Pacific Rim Beaten by Adam Sandler at Box Office

[HalfTangible]

... Look, I get that Pacific Rim isn't perfect and isn't the kind of movie that's going to appeal to everyone, but COME ON, how does it get beat by Adam Sandler?!

I'm just glad I was wrong the first time I read the article and thought it'd been beaten by Lone Ranger, too. At that point, I'm not sure what i'd have done ._.

Meh, Pacific Rim brought in $91 million [http://boxofficemojo.com/movies/?id=pacificrim.htm] worldwide. GU2 only managed to get $43 million [http://boxofficemojo.com/movies/?id=grownups2.htm] worldwide. Pacific Rim hasn't even opened in China and Japan. So globally, PR will certainly crush GU2, but for a lot of folks, the US market seems to be only thing that matters.

Sadly, this is too true. Box office is all that matters to too many people... which is precisely why this worries me. Watch the Big Picture episode on the Mountains of Madness (the episode's name escapes me at the moment) sometime, you'll see why.

EDIT: Found it! The Numbers.
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/the-big-picture/3281-The-Numbers

 

[Hutzpah Chicken]

One could say that most of the sales for Grown Ups 2 was for child tickets, but any kid would rather see giant mechs beating up giant, alien monsters. ANYBODY, except maybe Jane Fonda, would go see mechs putting the smackdown on anything. Long live the awesome movie genre!

 

[dreadedcandiru99]

Adam Sandler hasn't been funny.

There, fixed.

Seriously, America, what the fuck is wrong with you?

 

[Flatfrog]

My problem is when you come in here and criticize us for liking what we liked. You call us out for letting a movie get away with being dumb and cliched when you have done exactly the same thing when it was the thing you liked. You let the Dark Knight and the Avengers get away with being dumb and cliched because you like those movies. And I agree with you. I like those movies a lot. Just don't criticize me for letting something I like get away with being dumb and cliched because you don't like it.

Well hold on a second. I didn't criticise you for liking the movie, I just criticised the movie, and then you asked me to back it up so I did. And I criticised MovieBob for allowing it to get away with a level of dumbness which he wouldn't have tolerated in other movies, because criticising movies is his job. And I expressed surprise about how passionate people are becoming about this movie when it just seemed pretty stupid to me.

That lightness of tone stuff is not true if you think about it. Dark Knight was as heavy a movie as you can get and you have specifically, in this thread, used it as a positive example against Pacific Rim. While Dark Knight has a good deal of humor none of it is lighthearted. Pacific Rim, on the other hand, never takes itself too seriously, breaking up even the most intense action scenes with lighthearted jokes. So that cannot be the reason you find the robot with the sword so much worse.

There's a difference between lightness of tone and lightheartedness, which I may not have made clear because I was focusing on Avengers rather than Dark Knight. Avengers is a much better example anyway because it's a much better candidate for dismissing as a big dumb movie than Dark Knight is. I don't think there's much of a comparison with Dark Knight because it goes entirely the other way - rather than embracing the silliness of its concept and going out bold and brash with it, it takes the silly concept and treats it mostly seriously (although it does have plenty of humour too). But again, Dark Knight is primarily a character movie, where the big set pieces are built around the interactions between the three main characters and the ambiguity of hero and villain.

You like the cliches and tropes in the Avengers more than the ones in Pacific Rim. You dislike event driven plots and you are more willing to put up with the dumbness of superhero movies than the dumbness of giant robot movies, all of which are completely valid positions. You like what you like. But we like what we like.

Sure, but then at the same time you can't turn round and be unhappy that the movie you like *despite all its acknowledged flaws* is not appreciated by other people, who prefer an Adam Sandler vehicle despite all *its* acknowledged flaws.

In any case, this isn't just about tropes and cliches. There's nothing wrong with taking a trope if you then do something new and original with it, and I just don't think there was a single new and original thing in PR, apart possibly from the neural interface thing. It was a grand homage (and a grand fromage) to the great monster movies, and while it did what it did very well, I don't think it brought anything new to the table, and it certainly did nothing to make me care one iota for the characters and their struggle.

 

[DrOswald]

My problem is when you come in here and criticize us for liking what we liked. You call us out for letting a movie get away with being dumb and cliched when you have done exactly the same thing when it was the thing you liked. You let the Dark Knight and the Avengers get away with being dumb and cliched because you like those movies. And I agree with you. I like those movies a lot. Just don't criticize me for letting something I like get away with being dumb and cliched because you don't like it.

Well hold on a second. I didn't criticise you for liking the movie, I just criticised the movie, and then you asked me to back it up so I did. And I criticised MovieBob for allowing it to get away with a level of dumbness which he wouldn't have tolerated in other movies, because criticising movies is his job. And I expressed surprise about how passionate people are becoming about this movie when it just seemed pretty stupid to me.

That lightness of tone stuff is not true if you think about it. Dark Knight was as heavy a movie as you can get and you have specifically, in this thread, used it as a positive example against Pacific Rim. While Dark Knight has a good deal of humor none of it is lighthearted. Pacific Rim, on the other hand, never takes itself too seriously, breaking up even the most intense action scenes with lighthearted jokes. So that cannot be the reason you find the robot with the sword so much worse.

There's a difference between lightness of tone and lightheartedness, which I may not have made clear because I was focusing on Avengers rather than Dark Knight. Avengers is a much better example anyway because it's a much better candidate for dismissing as a big dumb movie than Dark Knight is. I don't think there's much of a comparison with Dark Knight because it goes entirely the other way - rather than embracing the silliness of its concept and going out bold and brash with it, it takes the silly concept and treats it mostly seriously (although it does have plenty of humour too). But again, Dark Knight is primarily a character movie, where the big set pieces are built around the interactions between the three main characters and the ambiguity of hero and villain.

You like the cliches and tropes in the Avengers more than the ones in Pacific Rim. You dislike event driven plots and you are more willing to put up with the dumbness of superhero movies than the dumbness of giant robot movies, all of which are completely valid positions. You like what you like. But we like what we like.

Sure, but then at the same time you can't turn round and be unhappy that the movie you like *despite all its acknowledged flaws* is not appreciated by other people, who prefer an Adam Sandler vehicle despite all *its* acknowledged flaws.

In any case, this isn't just about tropes and cliches. There's nothing wrong with taking a trope if you then do something new and original with it, and I just don't think there was a single new and original thing in PR, apart possibly from the neural interface thing. It was a grand homage (and a grand fromage) to the great monster movies, and while it did what it did very well, I don't think it brought anything new to the table, and it certainly did nothing to make me care one iota for the characters and their struggle.

"But Jesus, you should not have let this movie get away with being as dumb and cliched as it was."

That is not a criticism of the movie, that is a criticism of the people who thought the movie was good. You may not have meant to say that but you did.

For a basic and stupid analogy, if you walk into a room with a thousand people all wearing green shirts and then say "Jesus Jim, why did you were a green shirt? They are so fucking dumb!" That is a criticism of everyone who wore a green shirt. Especially when you say it to the room at large with very little possibility that the person you are directing it to will even hear it.

As far as the tropes and cliches go, how exactly did The Avengers do anything new with their tropes? What was this original mix that they managed to put in there that justifies the use of all these old ideas? Because I really don't see it and I have watched The Avengers probably a dozen times. They don't do anything new or original in that movie. What they do is execute each and every cliche they use at an excellent level. They did a very good job of reusing old ideas. The Avengers was a movie about old characters in a familiar situation in an over saturated genre executed with a high level of excellence. It felt fresh to you because it was enjoyable.

Pacific Rim, on the other hand, is a new movie about new characters who we have never seen before. They came up with all new monster concepts and robot designs from scratch. They used the idea of mental linking to the robot in a new and interesting way. They attempted to make the giant robot and giant monster genres something more than a joke in mainstream movies. The robots had unusual, original, and competently made designs. But I will give you that the movie was rough. The acting was not as good as it could have been. The characters were a bit shallow. The plot had holes. It was no where near as polished as The Avengers. But don't tell me that The Avengers is better because it is more original.

On tone and silly genre conventions: So dumb things in movies only works when the movie has a light tone or is very serious? OK.

 

[sageoftruth]

Considering it's still summer, I'm not too surprised. Kids are still enjoying their summer vacation. They were probably filling the box office. When I was a little kid, I enjoyed movies like Mr. Nanny and Power Rangers the Movie. Knowing the theaters were filled with people sporting the same mindset, it seems inevitable that a Pixar film and and Adam Sandler movie came out on top.

 

[Olas]

yes, how dare they not like old made new giant robots vs monster b movie flicks and go for b movie quality social comedy flicks.

Pacific Rim has more comedy in it than Grown Ups did, and from what I've heard Grownups 2 is even worse.

 

[Drake the Dragonheart]

That makes very, very sad. You there! It's your fault! Go see Pacific Rim to try and rectify the issue. It's fun.

Alternatively, anyone else think we should send a Jaeger after Adam Sandler and see who's laughing then?

Not mine. I have already seen it twice, thinking about a third time! Maybe even do what one buddy did with Spider-Man 2. Went to the first showing of the day, as soon as it was over, went into the lobby, got another ticket, and basically watched it the whole day.

Well shit.

But did anyone honestly not see this coming?
/cynicism

Oh well, I'll try to remedy this issue by dragging as many people I know as possible to go see it tomorrow.

TOMORROW, WE ARE CANCELLING THE BOX-OFFICALYPSE!
/terrible, terrible joke

I got a great laugh out of that! so, good job!

 

[Roxor]

I understand why it isn't popular, it's because it doesn't show America saving the world. I didn't want to be they guy that said it, but there it is.

And now we are punished with Adam Sandler because of it.

You need America saving the day to have a popular movie in America? Bloody hell, the Yanks must have really fragile egos...

 

[4RM3D]

Pacific Rim Beat(s)en by Adam Sandler at Box Office

There, I fixed the title for you.

 

[KazeAizen]

I had no problem with Pacific Rim getting beat by Despicable Me 2. The first was good and while I haven't seen the second one yet I can't say I was mad that it got a second movie. Heck I forgot Pacific Rim opened against that one as well. My biggest complaint is that to me Grown Ups 2 is a sequel that did not deserve to see the light of day. In two genres that don't really demand sequels all the time i. e. horror and comedy studios decide that it is a splendid idea to run them into the ground. For instance Hangover should've just been a comedy classic and stand alone movie. Not a deteriorating trilogy. Hopefully Pacific Rim picks up and makes the money it deserves because if that happens that live action Evangelion movie they've been trying to make for like the last 5 years or so will finally get green lit.

 

[Extra-Ordinary]

Pacific Rim loses to Despicable Me 2.
Okay, fine. That's kind of expected in hindsight.
Pacific Rim losing to Grown Ups 2.
...
Personally, I think the "I don't want to live on this planet anymore" joke is a bit overdone, but I legitimately do not want to live on a planet where Grown Ups 2 is doing better than Pacific Rim.

 

[Lovely Mixture]

GU2 just sells on celebrity names. So I'm not surprised.

Pacific Rim sells on its plot and Guillermo del Toro's directing it. For it to make 3rd place, I'm happy enough.

 

[Mezworld24]

Okay, this shouldn't be a 'geek only thing'. The average human should have a greater desire to see giant robots fighting giant monsters than seeing Adam Sandler doing the same thing he has done in every other film he has ever been in.

 

[endtherapture]

With the hype that Pacific rim has got, if I see it, I expect it to be no worse than Gladiator, The Dark Knight and Fight Club combined.

 

[SonicWaffle]

Pacific Rim has more comedy in it than Grown Ups did, and from what I've heard Grownups 2 is even worse.

...Pacific Rim had comedy? I'm not trolling you here, I just genuinely don't remember any.

Pacific Rim sells on its plot and Guillermo del Toro's directing it. For it to make 3rd place, I'm happy enough.

Pacific Rim sells on the fact it has big robots and monsters. Turns out that isn't as big a draw as we all thought. As far as plot goes, all the bits which weren't robots punching monsters (and as the film wore on, even some of the bits that were about giant battles) were really dull and cheesier than an unwashed penis. I say this as someone who saw it the day after release and really wanted to love it, but the movie was pretty bad outside of the (admittedly epic) fight scenes.

3rd place is pretty good for a movie wwhose only selling point is impressive spectacle.

 

[Lovely Mixture]

Pacific Rim sells on the fact it has big robots and monsters.

Well yeah, that is its plot. We seem to be on the same page.

3rd place is pretty good for a movie wwhose only selling point is impressive spectacle.

It's what Guillermo does best, love or hate the man. His spectacles are nice to look at.

 

[SonicWaffle]

Pacific Rim sells on the fact it has big robots and monsters.

Well yeah, that is its plot. We seem to be on the same page.

I'd call that a concept rather than a plot. If the entire plot were just "robots and monsters fighting" nothing would ever be explained, it'd just be a constant fight scene. The plot itself, near as I can recall, was about emotionally damaged people overcoming their problems to kick some ass, and I just didn't connect with it. It felt very much like what it was; an excuse for the fight scenes. I don't have a problem with that per se, but when the excuse plot takes up way more time than the reason I came to see the movie, I find myself getting pretty darn bored.

3rd place is pretty good for a movie wwhose only selling point is impressive spectacle.

It's what Guillermo does best, love or hate the man. His spectacles are nice to look at.

Certainly, I'm not disagreeing there. As I said, though, it's the balance issue. Spectacle was the selling point, and as such it should have been the driving force, not an occasional aside so the movie could focus more on the comparatively weak human drama element.

 

[Lovely Mixture]

I'd call that a concept rather than a plot. If the entire plot were just "robots and monsters fighting" nothing would ever be explained, it'd just be a constant fight scene. The plot itself, near as I can recall, was about emotionally damaged people overcoming their problems to kick some ass, and I just didn't connect with it.

True, you could argue that. I mean, the concept has been used so much that it's hard to call it a standard plot instead of a gimmick.
Obviously the film is using that as it's selling point and using additional factors to try and make it more entertaining.

It felt very much like what it was; an excuse for the fight scenes. I don't have a problem with that per se, but when the excuse plot takes up way more time than the reason I came to see the movie, I find myself getting pretty darn bored.

That can be a problem. I haven't seen the film yet, but this gives me a good idea about what to be cautious for.

Certainly, I'm not disagreeing there. As I said, though, it's the balance issue. Spectacle was the selling point, and as such it should have been the driving force, not an occasional aside so the movie could focus more on the comparatively weak human drama element.

My bad, I didn't mean to sound argumentative when I said that.

Your lens of the film seems accurate, because what you're saying reflects my biggest issue with Guillermo. He has trouble balancing the entertainment factors of his movies.