Piracy Numbers

[Lord Krunk]

Pirates are thieves. Simple as.

I only pirate games I cannot physically get, like Sim City 2000 or Aladdin (ie. old classics)

So I'm a mini-thief, I admit.

Same here, although if I see said item in a shop then I won't hesitate to buy it.

I wish I could find an ISO for FF7 though. I want to know what makes it better than 8 or Legend of Dragoon.

Oh of course.....but something like Aladdin isn't ever possible (mainly because the Windows version it ran on....might have been 3.1 or even DOS isn't even made anymore).

Are we acceptable pirates then?

I don't think piracy in any form is acceptable, but I would call it 'harmless'.

 

[geldonyetich]

The really sad thing about this is that PC Gamers by and large don't realize how badly piracy has gutted the platform.

They post up their "happily dying since X" poster, blind to the massive loss of shelf space at the local game shops compared to the times of over 90% of the games in that picture were released.

They remain thoroughly ignorant that the main reason why PC gamers are so boring these days being that most talented developers have gone elsewhere - to where the money actually is. I'm an aspiring game developer myself, and I can confirm firsthand that I have severe doubts that this platform is worth developing for.

Shamus Young is merely posting up what we've been told repeatedly: piracy is the reason why the PC platform has gone to hell. In response, most PC gamers just put their hands over their ears and yell, "LALALA, I CAN'T HEAR YOU OVER THE SOUND OF ME GETTING FREE STUFF!"

Maybe the industry should plan a reverse boycott. 100% of big-name business moves to the consoles and refuses to do PC ports for 6 months simply to make a point. The PC platform will always indies, sure, but the indies can endure piracy even less.

 

[NoNameMcgee]

Yawn...

This whole discussion is just tired. Pirates who claim what they're doing is completely justified are idiots, but people who take the high ground and say pirates are all scum need to get off their high horse and shut the hell up.

I pirate most of my games first, and if I feel the game is worth the money I like to buy them at a later date. Games I am quite sure I will enjoy a lot get bought straight away, and games that I download and turn out to be 'bleh' I never bother buying. For example, I bought Mass Effect 2 straight away on launch because I knew it would be an excellent game. Last week I downloaded Bioshock 2 because I was unsure about it, I am near the end of the game now and I can safely say the game is great, so I'm going to buy it in the future. I downloaded Red Faction Guerilla because I was pretty sure the game would be 'okay' at best; turns out I was right, and even though I got through most of the game the entire experience was at best a time-waster and at worst completely lackluster, therefore, not worth the money in my eyes and I have no interest in supporting the developer.

I do care about the games industry, and I support the game developers that I actually give a crap about. I don't have the kind of money to buy all my games, and if I did, hell I probably would buy them all simply for the ease of it all. However, since I don't have much money, I have to be selective about what I buy, and I would prefer the money I'm spending to go towards a developer who actually deserves it. Since I'm getting increasingly picky with games and my overall tastes in games are often a lot different than most peoples, I can't fully rely on reviews anymore because they usually don't tell me enough about the game for me know if I'm going to really like it or not. And we all know demo's tell us fuck-all in the long run because it's a small snippet of a game that can completely go downhill at any point past the first level.

Am I a pirate? Hell yes. Am I a thief? No, I don't personally think I am. Piracy can't be judged the same as going into a store, taking something off the shelf and running off with it. You must ask yourself if I would have actually bought the games I pirate if I couldn't pirate them. The answer is hell no. In fact, if I couldn't pirate games I would buy LESS games in the long run because the games I am unsure about I would never buy. But if I pirate a game I'm unsure about, and find out it's actually pretty great (which has happened a lot in the past) I will then put it on my list of things to purchase in the near future.

I don't think piracy is good or bad, I think it's a massive Grey area. People pirate for different reasons, there are a tonne of variables involved and it's not as simple as just pointing at all of us and going "thieves!" I don't think I'm in any kind of lawful right with what I am doing, and I don't think I should be in any kind of lawful right. But what I'm doing is not morally wrong either (according to my personal morals, remember we all have our own batch of those). I really don't give a shit about developers who make shitty/mediocre games, and I don't want to support them to keep making them. So piracy is a life saver for me because it lets me pick and choose what I personally believe is worthy of paying the money for and is worthy of being in my collection. Whatever reasons other people pirate games, or the pirate community as a whole is of no interest to me, it doesn't concern me. I have my own personal reasons and I'm glad that I am this way instead of buying everything and feeling constantly disappointed and ripped off by the shovelware that keeps getting thrown at us and I am expected to pay $100 AUS for.

I'm not a jerk, I just refuse to accept all the crap that is churned out at me by the games industry.

the thread should have ended after this post, AverageJoe rules.

Thanks. Sadly nobody else even replied to the points I brought up and just keep repeating the same tired things over and over. It's funny how these people who are supposedly the "good guys" in this situation can be so narrow-minded as to lump us all into the same category without looking at the variables. Especially my part about how developers would actually get less of my money if it wasn't for piracy, which is completely true. Before I discovered piracy and got into the routine I have now of "try first, buy if its good", I bought a lot less games because I was unwilling to take chances of spending $100 on a game that might be shit. Some people refuse to believe that pirates like me actually exist, well hey, we do, and I care a lot about the game developers that are actually worth a damn.

 

[llafnwod]

In a lot of cases, yeah, they can. I torrented Psychonauts, The Longest Journey, and The Witcher, games I would not have bought had they not been "freely" available, and have since purchased all three of them. I got ICO for the PS2 since acquiring it "legitimately" through eBay would have cost at least one hundred USD more than retail price, precisely 0% of which would have gone to the developers.

Psychonauts was freely available for the PC for a long time via GameTap, though it worked more like a prolonged rental. Plus my nature is one of disbelief in regards to your claim. Old Missouri blood I suppose.

Curious now. If ICO receives its PS3 port, will you purchase a copy?

As to your first point, I was unaware. I bought it anyway over Steam. I have zero reason to lie since, as you are not an actual acquaintance, I have no vested interest in your opinion of me.

As to your second, I certainly would.

Thanks. Sadly nobody else even replied to the points I brought up and just keep repeating the same tired things over and over. It's funny how these people who are supposedly the "good guys" in this situation can be so narrow-minded as to lump us all into the same category without looking at the variables. Especially my part about how developers would actually get less of my money if it wasn't for piracy, which is completely true. Before I discovered piracy and got into the routine I have now of "try first, buy if its good", I bought a lot less games because I was unwilling to take chances of spending $100 on a game that might be shit. Some people refuse to believe that pirates like me actually exist, well hey, we do, and I care a lot about the game developers that are actually worth a damn.

Very well said; both this and your original post.

 

[Morbira]

This jerk simply wishes to point out the tens of thousands of dollars he has poured into the gaming industry within the last 5 years on all platforms. Just saying.

 

[matt1256]

Pirating games ended almost completely when I moved to primarily online pc and console gaming. I am somewhat peeved at the fact that the games won't be around in so many years to play whereas I can install and enjoy Fallout/Fallout2 for years to come.

I think, though, that if you can afford it you should be paying for it. It sucks hard to be the only kid on the block because you and/or your folks can't afford for you to be playing with your friends. It's kind of like having all of your friends play hockey (Canadian all the way), but you can't because the cost of pads, sticks, helmets, skates and ice time is just too much.

 

[Novascatia]

I weep for the future of PC gaming.

 

[Space Jawa]

How many pirates are jerks?

100%

This point alone made the article worth reading and makes me chalk it up as one for the 'win' column.

 

[llafnwod]

Honestly the only reason anyone who pirates is even talking in this thread is because they're trying to justify their own activities or in their eyes mitigate what they're doing. To me it's black and white. Which is fine, because really all anyone here is doing is trying to convince THEMSELVES that it's okay, if we happen to agree with you then that's just reinforcement. But the only people who are going to agree with you are like-minded individuals so really, you're just convincing yourselves on a larger scale.

Anyway, have fun with that.

You just made an argument against all discussion.

 

[shadow skill]

Honestly the only reason anyone who pirates is even talking in this thread is because they're trying to justify their own activities or in their eyes mitigate what they're doing. To me it's black and white. Which is fine, because really all anyone here is doing is trying to convince THEMSELVES that it's okay, if we happen to agree with you then that's just reinforcement. But the only people who are going to agree with you are like-minded individuals so really, you're just convincing yourselves on a larger scale.

Anyway, have fun with that.

You just made an argument against all discussion.

Gotta love the internet.

 

[MiodekPL]

I do use pirated games as demo versions (since almost no one uses the now), because I want to know what am I buying (and I almost always buy those games).

Also I very rarely use them as DRM-free, since no DRM systems gave me any problems anyhow (I remember doing so only twice - in both cases StarForce asked me to insert original DVD - which of course was in the DVD-drive.)

Also I use them as... getting back to original language! I live in Poland and there happens shitty translations from time to time. But I never refused to buy a game "because of polish language only". If so - I buy a original game, pirate it so it'll be in proper english and be happy about it.

It's always a piracy, but I think it's morally justified.

tl;dr - I'm a pirate.

 

[Premonition]

How many pirates are jerks?
100%

What about the people that pirate old games that cost a bazillion bucks on E-bay?

Still jerks, just ones that would rather be a jerk then play a bazillion dollars. (aka Smart)

I'd rather say that the guys who canceled the game's distribution are the jerks.

 

[addeB]

Not all pirates are jerks...

 

[reg42]

I never realised how big the figures were; its quite... staggering. But DRM has to come to an end IMO, it's just causing problems for people who buy games, not for pirates. Take my Mass Effect for example, let's say I installed it 5 times and now I can't install it anymore. I'm sure as shit gonna download it if I want to play it more.

 

[Olrod]

Thanks. Sadly nobody else even replied to the points I brought up and just keep repeating the same tired things over and over. It's funny how these people who are supposedly the "good guys" in this situation can be so narrow-minded as to lump us all into the same category without looking at the variables. Especially my part about how developers would actually get less of my money if it wasn't for piracy, which is completely true. Before I discovered piracy and got into the routine I have now of "try first, buy if its good", I bought a lot less games because I was unwilling to take chances of spending $100 on a game that might be shit. Some people refuse to believe that pirates like me actually exist, well hey, we do, and I care a lot about the game developers that are actually worth a damn.

Hey look, someone else trying to justify what they're doing as right.
Try before you buy? It's called a DEMO buddy. Most if not all games have them.

"developers would get less of my money if I didn't pirate"? hahahahaha. What if you couldn't pirate? Would you stop playing games? Stop buying anything? No, of course not. You'd still buy games. Maybe more, maybe less. You'd buy shitty games sometimes, but in the end you wouldn't be playing anything for free. Want a free game? Go to a flash site. Go play that crap RTS with the lingerie ads. Ebony.

Try bringing up a point that doesn't try to justify your own existence.
See you accuse the naysayers of being too snobbish, as in "I'm better than you pirates". But you're doing the same thing! "I buy what good games I pirate, I just don't buy the shitty ones, but at least I buy some. And once in a blue moon, I even buy a game WITHOUT PIRATING it! Wow I'm so great, not like those other guys."

Everything is shades of grey.
Most of the pirates in this thread are simply trying to convince us and themselves that they're a lighter shade of grey and therefore better. Well who cares. 'sides none of us are paragons of virtue, unless we play Ultima of course, we all have our demons. But this is only about piracy.

I notice many of your points were already explain in the previous comment, including explanations as to why "developers would get less of my money if I didn't pirate" due to lack of confidence in the quality of potential purchases and the lack of demo versions for many games.

 

[Arcticflame]

I find it interesting that the "extended demo" argument yielded 0% success.

I myself don't rationalise with extended demo, but I have tried out games before and been wowed, leading to be purchasing the game after I got a pirate copy of a friend, games I have done this on include Mass Effect, Dawn of War (led to me buying all expansions), GTA III (which of course led to me buying all of the other ones), KOTOR 1 & 2, Braid, Battlefield 2, Killing Floor, puzzle quest, Oblivion, Black and white, Supreme Commander. And all of these off the top of my head. I'm sure I could think of about 20 other games I first encountered through a pirate copy and then later purchased.

Also note that I don't pirate games in terms of if I want a game I pirate it, If I want a game I research it, if I still find myself wanting it I buy it. The times I pirate are when friends have a copy of a game which I haven't heard of, and give me a copy through reccomendation or perhaps interest on my part.