Poll: Are gamers today too self entitiled?

[Darkcerb]

I don't get why everyone thinks this is just in response to the ME3 bullshit. Want to see entitlement in action? Look at any old MW2 or Black Ops PC thread you can find.

I promise you you'll find numerous complaints from people about not having dedicated servers or modding tools. They were never promised them, nor were they told to expect them. But they felt entitled to them.

I hate hate HATE how this sounds like flamebait, but from every observation I've ever made, this "self-entitlement" thing only occurs to PC gamers. I can't remember the last time I met one of my console-owning friends and discussed how sad it was that we didn't have dedicated servers or mods.

It of course can't be for any other reason than the publisher hating you and wanting to extract money from you. Not handing you a sandbox to fuck around with their work is the ultimate disservice, apparently. And because of this "we deserve mods" mentality, they also feel entitled to any form of DLC, claiming that "they could have made it themselves if you had given them the chance".

I'll say this again; I don't wish to offend any PC gamers and what I've noticed may not apply to you indivudually, so don't take it personally. But for people who enjoy video games and are getting tired of the drama and politics, I genuinely feel that console gaming makes for a far more pleasant experience.

I don't see how any of that applies to anything but the bethesda series, and even then only tangentially.

I've seen people complain they didn't get there moneys worth from dlc but never that they need to pay for it see horse armor...in fact everything but shivering isles.

And even if console gamers didn't complain incessently that pc gamers get anything more then they do the community especially the xbox live community is the worst of any gaming collective I've ever encountered in 20 years of gaming.

 

[Fidelias]

Games are a business, and gamers are consumers.

Part of business is feedback and criticism. Sure, sometimes the criticism gets out of hand, but when you have a majority of consumers all agree about a percieved failing of a product, then there is something wrong with the product.

We are consumers. IT IS NOT OUR JOB TO PROTECT THE PUBLISHERS OR DEVELOPERS. They have people for that. It's our job to give feedback and criticism so that publishers and developers can make well-made products that we WANT to buy.

Edit: Oh, in case you were wondering, I'm saying NO, gamers are not self-entitled.

 

[e2density]

More or less.
I think game companies today are getting sloppy, but I think that customers continue to support them by pumping money into 'em anyway. It's never JUST one sides fault.

 

[LiquidSolstice]

I don't see how any of that applies to anything but the bethesda series, and even then only tangentially.

I have you specific examples of MW2 and Black Ops and you don't think it applies?

I've seen people complain they didn't get there moneys worth from dlc but never that they need to pay for it see horse armor...in fact everything but shivering isles.

Wait....what?

And even if console gamers didn't complain incessently that pc gamers get anything more then they do the community especially the xbox live community is the worst of any gaming collective I've ever encountered in 20 years of gaming.

Oh? You've met every single one of us in the XBL community? Damn, I wish I had all the time that you did. Using that same logic (since we're generalizing), I'll just go ahead and say that the PC gaming community is the worst and most arrogant gaming collective I've ever encountered in all MY time of gaming. That's fair, isn't it?

Knock knock, you play with people on the internet. It's the fricking internet. No shit there will be assholes on the internet, ergo, of course there will be assholes on whatever gaming medium you choose. You know what genuine issue I take with the majority of PC gamers? The essence of the game itself appears to be lost in complaints. I genuinely feel that as a console gamer, I'm able to appreciate the work put into the games I play because I know how far gaming has progressed, and rather than be a political activist about it, I sit down, shut up, and I enjoy it.

 

[Joshimodo]

No.

To anyone who thinks gamers are acting "entitled", you need to look up the definition. Gamers would be acting entitled if they demanded things far beyond what is expected.

The 2 points that are fresh in everyone's mind are logical. BioWare/EA churned out a less-than-stellar ending that damaged the series, confirmed a flat-out lie from the developers themselves, and was on the whole a negative.

The Dark Souls/GFWL thing is also legitimate, because GFWL is an obsolete, obtuse system that is counter-productive. It's less of a "waah, I want Steam instead!" and more of a "People will actively avoid buying a game they want because of GFWL, don't make that mistake".

 

[Darkcerb]

I don't see how any of that applies to anything but the bethesda series, and even then only tangentially.

I have you specific examples of MW2 and Black Ops and you don't think it applies?

I've seen people complain they didn't get there moneys worth from dlc but never that they need to pay for it see horse armor...in fact everything but shivering isles.

Wait....what?

And even if console gamers didn't complain incessently that pc gamers get anything more then they do the community especially the xbox live community is the worst of any gaming collective I've ever encountered in 20 years of gaming.

Oh? You've met every single one of us in the XBL community? Damn, I wish I had all the time that you did. Using that same logic (since we're generalizing), I'll just go ahead and say that the PC gaming community is the worst and most arrogant gaming collective I've ever encountered in all MY time of gaming. That's fair, isn't it?

Knock knock, you play with people on the internet. It's the fricking internet. No shit there will be assholes on the internet, ergo, of course there will be assholes on whatever gaming medium you choose. You know what genuine issue I take with the majority of PC gamers? The essence of the game itself appears to be lost in complaints. I genuinely feel that as a console gamer, I'm able to appreciate the work put into the games I play because I know how far gaming has progressed, and rather than be a political activist about it, I sit down, shut up, and I enjoy it.

Calm down junior, how about you re-read your post that implies the whole of pc gaming community is how you say it is.

And no it's not a few bad apples as you'd find in any online endeavor on xbox live it's the majority, I don't have to meet every single one of them to know that in every game of halo2-3 gears(all) there are arsehats.

If you want to sit and eat crap go for it, me I complain when I feel I haven't got my moneys worth and I say how I feel any given game could be improved from my point of view. Nothing ever improved without criticism and the developers don't need protecting they're big boys now and they can handle it.

I guess it wasn't clear enough People complain when they feel ripped off.

People didn't complain that they had to pay money for content. At least in bethesda games cases.

And no it doesn't relate when you imply a series that's never had modding tools suddenly...doesn't, did you even read your post what exactly was your point? that it should? I agree but then I feel like most company's could do alot worse then copying valve.

 

[LiquidSolstice]

Calm down junior, how about you re-read your post that implies the whole of pc gaming community is how you say it is.

Oh no, you don't get to use that against me because you've done the exact same thing to the console community. Why have different rules?

And no it's not a few bad apples as you'd find in any online endeavor on xbox live it's the majority, I don't have to meet every single one of them to know that in every game of halo2-3 gears(all) there are arsehats.

And I don't have to know that in every game of TF2 I'll meet complete dickheads, ergo it's alright for me to decide all PC gamers are dickheads. I don't need to know every single one of them either, right? Do you have a point?

If you want to sit and eat crap go for it, me I complain when I feel I haven't got my moneys worth

That fucking sucks for you. You purchased it. You experienced it. Deal with it. You don't go bitching to the director after a movie you paid to see wasn't want you wanted, right?

and I say how I feel any given game could be improved from my point of view. Nothing ever improved without criticism and the developers don't need protecting they're big boys now and they can handle it.

When I say it's a content director's right to create their content how they wish, I am not protecting them.

People didn't complain that they had to pay money for content. At least in bethesda games cases.

Yes, because no one ever bitches about DLC. Do you live under a rock?

And no it doesn't relate when you imply a series that's never had modding tools suddenly...doesn't

Oh yes it does. PC games are known for having mod tools. So when a game comes out and doesn't offer them, people are pissed off and feel entitled to said mod tools. That is called entitlement.

did you even read your post what exactly was your point? that it should?

My post was concerning how this "entitlement" thing has been around a lot longer than all the people bitching about ME3.

I agree but then I feel like most company's could do alot worse then copying valve.

Seeing as Valve is the master at copying their own games, changing a few textures, and reselling them, I guess you're right.

 

[Darkcerb]

I can't think of a gaming community who has a worse reputation for being awful then xbox live.

And no it doesn't relate, even if PC gaming is known for it's mod tools (I can count with my hands how many games have mod tools and have a few fingers to spare) the games you listed aren't and never have.

We're not talking about movies, we're talking about games interactive storys far more expensive but sure I do complain or did I haven't gone to see a movie for years because by and large they were awful something I do for several game company's and might do for bioware.

And again we have every right to critic and will continue to if you don't like it go elsewhere, back to your flowery wonderful xbox live community.

You getting all worked up wont change that and certainly wont effect my desire to complain when I feel a game could be improved or when I feel ripped off.

You keep your head in the sand method of dealing with all your purchases though, I'm sure that'll work out for you and whatever industry is involved.

 

[Grunt_Man11]

snip

I agree that ME3 is not a case of too much self-entitlement.

I haven't even played through the first Mass Effect, but I've seen videos that clearly show the endings not living up to what Bioware promised. Either they lied, or are so incompetent they don't know what an "ABC ending" actually looks like. Either that, or EA did a lot of Executive Meddling.

Though I still question some of the methods of those wanting a new ending, or the "real" ending.
Was sending 400 symbolic cupcakes to Bioware really necessary?
Plus demanding donate money back from Child's Play was just plain petty.

I will still warn against the possible "can-of-worms" this could open up. Truly self-entitled people thinking they can completely dictate how a developer makes a game by using the "Retake Mass Effect" movement as a justification to force their bad ideas into a game.
I've seen it before. People will use the fact that a developer did this thing in order to justify the demand they do this other non-related thing.

 

[The Unworthy Gentleman]

For the most part, no. The concerns are legitimate. People see gamers acting like consumers of any other product, and ddcide that they're all self-entitled little twerps.

Except when you read a book and decide the ending didn't match what you expect you don't demand a better one replace it. You also don't petition the publishers not to sell it at Barnes and Noble for whatever bullshit reason you have. Gamers are one of the worst consumers for their own false entitlement. As if the consumer has ever had any sway in deciding what distribution will be used other than which is used most or what would.

If you have to have every little thing pertaining to your hobby suit your personal desires then you're a fucking moron.

 

[Thomas Knapp]

The problem is that the answer is both "yes" and "no", because gamers are a very broad group of people.

Just as there are perfectly rational gamers who supply their criticisms, ask something be done, and if the request isn't met in a satisfactory matter, wash their hands of the whole thing and walk away... there are also the self-entitled twats who think they have the right to demand game companies bend over to serve their every whim and that anyone who doesn't agree with them is a sell-out and deserves to be scorned and ridiculed.

Welcome to human civilization. It can get pretty messy down here. Bring a raincoat.

 

[Chairman Miaow]

No, but the escapist forum users are far too quick to complain about people complaining about things.

 

[Chairman Miaow]

For the most part, no. The concerns are legitimate. People see gamers acting like consumers of any other product, and ddcide that they're all self-entitled little twerps.

Except when you read a book and decide the ending didn't match what you expect you don't demand a better one replace it. You also don't petition the publishers not to sell it at Barnes and Noble for whatever bullshit reason you have. Gamers are one of the worst consumers for their own false entitlement. As if the consumer has ever had any sway in deciding what distribution will be used other than which is used most or what would.

If you have to have every little thing pertaining to your hobby suit your personal desires then you're a fucking moron.

Go read up on Sherlock Holmes.

 

[Aprilgold]

Yes! Yes! Yes!

I just started a thread about this, but there is no doubt in my mind that we are far too entitled.

But isn't it a good thing to be in knowledge of your rights as a citizen? Have you seen the definition of Entitled or Entitlement in a while. In case your wondering, its here:
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/entitlement
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/entitled

Its not a insult at all, really.

I feel we should be entitled to people using the search bar

I haven't seen a search bar comment in such a long time, thank you for taking the time to comment that instead of contributing to the discussion.

Well, we had this one yesterday
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/9.366657-Buzzword-of-2012-Entitlement

Then all these
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/9.360252-Gamer-Entitlement-and-the-PC
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/9.357146-Entitlement?page=1
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/18.307150-I-am-so-sick-of-entitlement?page=1
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/9.354296-Poll-Gamer-Entitlement
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/9.285168-Overuse-of-the-word-Entitlement

I just feel there's nothing left to add to the discussion.

Okay fine but I if I post in one of those threads I can guarantee pretty much nobody will read it and then I wouldn't be able to discuss it myself, if I make a new thread my post will be read and I can then partake in discussion about the topic. Having to use a search bar everytime I think of something to post is a waste of time.

That doesn't mean create four NEW threads on the subject.

For the most part, no. The concerns are legitimate. People see gamers acting like consumers of any other product, and ddcide that they're all self-entitled little twerps.

Name me one other product where the consumers are as vocal and obnoxious as gaming.

Star wars, firefly, star trek,

The original great expectations ending was changed due to the outcry, then changed back

Sporting teams/franchise fans

Ios/android fans

Obnoxious? I think you just insulted everyone ln this website. Remember, no one is forcing you to be here or play games.

OH MY GOD! YOU JUST PROVED MY POINT!!! Those were all nerd-centric (besides sports). Think about it. Nerds and sports fans are now on the same level of annoying bitching over NOTHING.

RED ALERT! I WANT ALL HANDS ON DECK; DOUBLE-TIME! OUR SHIELDS CAN'T DEFLECT BULLCRAP OF THIS MAGNITUDE!

Why is it, that every time someone has an opinion different than the majority, they are a troll? I'm not trolling, I'm just pointing out the hypocritical nature of your arguments.

Because the way you state your opinion makes you look like a troll? Try rephrasing your points to be a bit more straight forward without insults.

-----------------------------------------------------------------

[sighs] This word is dead now due to nobody using it properly, thanks internet... Thats a joke, but this word has lost a lot of meaning in the video game industry.

 

[The Unworthy Gentleman]

Go read up on Sherlock Holmes.

No. Just because something happened once doesn't make it at all okay for it to be repeated.

 

[TheRightToArmBears]

Huh, 'entitlement' is the new 'elitist'.

I think gamers can take things a bit too far sometimes, like the whole ME3 thing. I don't think it's 'entitlement', but gamers (and I suppose, nerds in general, just look at Star Wars) could do with not making quite such a big deal out of things. In the last few years I've been on this site I've seen people proclaim any new thing is 'the death of gaming!' when really, it's made barely any difference to people. Chill the fuck out, guys.

 

[Aegixx]

Yes.
It's quite boring to read.

 

[Chairman Miaow]

Go read up on Sherlock Holmes.

No. Just because something happened once doesn't make it at all okay for it to be repeated.

This is a thread about gamer entitlement. Your post was saying that this wouldn't happen in other mediums. But it has. It's irrelevant whether or not it's ok, it has happened.

 

[Shadowkire]

Gamers are too self-entitled, and thus they feel that everything needs to be tailored to their specific needs, however...

Most big name publishers see gamers as money farms, and thus they produce games like CoD which are tailored specifically to rake in the hugest profits while appealing to the largest fanbase, alienating any chance of development in the gaming market in general.

But since gamers are too self-entitled, we can't form together and create an effective resistance to this mass-produced crap without some idiots making some like Retake Mass Effect and making us look more like self-righteous pricks than people with some actual common sense.

It's a perpetual cycle of shit.

Retake Mass Effect was a movement where people donated money to charity as a method of showing BioWare the size and sincerity of the group of people who would like(no demands were made by RME) a fix for the ending, not a pit of vipers forming an army to attack BioWare or something.

 

[AnarchistAbe]

Indeed. It also strikes me as funny that Dark Souls got an internet petition to be made. Then, when gamers get what they wanted, they aren't happy with the way it's being done. So, a new petition, to change the game they're getting because of a petition (which hasn't been released yet), is now circulating.

How can you say that we aren't being entitled?

Here's why people complain about it. [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q6p8qz6wv8M] It's actually locked me out of games that I've bought in the past. Asking that products that I pay money for should work isn't entitlement, it's how it should be.
GFWL is shit. I can see the decision to use GFWL in this case(video explains it), but I don't think I'll buy the PC version of Dark Souls at full price.

The video is interesting... However, he does touch (albeit, very VERY briefly), over the same major concern that I have: Gamers request a game, publisher makes the game, the game doesn't sell...no more games.

Obviously, that's a tad extreme. But publishers hate nothing more than losing money. They obviously didn't have much faith in a PC Port to begin with, or they would have just made one. This just re-affirms their decision to NOT make a port. And don't be naive enough to think other publishers will look at what Namco did wrong here. Expect them to see the hit to Namco's bottom line, with the cause being a PC port.