No Right Answer: Attack on Attack on Titan

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Mr. Clarinet

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Sep 20, 2012
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Paranoia Agent?

I like Monster as a good anime but I mostly just revel in the atmosphere. Plenty of people find it boooring and that's a valid complaint but not one that I find when the atmosphere frequently picks up when the plot lumbers around.
 

Firefilm

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May 27, 2011
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Chris Pranger said:
Mossberg Shotty said:
Awesome, two ugly brown-haired guys bitching about an anime they could never hope to surpass. Exactly what are your credentials? Did you write, animate and direct an anime that was so vastly superior to AoT that you can stand around an criticize it for the stupidest reasons?

Are you so blinded by hubris that you fail to understand that your biggest complaint is about the dichotomy between the American and Japanese entertainment industry? "It's not a harem anime, it's not about giant mechs or scantily-clad ninjas!"

Seriously, both of you need to shut the fuck up. In your entire review you didn't say a single thing that didn't amount to 'I hate it because it's popular!'
I just love that our greatest takedown begins by pointing out that we're ugly and have brown hair. They're on to us, Dan! :)

To be more serious, no, I don't believe myself greater than anyone else when it comes to creating something. I enjoyed a lot of Attack on Titan, but I also felt that it was lacking in a lot of areas, namely plot progression, character development, and most importantly treating the audience with respect. The first half of the first season does a pretty great job with Eren, Mikasa, and Armin, has a few nice twists, and introduces an overall really fascinating concept. The second half of the first season attempts to undo all of that by throwing in more questions before stalling for time and then leaving off without answering anything significant. That, plus none of the other characters are given much development until after their important moments, which robs the moments of any weight. That's my take on it though, which isn't meant to be law or anything resembling law.

Again, I don't believe myself above the show, which is why I'm not worried about hurting its popularity or fanbase with a silly video on the Internet. Although your reaction does make me curious just how much power you think we have... Is it our brown hair? It's the brawn hair I bet. Brown hair is very threatening.
That's it, I'm dying my hair blond. Or maybe green, let's get crazy.
 

Triaed

Not Gone Gonzo
Jan 16, 2009
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So, does this mean that both, Dan and Chris, lost the debate for being on the same side?
I grant them the localisation point, but in no way can this be considered a "win"
 

coolenaab

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Jun 25, 2013
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I think you should try Black Lagoon, it has an amazing dub done by professionals and I think it feels more like an action movie than an anime so that could be a good element for people who don't really like anime in general.

My personal favorites are Steins;Gate, Gankutsuou: The Count of Monte Cristo and Death Note but they barley have any action so that may be a turn off for some people but thats why I like them, there more "intellectual" so to say.
 

Marik2

Phone Poster
Nov 10, 2009
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Go watch Ghost Stories cuz that is one of the few animes where the localization is 100 times better than the original.
 

Jennacide

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Dec 6, 2007
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I feel like they didn't even touch on some of the more obnoxious issues with Attack on Titan. What irked me most was as they pointed out, early on it'll get it's hooks in because of the interesting premise. But after 24 episodes NOTHING HAS HAPPENED YET, and it treats you like an idiot as they point out. I was so frustrated with nothing happening so far, I went online to look up what has been resolved in the story so far, and basically nothing has. We know who the Shifters are, and only vaguely what they were after but not why, and nothing else. Female Titan still isn't out of stasis, no idea what the connection to Titans and The Coordinate there is, what caused the Titan appearance, etc. And the manga has been running for over 5 years.

Attack on Titan is the Game of Thrones of anime. Everyone dies, nothing happens, and there is no end in sight.
 

Mossberg Shotty

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Jan 12, 2013
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Chris Pranger said:
Mossberg Shotty said:
Awesome, two ugly brown-haired guys bitching about an anime they could never hope to surpass. Exactly what are your credentials? Did you write, animate and direct an anime that was so vastly superior to AoT that you can stand around an criticize it for the stupidest reasons?

Are you so blinded by hubris that you fail to understand that your biggest complaint is about the dichotomy between the American and Japanese entertainment industry? "It's not a harem anime, it's not about giant mechs or scantily-clad ninjas!"

Seriously, both of you need to shut the fuck up. In your entire review you didn't say a single thing that didn't amount to 'I hate it because it's popular!'
I just love that our greatest takedown begins by pointing out that we're ugly and have brown hair. They're on to us, Dan! :)

To be more serious, no, I don't believe myself greater than anyone else when it comes to creating something. I enjoyed a lot of Attack on Titan, but I also felt that it was lacking in a lot of areas, namely plot progression, character development, and most importantly treating the audience with respect. The first half of the first season does a pretty great job with Eren, Mikasa, and Armin, has a few nice twists, and introduces an overall really fascinating concept. The second half of the first season attempts to undo all of that by throwing in more questions before stalling for time and then leaving off without answering anything significant. That, plus none of the other characters are given much development until after their important moments, which robs the moments of any weight. That's my take on it though, which isn't meant to be law or anything resembling law.

Again, I don't believe myself above the show, which is why I'm not worried about hurting its popularity or fanbase with a silly video on the Internet. Although your reaction does make me curious just how much power you think we have... Is it our brown hair? It's the brawn hair I bet. Brown hair is very threatening.
This isn't about brown hair. If you didn't notice, my hair is equally brown, if not more brown than yours. But on a more serious note, if you don't want your smug sense of superiority to come across, maybe you should adjust your on-camera persona to not behave as a self-righteous anime herald. I see you're going to slide over my point about the differences between the Japanese and American audience, so lets just let that one go. I don't see how making a few of the twists more obvious than your liking amounts to disrespecting the audience. I'm sure you're familiar with the whole 'if you introduce a gun in the first act, you must fire it in the second act' thing. You know when those characters might get more screen time an character development? In the second season. Again, you seem to be under this impression that every anime has some obligation to develop every single character, answer every single question and still be a compelling story all within one season. Are you so entitled that you can't wait for some of your questions to be answered? Do you not realize that that's the very thing that sparks debate and theories among the fans?

I know your opinions aren't law, and thank God for that, because if it was we would be left with nothing but boring, formulaic anime's that read like a Wikipedia page.
 

The Grim Ace

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May 20, 2010
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Strife2GFAQs said:
Ghost Stories

They scrapped the original concept and just wrote whatever stupid comedy **** they wanted ala Shin-Chan
Came here to say exactly this, it worked so well. Taking a show that probably couldn't work in the US due to a lack of familiarity with the subject matter and finding a ridiculously hilarious way to make it work.

Also, I think Eden of the East holds up very well outside of Japan.

Cybylt said:


No JoJo's recommendations? For shame.
Seconding this too, manliest anime to manly an anime.
 

TitanAura

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Jun 30, 2011
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THANK YOU. JESUS.

Anime you guys should watch? RWBY. It counts. And it has dialogue that doesn't make me want to put screwdrivers through my ears. And the annoying quirky characters who in anime are usually DEFINED by that singular trait? They actually have depth and a REASON for having that particular trait. In fact, I'd consider the show to be hands down one of the best examples of anime trope deconstruction because it was written by a couple of guys who, until they were tasked with writing the show, WERE NOT THAT FAMILIAR WITH ANIME.
 

Mad Nicole

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Mar 19, 2014
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Space Dandy is pretty good, English dub comes out first so it's always really spot on with the translation, since there is no translation.

ALSO! It's NOT based on a manga. It's its own thing.

It's directed by the same guy that did Bebop, but it's COMPLETELY different.
 

Coruptin

Inaction Master
Jul 9, 2009
258
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i can tell you some of what to avoid

gurren lagan
evangelion (or anything else that's parroted as psychological, complex, or dark)
kill la kill(pretty much anything in the sexy/cute girl with dangerous thing genre)
sword art online
high school of the dead
code geas
death note
most anything adapted from weekly serialized manga

edit: add mature to the list of parroted attributes to avoid
 

FPLOON

Your #1 Source for the Dino Porn
Jul 10, 2013
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What? No mentions/recommendations for Afro Samurai?!
https://secure.static.tumblr.com/ab5adc901c8f8428f6d1a73ba6c862f1/uljukhv/HPBmzhamx/tumblr_static_afro-samurai-002.jpg
It has Samuel L. F[reak]ing Jackson in it!!

(Well, that and it's short with a movie and stuff like that... Plus, everyone else mentioned the ones I was going to mention anyway, excluding Witchblade and its bittersweet mother/daughter "subplot"[footnote]Seriously, that's the best part about the anime Witchblade "adaptation"...[/footnote]...)
 

Nydestroyer

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Jun 12, 2011
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I really only watch subbed anime so I am not sure how good this is in dubbed but Steins;Gate is an extremely good anime that is now in my top 3 above Death Note and just below Phantom: Requiem for A Phantom. Basically its a time travel type show with a "Mad Scientist" main character the side characters are kind of poor sometimes but the story is whats really good. I will note it is not an action anime but it is very story driven.
 

Spyre2k

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Apr 9, 2013
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I highly recommend Madoka Magica. I originally found out about it when http://sfdebris.com/ did a review on it and gave it glowing praise. Which was kind of a surprise because he is an admitted anime novice and not really interest in it, he only did it because of a request. The series is very concise with every episode building the characters, plot, and world over the 12 episodes.


I saw some people recommend Steins Gate and I'm kind of mixed on that one. I do think it's good given the overall story and twist but it does have the pacing issue you guys mention in the episode. I originally watched the series based on a recommendation from a guild mate who claimed it was the best anime ever, I have to disagree on that one. The first episode was hair pullingly slow and frustrating to sit through. The main character was obnoxious and annoying beyond anything I had seen in any other anime. But after the extremely slow first 5 or so episodes things pick up and it does get better as the main character gets dialed down a lot to not be as obnoxious. Though a few more slow episodes do pop in during the rest of the run but it finishes on a strong note which I think is what sticks with most people.
 

Therumancer

Citation Needed
Nov 28, 2007
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Well, I'm not as big an anime fan as I used to be, but I think I understand the problem. A lot of the "big" series intended to occupy long term spots on TV like Bleach, Naruto, Dragonball, etc... tend to involve tons of filler because they are something people tend to get into as part of a routine, and it's set up where missing an episode or two isn't likely to be a big deal. This becomes more noticeable if you sit down for a few hours for some video entertainment as opposed to seeing it spaced out over a period of time. Now that Anime is better known, the novelty of it and it's unique tropes don't carry things so well. I get the impression from things I've heard that "Attack On Titan" was probably conceived as a show in that vein but for various reasons it might not peak out that way.

That said, I think one of the big problems with Anime is that attempts at drama and more serious storytelling don't always pan out because of localization issues... and yes, fan translations can be better than professional ones, in part because the fans just sit down and do it, and are motivated to do it right for reasons of love (though this is not always true), the pros drag their feet instead of planning for immediate localization, and then when they finally get around to it, it seems the people they get have a sort of "why bother" attitude, especially if someone else already did a version as accurate as anything they could turn out.

I think series like "Higurashi: When They Cry" (basically an anime-horror version of Groundhog's Day, where you have a few episodes of nothing much happening, followed by a massacre and a reset) never caught on, because they were so heavily dependent on translating a drama without a whole lot of frequent action to tie things together, not to mention that a lot of it is a mystery and certain hints or things that are supposed to make you wonder can revolve around something as simple as a turn of phrase.

That said while it's a mixed bag there are a number of Anime series that I think do well at not having a huge reliance on drama and a lot of stuff going on so things happen in each episode.


Outlaw Star
Escaflowne
Gantz
The Dirty Pair (just about everything)
Coyote Ragtime Show
R.O.D. (Read Or Die)
Fushigi Yuigi: The Mysterious Play (and it's sequel)
Revolutionary Girl Utena (the series, the self contained movie is even more surreal and works best if you see series 1st)
Gundam W
Gundam Seed (less impressed with it's sequel)
Noir
Baccano
Deadman Wonderland
Dagan Rompa
Spiral
Dual
Lost Universe
Ruruni Kenshin (the TV comedy series, not so much the Samurai X stand alones)
Rune Soldier
Soul Eater
Soul Hunter
Hellsing
Bubblegum Crisis 2040
Corpse Party (anime viewable on Youtube still I believe)


I could go on, this is a mixed bag, ranging from truly surreal comedies, to the fairly serious. I don't want to post a huge message full of nothing but titles (as my messages tend to be long enough). While a lot of those series might have a filler episode or two (the cast goes to a hot spring!) they generally stay on target and have things happen to move the story forward in pretty much all the episodes and/or do episodes with a self-contained plotline. "Ghost In The Shell" (two seasons) is an example of a series that does both "metaplot" episodes and ones that are self contained representing other cases the cyborg police get involved in outside of the main plot (since the world doesn't stop) and need to be dealt with.

To be honest my problem with Anime oftentimes revolves around terrible endings, many of which can actually be worse than the end of "Mass Effect 3" and that can take some doing. :)

I'll include an honorable mention for "Hell Girl" which is kind of grim, but pretty much every episode is self contained. It's basically about a demon people can summon and sic on other people to take them to hell, but in return when they die they go to hell themselves. So pretty much every episode ends with everyone being doomed to eternal agony, though whomever summoned The Hell Girl usually has things turn out a bit better for them on earth for a bit. It follows a pretty standard formula (bad stuff happens, person calls Hell Girl, is shown that the cost of justice/revenge/setting things right is going to hell, the person usually refuses, things get worse, hell girl is called again, unholy vengeance is wrecked on the tormentors, and things get better for the summoner but they are also equally doomed). I could personally only take so much of a series where nothing good happens to anyone, ever, I mean even the demon seems perpetually depressed and unhappy with her job. :)
 

mrwolfdw

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Sep 16, 2014
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Good English dub?
Trigun
Ninja Scroll
Samurai X: Trust
Samurai X: Betrayal
Anything made by Studio Ghibli

Worst English dub ever for one of the best anime series ever?
Vision of Escaflowne

It's best and probably easier to find a good subtitled edition. The original Japanese voice actors are much better at actually acting, instead of just reading a script into a microphone.
Then watch GTO (Great Teacher Onizuka) and Samurai Champloo. And Vision of Escaflowne. And Trigun and Ninja Scroll and the Studio Ghibli films again. But not Samurai X. That's the only anime I know that's better in English.


Be advised, these are my opinions and not objective fact.