Review: Star Ocean: The Last Hope
- Thread starter John Funk
- Start date
Not sure I follow you on this one. Honestly now, the FPS genre hasn't evolved that much over the years either. The graphics got flashier, the animations are nicer, some of them have a few neat features that others don't. All of this is true for JRPGs as well. But just like JRPGs, the real meat and potatoes of the FPS experienced hasn't changed much over time. This is the basic formula of just about every FPS ever released: You, the player, run around and shoot things. But I don't hear people saying that the FPS genre is a relic. Why is that?CantFaketheFunk said:
As one of the most stedfast defenders of JRPG's on this site I still kind of agree with John Funk. I don't really ever want the JRPG to go away completely, I don't completely hate cutscenes (though the Play 5 Minutes, watch a 15 Minute cutscene ratio really must change) and I horribly FEAR every RPG becoming either a Diablo clone or a crappy attempt at another Oblivion or Fallout style game.
I do however strongly feel that JRPG's need to grow up, at least a little. The formula of Dungeon, Town, Cutscene must be broken, and broken hard. The only gameplay most JRPG's offer is in Dungeon Exploration and Combat whereas in Mass Effect the simple act of TALKING is transformed into a fantastically variable element of gameplay, why can't JRPG's follow suite, at least a little.
As well some attempt at giving the players more of a role in guiding the story would also be appreciated, why not make shorter games with more branching plots instead of 80+ hour epic monsters which are super linear from start to finish... not saying I will never play another Xenogears, but again, why not at least make the attempt.
And FPS's have evolved, at least a bit, though if Killzone 2 is any indication, they need to start innovating and soon. Still, saying that an FPS is "just" running and gunning is like saying an RPG is just grinding and finding (leveling up and searching for treasure). If they are, they're clearly not good examples of the genre. The FPS, thanks to folks like Valve and 2K Boston, has become an interesting genre for telling a story through action and in some cases it becomes about emulating a specific tactical style ala Rainbow Six.
I do however strongly feel that JRPG's need to grow up, at least a little. The formula of Dungeon, Town, Cutscene must be broken, and broken hard. The only gameplay most JRPG's offer is in Dungeon Exploration and Combat whereas in Mass Effect the simple act of TALKING is transformed into a fantastically variable element of gameplay, why can't JRPG's follow suite, at least a little.
As well some attempt at giving the players more of a role in guiding the story would also be appreciated, why not make shorter games with more branching plots instead of 80+ hour epic monsters which are super linear from start to finish... not saying I will never play another Xenogears, but again, why not at least make the attempt.
And FPS's have evolved, at least a bit, though if Killzone 2 is any indication, they need to start innovating and soon. Still, saying that an FPS is "just" running and gunning is like saying an RPG is just grinding and finding (leveling up and searching for treasure). If they are, they're clearly not good examples of the genre. The FPS, thanks to folks like Valve and 2K Boston, has become an interesting genre for telling a story through action and in some cases it becomes about emulating a specific tactical style ala Rainbow Six.
Thank you, Funk! This is part of what keeps me coming back to this place. The Truth!
Last Hope is seriously an abomination in the face of anything creative or innovating.
Last Hope is seriously an abomination in the face of anything creative or innovating.
Being a JRPG fan and having never enjoyed a Pokemon game I really must ask why? Pokemon is almost a genre unto itself and isn't really indicative of JRPG's as a whole.Pyronox said:
No amount of innovation or gameplay is going to save your JRPG if your story-telling is lacking. If you can't attach yourself to the characters because the voiceovers are annoying, the cutscenes are intrusive, and you have little impact over the choices you can make in the story, why bother?
I plunked down my $59.99 for SO4. Was excited about the multiple disc JRPG I was about to jump into it and was so horribly disappointed in the first hour that the game immediately found a new home on my shelf where all the other games I no longer give a crap about reside. Maybe one day I'll give it another go, but not while there are other more worthwhile games I haven't finished yet.
I plunked down my $59.99 for SO4. Was excited about the multiple disc JRPG I was about to jump into it and was so horribly disappointed in the first hour that the game immediately found a new home on my shelf where all the other games I no longer give a crap about reside. Maybe one day I'll give it another go, but not while there are other more worthwhile games I haven't finished yet.
I can agree with most of what has been said in the article about Star Ocean and add a few like the fact that the camera is unruly at best, and the graphics have that overblown blinding shine to them. But for some reason I still decently like(definitely not my favorite but not the worst I have played) the game even though the story unravels in a completely linear progression it is still a interesting story and the story is kind of built into sections that all start coming together in the end which makes it like bite sized chunks to devour.
As JRPG's in a whole I have seen many with much better story telling than many games from the anywhere else. Although I do think Square has rested on its history too much Lost Odyssey was decent but most games they have put out lately pretty much have had game breaking graphics glitches and/or characters that you could just not care about. Granted multi branching stories are great but sometimes it just works better to tell the story the way it was meant to be and multi branches can cause convolution.
I think the biggest reason people are not seeing the innovation from JRPG's is because they are to busy kissing squares butte buying their games then trying other games. In the genre that are much better with way better stories.
As JRPG's in a whole I have seen many with much better story telling than many games from the anywhere else. Although I do think Square has rested on its history too much Lost Odyssey was decent but most games they have put out lately pretty much have had game breaking graphics glitches and/or characters that you could just not care about. Granted multi branching stories are great but sometimes it just works better to tell the story the way it was meant to be and multi branches can cause convolution.
I think the biggest reason people are not seeing the innovation from JRPG's is because they are to busy kissing squares butte buying their games then trying other games. In the genre that are much better with way better stories.
I call 'em Rail Playing Games for a reason.
The genre is pretty much dead on the current consoles yet at the same time it's coming back. The actual jRPGs are dying but instead everythign else develops gigantic cutscenes and because those aren't interactive they get tons of quicktime events applied.
The genre is pretty much dead on the current consoles yet at the same time it's coming back. The actual jRPGs are dying but instead everythign else develops gigantic cutscenes and because those aren't interactive they get tons of quicktime events applied.
Looked fun until you mentioned the voice acting and then tortured us with making us listen to it.
Ugh, I had to claw my ears off...
Ugh, I had to claw my ears off...
This actually spawned an interesting discussion while Funk and I were video capturing for this game. I wonder what other people's thoughts on it were.Frank_Sinatra_ said:
Which would you prefer
-Game with voice acting, but it's terrible.
-Game without any voice acting, but maybe that money was invested into a new feature.
Do you think that voice overs have become the norm for RPGs and that without it a game would be as well received even if it was superior to a game with bad voice talent?
I personally could see some games doing better by canning their voice talent and investing that money into better writers, graphic engine, etc. If you are not going to strive to do something well then why bother, play towards your strong points. A good percentage of RPG gamers grew up on games that never had voice acting, I don't see a game releasing without any having a major effect on sales. At least for a percentage of the market, there are bound to be some who would think the game would be incomplete without it or that it's simply unacceptable for a game to release without it now days.
What is it with everyone crying out about the horrible voice acting? I've heard much worse voice acting, and had to withstand much MUCH worse writing. It's not fantastic, but I found it bearable.
That being said, I was quite disappointed with the game. The story was far too simple: It took me 80 hours to beat, but I felt like I had played it for 5 thanks to the straightforward plot told at a snail's pace.
I've also gotten in the habit of enjoying my games in hour and a half chunks, since I really don't have the time these days. This game was tough for me since the size of the dungeons was absolutely ridiculous, and it didn't help that the game uses save points sparingly at best.
The end game is also terrible. I mean, There's sooo much to do, but you don't want to do any of it for one simple reason: item creation. At the end of the game, the item creation can only be done on Disc 3, but majority of the environments are on Disc 2. Thanks to the fact that the discs can't read each other when installed to the hard drive, this forces constant disc swapping.
That being said, I was quite disappointed with the game. The story was far too simple: It took me 80 hours to beat, but I felt like I had played it for 5 thanks to the straightforward plot told at a snail's pace.
I've also gotten in the habit of enjoying my games in hour and a half chunks, since I really don't have the time these days. This game was tough for me since the size of the dungeons was absolutely ridiculous, and it didn't help that the game uses save points sparingly at best.
The end game is also terrible. I mean, There's sooo much to do, but you don't want to do any of it for one simple reason: item creation. At the end of the game, the item creation can only be done on Disc 3, but majority of the environments are on Disc 2. Thanks to the fact that the discs can't read each other when installed to the hard drive, this forces constant disc swapping.
I would prefer that too. If the voice acting is going to suck then don't give it to us, put the money somewhere else.Slycne said:
I'm currently playing Suikoden: Tierkries on the DS and I can attest that I'd often rather play it with no sound than listen to the terrible voice acting. Thankfully it's not 100% and I can go through most dungeons while enjoying the music without needing to listen to the poor vocals.Slycne said:
