.

I get that its the publisher's job to advertise the game, but lets go back to the 2 games that were mentioned before.
MadWorld. This game had one hell of a lot of TV ads, internet ads and so on. It was a game that utilized the Wii's motion controls very well (hell, better than a lot of Nintendo's own 1st party games). Still flopped. The audience wasn't there for it. The problem isn't with traditional Nintendo gamers. They make up one majority of those who own Wiis. The problem was that the only other majority of people who bought Wiis are people who never played video games before. That was the outcome of Nintendo's marketing to that audience. Anyone who wanted a console to play great games outside of JUST Nintendo's 1st party didn't buy the Wii because they didn't see any games that grabbed their interest. Hell, I bought a Wii FOR No More Heroes. I thought there was going to be as many sleeper hits on the Wii as the Gamecube had. I was sadly disappointed and sold mine Wii 10 months after launch. Not counting 1st party games I can count with both hands the games that I'l buy for the Wii today.

No More Heroes was decently advertised too. It was the game that was supposed to fill the void of titles to play on the Wii while people waited for Smash Bros Brawl. It sold moderately and gained a decent amount of acclaim. Its sequel freaking bombed.

My point is that there are a decent amount of 3rd party titles on the Wii that were advertised decently enough to sell but didn't due to the lack of audience. The people who would have bought those games simply didn't buy Wiis. That can be put on the way Nintendo marketed their console. The PS3/360 didn't pick a specific market for their entire console to be based on, they let the publishers advertise their games without pushing who should be buying their consoles.

 

[kortin]

Don't you just love it when one company predicts the future for another company? It's like they're hyper-intelligent!

 

[subtlefuge]

I don't think anyone wants the job of counting the stacks of money from multi-platform Nintendo releases, so I'm calling bull on this.

A real Zelda or Pokemon game for PC would be awesome though.

 

[Kevin7557]

Says the company whose stock listing was a scam and probably won't be around in 10 years.

I don't think anyone wants the job of counting the stacks of money from multi-platform Nintendo releases, so I'm calling bull on this.

A real Zelda or Pokemon game for PC would be awesome though.

I had this idea that the major publishers should release their games on their system one month in Advance then sell them on the other consoles. The gobs of money they would make would be incredible. Isn't going to happen but yeah Nintendo games on other consoles would be awesome.

 

[CrazyBlaze]

to be honest, this is no surprise to me... i mean the wii was a flop in the long run, and the WiiU is so "weak" spec wise, that it does not even force microsoft or sony to rush their next gen consoles out the door

I think the Nintendo Wii is a pile of wank (mine collects dust) but it sold really, really well. How, then, was it a flop? Or do you mean it was a failure in the sense that it's a bad product in your opinion?

It was a bad product which burned some bridges with core gamers. The WiiU would have to be something really special to make up for that but it doesn't look like the WiiU will win over too many core gamers.

Why should it really care though? I mean the core gamer audience is fairly limited if we are honest about it, compared to the casual market that the Wii and the WiiU now seem to be looking at. And I don't think the Wii was a bad product per say but it sure didn't try to appeal to older fans of Nintendo, which I don't think is that much of a surprise because looking back (and this may just be me) I feel that Nintendo has always been targeting a younger audience than an older one (and most core gamers are older).

 

[ReinWeisserRitter]

First of all, there's really no reason whatsoever to take this guy seriously.

That out of the way, if anyone ends up software-only, the other two guys are going to be there way before Nintendo is; Nintendo's brand is too strong for it to cater to other companies, and its massivefinancial success with its last console doesn't invalidate that in the slightest. The last five years have also been almost nothing but everyone else copying them on the hardware end of things; that's hardly a sign that a company needs to go software-only.

 

[JediMB]

My point is that there are a decent amount of 3rd party titles on the Wii that were advertised decently enough to sell but didn't due to the lack of audience. The people who would have bought those games simply didn't buy Wiis. That can be put on the way Nintendo marketed their console. The PS3/360 didn't pick a specific market for their entire console to be based on, they let the publishers advertise their games without pushing who should be buying their consoles.

Really, it's not a matter of who Nintendo targeted with the Wii. From the very start, Nintendo tried to convince everyone that the Wii was for new gamers, Nintendo fans, and "action" gamers alike, but they couldn't get the message through because gaming media and gamers had largely convinced themselves that Nintendo had abandoned the "hardcore" for the new "casual gamers" (a term Nintendo didn't even use themselves until several years into the Wii's life cycle). The Wii being for "casual gamers" became a meme, and Nintendo never stood a chance of convincing people that it wasn't true, and so it turned into self-fulfilling prophecy.

But, yes, it's true that even properly advertised games for the Wii didn't sell simply because the audience wasn't there. And that's why we have these pictures:

(Not the exact list of games I'd put together, personally, but it gets the points across.)

 

[Heart of Darkness]

It's true that not all gimmicks are bad but motion control had it's chance and here we are 6 years later, it has not convinced most people.

Ooh, fun, weasel words. But unless you can provide a source on that, please forgive me for actually doubting that claim.

Motion control is a backstep if you consider accuracy to be important.

Which is why people aren't motion control as the primary control scheme for games that require high degrees of accuracy. But hey, let's forget about IR technology entirely and that computer mice are motion controlled devices.

Normal games are games that use a time tested, accurate controller

Time-tested means nothing in the console market, since controllers actually change generation to generation. The only controllers that really haven't changed are computer-input devices, with the primary setup being the mouse and keyboard. And, as I previously mentioned, the mouse is a motion-control based input device that is highly accurate and pretty much the dominant PC controller type.

and a viewing method that is natural to everyone who is not blind.

Looking at a screen for hours on end isn't natural.

3D is unnatural, some people can't even see the effect and others get terrible headaches.

No, 3D is indeed quite natural. There is this thing called depth perception that most people have that actually relies on two flat images being merged together in your brain to create the illusion of depth.

Further, the 3DS is not well designed to use it's own gimmick, it simply doesn't have the battery life to make it practical to play with the 3D on all the time.

While the battery life thing is an issue, it's hardly a dealbreaker. Plus, you can always turn 3D off to conserve battery power. That's always an option, too.

 

[JediMB]

that pic is used against guys like you. i would use that "T" word but i get infractions for that while guys like you get away with it. so i'm just gonna assume you have no sense of self-consciousness.

What the hell are you talking about? What would you say a guy like me is?

 

[Wesley Brannock]

This article speaks of Nintendo becoming a software only company. However I don't want Nintendo to go software I want them to go AWAY. I have no problem with a system that plays to games appropriate to children and casual gamers. But and this is a BIG but. When you placate ONLY to those gamers then your company SHOULD go the way of the dinosaur's , Sega , also atari what I'm saying is Nintendo's time has come and gone they should take this chance to dig up any shred of self-respect they have left and leave the stage gracefully. Rather then this last song and dance they are making us sit through unwillingly.

 

[ZippyDSMlee]

WIIU is more powerful than the PS360 so specs are not much of a problem as the whole thing feels like a WII add on and probably won't do so well.

 

[AzrealMaximillion]

My point is that there are a decent amount of 3rd party titles on the Wii that were advertised decently enough to sell but didn't due to the lack of audience. The people who would have bought those games simply didn't buy Wiis. That can be put on the way Nintendo marketed their console. The PS3/360 didn't pick a specific market for their entire console to be based on, they let the publishers advertise their games without pushing who should be buying their consoles.

Really, it's not a matter of who Nintendo targeted with the Wii. From the very start, Nintendo tried to convince everyone that the Wii was for new gamers, Nintendo fans, and "action" gamers alike, but they couldn't get the message through because gaming media and gamers had largely convinced themselves that Nintendo had abandoned the "hardcore" for the new "casual gamers" (a term Nintendo didn't even use themselves until several years into the Wii's life cycle). The Wii being for "casual gamers" became a meme, and Nintendo never stood a chance of convincing people that it wasn't true, and so it turned into self-fulfilling prophecy.

But, yes, it's true that even properly advertised games for the Wii didn't sell simply because the audience wasn't there. And that's why we have these pictures:

(Not the exact list of games I'd put together, personally, but it gets the points across.)

That pic really doesn't help prove your point. Think of how long the wait in betweeen those games' releases were. That's 2 games a year for someone who wants them. So core gamers would wind up having their Wiis collect dust after they've beaten a game or two per year. Now I know that there are more 3rd party games on the Wii then that but more to the point, they probably flopped pretty hard to due to the fact that they weren't advertised very well. Meanwhile a game like Demon's Souls turns into a triple A franchise with just word of mouth. Word of mouth caused by having enough of an audience on the PS3 and enough of a want for a game like Demon's Souls on the 360 and PC.

 

[Wesley Brannock]

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