(NSFW) Assassin's Creed: Unisexity

Do4600

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That elicited a robust guffaw, thank you for that.

Perhaps now the E3 crowd realize that if they have tens of millions in their budget, they might as well begin development with male and female models, if only to cater to a wider market. It's a terrible shame that they for the most part have to be pressured into taking more money from more people.
 

Aaron Sylvester

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Ubisoft are either slapping themselves for giving such a dumb reply to those questions (when there are at least 5 non-stupid replies I could've easily thought of)....

OR

They are congratulating themselves because this controversy is reeling in TON of free marketing for their game based on the law of "no publicity is bad publicity", i.e. everything is going as planned.


Hmmm it's really hard to say because Ubisoft can't be that stupid, but they cant' be that SMART either. I genuinely don't know :p
 

Darknacht

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While I don't see a problem with making a generic androgynous previously male character a generic female character, I also don't really see a point. Some people will see it as progressive and others with complain that its just continuing the trope of female characters just being gender swapped versions of their male counter parts.
Besides I've always though a far more interesting idea is to have Link and Zelda working together in a game Lost Vikings style.
 

Grahav

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Aaron Sylvester said:
Ubisoft are either slapping themselves for giving such a dumb reply to those questions (when there are at least 5 non-stupid replies I could've easily thought of)....

OR

They are congratulating themselves because this controversy is reeling in TON of free marketing for their game based on the law of "no publicity is bad publicity", i.e. everything is going as planned.


Hmmm it's really hard to say because Ubisoft can't be that stupid, but they cant' be that SMART either. I genuinely don't know :p
Who knows? Maybe they do a magical trick and at the last hour they pull a female off from their hats: "Lol, just trolling for free advertising. We wouldn't get this much attention if we presented a female firsthand."
 

truckspond

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byte4554 said:
For the love of...It's one guy. ONE GUY. THERE IS NO FEMALE CHOICE BECAUSE IT'S ONE CHARACTER! ADDING A FEMALE PLAYER CHARACTER WOULD MEAN ADDING A SECOND PROTAGONIST.

Sorry. It's just that every thread and every single comic and every single video ignores this fact. It's not that they hate women, it's that they didn't want a second protagonist.
THIS IS NOT IN THE SINGLE PLAYER! THIS IS IN A SEPARATE COOP CAMPAIGN WHERE THERE ARE ALREADY FOUR SEPARATE CHARACTERS TO BEGIN WITH!
 
Aug 31, 2011
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Eclectic Dreck said:
(snip)

By contrast, adding a bit of DLC that gives a new outfit or weapon only requires a fraction of the work - a new model and a new texture and whatever game files govern the behavior of that item. Moreover, adding lots of DLC offers additional avenues for revenue where adding female characters offers precisely nothing tangible. Thus, if pressed for time, which do you think will be cut? The easy DLC that might net a hundreds of thousands if not millions of dollars or female playable characters?
I call nonsense. They're assassins wearing hooded cloaks for almost the entirety of gameplay. You could get away with just having voice actresses. Call her 'slim' and get on with it.

See, as a female gamer who has heard this same excuse from a dozen games, I'd rather spend my money elsewhere. Which is a shame, because I'm exactly the sort of gamer who'd pony up for a pre-order. I do love me some four-player co-op. (And no, this isn't the first time I've refused purchasing a game because of what amounts to casual, 'it's not worth it' exclusion of women in a game.)
 

Eclectic Dreck

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Overquoted said:
Eclectic Dreck said:
(snip)

By contrast, adding a bit of DLC that gives a new outfit or weapon only requires a fraction of the work - a new model and a new texture and whatever game files govern the behavior of that item. Moreover, adding lots of DLC offers additional avenues for revenue where adding female characters offers precisely nothing tangible. Thus, if pressed for time, which do you think will be cut? The easy DLC that might net a hundreds of thousands if not millions of dollars or female playable characters?
I call nonsense. They're assassins wearing hooded cloaks for almost the entirety of gameplay. You could get away with just having voice actresses. Call her 'slim' and get on with it.

See, as a female gamer who has heard this same excuse from a dozen games, I'd rather spend my money elsewhere. Which is a shame, because I'm exactly the sort of gamer who'd pony up for a pre-order. I do love me some four-player co-op. (And no, this isn't the first time I've refused purchasing a game because of what amounts to casual, 'it's not worth it' exclusion of women in a game.)
Read Shamus' post on this very subject as it would make more or less the same argument I will. To put it simply, the female character would require lots of work or else it would be a poor implementation that would look and feel like it was tacked on. They opted to not spend the resources to do it properly or at all and, again, without being able to understand how they would benefit from the move (i.e., what the impact on the bottom line would be) what argument is there?

They are ultimately, like any large corporation, motivated by profit. It is easy to make a case for DLC but difficult to argue that they ought to add a feature that serves no function nor has any tangible benefit on the bottom line. That, fundamentally, is the problem: being inclusive to all races and genders and sexual identities is difficult to attach a price tag to and thus arguing for inclusiveness is to fight an uphill battle.
 

Elberik

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Drake666 said:
byte4554 said:
For the love of...It's one guy. ONE GUY. THERE IS NO FEMALE CHOICE BECAUSE IT'S ONE CHARACTER! ADDING A FEMALE PLAYER CHARACTER WOULD MEAN ADDING A SECOND PROTAGONIST.

Sorry. It's just that every thread and every single comic and every single video ignores this fact. It's not that they hate women, it's that they didn't want a second protagonist.
Hum. You know that in AC: Unity, there is 4 players, right?

*EDIT* Or at least a 4 player mode. *EDIT*
Each of the 4 players perceives themselves as the main character. The other 3 are just guys wearing different cloaks.
 

Lyvric

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CorvusFerreum said:
Schadrach said:
CorvusFerreum said:
snip
I personally won't really care if I play a man, a woman, a dog or a fungus from space. As long as the gameplay is enjoyable, I'm fine.
It just annoys me, that the gaming industry doesn't seem to be willing to put the least bit of effort into something that most likely would increase the appeal of the product. This lazy, bloated attitude really get's to me.
Okay I know this is about female characters being popular and new models costing more money...

But you can't tell me I'm not the only one who thinks an assassin fungus from space back in time wouldn't be pretty awesome! Anyone?
 

SacremPyrobolum

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Vault101 said:
At least EA can see the profit I'm including feeeeeemales...even if they are ferengi
Wait, whose a Ferengi?

Anyways, I hope this is the last we spend on this subject. Everything that could be said has. We have to move on and start bashing Ubi for withholding complete WiiU games. Maybe after that we can even get another publisher on the chopping block of hate!
 

Vault101

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Sep 26, 2010
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SacremPyrobolum said:
Wait, whose a Ferengi?
EA

I mean Ferengi don't give a dan about feeeeemales...but I'm sure if you convince them theres profit to be had...
 

Dark Knifer

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I don't know why anyone was expecting anything but laziness in terms of assassins creed. Is a yearly release cash grab, why was anyone expecting them to be progressive? Particularly in a series that's main deal is gameplay because the characters are so weak sauce that even if they had a female character she'd be completely boring and pointless.

I'd rather have actual strong females instead of a co-op reskin that adds nothing.

Basically, ubisoft are lazy in writing, dunno why anyone is in surprise but innovation won't come from a company like that.

Look elsewhere for progression.
 

octafish

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Requia said:
Legion said:
Whereas yourself and many others are choosing to ignore the fact that Ubisoft have explicitly stated that they did want a female character but it was too resource intensive to do so.
Didn't one of the devs come out and say this was bullshit?


Grey: Is that art history thing the woman who killed the famous jocobin being dragged away? Can't remember either of their names to Google.
Charlotte Corday, killed Jean-Paul Marat in his bath. However, as others have pointed out, it is not Corday it is Liberty.

Ubisoft? They have no fucking idea about anything. Their time here is short.
 

spoonybard.hahs

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youji itami said:
Yeah Ubisoft is so rich!

https://www.ubisoftgroup.com/comsite_common/en-US/images/d20140515031323ubisoft%20fy14%20earnings%20english%20finaltcm99143198.pdf

oh look Ubisoft lost ?65 million last year.
That's in operating costs. Ubisoft still raked in hundreds of millions of dollars (over 700 million, in fact) in profit.
 

Shirokurou

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I did the exact joke about cancelling Marianne too. Great minds think alike.

Also, while discussing this on Twitter I wondered: "Couldn't they just use the animations from the female characters in the multiplayer?" someone told me, that there won't be a usual competitive multiplayer. F' you, Ubisoft.

I might actually sit this AssCreed out. No ships, no girls, no MP...Meh.
 

w00tage

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Eclectic Dreck said:
w00tage said:
This sounds perfectly logical, if it weren't for all of the other game studios that do exactly this as a matter of course. Creating a female character and having them share the animations n'stuff is absolutely commonplace and it's BS that they said "waaahh we don't have enough money".
Other games manage because having high quality animation isn't particularly important. In Skyrim, all human characters use the same animations across the board and they generally look fairly bad. Stabbings where you never actually touched them with the knife or sword are common. Acting, such that it is, is incredibly wooden - a fact that has generated more than one meme. To this day there are people working for free to modify those art assets that Bethesda had years to work on.

By contrast, if you want a female playable character in that universe, you can't get away with just swapping the models. Clipping errors and graphical glitches would be fantastically common not to mention the simple fact that in any cut scene, having the female character do exactly what the male character does would be off putting and more importantly calls into question why you'd want the female character in the first place.

Now, that is obviously a readily solved problem. After all, they have artists of all stripes. But time and resources are limited and bear in mind what Ubisoft wants is to make a profit and importantly have that profit delivered within a certain window during the fiscal year. Ultimately that means they are going to spend money to purchase time and even with a large budget you can surely understand you'll have a finite amount of time to spend. Thus, when budgeting the time, what benefit is there to spending a huge chunk of that time budget adding a playable female when that time could be spent doing literally anything else (some of which could offer additional revenue streams)?

That of course leads to your next point.

w00tage said:
News flash to game developers, if players WANT something,
Players, which I will substitute for consumers, do not know what they want. If you ask them they simply say "that thing I liked but more so". To famously misquote Ford, if he gave the consumers what they wanted we'd just have a faster horse. That's just a blanket statement of course and not particularly directed at your comment. It's just a general observation.

w00tage said:
and you want the player's MONEY, you GIVE THEM WHAT THEY WANT.
When players buy millions of copies of the next game they will have demonstrated the fundamental flaw of this line of reasoning. People are going to buy this game. Lots and lots of copies. They will also buy the DLC - millions of downloads worth easily. This thus proves that people will buy something even if it isn't exactly what they want. Unless, of course, they somehow don't sell millions of copies and somehow consumers manage to consistently assert that they refused to make the purchase because of the gender thing. Then they might manage to make a point.

w00tage said:
That is the secret to making money versus losing money, Ubisoft.
Ubisoft has consistently made money on the franchise in spite of everything from DRM that made Assassin's Creed 2 all but unplayable on PC to having one of the more disgusting DLC strategies out there. They thus seem to understand perfectly well how to grind money from their audience.

w00tage said:
Trying to cheap out =/= making money, it == saving money. But you kind of have to prioritize making it in the first place, know what I'm saying?
Saving money is making money.

Consider the following easy scenario. Say I have a game that cost 30 million dollars to make and 50 million dollars to market. This game sells 10 million copies and I receive 30 dollars per copy. I have brought in 300 million in revenue but I spent 80 million to get that revenue. Thus my profit is 220 million dollars.

Now, say I take that same 30 million dollar game and that same 50 million dollar marketing budget and I decide I want to add a female playable character and have determined (based on what it took to make the male character) that it would cost about 6 million dollars that I will spend on writing and recording new dialog, custom animations for the female characters and lots of re-animation of existing scenes not to mention models and 2d art. My game now cost a total of 86m million dollars to make and thus in order to receive the same profit, I need to make 306 million dollars. The question becomes (in this case), do I think that this change will increase sales by at least 200,000 copies? Because if it does not increase sales, I have effectively reduced my net profit.

That is a big part of why things get cut. At some point a studio tries to figure out how important some feature or item might be and if it is determined that it isn't cost effective, it gets cut.

There is, of course, a different way to approach this problem - just make the player character female from the start. That would still require more work than using a male character (especially an established male character) but it would allow more resources to be directed to the natural end of having a good game built around a good character. Of course, the problem here is that there is a fairly well documented problem that games with female leads tend to not sell well. That may, of course, just be because most of those games weren't particularly good but regardless it's been cited as true by more than one industry leader.
So...much... plausible-sounding diversion from...actual realities.....unable to...maintain interest in...arguing with...apologists for...bad companies.....must go...do something useful instead....

Nah, not really. I got time to sort your stuff out. Your points are well written to be sure, but frankly invalid, and contradictory on their very face. Let's state some realities to clear the smoke and take down the mirrors.

1. Ubisoft was in complete control of this new games' production from start to finish. Therefore, everything wrong with the game in the eyes of their consumers is completely their fault, and those consumers are completely in the right to hold them accountable for it. If they mismanaged the production of the game so that they couldn't deliver promised features, that is explicitly their fault and they as a whole company are liable for it. Welcome to business.

2. Everyone can tell you what they want at any time. It's explicitly the job of someone who is offering goods or services to people to understand what their consumers want and to deliver it. Welcome to business.

3. Misogyny in the form of sexploitation and second-class citizenry is an official games-industry thing. Welcome to the unholy union of Hollywood and the games industry.

4. Ubisoft, knowing all of the above, promised a playable female main character. Welcome to making promises that hit hot-button issues and raise the hopes of your fans. Edit: and welcome to the fallout when you dump on a promise that is routinely delivered by other companies in the same industry because "it would be too hard / cost too much".

5. Your personal opinion (or mine) on how difficult / not difficult it is to deliver that feature is completely irrelevant, as is your and my opinion on what quality levels would be accepted by the consumer base. The fact that other game studios routinely deliver playable female main characters, and those games sell, belies any claims that Ubisoft "couldn't do it for reasons of resources" or that "it wouldn't be good enough".

6. Re how many copies will be sold anyways, what's the historical return rate on software by dissatisfied consumers? O wait, this is a protected industry, consumer protection laws don't apply to software buyers. Therefore companies can sell complete shite all day long and use "caveat emptor" as a fig leaf for fraud. And game companies can partner with monopolistic console developers and create vast legions of captive audiences for their content, because monopoly.

You're right, a lot of copies will doubtless be sold, based on the marketing and recognition of the franchise. But let's not pretend the consumer will have, or ever has had under these monopolies, any real choice. If they want the game console to work, they have to buy games for it. Unless there's a playable demo version involved, the decision on what game to buy is not based on perceived value, it's based on promised value. And software consumers cannot return products after purchase even if they have been outright defrauded.

So all claims of consumer choice being responsible for a product's success are bogus under this model. (And industry protectionism like this is a fine example of why we should not let our government (US here) accept money from lobbyists to fund the campaigns by which they keep their jobs.)

7. Re your "real world example", I have to ask, did no one ever tell you that spinning the whole equation around to play net-profit games is a great way to reduce your gross sales and therefore your gross and net profits? You cannot assume your sales numbers will stay the same when the product has changed. And if Ubisoft guessed wrong on what features would be important to their anticipated consumer base, is that not totally their fault?

The fact is consumers are willing to buy more of and pay more for what they have specifically stated they want. That is one of the secrets of the crowdfunding explosion, fyi - that is so true a reality that people will pay full price IN ADVANCE as long as they can declare "that's what I want" at the time of pre-purchase. Companies which let marketing and upper management try to guess what people want are ignoring that reality, but it's extremely commonplace due to ivory-office syndrome.

Good try on the whole deconstruction thing, but some of us are successful because we listen to what people want, deliver as much as we can, and are completely open about what we can and can't do throughout the entire process. Companies which don't do this imo need to go the way of the dinosaurs to make room for companies that will.
 

youji itami

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spoonybard.hahs said:
youji itami said:
Yeah Ubisoft is so rich!

https://www.ubisoftgroup.com/comsite_common/en-US/images/d20140515031323ubisoft%20fy14%20earnings%20english%20finaltcm99143198.pdf

oh look Ubisoft lost ?65 million last year.
That's in operating costs. Ubisoft still raked in hundreds of millions of dollars (over 700 million, in fact) in profit.
Scroll down in my link to page 8.

Ubisoft had revenue of ?1 billion for the 12 months ending 31st of March 2014 there gross profit/margin was ?700 million but that is irrelevant just like revenue it's net profit that matters and that was a ?65 million loss.
 

spoonybard.hahs

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youji itami said:
spoonybard.hahs said:
youji itami said:
Yeah Ubisoft is so rich!

https://www.ubisoftgroup.com/comsite_common/en-US/images/d20140515031323ubisoft%20fy14%20earnings%20english%20finaltcm99143198.pdf

oh look Ubisoft lost ?65 million last year.
That's in operating costs. Ubisoft still raked in hundreds of millions of dollars (over 700 million, in fact) in profit.
Scroll down in my link to page 8.

Ubisoft had revenue of ?1 billion for the 12 months ending 31st of March 2014 there gross profit/margin was ?700 million but that is irrelevant just like revenue it's net profit that matters and that was a ?65 million loss.
A 65 million loss compared to either their revenue or their actual net profit is like spitting in a puddle. That is less than a 10% loss out of their profit, which is not enough to hurt a company. And either way, it's from operating costs, which is an expected expense (or in this case, an expected expense they need to reign in). It's not like they lost the money due to extremely poor sales. And even with a dip in their sales figures, they still pulled in a shit ton of cash.

Regardless, this is still a discussion of a company not using its money and resources wisely.

EDIT: And by using its money wisely, I mean by spending money on attracting other demos.
 

Quellist

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Oct 7, 2010
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Daystar Clarion said:
Dem tags XD

Everyone knows women can't be assassins, their boobs are adverse to violence. Ever seen an angry boob?

The Council or Uteri would have a field day!
Just reading this makes me want to make an angry birds reskin...

If only I had any programming skill whatsoever