Six-Year-Old JRPG Beats Assassin's Creed Unity in Steam Charts

[Dalisclock]

Eh. I can't remember that either to be honest. Not a huge fan of it, mainly because I don't like it when stories go "This person is qualified for this because of this thing that happened off screen." Sometimes I let it slide, but only when it matches up with the person's character. Welkin just doesn't strike me as leader material. Or someone who would enroll in officer candidate school willingly.

Well, the universal military training thing, which seems to be integrated into the university system seems to imply he already went through officer candidate school, possibly because those classes were required for him to get his degree. So just by getting his degree, he was also getting his officer training at the same time.

As for leadership material, you've got a point. However, at the same time, the military doesn't really care. If they need a body somewhere, they'll find someone to put there. Sometimes it doesn't matter if that person shows any signs of being good at the job or not. It's also fairly common to have one person doing the jobs of several people, even if that means the person is overworked, exhausted and thus, instead of doing one job well, will do three jobs at a mediocre level.

The military(the US at least) pushes you to be a leader, even if you don't want it or aren't good at it. I'm Navy enlisted and I'm continually told I should be pushing for promotion to Senior Enlisted(E-7/Chief Petty Officer). I've also been pushed towards management/supervising numerous times over my career. I don't consider myself leadership material and told them that. Few people seemed to care(Wait? People don't want to lead? That's crazy talk).

A year ago they tried to make me run a recruiting station(since I was working navy recruiting), apparently not caring that I HATE recruiting and running a station is even worse. I still had to fill in for my boss at times, despite hating the job, because I was the next senior person there.

I'm a month away from having a 4 year degree and I'm already getting people telling me that I should request to become an officer. This is despite the fact I've already stated my intent to leave the military when my contract ends in six months.

In VC, there's a war on(and a full scale invasion), which means they're pretty desperate for manpower. Welkin probably didn't have a choice. "You have the requires for a commission? Good, we need officers and a leader for Squad 7. Congrats on your promotion, Lt."

Now, if Welkin had turned out to be totally inept at running Squad 7, he probably would have been demoted or assigned to work at a supply depot somewhere.

 

[NiPah]

You know, I don't consider missions that can be beaten in a turn or two much better than one that's nearly impossible to beat. Both hint that the game is poorly balanced.

Well, no one is disagreeing with you there, as it was a legit complaint for VC1, which would be fixed in VC 2 and VC 3, where they implement multiple area maps making the "Scout Rush" Ineffective, because moving unit to another part of the map ends the turn of that unit.

Speaking of war portraying, VC more closely resembles WW 1, because of the Battle at Naggiar Plains, with it's trenches.

Eh, if it was about WW I then every single battle would've been like that. Plus the tanks would've been much slower and less effective. And bolt action rifles would've been the only weapon that could be easily carried and fired by an individual soldier.

That sounds like it would have been a blast to play!

Hey everyone, let's make exactly the same game, only show more holocaust victims and have everything be slower and shittier!

For fucks sake.

 

[NuclearKangaroo]

Snip

Few more days than the guy who got promoted to Lieutenant had. But then again, you're right. Welkin getting an officer's position and Alicia a NCO's position both make no sense. Thank you for pointing out another plot hole for me.

its a militia they probably arent looking for too many experienced soldiers

Yeah, because knowing about nature is so useful when it comes to frontline tactics. I have a higher education, and if the US suddenly went to war and I got an officer's commission thrown at me, I'd ask the person who did it what the Hell they were smoking. And how does having a tank (That is thirty years old yet still more advanced than half of the modern tanks for some goddamn reason) in your garage make you a good officer? That's not awarding competence, it's awarding glory. It's like going "You sniped a high ranking enemy officer, you're a Lieutenant now!"

i didnt say it couldnt get grating, but knowing about nature did allow welkin to cross the river in the mayor operation squad 7 had and it allowed welkin to treat alicia's wounds in chapter 8

you can read the glossary in which it explains the Eldenweiss was created by isara's father, a gifted engineer, the only thing that kept the tank from going into mass production was its elevated costs of manufacture, a similar problem nazi garmany faced during WW2 since while the tiger tank could take out 4 sherman tanks at a time, the allies always had 5

You're gonna have to forgive me on that one, but when the game is more focused on trying to show me what a tree huger he is, no matter the circumstances, I'm not gonna be able to take a single goddamn thing he does seriously.

well are you just disregarding everything he said simply because of his hobby, is like i ignore everything you said because you happen to like video games

I was specifically talking about the giant tank that's a pain to kill that you fight in chapter 7. That's got German Wunderwaffe written all over it.

so the empire is located in what would usually be considered soviet territory, its a monarchy like the british and pre-WW2 russia, uses tanks inspired by soviet and french designs, but they have one big tank so they are nazis?

soryr but now, there are clearly some similarities but they are not the same thing

I know the empire aren't the only racist ones. Ok, I'll give you the fact that there is a historical reason for it, but the exploration of the racism just isn't engaging. It feels like the game doesn't want to get too far away from the cutesy tone it sets up so it can't be explored with the seriousness it deserves. That "Music" explanation the one eye guy gave made me want to groan out loud when he gave it. And I'm pretty sure I never said the Empire where the only bad guys, but we still get villains where the only personality trait they get is "racist". And that's lazy writing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PepiWB1BHvs&feature=youtu.be&t=5m6s
http://youtu.be/XNi5iOem_Xg?t=2m30s

spoiler alert to those who have not played the game yet

And what was that? One scene? Then you go back to gunning down Empire soldiers five minutes later? Welkin talking about how much he loves nature along the way? This game has a lot of parts that quite simply don't fit together. To quote Jimquisiton, Ludonarrative Dissonance.

implying Jim Sterling is worth quoting...

what do you propose he should do then? he is a soldier, he was drafted, he has to protect his homeland, or do you think the military only enlists psychopaths who love killing?

Theodore Roosevelt was a naturalist AND hunter

Adolt Hitler was an artist, a vegetarian AND a mass murderer

If it truly wanted to be a fictitious world with no ties to WWII, it should've done that. No concentration camps, no sketching of Europe, no exact same years. It should've been in a completely original world without any of the major ties to our one. It would have been a thousand times better. The inclusion of mystical elements do not wipe out any correlations between real world events. Especially when those powers are meant to be allegories for nukes! The wacky nature of the Butter Battle Book didn't make it any less about the Cold War.

so they cant be creative now?

or rather they can only be creative if they follow some specific guidelines

if rather have animu WW2 with all those excellent character weapon and vehicle designs than the some old tired setting we have had for 60 years in movies books and video games

I'm starting to get the impression that you think I'm going out of my way to hate this game. I'm not. I wanted to like it. It just failed to deliver. I haven't finished it yet (Don't own a PS3, been playing it on a friend's and she's away for college) and I'm gonna finish it, but my friend and I are well over halfway through the game, so unless the last few missions pull downright Shakespearean twists out, I don't think my overall opinion of the game is going to change that much. And when you've got six different people jumping on you for not liking a game, your ordinarily mild opinion of it can turn hot very fest when you get angry at constantly having to defend yourself for not sharing the majority viewpoint.

I don't WANT to dislike the game! I'd like nothing more than to like it! But it just doesn't engage!

yes you are going out of your way, you are drawing parallels where there are none, and establishing some out of place requeriments the game should have

not everything has to be about the holocaust jesus christ

there are 6 people calling you out because youve said numerous false things, see how i didnt call out what you thought about the gameplay, thats your opinion, if you dont like the anime style, your opinion as well, but dissing the game because alicia does act like a veteran (she isnt), because only the empire is racist (thats not the case), because everything must talk about the holocaust and they must make sure its as brutal as it can possibly be, thats crap

 

[Erttheking]

You know, I don't consider missions that can be beaten in a turn or two much better than one that's nearly impossible to beat. Both hint that the game is poorly balanced.

Well, no one is disagreeing with you there, as it was a legit complaint for VC1, which would be fixed in VC 2 and VC 3, where they implement multiple area maps making the "Scout Rush" Ineffective, because moving unit to another part of the map ends the turn of that unit.

Speaking of war portraying, VC more closely resembles WW 1, because of the Battle at Naggiar Plains, with it's trenches.

Eh, if it was about WW I then every single battle would've been like that. Plus the tanks would've been much slower and less effective. And bolt action rifles would've been the only weapon that could be easily carried and fired by an individual soldier.

That sounds like it would have been a blast to play!

Hey everyone, let's make exactly the same game, only show more holocaust victims and have everything be slower and shittier!

For fucks sake.

...You know I wasn't advocating for that. I was saying how the game WASN'T that.

 

[Dalisclock]

Snip

Few more days than the guy who got promoted to Lieutenant had. But then again, you're right. Welkin getting an officer's position and Alicia a NCO's position both make no sense. Thank you for pointing out another plot hole for me.

Yeah, because knowing about nature is so useful when it comes to frontline tactics. I have a higher education, and if the US suddenly went to war and I got an officer's commission thrown at me, I'd ask the person who did it what the Hell they were smoking.

Again, He was taking military courses while at university(essentially how ROTC works), so he actually knew something about how the military works. He had the base knowledge and prerequisites for a commission. And your degree doesn't actually matter(for the US, at least. Can't speak for anyone else), as long as it's 4 years(from an accredited college)and you have one. Some types of officers need specialized degrees(Engineering officers need engineering degrees) but a general officer can have a 4 year degree in english and they'll consider him. I've met officers who have degrees not unlike Welkins natural science one.

Alicia doesn't have the higher education, but presumably her time as part of the town watch counted for something. It's also possible she got promoted based on her part of the defense of Bruhl. Perhaps Varrot had an NCO spot open(It's amazing what a major war does for promotion chances), Alicia showed that she could could handle herself in a combat situation, so she got promoted to Sergent.

 

[Erttheking]

Snip

And yet this group goes on to become the vanguard of the entire army?


Neither of those things have anything to do with nature. I'd say engineering and anatomy would've carried the day there.

If I have to look something up outside of a story to understand something in the story, that story has failed at explaining things.

Yeah, except I don't remind people at how much I love to play video games every five minutes regardless of context. Because I have other personality traits. Welkin...not so much. He's just so bloody generic.

No, it's the being aggressor in the second major conflict on not!Europe and having concentration camps for not!Jews that made me think that.


...You gonna make a point with that?

I'm suggesting that what a person does in game should match his character. I'm not asking for too much am I?

You're gonna have to explain to me how ripping off WW II is creative.
Yeah I saw that. My point was that when a racist enemy showed up, that's all there was to them.

I am? Because you've done a poor job of convincing me. And for the record, no one said any of the things you did, so no they aren't.


If you don't want you game to be about the Holocaust, DON'T PUT FUCKING CONCENTRATION CAMPS IN YOUR GAME! It's a very simple concept!

 

[NiPah]

You know, I don't consider missions that can be beaten in a turn or two much better than one that's nearly impossible to beat. Both hint that the game is poorly balanced.

Well, no one is disagreeing with you there, as it was a legit complaint for VC1, which would be fixed in VC 2 and VC 3, where they implement multiple area maps making the "Scout Rush" Ineffective, because moving unit to another part of the map ends the turn of that unit.

Speaking of war portraying, VC more closely resembles WW 1, because of the Battle at Naggiar Plains, with it's trenches.

Eh, if it was about WW I then every single battle would've been like that. Plus the tanks would've been much slower and less effective. And bolt action rifles would've been the only weapon that could be easily carried and fired by an individual soldier.

That sounds like it would have been a blast to play!

Hey everyone, let's make exactly the same game, only show more holocaust victims and have everything be slower and shittier!

For fucks sake.

...You know I wasn't advocating for that. I was saying how the game WASN'T that.

Ah... then what the heck are you going on about?

I read your last post and:

If you don't want you game to be about the Holocaust, DON'T PUT FUCKING CONCENTRATION CAMPS IN YOUR GAME! It's a very simple concept!

So, take out a major aspect of the story? You do understand the racial tensions among the different races in the game played a crucial role in the story right?
And just a heads up...

It's not actually the holocaust.

So yeah, take out a major aspect of the story... and I say:
Sounds like a blast to play!

I get that the game really didn't mesh with you, but most of the reasons you've given that drew you out of the experience are actually beneficial to the experience others had, most of the conversation can end there.

 

[Erttheking]

You know, I don't consider missions that can be beaten in a turn or two much better than one that's nearly impossible to beat. Both hint that the game is poorly balanced.

Well, no one is disagreeing with you there, as it was a legit complaint for VC1, which would be fixed in VC 2 and VC 3, where they implement multiple area maps making the "Scout Rush" Ineffective, because moving unit to another part of the map ends the turn of that unit.

Speaking of war portraying, VC more closely resembles WW 1, because of the Battle at Naggiar Plains, with it's trenches.

Eh, if it was about WW I then every single battle would've been like that. Plus the tanks would've been much slower and less effective. And bolt action rifles would've been the only weapon that could be easily carried and fired by an individual soldier.

That sounds like it would have been a blast to play!

Hey everyone, let's make exactly the same game, only show more holocaust victims and have everything be slower and shittier!

For fucks sake.

...You know I wasn't advocating for that. I was saying how the game WASN'T that.

Ah... then what the heck are you going on about?

I read your last post and:

If you don't want you game to be about the Holocaust, DON'T PUT FUCKING CONCENTRATION CAMPS IN YOUR GAME! It's a very simple concept!

So, take out a major aspect of the story? You do understand the racial tensions among the different races in the game played a crucial role in the story right?
And just a heads up...

It's not actually the holocaust.

So yeah, take out a major aspect of the story... and I say:
Sounds like a blast to play!

I get that the game really didn't mesh with you, but most of the reasons you've given that drew you out of the experience are actually beneficial to the experience others had, most of the conversation can end there.

I wasn't advocating for the game being like WW I. Because that's what I was talking about in the post you replied to.

Yeah...it's not about the holocaust in the same way that animal farm isn't about the soviet union. I'm sorry, a group of minority people that get shit out by absolutely everyone, have been for thousands of years, and there's one major faction that's the instigator in the second major war to consume a continent, thirty years after the last one, who rounds them up and puts them in concentration camps? How the Hell am I NOT supposed to draw parallels towards the concentration camp.

Well then, be prepared for me to point out the bleedingly obvious similarities between this and the real world thing.

 

[NiPah]

Maybe they were more closely mimicking the concentration camps created by the US and Canada which held Japanese?
But then again I ask you, what does it matter? Yes it draws parellels between real world events but at its heart it's a work of entertainment.

 

[NuclearKangaroo]

so if you make a list of JRPGs released on 2013 and 2014, you are going to include that game twice?

when you said "im going to include releases in the west" you actually meant YOUR west?

What is that supposed to mean? YOUR west? Bloody hell.

establish some ground rules first, the entire problem with your list is that you keep making rules up as you go, and conviniently these rules always benefit the console JRPG count

if you say west, what do you mean by west? US? europe? whichever sees a release first?

so thats why you included games released years ago, non-localized games, and failed to account numerous PC releases

I couldn't find a complete list so had to compile it from several, and than checking the names on Wiki. Errors happened which I had no problem admitting to, you've admitted to none of yours.

such as?

im not addressing exclusives when you yourself name numerous multiplat titles

They are exclusives to the holders (Sony/Nintendo).

yes another rule you made up right after you compiled the list, a rule i might add that conveniently favors your console JRPG count because nobody happens to own PC, and when you base exclusivity on platform holders, it means that, in the case of sony which is of course the worst offender on your list, you get a list of the exclusives from the PS3, PSVITA and PS4 combined

and yet this stupid ass rule serves no purpose, if you ONLY own a PS3 you obviously cant play VITA or PS4 games, if you ONLY own a VITA you cant play PS3 or PS4 games and if you ONLY own a PS4 you cant play VITA or PS3

that dumb rule exists ONLY to inflate your list

meanwhile a more sensible list would compile the number of JRPGs released for each platform, that means if you own X platform you can play Y amount of JRPGs

so let me see

"im only counting games already released"

except you dont

"im only counting released and yet to be released games"

except you dont

FF13-2 is less than a month away and you wont include it just to decrease PC numbers, while at the same time you will include persona Q

bias

What did I say? "So it does". Your translation of that is hilarious.
A simple mistake with the dates being so close that I've owned up to, what does that prove?

so it does? what does that mean?

will you include persona q on your list or not? i dont read minds

"i only posts new games!..."

"... and re-releases, but only MY re-releases count, yours dont!"

yeah yeah i mean, who cares if VC now supports 1080p and beyond resolutions and runs at 60 FPS, who cares if the same applies to tits, old, old, old, old

... ... ... Find me where I discounted VC. The original post that I edited because I forgot to include it originally? So? I corrected myself and had no problem including it, yet you're making out that I discounted it... poor show.

in almost every post you complain either about VC, TiTS or HMH2 for being rereleases, and at one point you tried to discount TiTS but atleast you changed your mind

they are old and therefore they stop being JRPGs? good to know, specially when some of them saw either no or limited releases on the west

New JRPGs aren't coming to PC by the "truckloads", that was my disagreement towards what you said. You have never countered that point. You can bring up as many FF3s as you like, it'll do nothing.

Which ones on the PC list had limited to no releases in the west? Hero 2 from the looks of it. Trails you made a blunder on, a blunder you've yet to own up to even though I've put it in front of you many times now.
Funny how I'm biased and unreasonable when I own up to my mistakes while you don't.

Trails saw a limited release, it was originally avaliable on PC but the west only saw the PSP version first, HMH2 like you said, saw no release at all until now

so its everyone else's fault?

you are bieased, in this very same discussion you have continuously failed to hold PC at the same standard as other platforms

you compile a list of JRPGs released accross many platforms combined agaisnt the ones released on PC alone

you belittle or reject PC re-releases while at the same time including re-releases on your own list of JRPGs

you argue to only count exclusives, despite the fact many games on your list are not exclusives

you include games not released this year on your console JRPG list

you include unreleased games on your console list but fail to do the same for PC, despite both games being less than a month away from release

tell me, are we counting:

JRPGs released on each platform this year

or are we counting:

new exclusive and platform holder exclusive JRPGs released on both PC and all platforms combined this year or yet to be released this month

because thats some awfully specific wording

Actually I've continually admitted my mistakes while you haven't, and I was charitable enough to let you have Hero 2. Still I thank you because the bullet "You never admit to mistakes" is one I've had used on me a couple of times now (which I had no actual evidence besides my word to counter), and this thread is very much upping my defense on that.

They were released this year as we aren't including JP releases, and hey if you want to than whatever I'll not mind. I'd have to discount a lot of games on the list, but I'd have an avalanche of other titles so pick your poison.
Not to mention that if we go by orginal releases than most of your PC list would be immediately gone also... so if you want to shoot me in the knee its fine, because doing so blows off your entire leg.

ok what mistakes have i made? did i talk about PC getting more JRPG exclusives? no, did i talk about PC getting more newer JRPG releases? no

i only said PC is getting more JRPGs, and some of them, such as TiTS and VC are known as some of the best

and that simple fact seems to be driving you crazy to the point you are practicing some of the most outrageous mental gymnastics ive seen just to keep your console JRPG count up, coming up with arbitrary rule after arbitrary rule

lets make it easy

number of confirmed JRPGs releases per platform this year on the west for the first time, just the number of JRPGs on each platform, none of that "platform holder exclusive so it counts as one single console" stuff

count the numbers of releases and ill accept any result that comes up as long as you make no mistake

 

[NuclearKangaroo]

Snip

And yet this group goes on to become the vanguard of the entire army?

did you even pay attention to the story? its made perfectly clear every other branch of the military is engaged in battle accross the entire country, the story is simply centered on squad 7, hell the 3rd game is based around a whole different squad in the same time frame, they are not the vanguard of the entire army

Neither of those things have anything to do with nature. I'd say engineering and anatomy would've carried the day there.

again, did you freaking pay attention to the story?

Welkin knew part of the river was shallow and the tank could pass through because of the vegetation above the water which would only grow on shallow water, Welkin treated alicia's wound with plants he found in the forest, because, being a dirty nature lovin' hippie, he knew those plants in particular could help alleviate the pain Alicia was suffering from her wound

If I have to look something up outside of a story to understand something in the story, that story has failed at explaining things.

hell you dont even understand story by watching the cutscenes it seems, it was mentioned the father of isara build the tank, it was also mentioned he was a gifted engineer, the tank was obviously amazing for its time

plus is not like the Eldenweiss being able to go toe to toe with empire tank designs was ever a mayor plot point

and many of the first tanks you face in the game are light tanks, so it makes perfect sense that the Eldenweiss, a medium tank, should be able to outclass them

later on you are able to keep up with imperial tank and imperial tank aces because you keep upgrading the freakin' tank

Yeah, except I don't remind people at how much I love to play video games every five minutes regardless of context. Because I have other personality traits. Welkin...not so much. He's just so bloody generic.

yes is grating i already said this, that doesnt make everything he says invalid

No, it's the being aggressor in the second major conflict on not!Europe and having concentration camps for not!Jews that made me think that.

you know who else was the aggressor in WW2? the soviet union, they also invaded poland, did you know who else had forced labor camps? the soviet union, ever hear of gulags? did you notice the empire is located in what would traditionally be soviet territory?

jesus this is so ridiculous, now everything even vaguely resembling WW2 has to address the holocaust and it has to address in the most gruesome manner possible?

...You gonna make a point with that?

I'm suggesting that what a person does in game should match his character. I'm not asking for too much am I?

so the man who has shown conviction time and time again to drive the imperials out of gallia to the point of saying that each same thing at the start of every skirmish game... shouldnt want to drive the imperials out of gallia? he HAS to kill because its a WAR, to participate in a war you dont have to like killing thats one of the most ridiculous things ive heard

hell if he was participating in some senseless killing or destroying nature, just because, youd have a point

but no, he doesnt kill if he doesnt have to, and loving nature doesnt stop you from killing people

You're gonna have to explain to me how ripping off WW II is creative.

ok how many games feature a fictitious european continent in the middle of a big war with technology similar to the one avaliable in the early 20th century?

also did you know what for the landscape the developers decided to go instead for a WW1 aesthetic instead of a WW2 one because they thought WW2 cities looked too modern?

so yes its based on WW2 europe but its clearly not ripping it off, stop making stuff up

Yeah I saw that. My point was that when a racist enemy showed up, that's all there was to them.

did you even watch the freakin' opening scene?

the empire invades because of a shortage of ragnite, not because of racism, and everyone is racist, how the hell does racism make the empire bad but doesnt make everybody else bad?

I am? Because you've done a poor job of convincing me. And for the record, no one said any of the things you did, so no they aren't.

one of the very first thing you said to me, and i quote

(Alicia is frankly a shining example of a trope I hate in storytelling, when a person's role in the plot directly contradicts their character. She's supposed to be a veteran soldier and a no nonsense one at that, yet she's junior to the college idiot who's been in the army for three days. Because she isn't the main character. Also she gets hurt and has to be tended to by him. Because she's the love interest. This is not how human beings act)

you were corrected on that by like 3 people

and the racist thing and holocaust thing i address on this post

If you don't want you game to be about the Holocaust, DON'T PUT FUCKING CONCENTRATION CAMPS IN YOUR GAME! It's a very simple concept!

thats the dumbest thing ive heard

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internment

as if nazis had invented concentration camps jesus christ, not everything has to do with the holocaust

 

[Rozalia1]

establish some ground rules first, the entire problem with your list is that you keep making rules up as you go, and conviniently these rules always benefit the console JRPG count

if you say west, what do you mean by west? US? europe? whichever sees a release first?

I meant exactly what I said, western releases. A North American and European releases are different releases, and if it so happens Europe inches into 2014 than I count it simple as.

such as?

Trails, told you as such a great many times.

yes another rule you made up right after you compiled the list, a rule i might add that conveniently favors your console JRPG count because nobody happens to own PC, and when you base exclusivity on platform holders, it means that, in the case of sony which is of course the worst offender on your list, you get a list of the exclusives from the PS3, PSVITA and PS4 combined

and yet this stupid ass rule serves no purpose, if you ONLY own a PS3 you obviously cant play VITA or PS4 games, if you ONLY own a VITA you cant play PS3 or PS4 games and if you ONLY own a PS4 you cant play VITA or PS3

that dumb rule exists ONLY to inflate your list

meanwhile a more sensible list would compile the number of JRPGs released for each platform, that means if you own X platform you can play Y amount of JRPGs

I didn't make up a bloody thing, its damn obvious. No body calls the likes of Natural Doctrine a multiplat, they call it an exclusive as its a game exclusive to Sony's holdings.

Well there is a lot of... "cross play" amongst Sony's titles.

And what would it matter if I conceded that for you? You're still left with a PC list full of old ports with the one exception which you I've been kind enough to let you have and you keep insulting me regardless.
New JRPGs (games you don't care about or are aware of) are not coming to PC, fact as Mr Hart would say. You can in no way counteract that. Oh and yes I know what you're thinking of responding with, Lightning returns and all that. No, final fantasy means nothing when it comes to what we're talking about.

The heart and soul of the genre is the "niche" titles (not a good word to use really because pretty much all JRPGs are niche...but whatever you should know what I mean), those games you don't care about... not final fantasy who in pursuit of bigger riches have embarked on a foolish quest that has lead to the complete degradation of the final fantasy brand... Actually no, Enix also screwed up a lot of their other brands too such as Parasite Eve. In fact Third Birthday is a perfect study of everything wrong with Enix and JRPGs... but that is a talk for another time. The only good thing that came out of Third Birthday was people began to see Parasite Eve 2 in a much kinder light. Kind of like how FF9 had a rep of being crap when it came out among a lot of people, and now people (myself included, though it's always been my favorite since it's release) talk about it as either the best FF of all time, or the last great FF if they don't rate 10.

will you include persona q on your list or not? i dont read minds

I'm not running a bloody ongoing list, I doubt I even got everything as I clearly missed the likes of FF3. Take it off if you want as I keep telling you, my point stands.

in almost every post you complain either about VC, TiTS or HMH2 for being rereleases, and at one point you tried to discount TiTS but atleast you changed your mind

Never did that for Hero 2, Trails I thought released in the west originally in 2006 on PC as I told you, and VC... again never belittled it. The mistake you're making is you fail to see the reason old ports of the likes of FF3 don't matter.
Its no Atelier, its not a new title. What I've been telling you is the new JRPGs are simply not coming to PC. You have 1 title in Hero 2 which I have been gracious to allow you to have. How many brand new titles did I list?

Trails saw a limited release, it was originally avaliable on PC but the west only saw the PSP version first, HMH2 like you said, saw no release at all until now

It says it got world wide release as the same time as every other platform its on from it says to me. It wasn't available in the west until that point.

ok what mistakes have i made? did i talk about PC getting more JRPG exclusives? no, did i talk about PC getting more newer JRPG releases? no

i only said PC is getting more JRPGs, and some of them, such as TiTS and VC are known as some of the best

and that simple fact seems to be driving you crazy to the point you are practicing some of the most outrageous mental gymnastics ive seen just to keep your console JRPG count up, coming up with arbitrary rule after arbitrary rule

lets make it easy

number of confirmed JRPGs releases per platform this year on the west for the first time, just the number of JRPGs on each platform, none of that "platform holder exclusive so it counts as one single console" stuff

count the numbers of releases and ill accept any result that comes up as long as you make no mistake

Did you talk about this meaning something? Yes. Now granted in actuality games from 2014 don't actually matter, we'd have to wait a whole year to see if your assertion is correct.

Some of the best? They are no lets see...oh crap I didn't list Freedom Wars in the list which I got just last month...whoops. There has to be a complete list bloody somewhere. Anyway, they are no Atelier Totori.

Look at the original list, see the top? All the specification are there, I've not been underhanded in anyway and have repeatedly let things go in your favour (as my point stands no matter what). I'm not angry, perhaps slightly irritated that someone who admits to not liking the genre and thus not following it thinks they can tell how the future will go for it.

Count them? Why? Are your numbers not correct? The point is outside the 1 they are exclusive or new.

 

[NuclearKangaroo]

establish some ground rules first, the entire problem with your list is that you keep making rules up as you go, and conviniently these rules always benefit the console JRPG count

if you say west, what do you mean by west? US? europe? whichever sees a release first?

I meant exactly what I said, western releases. A North American and European releases are different releases, and if it so happens Europe inches into 2014 than I count it simple as.

so you are going to count every game twice?

such as?

Trails, told you as such a great many times.

no i mean times I have been wrong

yes another rule you made up right after you compiled the list, a rule i might add that conveniently favors your console JRPG count because nobody happens to own PC, and when you base exclusivity on platform holders, it means that, in the case of sony which is of course the worst offender on your list, you get a list of the exclusives from the PS3, PSVITA and PS4 combined

and yet this stupid ass rule serves no purpose, if you ONLY own a PS3 you obviously cant play VITA or PS4 games, if you ONLY own a VITA you cant play PS3 or PS4 games and if you ONLY own a PS4 you cant play VITA or PS3

that dumb rule exists ONLY to inflate your list

meanwhile a more sensible list would compile the number of JRPGs released for each platform, that means if you own X platform you can play Y amount of JRPGs

I didn't make up a bloody thing, its damn obvious. No body calls the likes of Natural Doctrine a multiplat, they call it an exclusive as its a game exclusive to Sony's holdings.

Well there is a lot of... "cross play" amongst Sony's titles.

so being avaliable in multiple platforms doesnt make a game multiplatform?

also cross play? what does that mean, if i buy disgaea 4 for the VITA can i play it on the PS4, if not, your list makes no freakin' sense and the rule exists ONLY to inflate your numbers

And what would it matter if I conceded that for you? You're still left with a PC list full of old ports with the one exception which you I've been kind enough to let you have and you keep insulting me regardless.
New JRPGs (games you don't care about or are aware of) are not coming to PC, fact as Mr Hart would say. You can in no way counteract that. Oh and yes I know what you're thinking of responding with, Lightning returns and all that. No, final fantasy means nothing when it comes to what we're talking about.

hell you are including games with awful critical reception and re-releases why cant i include old games?

i didnt say they were new, i didnt say they were exclusives, i just said PC is getting more and more JRPG releases, how is that wrong? and the quality of course is improving, VC is a blast

The heart and soul of the genre is the "niche" titles (not a good word to use really because pretty much all JRPGs are niche...but whatever you should know what I mean), those games you don't care about... not final fantasy who in pursuit of bigger riches have embarked on a foolish quest that has lead to the complete degradation of the final fantasy brand... Actually no, Enix also screwed up a lot of their other brands too such as Parasite Eve. In fact Third Birthday is a perfect study of everything wrong with Enix and JRPGs... but that is a talk for another time. The only good thing that came out of Third Birthday was people began to see Parasite Eve 2 in a much kinder light. Kind of like how FF9 had a rep of being crap when it came out among a lot of people, and now people (myself included, though it's always been my favorite since it's release) talk about it as either the best FF of all time, or the last great FF if they don't rate 10.

oh ok now you get to define JRPGs too

Japanese Role Playing Games, stop pulling new definitions out of nowhere, if its a role playing game, made in japan, is a JRPG

but thanks for reminding me of another PC JRPG release this year, Dark Souls 2

in almost every post you complain either about VC, TiTS or HMH2 for being rereleases, and at one point you tried to discount TiTS but atleast you changed your mind

Never did that for Hero 2, Trails I thought released in the west originally in 2006 on PC as I told you, and VC... again never belittled it. The mistake you're making is you fail to see the reason old ports of the likes of FF3 don't matter.
Its no Atelier, its not a new title. What I've been telling you is the new JRPGs are simply not coming to PC. You have 1 title in Hero 2 which I have been gracious to allow you to have. How many brand new titles did I list?

you keep talking about how "kind" you are for including Hero 2 on your list, and you are not belittling it?

again, for the 1000th time, my whole argument:

more JRPGs are being released on PC, you have so far being completely unable to discredit that claim, instead you keep changing the rules to guide the discussion in your favor, i mean so far you have tried to change the definition of both JRPGs and exclusives

now JRPGs arent just Japanese Role Playing games, no, they have to be NICHE as well, and exclusives? hell they can be on as many fucking platforms you want, but the platforms must be under the same holder, mind not the fact that nobody owns PC so this stupid rule favors you

Trails saw a limited release, it was originally avaliable on PC but the west only saw the PSP version first, HMH2 like you said, saw no release at all until now

It says it got world wide release as the same time as every other platform its on from it says to me. It wasn't available in the west until that point.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Half-Minute_Hero:_The_Second_Coming

read it, no PSP release on the west

ok what mistakes have i made? did i talk about PC getting more JRPG exclusives? no, did i talk about PC getting more newer JRPG releases? no

i only said PC is getting more JRPGs, and some of them, such as TiTS and VC are known as some of the best

and that simple fact seems to be driving you crazy to the point you are practicing some of the most outrageous mental gymnastics ive seen just to keep your console JRPG count up, coming up with arbitrary rule after arbitrary rule

lets make it easy

number of confirmed JRPGs releases per platform this year on the west for the first time, just the number of JRPGs on each platform, none of that "platform holder exclusive so it counts as one single console" stuff

count the numbers of releases and ill accept any result that comes up as long as you make no mistake

Did you talk about this meaning something? Yes. Now granted in actuality games from 2014 don't actually matter, we'd have to wait a whole year to see if your assertion is correct.

Some of the best? They are no lets see...oh crap I didn't list Freedom Wars in the list which I got just last month...whoops. There has to be a complete list bloody somewhere. Anyway, they are no Atelier Totori.

Look at the original list, see the top? All the specification are there, I've not been underhanded in anyway and have repeatedly let things go in your favour (as my point stands no matter what). I'm not angry, perhaps slightly irritated that someone who admits to not liking the genre and thus not following it thinks they can tell how the future will go for it.

Count them? Why? Are your numbers not correct? The point is outside the 1 they are exclusive or new.

so you make the rules and thats why they are not heavily on your favor, why yes it makes perfect sense, lets recap because i feel feel you dont quite understand the holes in your argument

-PC has no platform holder, yet you try to to apply a rule about all games released on platforms under the same platform holder add up

-the previous rule means nothing to the customer, a game only avaliable on the PS3/VITA/PS4 cant be played on any other platform even under the same holder

-you even break your own rule with 2 games, mind zero and conception 2

-you keep discrediting PC releases for being old, as if that had anything to do with my argument that PC has more JRPG releases

heres the thing i said that started this whole discussion

and like it or not, PC IS getting a load of JRPGs and japanese games in general, and theres no reason to think the flow of those games wont keep increasing

did i mention new? did i mention exclusive?, no, you added those rules to inflate your numbers

 

[Rozalia1]

so you are going to count every game twice?

... ... ... This is on purpose, only explanation.

no i mean times I have been wrong

Trails, told you as such a great many times.

so being avaliable in multiple platform doesnt make a game multiplat

also cross play? what does that mean, if i buy disgaea 4 for the VITA can i play it on the PS4, if not, your list makes no fucking sense and the rule exists ONLY to inflate your numbers

... ... ... If the game was also on the 360 than no it wouldn't be exclusive, but as all the platforms its available on are Sony... its an exclusive. No will call Natural Doctrine a multi plat as in gaming lingo that would give the message that it would be available on another holder's holding/PC.

What I mean is quite a bunch of games for PS3/4 get Vita releases too.

you keep talking about how "kind" you are for including Hero 2 on your list, and you are not belittling it?

more JRPGs are being released on PC, you have so far being completely unable to discredit that claim, instead you keep changing the rules to guide the discussion in your favor, i mean so far you have tried to change the definition of both JRPGs and exclusives

now JRPGs arent just Japanese Role Playing games, no, they have to be NICHE as well, and exclusives? hell they can be on as many fucking platforms you want, but the platforms must be under the same holder, mind not the fact that nobody owns PC so this stupid rule favors you

How is that belittling to the game exactly? I'm throwing you the bone you want.

I... see that would be an actual good time to use all caps, but nope. I have changed no rules.
There is no new titles outside the 1 coming out on PC, girl bye.

Not what I said but I should have known you'd say that. As for the PC holder thing, PC is different though technically there are different realms inside it, that is not a talk for this thread. If the game was released on PC and PS4 I'd not put it as PS4 exclusive because PC doesn't have a holder don't be silly. I'll have to remember to not be so gracious with you next time because constantly being portrayed by you as an unfair meanie head is really irritating me.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Half-Minute_Hero:_The_Second_Coming

... ... ...

You: "Trails saw a limited release, it was originally avaliable on PC but the west only saw the PSP version first, HMH2 like you said, saw no release at all until now"

Me: "It says it got world wide release as the same time as every other platform its on from it says to me. It wasn't available in the west until that point".

Why would you think I was talking about Hero 2, when I've been giving you that one every single time? Bloody hell.

so you make the rules and thats why they are not heavily on your favor, why yes it makes perfect sense, lets recap because i feel feel you dont quite understand the holes in your argument

-PC has no platform holder, yet you try to to apply a rule about all games released on platforms under the same platform holder add up

-the previous rule means nothing to the customer, a game only avaliable on the PS3/VITA/PS4 cant be played on any other platform even under the same holder

-you even break your own rule with 2 games, mind zero and conception 2

-you keep discrediting PC releases for being old, as if that had anything to do with my argument that PC has more JRPG releases

heres the thing i said that started this whole discussion

Console platforms and the PC platform are different, shocker.

They are exclusive to the holder.

Your point has always been here, and previously in other threads that this is a sign that new JRPGs are going to start popping up on PC as Japanese devs "are getting the message that the PC is a viable platform", or whatever else. 2014 shows that isn't the case, 2015 I can not say 100% because I'll not be so arrogant as to presume to know the future in its totality...however the odds of me being correct are very near that 100% figure.

did i mention new? did i mention exclusive?, no, you added those rules to inflate your numbers

What does an exclusive mean? It means it isn't available elsewhere, in this discussion namely the PC. If the number of exclusives remain as they are then what you're saying will never come to pass.
Most JRPGs are exclusive even today, which is not something you'd know I suppose as you don't follow them which has been your fatal flaw this whole time.

 

[Abomination]

If you don't believe that VC is essentially an Anime telling of World War II you have not been paying any attention to the major themes and settings of either game or war.

They even mention EW1 multiple times throughout the game. This is literally the second war of equivalent size set approximately 25 years after the first one. The second war is caused by animosity due to the settlement of the previous war. The parallels between the VC setting and World War II are undeniable. At least, if you know anything about World War II from the European perspective.

Certainly there was no "Galia" equivalent nation during World War II... unless you count Croatia?

I'm with @erttheking on this one. I mean, I like the game and I like the plot but the TONE is really really off. I can even handle the super-powered magic chicks turning the tide of battle since they're invulnerable and can take out a tank with the wave of a lance. It's pretty much a World War II game with a twist, much like Red Dead Redemption Undead Nightmare.

I'm glad it gave AC:U a bloody nose. Damn game was hyped to all hell and was obviously not fully out of beta.

 

[Amaror]

It's almost as if there were a lot of fans of turn-based strategy gameplay on pc. Weird.

 

[Erttheking]

Snip

My bad. They're not the vanguard. They're just apparently the best unit ever considering all the important crap that they get assigned to handle.

Is knowing a river is shallow really something that you need a college degree for? Can't you just, you know, ask a local? Or look at it? And engineering would be needed to make sure the tank can survive in water. And it's fine and dandy if he can find the plants that can be use for medical treatment, but it wouldn't be much help if he didn't know the first thing on what to do with them. I'm pretty sure classes on nature don't include first aid.

No. That is a bullshit excuse. I don't care how brilliant you are, you don't just up and invent tanks that are thirty years ahead of their time. That does not happen. This isn't the 41st millennium, older technology should not be better. It was still able to go toe to toe with the lighter tanks. Tanks that by all rights should have been able to blow it to Hell with one hand tied behind their back. It doesn't matter if the tanks at the start were light. Because later on the tank goes up against medium tanks, and even though it's the same class with thirty more years of technological advancement, the Eldenweiss can come out on top. And that is the only thing about this tank that makes sense.

Doesn't make him a well written character either. And when a cardboard makes a point, I struggle, and fail, to care. Why should I care if a story makes a good point but is badly written? Taking care of the environment is really important, it doesn't make all the environmental movies from the 90s any less crap or painful to watch.

I know about the Soviet Union. I know a fair bit about the Soviet Union, including the penal brigades and the great purge Stalin had of his officers. And I have to say I don't recall those work camps being specifically designed for a minority. I seem to recall them being more general. Unlike the ones in Valkyria Chronicles. Also the Soviet Union invaded? Yeah. Two weeks after Germany did. Germany invaded September 1 1939. The Soviet Union invaded September 17 of the same year. So yeah, Germany was the instigators.

It does when you have the main bad guys include concentration camps. And no, I don't care where they're located on the map, if they're the instigators in the second major war on not!Europe, rounding up the not!Jews at the same time while the villian involved in the camp is dressed like a not!SS officer.

http://img2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20110820021625/valkyria/images/0/03/Berthold_Gregor_Profile.png

I'm calling them what they are. NAZIS!

If they didn't want to represent the Holocaust, then they shouldn't have included the fucking camps! They brought this criticism on themselves!

The guy is supposed to be a massive peace lover, yet every mission he jumps into a tank a wipes a few dozen thinking feeling people off of the face of the earth. All throughout the war he goes through warzone after warzone, hundreds of people dying as he is forced to keep fighting...and he keeps acting like a cheerful idiot throughout the whole thing. It doesn't feel real. It'd be a thousand times more interesting if the war was tearing him down, forcing him to abandon his peaceful lifestyle, and seeing how he was coping with it. Him just smiling all the way through just makes me feel like the guy is secretly a sociopath. And I know what you're going to say "Oh what, so a war character has to be miserable to be well written?" A character has to fit the tone of the story. And in a game that has racism and ethnic purging as part of the plot, Welkin's happy go lucky attitude that rarely falters fits in about as well as a happy clown in the middle of Full Metal Jacket.

Dumbest thing you've ever heard huh? I KNOW that the Germans didn't invent concentration camps! But you know, I'm not really ready to believe that these camps were inspired by the Japanese intern camps. As horrible as those were, the American government weren't trying to kill the Japanese. And you know what? The picture on that very link you gave me, the one of Buchenwald? That looks A LOT like the camp in Valkria Chronicles.

That's not an answer to my question. Plenty of people copy it? It's still not creative if you don't do anything good or interesting with it, something the game fails on both fronts on. Yeah, and they also watched Saving Private Ryan, Band of Brothers and Combat! in their research. The aesthetic is WW I, but everything else is WW II. And even then WW II aesthetics still bleed though sometimes. Hence Gregor the not!SS officer

When a RACIST ENEMY showed up! I did not say everyone in the Empire was racist, I said when they had a racist character, the racism was all he had. Christ, and you accuse me of making stuff up. You've got a lot of nerve.

Three is a lot less than six. And even then I was able to clarify what I meant with them in a way they found acceptable.

Dumbest thing you're ever heard. Thanks for sharing. Yeah I know that the Germans didn't invent concentration camps. But then again the camps in Valkyria Chronicles don't strike me as being that similar to either the Japanese internment camps or Gulags. In fact, the picture in the link you gave me has a picture of a Nazi concentration camp that looks very similar to the one in Valkyria Chronicles. Also you're saying the game is more WW I than WW II? In that case where did the camps come from? The Canadian Ukrainian camps? I kinda doubt it.

 

[NuclearKangaroo]

Snip

My bad. They're not the vanguard. They're just apparently the best unit ever considering all the important crap that they get assigned to handle.

maybe because as the game progresses welkin gets more and more awarded for his commanding abilities

Is knowing a river is shallow really something that you need a college degree for? Can't you just, you know, ask a local? Or look at it? And engineering would be needed to make sure the tank can survive in water. And it's fine and dandy if he can find the plants that can be use for medical treatment, but it wouldn't be much help if he didn't know the first thing on what to do with them. I'm pretty sure classes on nature don't include first aid.

holy cow you are grasping straws now

i dont think its weird for a biologist to know what the stuff hes researching is used for

so now every local knows everything about the rivers in their areas, locals that btw, were most likely evacuated

and welkin did look at the river and noticed the vegetation

you are being ridiculous now, Welkin's knowledge of nature is shown to help the squad

No. That is a bullshit excuse. I don't care how brilliant you are, you don't just up and invent tanks that are thirty years ahead of their time. That does not happen. This isn't the 41st millennium, older technology should not be better. It was still able to go toe to toe with the lighter tanks. Tanks that by all rights should have been able to blow it to Hell with one hand tied behind their back. It doesn't matter if the tanks at the start were light. Because later on the tank goes up against medium tanks, and even though it's the same class with thirty more years of technological advancement, the Eldenweiss can come out on top. And that is the only thing about this tank that makes sense.

the M1 Abrams is over 30 years old now

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M1_Abrams

you are being absolutely ridiculous

"this should be realistic in my fantasy setting!"

Doesn't make him a well written character either. And when a cardboard makes a point, I struggle, and fail, to care. Why should I care if a story makes a good point but is badly written? Taking care of the environment is really important, it doesn't make all the environmental movies from the 90s any less crap or painful to watch.

well thats just like your opinion man

if you are going to argue the character is badly written, ok, you can think that, but saying "he likes nature, therefore he shouldnt be taken seriously" is dumb

I know about the Soviet Union. I know a fair bit about the Soviet Union, including the penal brigades and the great purge Stalin had of his officers. And I have to say I don't recall those work camps being specifically designed for a minority. I seem to recall them being more general. Unlike the ones in Valkyria Chronicles. Also the Soviet Union invaded? Yeah. Two weeks after Germany did. Germany invaded September 1 1939. The Soviet Union invaded September 17 of the same year. So yeah, Germany was the instigators.

are you listening to yourself right now?

"their concentration camps were more diverse, that makes them less awful"

"the soviet union and nazi germany had both agreed to invade poland, but since the soviet union invaded AFTER the germans, they weren the instigators"

yeah, fucking no, the soviet union didnt see germany invading poland and said "i want some of dat" it was planned from the begining

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_annexation_of_ethnic_Ukrainian_territories_(1939)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molotov%E2%80%93Ribbentrop_Pact#The_secret_protocol

It does when you have the main bad guys include concentration camps. And no, I don't care where they're located on the map, if they're the instigators in the second major war on not!Europe, rounding up the not!Jews at the same time while the villian involved in the camp is dressed like a not!SS officer.

http://img2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20110820021625/valkyria/images/0/03/Berthold_Gregor_Profile.png

I'm calling them what they are. NAZIS!

do you think it looks like this:

http://skalle.dk/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/GermanSSCharSheet2.jpg

or more like this:

http://i.imgur.com/oNBGF7Z.png

http://p2.la-img.com/241/22852/8015724_1_l.jpg

what are those last 2 you say? why they are just IMPERIAL RUSSIAN COMMANDER UNIFORMS

but dont let little things like facts get in the way of your argument

If they didn't want to represent the Holocaust, then they shouldn't have included the fucking camps! They brought this criticism on themselves!

everything has to be about the holocaust now?

The guy is supposed to be a massive peace lover, yet every mission he jumps into a tank a wipes a few dozen thinking feeling people off of the face of the earth. All throughout the war he goes through warzone after warzone, hundreds of people dying as he is forced to keep fighting...and he keeps acting like a cheerful idiot throughout the whole thing. It doesn't feel real. It'd be a thousand times more interesting if the war was tearing him down, forcing him to abandon his peaceful lifestyle, and seeing how he was coping with it. Him just smiling all the way through just makes me feel like the guy is secretly a sociopath. And I know what you're going to say "Oh what, so a war character has to be miserable to be well written?" A character has to fit the tone of the story. And in a game that has racism and ethnic purging as part of the plot, Welkin's happy go lucky attitude that rarely falters fits in about as well as a happy clown in the middle of Full Metal Jacket.

how many freaking times he talks about pushing the imperials out of gallia, seriously count them, how else would he achieve peace for his nation, do you think soldiers want to live in war forever? that they dont love peace as well? that they dont dream of comming back to their families?, of seeing their homeland free?, of no longer watching their friends die?

also it is mentioned later on by Welkin himself that if he started acting like that, it would mean he lost all hope

but of course at this point is clear you are not even paying attention to the story and you just want to get offended

That's not an answer to my question. Plenty of people copy it? It's still not creative if you don't do anything good or interesting with it, something the game fails on both fronts on. Yeah, and they also watched Saving Private Ryan, Band of Brothers and Combat! in their research. The aesthetic is WW I, but everything else is WW II. And even then WW II aesthetics still bleed though sometimes. Hence Gregor the not!SS officer

more like gregor the not!Imperial Russia officer, and btw imperial russia existed during WW1, so once again, the game combines aspects of BOTH WARS

so far youve been completely unable to support any of your claims, you accuse the empire of having german tanks, when in fact their designs have more in common with early allied tanks, you accuse them of being nazis because they were the aggressors, but the soviet union ALSO was the aggressor in WW2, you accuse them of having SS uniforms yet their uniforms have much more in common with imperial russian uniforms, you argue they are nazis because they have concentration camps despite the fact many nations throughout history have had concentration camps, INCLUDING THE SOVIET UNION, not to mention the empire is located exactly where modern russia is located

When a RACIST ENEMY showed up! I did not say everyone in the Empire was racist, I said when they had a racist character, the racism was all he had. Christ, and you accuse me of making stuff up. You've got a lot of nerve.

and what happened when a RACIST ALLY showed up? because as far as i know, Rossie showed her racism way before gregor did

gregor is serious, nationalistic and loyal servant to the imperial royal family, if all you saw was his racism, theres something wrong with you

Three is a lot less than six. And even then I was able to clarify what I meant with them in a way they found acceptable.

and thats why you still have people correcting you

Dumbest thing you're ever heard. Thanks for sharing. Yeah I know that the Germans didn't invent concentration camps. But then again the camps in Valkyria Chronicles don't strike me as being that similar to either the Japanese internment camps or Gulags. In fact, the picture in the link you gave me has a picture of a Nazi concentration camp that looks very similar to the one in Valkyria Chronicles. Also you're saying the game is more WW I than WW II? In that case where did the camps come from? The Canadian Ukrainian camps? I kinda doubt it.

oh really? were are the chambers? where are the human experiments?

i mean lets see you prove these are nazi camps, show us the most striking feature, the most inhuman aspect of nazis concentration camps, where are the fucking gas chambers?

the big damn hole in your holocaust theory, is that the imperial concentration camps werent extermination camps like the ones nazis had, they were FORCED LABOR camps, like the ones the soviet union had

and how do we know this? because gregor the not!Imperial Russia officer, actually let one inmate rest... SO HE COULD KEEP WORKING AND NOT DIE

 

[NuclearKangaroo]

so you are going to count every game twice?

... ... ... This is on purpose, only explanation.

your rules make no sense

no i mean times I have been wrong

Trails, told you as such a great many times.

ok how i was wrong about trails, as far as i know YOU are the only one who was wrong about that

so being avaliable in multiple platform doesnt make a game multiplat

also cross play? what does that mean, if i buy disgaea 4 for the VITA can i play it on the PS4, if not, your list makes no fucking sense and the rule exists ONLY to inflate your numbers

... ... ... If the game was also on the 360 than no it wouldn't be exclusive, but as all the platforms its available on are Sony... its an exclusive. No will call Natural Doctrine a multi plat as in gaming lingo that would give the message that it would be available on another holder's holding/PC.

how convenient then that PC happens to have no holder huh? how conveninent that the rule has no reason to exist because it means nothing to the customer

What I mean is quite a bunch of games for PS3/4 get Vita releases too.

ok, play mind zero on the PS3 alone, ill wait

you keep talking about how "kind" you are for including Hero 2 on your list, and you are not belittling it?

more JRPGs are being released on PC, you have so far being completely unable to discredit that claim, instead you keep changing the rules to guide the discussion in your favor, i mean so far you have tried to change the definition of both JRPGs and exclusives

now JRPGs arent just Japanese Role Playing games, no, they have to be NICHE as well, and exclusives? hell they can be on as many fucking platforms you want, but the platforms must be under the same holder, mind not the fact that nobody owns PC so this stupid rule favors you

How is that belittling to the game exactly? I'm throwing you the bone you want.

I... see that would be an actual good time to use all caps, but nope. I have changed no rules.
There is no new titles outside the 1 coming out on PC, girl bye.

Not what I said but I should have known you'd say that. As for the PC holder thing, PC is different though technically there are different realms inside it, that is not a talk for this thread. If the game was released on PC and PS4 I'd not put it as PS4 exclusive because PC doesn't have a holder don't be silly. I'll have to remember to not be so gracious with you next time because constantly being portrayed by you as an unfair meanie head is really irritating me.

yeah you practically asking me to thank you for accepting you are wrong, how says you are acting condescending

ok explain to me what is the purpose of your stupid platform holder rule? and hell whats stopping me from making a rule that emulation counts for PC, and any game that can be emulated is for all intents and purposes a JRPG avaliable on PC, hell that makes MUCH more sense that your platform holder rule

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Half-Minute_Hero:_The_Second_Coming

... ... ...

You: "Trails saw a limited release, it was originally avaliable on PC but the west only saw the PSP version first, HMH2 like you said, saw no release at all until now"

Me: "It says it got world wide release as the same time as every other platform its on from it says to me. It wasn't available in the west until that point".

Why would you think I was talking about Hero 2, when I've been giving you that one every single time? Bloody hell.

ok trails then

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Legend_of_Heroes:_Trails_in_the_Sky

you are still wrong

so you make the rules and thats why they are not heavily on your favor, why yes it makes perfect sense, lets recap because i feel feel you dont quite understand the holes in your argument

-PC has no platform holder, yet you try to to apply a rule about all games released on platforms under the same platform holder add up

-the previous rule means nothing to the customer, a game only avaliable on the PS3/VITA/PS4 cant be played on any other platform even under the same holder

-you even break your own rule with 2 games, mind zero and conception 2

-you keep discrediting PC releases for being old, as if that had anything to do with my argument that PC has more JRPG releases

heres the thing i said that started this whole discussion

Console platforms and the PC platform are different, shocker.

They are exclusive to the holder.

and why should anybody care if a game is exclusive to the holder?

let me give you an example, say you wanted to convince someone the PS4 is an amazing platform for JRPGs based on YOUR list

they buy the console but are surprised the find out the vast mayority of the games on your list cannot be played on the PS4, "exclusive to the platform holder" means jackshit for that person, because its not a correct way to meansure the amount of JRPGs that person can play in his platform of choice

Your point has always been here, and previously in other threads that this is a sign that new JRPGs are going to start popping up on PC as Japanese devs "are getting the message that the PC is a viable platform", or whatever else. 2014 shows that isn't the case, 2015 I can not say 100% because I'll not be so arrogant as to presume to know the future in its totality...however the odds of me being correct are very near that 100% figure.

if thats not the case, why did PC get more JRPGs than ever before?

i mean you have to yet to refute that if you want to argue PC isnt getting more JRPGs, you have to refute the fact PC got many JRPGs this year

did i mention new? did i mention exclusive?, no, you added those rules to inflate your numbers

What does an exclusive mean? It means it isn't available elsewhere, in this discussion namely the PC. If the number of exclusives remain as they are then what you're saying will never come to pass.
Most JRPGs are exclusive even today, which is not something you'd know I suppose as you don't follow them which has been your fatal flaw this whole time.

It means it isn't available elsewhere

except they are, they simply belong to the same platform holder, but they are NOT exclusives

and considering many of the JRPGs PC is getting were once exclusives, well i think that says a lot about the future right? i mean why would japanese devs keep their niche games restricted to a single platform? after seeing falcom's and SEGA's success on Steam, id say more than one of them is already considering porting some of their backlog to the platform

 

[Erttheking]

Snip

The command ability that he magically has because he is the main character.

I don't think biology majors are taught how to ground up plants into medicine.

Locals tend to know how deep the rivers that are around their town? Yeah kinda. That's not exactly forbidden lore.

I suppose tracking one down and asking him a question would've been too much of a herculean task?

Yeah, it was shown to help. I'm saying the way it was shown to help was really fucking contrived and they might as well have been saying "This looks like a job for Aqua man"

Because a better design has not been come up for it. Considering that all the other tanks in the setting are not thirty years old and yet manage to only be just as advanced as this tank, and that no other tanks as advanced as this one were able to be built by anyone else 30 years ago then that implies the man who built this tank was a goddamn time lord. It's a bullshit excuse pure and simple Oh. Pardon me for asking for fucking internal consistency and for things to actually make sense. If fantasy is included that I suppose I shouldn't question anything if Welkin suddenly gains the ability to fart lighting out of his ass I shouldn't question it because "fantasy"

He's not a bad character because he loves nature. He's a bad nature because he struggles to have any character outside of that. There isn't much else to him besides that.


Because I TOTALLY FUCKING SAID THAT! I said that the Soviet Labor camps were designed for everyone where as the German concentration camps were designed for a minority, therefore the ones in game were more like German camps. That is fucking all and I would appreciate if you don't blatantly misinterpret what I'm saying like that ever again. You said the Soviets were the instigators in the war, but the German army got their two weeks early. Not that it matters. Even if the Soviet Union did get their first it wouldn't make this game any less shit.

Now look at the picture of the nazi, look at his hat. Notice the eagle. Now look at Gregor's. Notice it's the exact same eagle. Now notice the identical boots. And gloves. I'd be willing to accept that it's a hybrid design, but it is most certainly not free of Nazi imagery.

You keep saying that like it means something. Where the Hell does "everything" keep coming into the situation. Did I say anything about that? Why no I didn't. You can't stop bringing it up now. And for the umpteenth time. Second not!European war. Not!Jews all being rounded up. If you don't want your game to be associated with the holocaust, don't bring in parallel to the holocaust. It's...very...VERY fucking simple.

You're missing the point. I don't care how many times he says he wants a free nation. People do not go into a goddamn warzone and come out this happy to lucky. War changes you. It fucks you up. And Welkin comes out of it as the same dumbass he went into it as. I don't buy that for a fucking second. Yeah sure I just want to get offended. Sure. Why the fuck not. This story isn't shit at all. Welkin isn't a horribly written character with the personality of a piece of wood at all, Erttheking is just looking to be offended. The game sucks, pure and simple.

Elements of one war don't cancel out the elements of another, don't know what you're trying to prove here.

HA! I said that they had a giant ass tank that was of German design. WHICH THEY DID! And they still have elements of SS uniforms. You know the only thing you're proving to me here is that the Empire is a mix of the Soviet Union and Nazi Germany (Somehow I feel like this game sold poorly in Russia). And if that's the case, it explains the Russian style of the camps, despite the fact that, you know, they're clearly filled with not!Jews

Well I wasn't talking about that, so it really isn't relevant now is it? The point I was making is that the racist enemies were badly written. This point does not invalidate my point. Something wrong with me huh? Wow. And yeah, he pretty much was just a racist fucktard. Oh he's loyal to his country. Such a rich personality trait that I'm pretty sure can be said of every single soldier in the game.

No. It's really just you. And you're misusing the word "correcting"

You know there's one massive hole in your argument. Let's say that these camps really are more like Soviet camps and not Nazi camps...they're still including such a serious element in a story that clearly isn't up to handling it. And fucking up the reality of what actually happened in a cutesy ass story that isn't as nearly as mature or well written as it thinks it is. So yeah. This game's story still sucks and it's attempts to handle the grim reality and horrors of war makes me want to gouge my eyes out with grounded up glass, it the hope that it will be slightly less agonizing to deal with.

And when you come up with an explanation on who the people being shoved into camps are supposed to be if they weren't based off of Jews, I'll be waiting.

Also once again. You have actually caused my opinion of the game to decay. I used to think that it was a just meh game, but the more and more I argue with you about it, the more you refuse to accept my reasons for not liking the game, has just gotten me in a really bad mood and made me hate the game even more. I seriously hope your goal wasn't to get me to like the game or change my views on it, because you made the opposite happen.