Poll: Would we all be cool with a female Link?
- Thread starter TheRiddler
- Start date
This one might turn out to be long, I apologize in advance..Coakle said:
Also, before we begin, this involves a much more liberal reading of Nintendo's "Official" timeline which, if you've played all the games, makes absolutely no sense and is completely incongruous with the early titles. It seems like they hammered it out in an afternoon because a lot of people were asking them to, rather than actually having designed the games to fit in that manner. Needless to say there IS a timeline to the games, and the order may be important to you depending on how you choose to interpret some of the lore.
There are two main stories in LoZ, that of Link, Zelda, and "Evil" (generally Gannon/Ganon) which, in turn, is representative of the struggle to find a balanced life judged by three virtues, shown as the three pieces of the triforce. The second is that of duality. Depending on the game in question, this duality is shown in different ways. Majora's Mask with the, erm, masks (more of plurality I suppose, but it makes the point) in A Link to the Past, with the Light world/Dark world, in Ocarina of Time with the child and adult worlds, in Wind Waker with the rather desolate present, but glorious past shown through the underwater sections. Twilight princess again with the light/dark worlds and human/wolf link.
Starting with the very beginning, The goddesses create the world, then the events of skyward sword occur. These events explain the origin of everything, so listen closely.
Zelda is the reincarnation of Hylia, a goddess.
Ganon (really should be Gannon here, but damn Nintendo..) is the pure malice of Demise being given form to conquer the world.
Link, through his actions to save Zelda (specifically passing three trials set before him by the goddesses which strengthen his spirit, important later on), becomes "The hero".
These three entities are the entirety of the series, they are destined to repeat this conflict in very similar fashion for the rest of time, as Demise mentions explicitly. Zelda, being the reincarnation of a goddess, must always be female. I hope we can agree on this one.
Ganon, being pure malice given form is technically gender neutral, though I doubt many women would want to claim pure evil as their own. There's also a rather Freudian connection between power and penis, which may or may not have influenced Nintendo on Ganon's gender. In short, Ganon's gender is not quite fixed by the lore, male just makes more sense given his attributes.
"Link" throughout time, is simply a person who possesses the now immortal and timeless Spirit of the Hero. This spirit is what is connected to the triforce of courage, this spirit is what transformed a ritual sword into a weapon against evil and it is this spirit, everyone, that ties all of the links together. The original hero was male, thus it makes sense the spirit of the hero would look for a male body to possess, if for no other reason than natural strength (not that link is particularly beefy, but men are, on average and especially in the time period depicted in the games, stronger than women).
It is also important to note that other than OoT and somewhat in A Link to the Past, link isn't special. Something has to happen to him before he becomes a hero. In wind waker and twilight princess, it is his sister being kidnapped which spurs him to heroism, and thus entices the spirit to place his bets on that person over any other. There is some slight predestination in the series, so it is also entirely possible that the goddesses, knowing full well the cycle is endless, plan ahead of time to have a suitable body ready for the hero when he is needed.
Lastly, there has always been a modicum of attraction between Zelda and Link, this begins first in syward sword, as it is the first game chronologically, and it is entirely likely the goddesses find it necessary that this attraction exists as extra motivation for the hero, and so that the hero and hylia can recognize each other. Were the hero to be female, this attraction would be different, it could not enter the realm of chivalry that embodied by the first heroes (they were knights after all) and instead would either be sexual, or of a close friendship.
In any case, the story has always demanded that courage and wisdom unite against powerful malice to save the world, in this respect, the hero and hylia need to complement each other. Zelda, physically, is timid and weak, yet she knows far beyond her years and is an accomplished sorceress. She alone is not strong enough to stop Ganon due to acting too late/not strongly enough, as shown in OoT.
The hero, is courageous, but simple. He needs guides, the sages and others who can see the bigger picture, who know what must be done to defeat Ganon. Courage alone would get link killed. It needs to be tempered by wisdom, which in most cases does not come directly from Zelda, but from other embodiments of divinity sages, fairies and the like. All these figures do is attempt to lead link to Zelda, while ensuring along the way he has completed the requisite tasks required to weaken ganon's hold on power and secure victory.
This perfectly mirrors the duality from earlier (you remember the tangent about duality, right?). Zelda, feminine, divine, wise, timid. Link, spirited, courageous, rash.
This theme, a Woman tempering a Man's courage with superior forethought and wisdom, this wonderful duality of life, along with the rest of my novel here, is why a female link cannot occur without drastically altering the canon of the series.
Thank you.
I'd prefer something innovative to come to the franchise beyond a gender swap character. Perhaps Zelda could get some play and agency of her own with different mechanics? Or we could play as a good Ganondorf putting obstacles and allies in crucial places to stop the plans of an evil queen and her silent knight progressing as they try to take over the world?
Let's have some switch up sure, but just gender swapping Link would feel like too little. Make a classic Zelda or a radical departure.
Also Nintendo is often shy enough about trying new things in established franchises that I'd prefer them to alter the story or gameplay in a meaningful way. That could include a female Link, but it'd better if it wasn't the take home point from what they did!
Let's have some switch up sure, but just gender swapping Link would feel like too little. Make a classic Zelda or a radical departure.
Also Nintendo is often shy enough about trying new things in established franchises that I'd prefer them to alter the story or gameplay in a meaningful way. That could include a female Link, but it'd better if it wasn't the take home point from what they did!
I think we should make all previous male protagonists female, that way maybe people will shut up about it.
Either using a female link or Zelda as the lead would be cool. Doing the latter you wouldn't even necessarily have to do something cheesy like have Link be kidnapped instead. There are Zelda games where she isn't even present or a part of whatever adventure Link is having. You could give her a Majora's Mask style game.
I think Zelda as the protagonist would be sick. I mean, it wouldn't be PRINCESS Zelda, but just a girl named Zelda who becomes the hero of time.
I'm suddenly getting this idea of a Ranma-esque game where Link gender-changes, just like how he changed into a wolf in Twilight Princess. I imagine it would be much more focused on gender roles than any other LOZ game (how else would gender-changing make a difference?), but it's made in Japan, so I doubt there would be any discomfort with rampant application of gender roles. On the other hand, I doubt such a game would ever get shipped to the US.
I'll be honest, before I ever played any of the Zelda games I thought that Link WAS a female. I was under the impression that the protagonist and titular character were one and the same and since I knew two women named Zelda (also got Samus and Metroid confused and didn't realize her gender either until reading the manual for Super Metroid 2 with more effort.) which combined with Link's androgynous features further fueled my confusion.
So I vote yes, since I was already used to the idea, and apparently so are cosplayers since most Link cosplay seems to be done by women.
So I vote yes, since I was already used to the idea, and apparently so are cosplayers since most Link cosplay seems to be done by women.
I would say no because it would kinda shoot the concept of the reincarnation that has been going through the series. (or at least the feel of the reincarnations.)
However, what i WOULD like to see would be a game where you can play as Zelda instead. It would give a nice twist to it and honestly, i think it could make for a good story. Plus it would be nice to see the triforce of wisdom to actually be USED or demonstrated. I've always thought it was stupid that wisdom was the one that got taken out so quickly. (plus I kinda don't like the concept of the hero using courage. sends the message that the other two are pretty much useless by comparison.)
However, what i WOULD like to see would be a game where you can play as Zelda instead. It would give a nice twist to it and honestly, i think it could make for a good story. Plus it would be nice to see the triforce of wisdom to actually be USED or demonstrated. I've always thought it was stupid that wisdom was the one that got taken out so quickly. (plus I kinda don't like the concept of the hero using courage. sends the message that the other two are pretty much useless by comparison.)
Well, personally no, my only concern at all would be F Link and Zelda, there's a girl going after to save another girl, and if we jump straight to lesbianism, that's fine, but traditionally you'd think the romance part would change or be removed if you had two female characters.TheRiddler said:
I guess you could also have prince Zelda? Possibly? I'm a mild fan of the Zelda series, owned several of the games, but, if Link changes each time, so too would Zelda is that right?
Ah didn't see this part.garcian67 said:
But that's my point, sort of, I don't see why a lesbian relationship couldn't be identical to a hetrosexual one for Zelda and (F) Link, I think women can do all of the things for women, that men do for women, why wouldn't they be able to use chivalry, ect?
I would be fine with it. I would prefer a game about Zelda but a female Link isn't unwelcome. And no, it isn't about the thousands of fan art and fanfiction Zelda and her Knight in green would spawn.
I can hear cries of "political correctness" and "feminism" being violently repeated, though, with such a change.
I can hear cries of "political correctness" and "feminism" being violently repeated, though, with such a change.
Nope, just because Link needs to be a male, a Zelda orientated game would work though. Maybe you play Zelda as she escapes Ganondorf in OoT.
I don't see why it has to be a female version of Link- why don'y we just have Zelda actually be the protagonist of a Zelda game? Would be a lot easier. Just all of a sudden in one of the timelines, Link is the royalty and Zelda is the courageous one to get everything done for once.
OlasDAlmighty said:
I'm seeing a lot of posts like this, and I would just like to clarify that there are many, varied, and strong lore reasons that Link, the hero, cannot be female. See my posts above.undeadsuitor said:
As a Zelda lore freak, this sentence kills me. "The Hero of Time" is only in one game, Ocarina of Time, Zelda can't be the hero of time because link was already the hero of time. and I don't think we want to go that far down the time travel paradox rabbit hole. Every Link that isn't OoT is simply The Hero, for future reference.acillies45 said: