Rage Cuts Single-Player When You Buy It Used

znix

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It's moronic decisions like this that make people pirate games even more.

When will developers learn that working WITH consumers always nets more goodwill (and eventually profit) than working against them?

Instead they want to really squeeze people for every last little penny. Sure, they're corporate and they're in it to make money. Unfortunately, this kind of action will probably have the opposite effect.

I for one am looking forward to seeing how quickly Diablo 3 single player is cracked and made to work flawlessly for offline pirates, while all the real customers get left high and dry.
It'll be an interesting lesson in blizzard forum activity, that's for sure.
 

stewox

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Just wanted to get something clear - that whatever for some reason you don't want to buy it ... let that be out of spite because of "how they treat us and work against us" - and not because of the GAME.

I can agree with most of the people here about Always-On and other things in some capacity - but this sewer stuff is just pointless to even discuss over - it won't do anything for the one who buys it and you'll are going to.


The industry just sadly follow suits whoever comes with an idea first - that's just the unfortunate of it - bethesda needs to come with unique ideas and stop copying EA with their online pass. And what the heck this is - it's NOT an online pass at all for RAGE - it's very very MINOR thing compared.

This outburst is detrimental to the community --- mostly because it's a new IP and people just don't realize how big it migth be.




Because this game might be worth the cash of any other game in years.

Im not saying it'll be the sole top 1# --- becase DOOM4 is going to set another line. and RAGE is not focusing o multiplayer. Doom4 will be also graphically 3 times as better(on consoles, but PC is already up high starting with rage)
 

MordinSolus

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Feb 10, 2011
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qwerty19411 said:
MordinSolus said:
Soviet Heavy said:
And this is going to stop modders from unlocking the content how?
You know, it'll stop them...from uh...getting underground with it's...firewall?
Obviously, you're not a golfer.

And wow Bethesda, next you'll be pulling this tactic on Skyrim and locking out Dragons.
I'm not a golfer? What does that mean?
 

Withard

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sosolidshoe said:
Mike Kayatta said:
Rage Cuts Single-Player When You Buy It Used



Rage's creative director has confirmed the lack of always-on DRM, but announced single-player cuts for aftermarket buyers.

In recent years, game publishers have made it no secret that they aren't particularly thrilled with the effect that pirating and used game sales have had on their profit margins. In response, they've stuffed games with everything from online passkeys to the ever-loathed always-on DRM, while gamers have had the privilege of playing guinea pig to whatever solutions they come up with. Bethesda's upcoming post-apocalyptic shooter Rage is no exception, and the game's creative director Tim Willits has confirmed what you'll be missing out on if you fail to buy it with the shrink wrap still in place: an entire section of the game's single-player experience.

Most people who spend a good part of their day on XBL or PSN have probably already run into the online pass, a special one-use code included with your disc that generally unlocks the game's multiplayer mode once you redeem it. What this means, of course, is that if you ever sell that game after growing bored with it, the unlucky sod who gets it next won't be able to pwn his buddies with that overpowered sniper rifle he unlocked by beating the game until he or she drops what's usually another $10 to $20 on a pass of his or her own. Rage won't be protecting its multiplayer, but it will be using a similar idea for part of its single player campaign. The "sewer hatches," an underground tunnel system that will reportedly bring players to new enemies and missions, will only open up with a brand new copy of the game.

When asked about the section that would be cut for aftermarket buyers, Willits said, "[M]ost people never even see it. I can tell you, some people will buy Rage, download that, and still never set foot in those things. They just won't. I think that's fair. It's cool. It's outside the main path. We're not detracting from anything. But I know some consumers, when you can't avoid it, then you get a little touchy subject." Later, in the same interview, he confirmed that while Rage will include its own brand of online pass, it won't include always-on DRM. That doesn't mean we won't see it in other games id Software works on in the future, however, as he did go on to champion its use. [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/112187-id-Software-Praises-Always-On-in-Diablo-3]

With Rage's plan sounding suspiciously similar to some sort of reverse day-one DLC, there're sure to be more than a handful of gamers who take issue with the decision. While publishers do have to take steps to protect their industry, what I don't understand is why Willits is trying to downplay the fun-factor of running through the sewer missions Rage is locking with an online pass. If it's true that "most people will never even see it" and that skipping the section doesn't "detract" anything from your experience, then why would this actually affect whether or not a gamer buys the game new or used?

Source: Eurogamer.net [http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2011-08-11-tim-willits-building-rage-and-never-selling-out-interview]


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I can't understand why this is legal. As in, I actually can't see how they could get away with this without being sued. A game disc, and the game on that disc, is a PRODUCT, not a service. These companies can get away with locking multiplayer access because the multiplayer aspect of the game requires connection to servers, making it a service.

However, if I buy a PRODUCT, that product is MINE by law. I own it. ALL of it. It doesn't matter if I buy it from the shop, or off the internet, or secondhand from a shady dude at a car boot sale, the physical product is in my possession, and as such is legally my property providing it was not stolen or copied. So why does this company feel it has the right to restrict my access to sections of a PRODUCT which I legally own?
Wrong. You read the Terms & Conditions? If not its your problem and there is NOTHING they can be sued for.

All these stupid arguments like "If I buy a car blah blah I dont want the breaks etc etc" are completely UNREALISTIC arguments.

Lets consider the following. The same model car comes in more lavish varieties for a premium.

Music CD's can have deluxe versions with a remix....the remix was NOT the intended final product but something that appeared along the side.

Directors Cut DVD's. The theatrical version is still there but so is a more in depth directors cut.

The list can go on so the way to look at this is EXACTLY like its said:



YOU GET THE GAME FROM START TO FINISH!! All you choose...yes CHOOSE not to have is a couple of odd side tidbits that do NOT effect the story (Movie?) that you have chosen to immerse yourself in.






You want more? Buy the Directors Cut of RAGE. Simple.
 

Rad Party God

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Feb 23, 2010
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Congratulations id, you're the second company (after Blizzard/Activision) I boycotted to buy any of your games ever again. Fuck you too id.
 

theultimateend

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CrazyMedic said:
killamanhunter said:
well...

screw you too id
yeah id wanting to make money I Mean what the fuck just because I am too cheap to buy the game new doesn't mean I shouldn't get their blood sweat and tears.
If you are bleeding while making a video game you should probably consult your doctor.

Also get back to me when this sort of thing is normal for any other industry.

"We've hidden chapters 15-19 of the latest Game of Thrones for anyone who buys it secondhand."

"We've removed the top 3 gears of our 4 door sedans for anyone who buys them secondhand."

"We've removed the last 5 tracks of the latest hit from pop sensation whoever for anyone who buys the CD secondhand."

Or movies that cut out part of the film if you rent, borrow, or buy secondhand.

Couches that don't come with cushions if you buy secondhand.

etc...etc...

Video games are apparently the only industry in the world that is spending so much for so little that they need to create gimmicks just to stay afloat.

I realize the complaining has been going on since at least the 90's but it really does feel like at one time folks made games, people liked the games, and thus money was made and now it is lets build a product and sell that product and label it a game.

Very surgical, sterile, disappointing.

Who knows though, this game might be great. I'll wait for the steam sale, but the hidden content on second hand purchases are obnoxious. If such a thing would cripple the company they should rethink their game development setup (and I don't mean fire people, I mean actually figure out what is important in making a fun game, cause the answer is not millions of dollars in graphics work).

Withard said:
Wrong. You read the Terms & Conditions? If not its your problem and there is NOTHING they can be sued for.
TOS comes after the purchase. Which is not how the TOS works for just about any other good or service. The only way to see the TOS is to put the game in a state that it cannot be returned: Opened.

Withard said:
All these stupid arguments like "If I buy a car blah blah I dont want the breaks etc etc" are completely UNREALISTIC arguments.
I know the rest of this will be fantastic.

Withard said:
Lets consider the following. The same model car comes in more lavish varieties for a premium.
This would not be the same. This argument would fit with buying a deluxe edition of a game versus a standard edition. If they wanted to avoid scrutiny they'd just have the "extra miniscule thing" be a DLC code and word it appropriately.

Withard said:
Music CD's can have deluxe versions with a remix....the remix was NOT the intended final product but something that appeared along the side.
Again, this is deluxe versus standard edition. Currently they have a game that looks the same in both states, but one state is less valuable than the other. It is misleading and assumes that all gamers have access to their news releases.

Withard said:
Directors Cut DVD's. The theatrical version is still there but so is a more in depth directors cut.
And again...different.

Withard said:
The list can go on so the way to look at this is EXACTLY like its said:
It could...but you'd be making the wrong point over and over.

Withard said:
YOU GET THE GAME FROM START TO FINISH!! All you choose...yes CHOOSE not to have is a couple of odd side tidbits that do NOT effect the story (Movie?) that you have chosen to immerse yourself in.
There are actually a few films that have very important scenes removed from them to make time for the release. Seeing these in the directors cuts provides you with a mucher better understanding of the story.

If this cave or dungeon has ANY additional insight on the story it means the overall story loses something.

At what point can you remove backstory or sidestory before it becomes too much?

Anywho, they have a really terrible marketer who should probably be getting a new job. Slightly better wording and perhaps proper labeling on their box could have avoided all the hubbub.

Withard said:
You want more? Buy the Directors Cut of RAGE. Simple.
See. Weird. You finally make the point.

You'll notice that in all other examples you provided there is proper documentation or different box art, advertising skus, etc.

So no, not the same.
 

Frost27

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Jun 3, 2011
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The line "...will reportedly bring players to new enemies and missions" makes it sound like they may be cutting off a hub that allows you to access DLC. Likely they have some big DLC plans and if you don't buy it new or pay for a pass, you don't play the DLC. IMO if this is in fact the case (not saying it is, just a possibility) then it is a severely dumb move on Id's part unless the DLC that gets blocked is free to download if you own the game.

I noticed today that games at a local resale outlet were selling for about $10 cheaper than the average price if they required an online pass. Apparently they do this so I can get MoH at the same price as, say, Far Cry 2 once I have paid for the online pass + game. Sounds to me then that all that type of tactic does is hurt the person who sells the game to the Gamestop, etc. since they get less in return for their sale when they bring it in.
 

Still Life

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-|- said:
Is this 17 pages of entitlement - I haven't read it all, but I bet at least 90% of it is?

FFS - it's pretty simple. Don't like the way ID are doing business then don't buy the game. ID does not owe you anything, but they do have something they want to sell you. Make a choice. I've made mine and have this on pre-order. Market will decide if this is the ""thin end of the wedge" or not based on sales rather than nerd whining.
Pretty much.

More ironic is that these 'first buyers' incentives have been the norm for some time now. There's a couple of dashes of reason here and there, but this is a thread full of rampant consumerism.
 

CM156_v1legacy

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Mar 23, 2011
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Mmmm, it appears Jim supports [http://www.destructoid.com/buy-rage-used-miss-out-on-extra-content-forever-208629.phtml] this idea.
That, right there, is a beautiful example of rewarding new customers without punishing used ones. A real reward for loyal support, rather than making an exclusive out of something that ordinarily isn't. RAGE was already high on my DO WANT list, but this classy not-online-pass scheme has definitely cemented my appreciation.
And he's really Pro-used sales.

Alright id, I'll let this slide. But I'm going to be watching you.
 

RadioactiveMicrobe

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Okay, so this all goes down, right? A few years from now, this game will be pretty hard to find new. So what then? The game just gets screwed over?
 

ultrachicken

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This is a rather pointless attempt at a solution to this "problem," as I doubt this will stop many people from buying it used. This won't stop me from buying it, though.
 

Beautiful End

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Well, good luck with Rage. Ya know, because it's such an expected game, more so than MW3 or Battlefield or even GoW. Because surely people will spend their 60 bucks on this unknown game, knowing that they got the best deal in their lives. And no sane person ever will sell this game because it would be like shooting the Pope; an unbearable thought. [/sarcasm]

Look, when you buy used games, developers DO see a profit. How? When a game is on demand (whether used or new), stores like Gamestop request more copies in order to satisfy people's needs. They get both used and new copies. The new copies will allow the used copies to keep coming and by requesting new games, the developers realize their game is selling and they send in more copies. It's a circle.

But anyway, I'm tired of that bullshit about how used games are a crime and whatnot. People who think otherwise are hopeless. So getting back to the main topic, Rage is not that big of a game yet in order to try that. When RE: Mercenaries did something similar to that, everyone thought it was a big deal because it was a Resident fucking Evil game. but Rage? Sorry, I know it looks awesome and whatnot but so did Brink before it came out. That's a dick move that it's only gonna backslash.

If they truly want to reward people who buy the game brand new, how about adding unique guns? Or suits? Maybe an extra map pack for reservation? Something that will say "Hey, I got this game brand new so I got this flashy outfit and a gun and all you got is that generic suit. Boo!". Modnation Racers did that by releasing a Sackboy kart and avatar if you bought the game brand new and they gave a Kratos kart and avatar for reserving it. Up until today, I still get asked online about my avatars. And I think I got a good deal. So learn from that, developers.
 

punipunipyo

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Care not, this game is a BUY, unless Pray2 comes out close to this and it's got better gameplay, not likely...
 

stewox

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People that live under a rock with stuff like not knowing the developer of rage ... have very little credibility in this thread ... especially all the complainers.

The point is nobody will sell this game after they bougt it ... maybe some fanboy idiot kid who doesn't know who IDSoftware is and doesn't know to play the game.