Rage Cuts Single-Player When You Buy It Used

[Kroxile]

Oh, ID Software, why hast thou forsaken me?

Seriously, 18 years ago I would have said ID Software is the greatest game developer in the world. Hell, I preferred their Doom over Valve's Halflife and still do. Surely they must see that this is just going to encourage piracy and game cracks right? Because this will in no way affect pirates, as much as they'd like to think it will

 

[0986875533423]

Haha, for some reason I got a kick outta that. Maybe because the way it started made me think of the oldspiceguy. Maybe that was intentional *shrug* but anyways.
Yeah, I totally agree.
It works that way for all of the other industries, and they don't whine about it nearly as much as game devs.
It would be idiotic to remove a chapter from a used book, wipe a song from a used CD, a scene from a used movie, or anything like that. So why should it be different?
And while I'm at it, last I checked listening to my CDs, watching movies, and reading books never required me to maintain a constant internet connection.
You know what, I think I understand now why other industries don't take the gaming industry seriously.
They're like the whiny little sibling that their mother forces them take with them to their friend's house.
(Haha, funny I of all people should say that, since I was that younger sibling in my family )

I think the greatest difference is probably the ongoing support for games (patches and so on). The original author of a book wouldn't come around to your house three months after publication, take their book off your shelf and correct the spelling error on page 214 with a biro. So I guess there's more of an emphasis on an active relationship between the dev and the customer than with other media.

Still, the way the industry behaves about it is, as you say, very childish.

 

[Ghored]

How is punishing late buyers gonna cut down the pirating rate of games? I saw trailers of Rage (which looked like a cross between Bulletstorm and Borderlands, honestly.), so I can't really say I was planning on buying it at $60, but really, does I.D. have to do this?

 

[xcgillx2]

There is no need for things like this if you really want to do something about the DRM take dead island as an example. when its released if you buy it new you get some DLC early and some exclusive DLC so it can save you money but offers and exclusive item(s) for customers who buy it brand new. this is a fine way of doing things you simply reward dedicated fans or people who might just like the game but don't punish people who weren't convinced that it was worth £40.
Or if you are going to restrict features of a game because people dont want to risk their money when they might buy it but dont want to miss out. the only way I can see this as OK is if they release a GOOD demo first not just some half arsed 10 minute section of the game

 

[William Ossiss]

well then. my views about this title are as such: was going to try it. now? fuck it. im not going to waste my time on something that is trying to fuck over us poor gamers. i purchase my stuff almost always used, or i rent. so when they do this type of shit... no. i have to put my foot down.

You must deal with this all the time! Every EA game you buy you have to deal with it so why is this pushing you over the edge?

i already don't buy EA games. aside from mass effect...

 

[Snotnarok]

Except it doesn't, they're cutting some part of the single player out. Like Mass Effect 2 you didn't get a character and the story connecting it. It's far from a game breaking or game destroying. This is basically the equivalent of getting regular seats vs leather seats.

It doesn't change the overall experience, and it's your choice to buy used and you know you'll get less. You get what you pay for as the saying goes and I'd say this applies.

And again, you're not giving id software a dime with this buy, why would they want to give you more when it cost time and money to make the game and you wont even give them a cent?

Fine then. Side with the corporations. See how far that will get you as a consumer. You and people like you are the reason they get away with shit like this.

And how game destroying it is, is a perspective thing. You think it's not, I think it is.

I'm glad you expect full package without paying the people who made it. That's like you moving a couch for me and I pay only your friend for finding you to move it for me and he doesn't give you anything. And you're right who cares about the developers who are over worked, underpaid and often stepped on, the developers who are people too.

I buy used too, I'm not bloody made of money and I save it where I can. But I'm not stupid and I know it doesn't go to them and it lowers their numbers which can hurt the budget for their next game or simply kill it.

I'm against DRM, I'm against fucking the customer over, but you're talking about removing something that does not wreck the game in anyway shape or form because you can easily buy that content via dlc now. And given you have an OPTION to buy it new or used and the choices are laid out rather than DRM where you just get to eat shit because the company legitimately hates their customers. They are not doing a thing wrong here, you just want all the content without giving them a dime, it's not siding it's just bloody common sense someone wants to be paid for their hard work.

So you can whine and throw your crayons at the wall and be self entitled that you paid for this game and it should have all the content,but you didn't pay THEM who MADE the game. Which means they're not making money which goes to cover the hours (sometimes years) they spend making that game. Not giving any money to the dev or helping their numbers. So you said it's a perspective thing, so why should they care what you want when you won't help them? How about that for perspective.

 

[orangeban]

Except it doesn't, they're cutting some part of the single player out. Like Mass Effect 2 you didn't get a character and the story connecting it. It's far from a game breaking or game destroying. This is basically the equivalent of getting regular seats vs leather seats.

It doesn't change the overall experience, and it's your choice to buy used and you know you'll get less. You get what you pay for as the saying goes and I'd say this applies.

And again, you're not giving id software a dime with this buy, why would they want to give you more when it cost time and money to make the game and you wont even give them a cent?

Fine then. Side with the corporations. See how far that will get you as a consumer. You and people like you are the reason they get away with shit like this.

And how game destroying it is, is a perspective thing. You think it's not, I think it is.

I'm glad you expect full package without paying the people who made it. That's like you moving a couch for me and I pay only your friend for finding you to move it for me and he doesn't give you anything. And you're right who cares about the developers who are over worked, underpaid and often stepped on, the developers who are people too.

No, that's a silly analogy. It's like I moved a couch for you, and you payed me. But later a different friend moved your couch and you didn't pay me.

Or heck, it's like you bought a sofa from a sofa maker, then later sold the sofa and didn't give the money you got back to the sofa maker.

Also, if your right about the conditions that developers work in, hell they don't need more money, they need a goddamn union.

 

[Brandon237]

...So it's like a middle school teacher rapping you on the knuckles for coming to school late?

I'm no advocate of used games sales. In fact I STILL don't get how people can genuinely separate it from bona fide Piracy; In either case, the publisher and Dev don't get a single cent from your purchase. What changes? The fact that your being conned by Gamestop? Well that makes YOU an idiot for getting fucking CONNED. Why is id being portrayed as the villain here?

I think as far as piracy fighting tools go, this isn't that bad of an idea.
Here's another idea id. Instead of making whole levels exclusives.......why not a gun? Remove one weapon (probably the shotgun as it's the most iconic) from the game entirely. You just can't equip it, if you're playing a used/pirated version of the game? You can still obviously do every single quest, but you just won't have as much fun.

Make pirates WANT to buy your game. Don't make normal people WANT to avoid it.

Let me see: Person A buys game. It is THEIRS. They sell it, as they have the right to (see "Capitalism") and someone buys it (see "Capitalism"). Suddenly a piece of it vanishes to the new buyer. WTH?! That makes no sense. That is like 5th gear breaking when a car is bought used, or all the red pixels disappearing from your second hand TV. Some of us don't have the money to buy every game new, and what buying 2nd hand does is gives us a chance to get to know a series, and it means that the seller can now afford another game new, game companies think of themselves each as a single link in a chain that moves in one direction, if the money moves below their link, they see it as gone, but it is actually an economic web, for games to enter the 2nd hand market, they have to be purchased, an the new seller gets money to buy more games, the whole industry will be shot in the foot with each game company that stops second hand selling. You also shrink your market as people won't enter gaming if everything they see costs $60, they will look at this and think "WTF?".

And in our capitalist modern world, it is perfectly legal to buy and then resell something. It keeps the economy flowing, which in the long run DOES help the companies at the top, because their usual buyers still have cash for new goods. You act as if it is wrong or illegal to buy second hand, something that happens in all but the consumables' industries and brothels, in fact I'm not even sure about it not happening in the second one! That attitude is screaming that you are either rich and don't care about people who aren't, or just don't care.

 

[lacktheknack]

I still don't understand why they just don't lock out patches for used copies. That way everyone who buys the disk gets what's on the disk. The patches are for people who bought new and supported the dev, so they get support back. People who buy used don't get support, since they didn't support the dev.

Pitch this idea in its own thread and see what happens. This looks like the best idea to me.

 

[orangeban]

...So it's like a middle school teacher rapping you on the knuckles for coming to school late?

I'm no advocate of used games sales. In fact I STILL don't get how people can genuinely separate it from bona fide Piracy; In either case, the publisher and Dev don't get a single cent from your purchase. What changes? The fact that your being conned by Gamestop? Well that makes YOU an idiot for getting fucking CONNED. Why is id being portrayed as the villain here?

I think as far as piracy fighting tools go, this isn't that bad of an idea.
Here's another idea id. Instead of making whole levels exclusives.......why not a gun? Remove one weapon (probably the shotgun as it's the most iconic) from the game entirely. You just can't equip it, if you're playing a used/pirated version of the game? You can still obviously do every single quest, but you just won't have as much fun.

Make pirates WANT to buy your game. Don't make normal people WANT to avoid it.

How is Gamestop conning me? It makes sense to me, I don't want game, Gamestop want to sell game, other person wants my game on the cheap, it's a glorius trade.

Anyway, that's a minor niggle, but how can you say with a straight face that an illegal thing (piracy) is the same as a legal thing (second hand sales). I mean, that's just batshit bananabrains silly.

Here's something I want to know, why is Gamestop, or any other game retailer less deserving of making money than the game developer? Why is it so wrong for the company to (in a totally legal way, as opposed to id's thing here which borders on breaking consumer rights) help both itself and its customers?

 

[ZippyDSMlee]

I wish people wouldn't buy games that used things like this. Too bad so many gamers exist these days therefor meaning that there will be more and more idiots that won't think twice when purchasing games that rip people off like this. No other product on this planet has such rediculous precautions in place when it comes to the used game market and even the new game market as well (always online etc)

It goes to show how the game developers that once treated their games with respect see them as nothing more than a tool to swindle more and more money out of unsuspecting victims. I only wish there was a way of getting my point across to the masses but, I know that these messages will probably just fall on deaf ears.

Developers have been doing this for years, its called day one DLC. A tiny section of the game is held back for people who buy it new
Christ I wouldn't have to correct everyone if they'd read the f*cking article

Its called fcking over the consumer for a dime more.

But why is everyone acting like this is something new? its happened in almost every EA game

Nerd rage its lulzy, all I can say I did it with them and Oblivoin, its senseless to do it this way, tho FO3 got it right as in the game in the year addition with everything on the disc(still wont buy it its a weak poorly paced mess of a game with some good level design put into it).


Its only a shame those that care are insignificant these days.

 

[RobCoxxy]

Any cut content detracts from the stock experience.

 

[Ipsen]

It's probably been done...1-4 times already, but...

I just like to comment on weird aspects to this debate.

1. Don't forget, everyone; when you buy a game, new or used, you only purchase a lease of the license to play that game; Publishers/Developers actually own the game you're playing, and all you actually own is a piece of plastic.

2. Here's an idea on how you kill the used game market; pubs lock games after one play through if you did not buy the game new. The shit that'd fly if when that's pulled... But that's what we're headed towards. Companies use their very innovative capabilities to lock up their works from the populace. And all they have to do is find a way to work with the major used retail market (granted, not a simple task, but fuck, its about time!).

3. I'll throw out some advice here. Know who you're defending when you make an argument for or against. I've always thought defending publishers is like shielding them from sniper lasers, while the publisher has the developer hostage with a gun pointed at their heads. But really, when have big publishers ever been happy with/receptive of our support as gamers/consumers? Open your eyes to the game big-dog publishers are playing; they'll NEVER be happy with what we give, even if the used market never existed/crumbled.

Now these antics with RAGE aren't ground-shattering; as long as I'd get to pay for the sewer access later on, should I like the game, I'd be alot more satisfied paying for it later (and probably other additions too). I'd even get the game new if I was interested in it. But publishers are getting more and more brave with their eagle-eye over their clients; if you don't see the nature of the beast just yet, you will in time.

 

[sunpop]

So the only people to be effected by this will be the small group of people who buy the game used and don't know how to download a crack that unlocked the sewers? I can almost guarantee that within a week of release there are a bunch of cracks to unlock the sewers without the code.

Yet I feel if someone downloads this crack it will be illegal which is a load of shit as you bought the game used legally and they are denying you the right to play everything in it.

 

[RevRaptor]

Well I'm not getting this game then, What happens If I get the ich to play it ten years down the track will the online pass still work or will I be forced to play the netuered version?
Was pretty lukewarm about this games anyway, this is just the final nail in the coffin.

 

[stewox]

All you need to know:
http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showthread.php?t=150325

 

[hellblazer445]

Next time I want to buy a used Mercedes, I'll call official Mercedes dealership to ask them if they're gonna cut my brakes if I don't give them a piece of that action.

Amen.

Id software seems to be saying some pretty whack shit these days. I think I'm gonna let this game pass.

 

[RedEyesBlackGamer]

I actually spoke to an Econ professor who was also a gamer about this. His solution? Cut spending, sell games for less, give people a bounus for buying new, and make fewer games. If a game requires over one million people to buy it new just to break even, something wrong is going on. Secondly, $60 is a bit high of an asking price for almost all new games. Price acorindly. Thirdly, if people got a discount on future DLC when they bought new, not only would that increase people buying new, it would also encourage them to hold on to the disk for future content, and fewer used copies would be floating around. It doesn't have to be much. Making 4 DLC packs 7.50 if you bought new (and, say $10 if you bought used) would still net you $30 at the end. Finally, if pubishers made fewer games, they wouldn't over-saturate the public. Again, I'm simplyfing these points.

That would be perfect. It would reward and encourage consumers to buy games new without punishing people who buy used. Which is why that system would never be put into place. Publishers are greedy and short sighted like that.

 

[sabercrusader]

So I'm wondering how many people actually read the whole article? It only cuts out a completly optional SP part that, as far as I know, isn't important to the story, and they went on to say that some people who buy the game new won't even see the place, it just seems to me like day one DLC that you get with the game for buying it new, and have the chance to buy it later if you got it used. It dosen't cut the SP from the game (although the title sure did suggest that, porbably would want to change that misleading title), it works the EXACT SAME WAY that if you bought Mass Effect 2 new, you got into Cerberus Network for free and got Zaeed for free, and if you didn't buy it new, you chose wether or not you wanted to buy the Cerberus Network and get Zaeed, he wasn't crucial to the story of the game, you could go on without him, it was just nice to have another party member. It's really not bad at all if you think about it. I'd rather have a non-crucial part of the single-player cut out than have to buy an online pass to play multiplayer.

It's still a part of the game! The guy said in the article that it had new missions and enemies, that seems a pretty big part of the experince.
This is just away for them to make more money, thats all they care about. This is why piracy is getting more common.

I torrent a game with some content missing? Oh well at least I didn't pay anything.
I pay for a used game; content missing. Wait what!?

It is Day One DLC, nothing else, and who are you to tell me that's a big part of the game? You don't know how long the part is. And do you not understand that they need to make money too? If you buy a game used, they get little to no money at all. Without money, they can't pay the people who made the game, and they can't make another game. Contrary to what you might belive, these people are doing they're jobs, and they're job is to make a great game for people like us to enjoy, if you can't afford new games then fine. I don't want to ban used game sales by any means, but when they cut something out because you don't buy the game new, I don't really care. I chose if I want to buy it or not.


Try putting yourself in the programmers shoes, or the game testers, or anyone that actually helped in the creating of the game. You create this awesome game and all, it's a completely orginal idea and all the reviews have been great so far, but the game bombs in moneymaking. Why? Most players bought the game used or torrented it so you got little to no money at all for spending countless hours doing whatever you did to make the game. Now imagine hearing that, when economy is so bad right now. Can you seriously tell me that you wouldn't be angry if that happened to you? And do you know what they do to combat that problem? This, they cut out a non-crucial portion of the game and release it as DLC for a price so that they can get some money.




I don't understand why people complain so much about this, do the think that robots make the games? That the people who make the games are rolling around in money? That's only the big ones. Look at it from the point of view of the workers on the game before you condemn the game. You're right, this is a way to get more money, because if they don't do this, they don't get payed, they don't get payed, they won't be able to make more games and people will lose their jobs, just because people like you whine and ***** and complain about them taking out a small portion of a game to try and tempt you into buying it new or paying for it after you buy the game used.



EDIT: Yeah, another giant wall of text, I really need to split these into paragraphs.

 

[Still Life]

However, if I buy a PRODUCT, that product is MINE by law.

That argument might work before the law if you weren't actually purchasing a license. The terms of which you agree to when you install the software.