Poll: Does pirating a game to test it make it okay?

[VoidWanderer]

This question is why demos should return.

 

[Aaron Sylvester]

This question is why demos should return.

There is another side to this, demos aren't as easy to create as you think. Developers can't just "cut out" a chunk of the game and package it into a functional program ready for playing, in most games the code & visuals are a horribly complicated interconnecting mesh, often being worked on by separate teams and then finally being assembled into one playable experience. In fact developers would have to do several beta tests of the DEMO itself to weed out all the bugs that may have popped up during the process of cutting-off the rest of the game. Then there's the additional costs of the release/launch cycle, along with advertising/promotion. Just for a freaking demo.

I don't know the intricate bits of it, but it's a lot more effort than what most people think and is one of the main reasons why demos have become so scarce.

Not only that, demos can actually result in a potential LOSS of sales. If someone thinks "oh god, I didn't like this demo one bit" there's a customer who is instantly lost because they judged the whole game based on the first 30 mins / first mission / whatever. If a demo wasn't available, there would've been a 50/50 chance of that person just taking a leap of faith and buying the whole game - in which case he would've given $60 to the developers and that would've been an instant win (for the developers/publishers I mean). See where I'm getting at?

I think the math-heads at EA/etc have probably calculated that packaging a demo is not worth the boost in sales it can potentially cause (or potential loss). Not true with every game though, looking at Mass Effect 3.

Personally I wish demos would come back (please?) but I can see the reasons why they have faded.

captcha: MARRY ME
No captcha, I'm not ready to commit to this relationship yet, need more time, etc etc

 

[fenrizz]

The good old slippery slope fallacy, eh?

Slippery slope =/= slippery slope fallacy. In order to be a fallacy, it actually has to be fallacious, i.e. extreme and/or illogical.

Or simply not true.

What did you mean by testing being a slippery slope then?
You'll inevitably end up as a full blown pirate?

 

[suitepee7]

No it is not (although I've found my stance on piracy to be one of the harshest on this site...basically, it's never OK unless you literally can't get the item in question due to it's age).

There are sites that you can go to that will tell you these things.

http://www.systemrequirementslab.com/cyri (like this one! I'm sure there are others but this is the one I personally use)

I pretty much agree with this. While I can see some merit when the testing is actually of a "can my system actually run this" nature, I still see testing as a pretty slippery slope.

The good old slippery slope fallacy, eh?

OT:
I see no problem with this.
It's not even piracy if you ask me.

i had the exact same problem, with the exact same game. in order to scrape 30fps i needed it to be in a retardedly low resolution so i could barely see the text on screen =\

OT: in my eyes, perfectly justified. if there's no demo out, then go for it. use your pirate as a demo to test it, then purchase it. the only problem after that is relying on your own self control.
So I ask you this escapists, is pirating okay if you're planning to test a game and then later on, buy it? Is pirating ever okay, under any condition?

Like I said over, I don't think it qualifies as piracy if it is for the purpose of checking if the PC in question can even run the game properly.

 

[Slayer_2]

If there is no demo and you buy the game if you enjoy it and play it more than a few hours, then I think it's fair enough. I don't do that, because my PC is powerful, so I don't worry about it not running, and usually games I play have a demo or I play them elsewhere.

I wouldn't feel at all bad pirating a game to test it, though, and I wish I had for a few piles of shit (like Homefront). Could have saved me a lot of money to play that game for three minutes past the intro cinematic and avoid it based on that. Instead I bought it day one for full price and got shafted by a crappy CoD wannabe with an interesting concept and horrible execution.

 

[madwarper]

This question is why demos should return.

EC [http://penny-arcade.com/patv/episode/demo-daze] did an episode about Demos. In short, their Cost/Benefit ratio isn't worth it.

OT: No, not ok.

As already stated, there are several free sites that will tell you if your computer's specs can handle the game.
As for whether or not the game is functional, you should be relying on reviews. If they say a game's handling is shit, don't get the game.

 

[Yopaz]

I'd say that morally you're in the clear, but legally it's still pirating. However I usually hate people who say they are downloading a game "just to test it " because in most cases it seem to mean that they are testing quality to see if the game is good and how the story turns out and how it ends.

If it truly means that you're checking stability then buy it, well the publisher gets the money and everyone is happy. It's kinda like if a clothing store wouldn't let you try on clothes and not offer refunds if something didn't fit.

 

[Rack]

I don't want to get into the morality here, but surely the practicality is fairly simple.Log on to his system with your steam account, install the game play it a bit and then log out. If it works well he can buy it, if not lesson learned.

 

[Cazza]

That would be like sneaking into a movie and only paying if you liked it. How is it morally grey? Then only way it comes close to morally grey is if you pirate it to test then buy it next time it discounted even if you couldn't run the game.

 

[Zhukov]

Ehhhh...

In legal terms, pirating is illegal regardless of intent.

In ethical terms... well, I'm certainly not going to get preachy at you for doing that. Although it should be noted that "I was just testing it out" is frequently just an excuse for regular old something-for-nothing piracy.

 

[Olas]

Well, I've always been of the belief that doing something illegal just because you don't personally think it's wrong sets a dangerous precedent, because then any act becomes okay if you can just convince yourself that it is. Next thing you know you're an ethical nihilist and laws become obsolete and therefore don't even really exist for you in any meaningful way.

But just as a thought experiment in a theoratical case of WOULD this be unethical. No, I don't see anything wrong with it. As long as she plays a very minimal portion of the actual game, to the point of insignificance I can't see what's wrong with this.

You know what does seem wrong? Paying money for a game and then finding out you can't play it.

 

[Creator002]

I think when it comes to digital only, where you cant re-sell it, then yes. If its retail, and you can resell it, then I think you should rent it.

In Australia, or at least Victoria, you can't resell PC games to video game stores, nor can you rent PC games. If you buy the retail version and it doesn't run well, then you're stuck with it until you can sell it online or something.

Morally, I'd be fine with downloading it to see if it worked and if I have full intention to buy it if it does, but legally, no. It's never OK to pirate something from a legal standpoint.
Since it's a Steam game, can't you simply log into your friend's PC on your Steam account, download the game and see if it runs?

 

[WoW Killer]

I don't see anything wrong with it personally. Legal or not, it's morally acceptable to want to see how a product runs before buying it. If there's no demo available, and piracy gives you that quick test, then so be it.

There are sites that you can go to that will tell you these things.

http://www.systemrequirementslab.com/cyri (like this one! I'm sure there are others but this is the one I personally use)

Even if that site was 100% accurate, it still wouldn't be giving you as much information as you'd sometimes want. You'll have a video demo showing off the game running on a state of the art rig, and then a website telling you "yes, you can run this". But that doesn't mean you can run it as well as you see in the videos. You'd need to see an example of the game running on your own specs to make an informed judgement.

 

[fenrizz]

That would be like sneaking into a movie and only paying if you liked it. How is it morally grey? Then only way it comes close to morally grey is if you pirate it to test then buy it next time it discounted even if you couldn't run the game.

you can't be serious...

It is nothing like sneaking into a movie, at all.
Maybe if you have new, fancy replacement cybernetic eyes and you are not sure if your new eyes are compatible with the 3D glasses at you local cinema and you kindly ask the manager to check it out for a minute and if it works then you buy a ticket.

Even so, paying for a game (even if it is discounted) you know for a fact you cannot play is rather ridiculous.

 

[Yopaz]

This question is why demos should return.

EC [http://penny-arcade.com/patv/episode/demo-daze] did an episode about Demos. In short, their Cost/Benefit ratio isn't worth it.

OT: No, not ok.

As already stated, there are several free sites that will tell you if your computer's specs can handle the game.
As for whether or not the game is functional, you should be relying on reviews. If they say a game's handling is shit, don't get the game.

Specs are a horrible way of judging how well a game will actually run. Sometimes meeting minimun specs will mean that you're able ro run it, but at a level too low to enjoy anything and often experience drops in fps when there's a lot of avtion on screen. I experienced this with BioShock. It was running fairly well with my just above minimum hardware, but it crashed the moment I met a turret. There's The Last Remnant which wouldn't even start (just got a blank screen) despite meeting requirements.

There are games that are horrible ports or have driver issues such as Rage which works poorlyndespite going far over recommended levels.

I also find it hilarious that GTA IV which has higher recommended specs than Saints Row 2 actually runs better on my computer.

You can't trust that specs will actually be helpful.

 

[ShindoL Shill]

In my opinion, yes. As long as you buy it if it runs. If it doesn't, you were never going to get it anyway.

That would be like sneaking into a movie and only paying if you liked it.

No, it isn't. It's more like only paying if the film was shown, as opposed to sitting in silent darkness for two hours because the cinema is somehow unable to play the film.

As already stated, there are several free sites that will tell you if your computer's specs can handle the game.

According to them, my computer can run Fallout 3.
It cannot.

Log on to his system with your steam account, install the game play it a bit and then log out. If it works well he can buy it, if not lesson learned.

Yeah, that would be simpler.

 

[Silverfox99]

From my perspective it is never morally right to pirate a game. All of the justifications I have read about why it is acceptable to pirate a game are about personal convenience. Morals are not about making your life easier, they are about doing the right thing.

For me, if I am unsure of the quality of a game, I will wait until the price of the game is at an acceptable risk level.

If I am not sure the game will run on my computer because of requirements I upgrade my computer first before I buy it. This can take some time but I will wait.

I don't say its OK because the publisher is greedy or has too much money. Being greedy in response to greed is not being moral.

I don't say its OK because I will buy the game in the future. If I am going to buy it why not wait until I do buy it?

Not everyone will see it this way, but this is how I see it.