Poll: Is Not Dating a Certain Race Racist?

[Agayek]

The problem being that it was racist, and the point you made about what it means was wrong. Therefore, the second part was irrelevant. I don't know what's hard to get here.

My entire point is that, on its own, it's not necessarily racist.

It certainly can be motivated by racism, there's absolutely no question about that, but that doesn't automatically mean that it is. It can just as easily be fueled by a lack of attraction to the physical features people of a certain ancestry tend to share (for example, one can just find dark (or light) skin sexually unappealing). That's no more racist than finding short people unattractive, or big hands, or whatever other physical feature you care to name.

Now, like I've said repeatedly, such desires can be ultimately driven by some degree of racism. There's just not enough information to judge that, going purely by the statement "I don't find blacks attractive". It's a blanket, sweeping generalization to be sure, but only the most literal idiots are going to take it as an absolute in-every-case statement.

 

[Something Amyss]

My entire point is that, on its own, it's not necessarily racist.

My entire point is that, within this context, you're wrong.

 

[BathorysGraveland2]

snip

There are some black women I find myself attracted to, but they are rare. My standards for the physical aspect of black women are much, much higher than any other race. So yeah, I guess I am racist. But you know what? You can try and make me feel like scum as much as you want, it won't work. I will never equalise a preference of sexual attraction to hatred or a sense of superiority.

 

[Adamantium93]

If I'm not attracted to someone, I'm not dating them. I don't think that makes me racist, but even if it does there is nothing I can do about it. Its just the way my body acts.

 

[Adamantium93]

If I'm not attracted to someone, I'm not dating them. I don't think that makes me racist, but even if it does there is nothing I can do about it. Its just the way my body acts.

Your body doesn't decide who you go out with. Your brain does. So there is something you can do about it- you can go on the date.

Now mind, I'm not saying you should go on a date with people you're not attracted to. Just that the host of people in this thread trying to paint their (potentially subconsciously) learned racial preferences as involuntary aren't really addressing this accurately.

Except that your body does decide who you date. Granted, the brain has input, but in order for any relationship to be successful, there has to be a component of sexual attraction. People who I really like as people but am not physically attracted to? They're friends.

I don't walk around looking at women going "Oh, she's white, going to bang her" or "Oh, she's black, not wasting my time". I get to know people and if I find that I like someone's personality AND find them sexually attractive, I consider asking them out. Over time I've noticed that I have never found a black woman attractive. Never. It just hasn't happened. I may think they look pretty in the same way that I can tell when a guy is looking handsome but it just doesn't do it for me. Maybe someday I will find an exception to this trend but so far I haven't.

This isn't technically:

Racism: the belief that all members of each race possess characteristics or abilities specific to that race, esp. so as to distinguish it as inferior or superior to another race or races

or

Prejudice: a preconceived opinion that is not based on reason or actual experience.

Its simply a matter of what my body responds to.

 

[Soundwave]

Yes it's racist.

No, it's not universally racist. The reasons for why a person says "no blacks" matter. If they're not attracted to black women as a general rule, that's very different than saying that they don't want to date black women because of some racist stereotype.

Yes people who think it's clever to compare gender, only finding one gender date-able is sexist.

Except it's not, by any definition of the word. Again, reasons matter. If you're not biologically attracted to women, you're not sexist for feeling that way.

Both sexism and racism very clearly state in their definitions that they are based upon beliefs and actions, which means they require a conscious mental decision to carry out. Your body's selection of physical attractions are not conscious mental decisions, they are biological activities controlled by your genes and triggered by hormones.

Sexism and racism are defined based on your actions and the way you think, NOT your biology. It is not sexism or racism to have preferences in what you find attractive. What IS sexist/racist is to consciously choose not to pursue potential mates that you may find attractive simply because of their gender or race.

People really need to learn the definitions of words before slinging them around.

People aren't arbitrarily not attracted to individuals of a specific race "as a general rule" without some (though they might be unaware of it) inherent racism. People are unintentionally racist all the time. Just because you don't know better doesn't mean it isn't racist.

It also doesn't mean that people who are unintentionally racist at times (as almost everyone is guilty of at least some) aren't worthy of tolerance (which I'll grant is a tangent, but I know somebody will try to make that point at me and I'm just being pro-active).

 

[Silkavenger]

Any decision based purely on race is by definition racist.

The fellow's original statement was that "(he would) date any race but 'black girls'".

The tactic many posters here are taking to defend this statement is to equate 'skin color' with 'physical attractiveness'. This is pure intellectual dishonesty. While skin tone may at a part in physical attraction, I do not believe for a moment that it can trump all other physical qualities. Posters who would defend the above quote as not racially motivated, would you defend any of the following statements?

1. All black women are ugly. All of them.

2. The ugliest white woman in the world is still more physically attractive than the most beautiful black woman.

If you feel these statements are racist, then you do not actually believe that attractiveness can be determined by skin color alone. The only thing that can be determined by skin color and zero additional information is race. If you make decisions based on race alone, you are to some degree racist. I'm not going to suggest that you should feel bad about that, but you should at least be honest with yourself about it.

Remember, it's the difference between saying "I've not yet personally met a black woman who I've wanted to date," or saying "I would never date any black woman ever, even without seeing them, and regardless of any other information about their likes, dislikes and behavior." The guy in the OP's statement is semantically identical to the latter of the two. Think about it.

 

[Demongeneral109]

It's not a choice made based on race. That race just happens to have physical features he(hypothetical dude) finds displeasing.

I'm going to leave this quote here, so you can read it as many times as you like, until you find the logical phallacy hidden in it.
Hint: it's between "it's not a choice based on race" and "that race has displeasing physical features".

If you remove a conditional, the context of words tend to change.

"Happen to have" As in, race was not considered.

Dude, you said it's not a "race thing", but it's a "physical feature associated with race thing", which makes it a race thing.

Not if said physical feature exists independent of said race.

Dude, you just said "That race just happens to have physical features he(hypothetical dude) finds displeasing".

Lets give the beneficent of the doubt and assume he's generalizing(not racist really.) Some Ethnicities are more prone to certain physical characteristics, which an individual may not find attractive. As long as things are taken by a case on case basis, generalizing and stereotyping, while admittedly not the best thing to do, isn't inherently racist. So he could, as a totally hypothetical example, not be fond of coarse hair. If this trait is predominant among black women, its not racist to say that he doesn't find black women attractive... but again, case by case basis. Im willing to say that its only racist with malicious intent, otherwise its stereotyping.

 

[Agayek]

My entire point is that, within this context, you're wrong.

If you mean the context of the specific individual the OP is discussing, then yes, that is probably the case.

That's pretty meaningless though. It's one example out of the millions, if not billions, of others out there, and cannot be used as a meaningful statistic regarding the "level of racism" of similar statements.

I've already admitted, several times at that, that it can be motivated by racism. That doesn't mean it's an inherently racist sentiment. That would be akin to saying that not finding red hair attractive is an inherently racist stance.

I would hope I don't need to explain how ludicrous that is.

 

[BarrelsOfDouche]

Racist? Maybe...

Class is really more important. Making the blanket generalization that he doesn't want to date black women because he believes they all have the same problem with attitude/education/financial status/etc is definitely racist simply because you're prejudging an entire group based on stereotypes. Obviously there do exist black women who aren't like what he thinks they are...

Yet, at the same time it's hard to know if this is the case or it's just his personal taste in feminine aesthetics.

And, really, it's only other people's business if you go out and publicly say stuff like this in the first place. Any comment you post on the net is open to ridicule and criticism, and he shouldn't be surprised of the vitriol emanating from every corner of his monitor after announcing his exclusivity.

 

[EyeReaper]

Saying not wanting to date a certain race is racist seems like saying not wanting to date a certain sex is sexist. It's not like you got handed a character sheet when you hit puberty and get to pick and choose what you get attracted to.

 

[Silkavenger]

I don't think people realize how radically different individuals look even within a given race.

 

[The Almighty Aardvark]

I find it hard to believe that is racist to be more attracted to certain races than others, or on the flip side to be less attracted to certain races. If it is, then the only traits that you're permitted to value in terms of attractiveness (without being prejudiced) are those not commonly associated with a particular ethnicity. Even if you were absolutely intent on keeping 'racism' out of your sexual attraction, I would be surprised if anyone would be able to force their minds to completely disregard all of the traits that fall into those categories.

Also, what about accents? Would it also be prejudiced to let those influence your attraction to someone? While it's entirely possible for your sexual desire to be influenced by racism, like the person the OP mentioned, it seems at least as likely for them to be from completely inane reasons.

Although I'll say that while it doesn't need to be racist, it is almost definitely a fair bit shallow to not date people of a certain race.

 

[Silkavenger]

It's not racist to be attracted to a set of individuals who have similar physical qualities.

It is racist to extrapolate that out to an entire race without considering the individual.

 

[TKretts3]

Technically, yes, it is racism. You're choosing who you will date (Or, specifically, not date) based on the colour of their skin. However, I would not put this down as negative racism, since it's not only rather in consequential, but also seems not to be done out of malice. This doesn't seem like the kind of thing that would also make a guy hate, or treat badly, black girls.

It's certainly discrimination, but neither positive or negative, simply neutral.

 

[Insideout Ink Demon]

what if someone has never been turned on by a certain race. Would that be racist? No choice just not arroused

It's a matter of contribution. You can't separate the discussion from the impact. Saying "I don't like tomatoes" could be the same as saying "I've never found a tomato that I like, but it could possibly happen" which is the argument you're making. If there were no racists, that would totally be a fine argument to make as it would just be a linguistic shortcut. The problem is that there are racists who use that kind of language to be racist, so people who care about that kind of stuff need to be a little more careful in how they phrase things.

well put, i'll think on how i word it, if the subject were to ever come up again.

 

[Strazdas]

So people learn to sexualy prefer skinny/fat people too you think?

Actually, yes. It's only relatively recently that the ideal body shape (in the west) is skinny. A few hundred years ago, larger bodies were popular, because it showed you had enough money to have adequate food.

Once starvation stopped being such an issue, the beauty standard changed to a much slimmer figure. It's only really been skinny recently, as recently as the 20th century, a fuller figure was considered beautiful. Certain actresses around WW2 come to mind.

And what about people who like fat people? they dont subscribe the idea of skinny body. even i personally like a moderate woman and not the skinny types.
As for the liking fat, it was a means of determining richness and not sexual appeal though. were talking about sexual appeal, you cannot control that. if you find something sexy you will contnue to find something sexy unelss you get branwashed like in Clockwork Orange.

Im not talking about beaty standarts, im talking about personal sexual appeal.

No question it is learned. It may be learned subconsciously, through seeing your culture popularly acclaim people of a certain build as beautiful (or handsome), associating those traits with desirability, and then desiring it oneself. But it is undoubtably learned. What would the biological mechanism be for it otherwise? How would it be that people could find themself sexually attracted to one build, and then when they hit it off with someone who doesn't match that build, learning to be attracted to them despite not fitting their previously-held weight "ideal" if it was biological and not learned?

We should seperate biological sexual attraction from being able to befriend/like/love.
I do not care what ethniticity my friends are and i could love a black person, but i would not find them sexually attractive.

 

[sumanoskae]

Perhaps, but not necessarily in overt or hateful way. It's not malicious and it's your right, but the question wasn't "Is it morally acceptable to only be involved with certain races", the question was if doing so made you racist, and speaking psychologically, I'd say it's likely that rejecting the concept of having a relationship with someone solely based on their ethnicity is evidence of a belief (Even if it's subconscious) in some inherent difference between the races.

I say this because there are only a few reasons for not dating people of a certain race.

A previous negative experience that has resulted in emotional trauma that resurfaces in a manner relating to that particular race: This, I would not call racist; it has little to do with the race itself, it's just a psychological trigger, one you would probably be glad to be rid of.

A belief that certain races invariably embody certain traits: The issue here is that if a hypothetical person came along that didn't fit this criteria, racism is the only reason you would still adhere to this concept. If you believe that, say, all black people speak in a manner that you find attractive, but you later meet a black person who speaks in a way you do find attractive and you still won't even consider dating them, then their manner of speaking is clearly not the real issue; it's simply the fact that they're black.

A sexual preference for the appearance of one race or another: Now, I want to clear a few things up; first of all, I think such preferences will become increasingly obsolete as the borders between races become even blurrier than they already are, second of all is that I don't consider this racist in extreme examples; if you are absolutely disgusted by fair skin, it's perfectly understandable that you would avoid it in sexual relationships, but as I said, this is an extreme example, and I think the following is much more common.

Speaking personally, I'm a little put off by albinos, I don't find the condition attractive and honestly it unsettles me. Obviously I have nothing against albinos, simply because I don't find them attractive doesn't affect my opinion of them otherwise. But if I met a woman who was albino, but was an otherwise amazing person, the fact that she was albino wouldn't matter; I wouldn't let this tiny preference sabotage an otherwise happy relationship, it isn't that important. The point is, that it takes an issue you hold very close to your heart to overpower genuine affection.

If you would have otherwise fallen in love with somebody were it not for their skin color, it's more than just a superfluous preference.

I think that if you won't even consider a relationship with a certain race, if you're willing to immediately eliminate the chance of finding something as primal as affection in a specific race, that bespeaks a certain degree of racism. This doesn't make you a bad person, and you have every right to be with who you want. You aren't racist in a severe or consistently destructive way, but race is clearly important to you.

 

[sumanoskae]

It's not racist to be attracted to a set of individuals who have similar physical qualities.

It is racist to extrapolate that out to an entire race without considering the individual.

Well said

 

[Chaud]

I think there are two issues here.

The first:
There are different definitions of racism being used here in the topic. Just as there are different definitions of the word "discriminate". Discriminate can mean the act of creating distinctions without merit, separate people based on arbitrary characteristics that don't do justice to what is being demanded of them. Or it may just mean "separate" , "distinguish". One term is broader and the other more specific and yet there is a profound relationship between both of them, but they have distinct meanings.

What is happening here is that many are using the term "racism" as "separate by race", but using the connotation of "disparage a particular group of individuals, treating them as less capable or qualified just because of their race". Except that even though both are valid meanings for the word to some extent , we need to be careful not to confuse them.

We can say, for example, that "black-skinned people are less susceptible to sunburn" - and this is a distinction by race. That, technically , is "racism" by that definition, but that is not the definition of racism that many people have of the word. The mere enumeration or distinction of a certain characteristic present in a given group that can be expressed by their race should not carry the negative connotation of the term racism, albeit it's still a differentiation by race.

The second:
People feel that they have the prerogative to "require" the acceptance of a certain standard of beauty from others, while ultimately beauty is a subjective and personal experience. That reminds me, for example , of the advertising of certain feminist groups who say that "everybody is beautiful". "Every woman is beautiful". Well, if you really think so, great! But I digress. I will not say someone is beautiful just because you say it is. I will say it only if i think it's true, simple as that.

Speaking of me, I don't think that obesity is something beautiful. Regardless of social class, age, gender, sexual orientation or any other factor. I also don't think that very tall people are attractive . They may even be "beautiful" in a vague sense , but I do not find them attractive. I never felt physical attraction for a very tall woman. It may seem arbitrary - maybe it is, but it's what I feel. I do not know why I feel it, but have no obligation to fell in any other way. I'm not disparaging anyone by not seeing beauty in them, since my personal taste is not up to anyone but me.

In my case I have no restriction on the color of skin. But skin color is a human characteristic. Just as physical type, height, eye color, hair type, hair size, etc. It is perfectly fine that someone thinks black skin is something that isn't appealing. If you want to call that "racism", fine, then I could call my preference "fatism". But the mistake here is trying to give the "heavy/bad" connotation of the term to make the person feel that his act would be reprehensible for some reason when in fact it is not.

No, nobody is forced to find someone with dark skin beautiful. Neither white skin. Or tall. Or small. Nor someone with a big nose. Or with curly hair.Nor anything else possible in the face of the planet Earth. Attraction is something that one cannot judge. Soon, people will feel entitled to "require" that the others should feel attracted by them. What kind of world would that be?