Poll: Jim sterling VS Extra credits

[DudeistBelieve]

Theres a fucking mute button for a reason. Just because people elect not to use it... ah fuck who cares.

Excuses excuses. A mute button doesn't make the problems go away. It just enables bad behavior.

"Yeah, I know my neighbor regularly beats his wife, but if I close the blinds, then I don't have to see it!"

Dude that isn't remotely the same thing.

If I have someone bothering me, and I don't wish to be bothered by it, I mute and I'm not longer bothered. That isn't the same as ignoring a mugging on the sidewalk because I don't want to be involved.

To use your example, muting someone is like the Wife leaving her abusive husband because she doesn't wish to be further abused.

...like really, WTF?

you can mute a person, but that person doesn't go away, other people will still have to put up with him. At the end of the day, a report function would be vastly better to the current system in place that does little more than enable poor behavior. Get it? Just because you don't see the link doesn't mean the scenarios aren't related.

All those people has the same option/chance to mute him. They choose not to. So no, I don't get it.

Also a lot of these sites, and Xbox Live do have report buttons... again, the majority just plain don't use them.

 

[ThePenguinKnight]

The industry should listen to us. But if I had to choose I'd say Jim.

Thread winner right here everybody, we can go home now.

What's there to say that hasn't already been said? Would you rather I jolt down a paragraph or two to further explain what everyone else has but in slightly different wording?

 

[doomspore98]

Another thing: Jim Sterling is a gamer first, journalist second. (There, I edited it, can you annoying folks leave me alone now? Find someone else to spam.) Extra Credits are games journalists. Big difference.

James is actually a game designer/teacher. The artist whose name escapes me right now. Is a video game artist. Dan not quite sure what he is exactly. So yeah their is a big difference between them and Jim Sterling. But they aren't game journalists.

He's an animator at pixar, I think, don't hold me to that

 

[I Have No Idea]

Wow. There's a ton of hate going around for Extra Credits. Jim is a great guy and entertaining to be sure, and EC is fantastic for finding anything and everything about the "big picture" of games. Posts from people like SmashLovesTitanQuest makes it seem like the EC personally attacked them. Which is ridiculous. I mean, come on guys, it's one thing to dislike something, but to completely discredit it as something with no value whatsoever is another.

 

[Saviordd1]

I still find the communities attitude towards EC funny. When they were on the escapist, everyone praised the earth they walked on and when they left any praise seemed to follow suite. Now Jim is now the appointed messiah of the Escapist Community.

Either way I think both parties have valid opinions and ideas, but if anything Jim sometimes feels a bit too tongue in cheek if that makes any sense.

Pretty much this.

OT: Extra Credits, they're less annoying.

 

[Frost27]

Jim Sterling has just about everything nailed down. I know a lot of people hate the guy but I very rarely disagree with him. For all his joking around with his God complex and what not, hes probably the most sensible content producer on this site.

Extra Credits on the other hand? Fuck EC. Thats all I am saying.

As for immaturity on xbox live specifically, you can mute people. I never understand the problem with minor online harassment. Some guy hitting on you in Facebook? You have a block button. Some kid on xbox live calling you a ****** jew? Bring up the scoreboard, scroll down to his name and press X. Problem solved.

You pretty much took the words right out of my mouth.

 

[OldNewNewOld]

I like both, but I voted for EC. I just like them a bit more.

Tho I don't really see a reason to compare them.
They have some similarities, but they are different shows for the most part.

Jim is all about ranting and showing what is wrong right now and possible solutions.
EC is all about an academic approach to problems, possible solutions and what the gaming industry/community could be.

So, they only are similar in 1 out of 3 points.
But then again, Jim has a childish viewpoint most of the times. Fighting insults with insults won't bring you anywhere.
And way to go with misunderstanding the EC solution. The auto-mute would only kick in if you are muted most of the times. Not always. Also, everyone who wants to listen to you can just unmute you.

Why should I, a constructive part of the community go out of my way to mute half of the online people. Shouldn't I be rewarded and them punished instead of the other way around? If someone wants to listen to them, they can just unmute them.

Also, I don't think it was meant to be a permanent auto-mute. First time you cross the average line, you get auto-muted for 1 day. Next time 3, than a week, after that 4... etc.

Also, they didn't suggest to take the messaging system completely away. Just so that you can't send messages to people who aren't your friends. You still can communicate with friends.

And 1 really important thing that was ignored. They never said it should be implemented as it is. They are trowing ideas to us and we can change them, combine, make new ideas. EC was always open for discussion and suggestions.

tl.dr.
Don't exagarate all tha bad sides of EC. Everyone has them, so do they. All in all, they are good.
And you can enjoy both since they are rather different shows.

 

[Lilani]

I think Extra Credits has the getting stuff done part down better than Jim, I think. They have more of a call to action to get people to actually DO something to improve the game industry (getting people to contact devs about certain issues, giving people information on how they can enter and be active in the games industry, etc). And while Jim does present a lot of valid points which I think the games industry should listen to, he's still just another person writing his opinions on the Internet. Again, all valid opinions, but I think positivity tends to get more done than negativity in the long run.

 

[SageRuffin]

Snippage.

I was gonna say something to the same effect, but I think you probably said it all better.

Fuggit, I'll try anyway...

I still think that back when the EC gang were simply on YouTube they had better videos simply because they didn't seem as "high-brow" and "snooty", if you will. In short, they were "real" and talked about real subjects. Then they came here and everything was still cool.

Then they started doing their episodes involving games being "artsy", so to speak. Once that hit, their episodes started appearing to carry this unspoken message akin to "if you don't like 'artistic' games, you're a fucking idiot" (complete with obligatory mentions of SotC, Ico, Braid, etc; I forget what episode it was). After that I was like "Okay... fuck this." Sometimes, I wanna, say, ponder my own place in the universe, and sometimes I just wanna drink cheap booze and shoot someone in the dick.

Aside: I've actually met James Portnow (is that how you spell it?) in person, and while he doesn't seem all that bad a guy, he definitely has a distinctive arrogance about him. The man has great hair, though.

Having said all that, I find Jim Sterling to be a fine addition to my Monday routine, especially since he cleaned up his messages and deliveries - like most, once upon a time I thought he was a colossal dick. But he's a colossal dick I can enjoy.

Wait... that didn't sound right...

 

[BehattedWanderer]

Because what the industry really needs is to pay attention to one narcissistic, self aggrandizing, egocentric loudmouth with a fetish for swearing, obviously. But I'd prefer James Portnow's somewhat elitist view on games than the views of "I wish people would love me" Jim Sterling. The EC guys might occasionally forget that the medium of discussion is games, and that one of the prime principles of games is that they're fun, but at least they reasonably embrace reality, instead of swearing constantly about having to enter an x digit code for various things in game or in the menu around a game.

The EC guys might have that "arrogant professor" vibe, which I'm used to since I've had many professors who looked down on me, but at least they're not complaining about petty bullshit that takes five minutes out of our lives that we might enjoy a developed experience.

 

[Zeckt]

There was one video that made me DESPISE extra credits to the point where I can never take them seriously again, which is ironic because I used to hold alot of respect for them. That one video about joint gaming or something where they think its a good idea for someone playing 5 minutes on an iphone to give a gamer a serious advantage on a full retail game.

That's even worse then day one dlc on the disk, that is a horrid idea. They want to further butcher games and give exclusive perks to some, that the other gamers who do not want to have to play or make their friends / family play stupid iphone mini games to get things that others will never get. Why should they get a serious advantage?

I think that video was done only to try to improve their karma with casuals. They seem to think of themselves as a malevolent jesus of gaming and it really angers me with their arrogance.

I'll take the guy who speaks honestly and goes for the Black Addler type comedy then some douchebag thanks.

 

[Austin Merida]

You people are all missing the real problem with EC - the f***ing annoying voices they use! it sounds like some 5-year-old in a helium-filled room talking into a voice changer! I only watched one episode a while ago, so I'm not sure if they have changed this, but seriously, that s*** is painful! Other than that, I have no comment on the actual intellectual comment of the show, but I do know this: We should all Thank God for Jim Sterling.

As to people suggesting draconian restrictions on online communication in gaming; Seriously? You are really THAT offended by some stupid 12-year-old who just learned what f** means that you would destroy all in-game communication or (in some cases) give up online gaming altogether? That is pathetic.

 

[MaxwellEdison]

No really opinion here, but holy shit, since when does everyone hate EC?
..Also, I have yet to see an explanation for the "pretentious" line...I've never felt that they were pretentious at all.

 

[JohnnyDelRay]

There was one video that made me DESPISE extra credits to the point where I can never take them seriously again, which is ironic because I used to hold alot of respect for them. That one video about joint gaming or something where they think its a good idea for someone playing 5 minutes on an iphone to give a gamer a serious advantage on a full retail game.

That's even worse then day one dlc on the disk, that is a horrid idea. They want to further butcher games and give exclusive perks to some, that the other gamers who do not want to have to play or make their friends / family play stupid iphone mini games to get things that others will never get. Why should they get a serious advantage?

I think that video was done only to try to improve their karma with casuals. They seem to think of themselves as a malevolent jesus of gaming and it really angers me with their arrogance.

I'll take the guy who speaks honestly and goes for the Black Addler type comedy then some douchebag thanks.

Yeah, that's the "Transgaming" episode which pretty much bit the bullet for me as well. Since then, it's hard to take anything they said seriously.

I've never had much against EC, and never felt talked down to, only that I agree with them about 50-50 of the cases they present. Whereas I agree with Jim on quite a lot more, maybe 80-20.

Jim's presentation has improved a lot since the early days, from language to content, but still not quite enough to be taken as seriously as EC perhaps, which is a shame. Some of the messages and arguments that he puts out I feel should really be heard by more, but probably won't get all that far.

And he seems big on keeping things fair for the consumer, which is dwindling in significance these days (I get the feeling that modern gamers now who tell other gamers who complain about things to "suck it up princess" and keep taking it, well maybe they just didn't play games when it was a matter of buying it, taking it home and playing the f'ing thing). Ok, it can do without the portrayal of publishers so strongly as greedy, evil corporate crybabies (that voice he does pisses me off, but I get pissed off when anyone does that), but I guess some people need that in order to get the picture, I dunno.

 

[FoolKiller]

Extra Credits tends to talk down to their audience quite a lot. That said, I liked their solution to this problem. The first one, about the default mute. Taking away the ability to message other players seems pretty draconian.

Xbox live is a nasty, immature community, and I've abandoned most online gaming because of that. Microsoft really should start taking steps to clean it up.

ECs solution, which I think would ruin multiplayer is to factor in A mute average. What if you are having A bad day and you trash talk the opisition? according to them you should be permenantly ostrisised, it is a dangerous idea.

I understand their solution. It would not necessarily penalize a bad day, or even the occasional bad day. There would be a threshold, and it would have to be fairy lenient to account for what you're talking about. Also you would have to factor in the risk that some players might mute people just out of spite. There are issues, but I think they could be worked out with a thoughtful implementation. It would spare us all listening to immature assholes every time we start a game, and I think that's a pretty worthwhile effort.

I'm sorry, I just have to: *Ostracized*

I mute just because I don't want to hear other people. I go online to kill them, not converse.

 

[Lunar Templar]

both Jim and EC have good ideas, i see no reason why one should be ignored over the other. following one set of ideas is why things are as they are right now after all

 

[natster43]

I haven't seen the newest episode so I am just going to talk about them in general. I think they should both be listened to for most subjects.
Personally I hate Jim Sterling's rants, but I usually agree with what he is saying in the few episodes I watched, and he does actually bring up good points, just while being a huge narcissistic twat about everything.
I like Extra Credits a lot, they do get preachy, but they bring up valid points and want to see the medium become more... I don't know... cultured I guess, I can't really think of a good word for what they want besides artsy and sophisticated and words I am too tired to think of to describe them, and I support that.
They both are for the betterment of the medium, just in different ways.

 

[launchpadmcqwak]

I've not watched the episodes in question, but in general I think that EC stands up better when put under a PROMPT analysis. Note that this is not about how entertaining they are, but each shows reliability.

Presentation: E.C use an even and easily understood tone to convey their message while Jim rants and slurs a lot, sacrificing clarity for a sense of personal voice.

Relevance: They both produce material about games. /shrug

Objectivity: While both have a bias, I think that E.Cs is the more open and honest here, although they want gaming to be considered a serious medium and as such they present their facts with some grandosity. They also tend to sugercoat negitive arguments, but at least they present them in some form or another. Jim on the other hand I feel is a little corrupt. I belive that his agenda is for sale to a certain degree as he often plugs individual games. This makes me question whether or not his opinions are his own or created for page views or regulated by his producer.

Method: E.C have a definate academic approach to what they produce. Jim seems to have no real method beyond opinion which is impossible to argue with or quantify.

Provenance: E.C show sources and they are open with the fact that they are industry professionals first, journalist second. Jim does neither of these but again it comes down to the fact that he produces opinion pieces. He is his own source and he has no apparent qualities that elevate this.

Timeliness: Since they both produce articles on a regular basis they can both be considered timely.

so no good points for jim?

 

[Simonoly]

Well there's no doubt about it, the games industry should definitely pay attention to EC. Some of their videos are wonderfully detailed and very well researched. Plus they actually present industry changing ideas which are more often than not quite brilliant.

But I do love Jim's rants as more often than not he presents a very compelling argument, albeit in a slightly less humble way.

 

[Thatrocketeer]

Extra Credits, if I wanted to listen to a Fat Brit talking about games I'd listen to TotalBiscuit, at least he isn't a narcissistic prick who drowns his points with his enormous ego.