Skyrim, where's the fun?

[Rooster Cogburn]

A slight correction, players who lack an active imagination are the ones who I would say fell victim to the hype.

My imagination works overtime when I am playing the game, self narration in my head, thinking of my characters in their own way and their individual stories as they move through the world ect.

Not everyone can do that, and they are the ones who are failed by the game.

Er, so what your saying is that you have to write a story for the game world, or else there is nothing interesting? This isn't fucking minecraft, that is a flaw, if a game is so poorly designed that people have to imagine something else is happening than it is a bad game.

I think I'm at least partially with FelixG, but you aren't wrong either. If Skyrim had nothing interesting, yea, that would fucking suck. But the Elder Scrolls is a little Tolkeinesque in that it does not answer all questions. (Ideally) it gives you enough to get you interested and then lets your imagination fly. Skyrim is a virtual playground in the way Lord of the Rings is a literary one. I am not comparing the quality of Skyrim to the Lord of the Rings. I just think there is an interesting parallel in their approaches.

 

[White_Lama]

Don't see why people find the game boring to be honest, I've been playing it since the release night and got a few hundred hours on different characters.

Have yet to find anything that bugs me, makes me bored or just makes me not wanting to play the game.

Maybe I just like the Elder Scrolls to much to find flaws in the games.

 

[00slash00]

the combat is elder scrolls games has always sucked. in skyrim you kinda have to make your own fun. i mean not to the extent that you do in minecraft, but theres not really any long term goal and doing random quests is only fun for so long. thats why i keep making new characters and have to take a break from skyrim every few months. i have logged about 200 hours into that game so obviously i enjoy the game and consider it worth the money, but if you play it a lot it can get boring pretty damn fast

 

[Rooster Cogburn]

Why is it that so many other RPGs can establish a character while still giving you control over who they become, but skyrim can't? Also, I like how the Ultima games gave you a nameless voiceless protagonist, yet those games don't suck. It is not fine for what it is, because all it is is a failed attempt at making a RPG.

Skyrim cannot establish a character because then there would be an established character. As for the rest, Skyrim is an awesome RPG.

 

[charge52]

Why is it that so many other RPGs can establish a character while still giving you control over who they become, but skyrim can't? Also, I like how the Ultima games gave you a nameless voiceless protagonist, yet those games don't suck. It is not fine for what it is, because all it is is a failed attempt at making a RPG.

Skyrim cannot establish a character because then there would an established character. As for the rest, Skyrim is an awesome RPG.

Except for the lack of stats, uselessness of skills, lack of differences in race choice, lack of any specialisation, lack of any important choices, and the fact that you aren't really playing a role, yeah, awesome RPG.

 

[jehk]

The best part of Skyrim is allowing the player to establish his or her own characters. I can understand if that's not your cup 'o tea but calling that bad is asinine.

 

[Rooster Cogburn]

I thought werewolfness would help spice things up a bit but it makes me really weak.

That was my first reaction when I played as a werewolf. But if you have the Dawnguard DLC it adds a skill tree and leveling system to the werewolf power. Give it some time and feed on a few bodies and it actually makes for a pretty unstoppable wolf-man killing machine. Although that function should have been in the base game...

I always wondered why a tiny part of me insisted that Oblivion was better despite the god-awful flaws the game had. It's so true though, Skyrim may play better but it's nowhere near as much fun as Oblivion, I just never noticed it before.

I think whoever made that image just forgot how much of Oblivion was spent in caves and dungeons. Skyrim has things that happen in the world to about the same degree as Oblivion did. I could make my own image and just reverse the names and list outdoor events in Skyrim. I don't think Skyrim is anywhere near Morrowind quality. But despite ultimately liking Oblivion I will never look back on it with nostalgia for the good old days lol.

 

[DoPo]

Magic is somewhat meh. Destruction magic with Impact is pretty much made to troll the enemies. Skill grinding the magic is annoying, though.

If you have the game on PC, I'd suggest mods. If not...the Divines help you. When I first played the game, after I was a couple of hours in or so, I realised I wasn't having fun. All the quests consisted of "go to X location, kill stuff, come back" and they made me trek all over the place to pad the length. I even questioned if I ever liked previous TES titles, since if they were all like this what had I been thinking. But I got over it. I mean, I remembered that Morrowind was actually fun to play. And I just stuck to bigger Skyrim quests - guilds, daedric, etc. Also mods. And now I'm waiting for Downguard (saving up money...) to play some more.

I tried magic for a few hours and it feels like I'm spraying people with a weak fire extuingisher. Not really what I was expecting, can I make spells later?

No, actually you can't. Which sucks majorly but there you go. I believe there are mods to allow it, though. And the first spells are quite crap, especially if you're levelled up already. What you need is the second damage spell (firebolt has the cheapest cost of the three) and Impact - when you do a two handed firebolt, the enemy is staggered. By the time they can move again, you would have launched another spell. It's permastun for as long as you have mana. Annoying when you haven't levelled up Destruction but when the spell cost gets low enough, you automatically win 1 vs 1 battles, while few opponents (2-3) are still easy with the right timing and maneuvering.

Be aware that the final level spells are flashy and sound powerful, but most of them are outdone by lower level ones, because of their huge cost and casting time.

 

[cerebus23]

because skyrim isn't much fun maybe? i play yhr game for maybe a evening or two then find some game breaking bug, or just look at my quest book with 500 quests i could not care less about doing because most of them are just trek 3/4 across the map to kill some stuff somewhere, or i just get bored and play something else.

hell i have yet to even finish the main quest, how much i was impressed by skyrim, oblivion i finished twice, fallout 3 once, fallout new vegas twice, so i get open world games, oblivion was way overhyped but despite its even buggier nature, worse animations, and other glaring faults it was a hell of alot more interesting and fun to inhabit than skyrim.

heck without mods the world of skyrim is about as static and boring as you can find, especially considering the nature of the world you are in with several sides struggling for power, without mods like wars in skyrim where is all this tension? where are the battles for the country? for all the conflict in skyrim they could not have done less in the game to actually show it.

 

[woodaba]

All I can say is, if you're not into Skyrim it's either you never liked the RPG setting or you simply don't play too many games in different genres.

Or we can realize that Skyrim is essentially a lobotomized version of Elder Scrolls designed specifically to appeal to the lowest common denominator. Some people do have opinions outisde the realm of your comprehension, ya know.

Nah. Skyrim is a good example of streamlining as opposed to dumbing down. It's less complex than Oblivion in superficial and super tedious ways but more sophisticated where it counts.

Please tell me where Skyrim is more sophisticated than Oblivion. And don't say Story/Quests or I will HURT you. Not really. Symbolically.

 

[theultimateend]

Skyrim is a victim to the hype machine in the sense that people forgot how much Oblivion sucked (for an Elder Scrolls game). Skyrim is awesome.

200+ hours on Skyrim and I dunno...

I like...really like it. Whenever another game fails me I can hop into Skyrim and enjoy myself. I have hundreds of screenshots up on Facebook from my adventures.

Basically I think people expected too much and I'm not sure any of that is Bethesda's fault. Everything I knew about the game from B was met with flying colors.

Plus you can mod this game to hell and back and it stays stable. I can't recall the last time I crashed :X.

The best part of Skyrim is allowing the player to establish his or her own characters. I can understand if that's not your cup 'o tea but calling that bad is asinine.

People just need extremes. I suspect that extreme or hyperbolic stances on things arouse dopamine production better than level headed objective-ish honesty.

Anything wrong with that? Not really, just a matter of shrugging it off when someone says "X GAME IS TERRIBLE BAD UNFUN TIME!"

Different strokes for different folks, the best you can get from these kinds of threads is circle jerks one way or another. Which again is fine but mostly unproductive outside of reward hormone production.

 

[Edl01]

I loved morrowind, I found oblivion incredibly average, I really like skyrim. Sorry I disagree on the fact it is boring and i don't find the combat that easy on my mage were near everything kills me in one or two hits so I have to kite the big creatures like a madman, I like the skills and the perks and contrary to most people I didn't have the problem with to many dragons, in fact I very very rarely saw dragons while playing skyrim which is the oposite opinion of most people but I still think Skyrim as an RPG is top of the line in quality.

 

[Rooster Cogburn]

Why is it that so many other RPGs can establish a character while still giving you control over who they become, but skyrim can't? Also, I like how the Ultima games gave you a nameless voiceless protagonist, yet those games don't suck. It is not fine for what it is, because all it is is a failed attempt at making a RPG.

Skyrim cannot establish a character because then there would an established character. As for the rest, Skyrim is an awesome RPG.

Except for the lack of stats, uselessness of skills, lack of differences in race choice, lack of any specialisation, lack of any important choices, and the fact that you aren't really playing a role, yeah, awesome RPG.

The lack of stats is a godsend. I literally used to mod Oblivion to accomplish substantially the same thing, long before we knew where Elder Scrolls V would take place. Stats added nothing to the game but agony and tedium while stopping me from building my character the way I wanted and at my own pace. They didn't contribute tough decisions or force me to make choices, they just meant I had to literally tally up hundreds of skill increases on a piece of paper to make the most of my character and kill myself if I ever leveled the wrong one by mistake. This is what I mean about superficial complexity vs. real sophistication and meaningful choice. You can't just pile up a bunch of horseshit and expect something good to result. What matters is how the elements work in tandem to create interesting systems with meaningful choice. The way the skill system was designed made the stats redundant. The skill system and the perk system together are fantastic. They accomplish everything stats were supposed to and more without tying an anchor around my character's ballsack.

There are no useless skills and they are all fun. The races do have differences. It's a good balance because your race will change the way you play, but it won't necessarily define your class, which defeats the point of having a choice. EDIT: Upon reflection, while I don't agree with you completely, I do wish there was more to distinguish the races from each other. There is an asston of specialization and I agonize constantly over the important choices. Don't know what you are on to there. I can't tell you how many times I have thought to myself "If I only had a few more skill-points..."

And you aren't playing a role? You're the goddamn Dovahkiin. Plus whatever role you want to be. People write long essays and freaking fanfiction about their characters' back-stories. Personally, I prefer the mystery of not knowing what happened before. The story is about fulfilling prophecy, really, not a character study. I like to think what happened in my past isn't as important as how I fulfilled the prophecy. But that's the whole point, there have to be strategically placed blank spots for your imagination to step in.

 

[Burst6]

Here's the reason why i don't like skyrim.

1) The combat. It's horrible. I got bored of skyrim's combat almost instantly. The spells have no punch to them (unless you get that perk that gives certain spells punch, but even then it's not that good), the melee combat is repetitive and based far more on luck and mashing buttons, and sneaking is OP. When i became a thief it's not because i wanted to sneak around, it's because i 1-shot everything so that pretty much removed the horrible combat.

2) The story is very.. meh. I can forgive a bad or nonexistent story (i love Monster Hunter and Dragons Dogma), and i'm not saying skyrim's story is that bad, but it doesn't help the rest of the game out too much. For me it hurt it. I was very bored by it. When a story aspect came along trying to slow me down i just wanted to skip it. I don't normally skip the story (i watched every single MGS cutscene and codex scene out there all the way through), but here i wanted to so bad.

3) The animations are horrible. This ties in with the combat in a way. If you want to make it feel like your movements and attacks have weight, you have to have the proper animation. Skyrim doesn't. Bethesda has problems with animation. This is a company that couldn't add a diagonal run animation to their early modern gen games. Everything is badly calibrated and you and your enemies slide along the ground all the time. The graphics can be breathtakingly beautiful, but if i see a bear sliding along a rocky path it'll ruin it for me.

 

[charge52]

Why is it that so many other RPGs can establish a character while still giving you control over who they become, but skyrim can't? Also, I like how the Ultima games gave you a nameless voiceless protagonist, yet those games don't suck. It is not fine for what it is, because all it is is a failed attempt at making a RPG.

Skyrim cannot establish a character because then there would an established character. As for the rest, Skyrim is an awesome RPG.

Except for the lack of stats, uselessness of skills, lack of differences in race choice, lack of any specialisation, lack of any important choices, and the fact that you aren't really playing a role, yeah, awesome RPG.

The lack of stats is a godsend. I literally used to mod Oblivion to accomplish substantially the same thing, long before we knew where Elder Scrolls V would take place. Stats added nothing to the game but agony and tedium while stopping me from building my character the way I wanted and at my own pace. They didn't contribute tough decisions or force me to make choices, they just meant I had to literally tally up hundreds of skill increases on a piece of paper to make the most of my character and kill myself if I ever leveled the wrong one by mistake. This is what I mean about superficial complexity vs. real sophistication and meaningful choice. You can't just pile up a bunch of horseshit and expect something good to result. What matters is how the elements work in tandem to create interesting systems with meaningful choice. The way the skill system was designed made the stats redundant. The skill system and the perk system together are fantastic. They accomplish everything stats were supposed to and more without tying an anchor around my character's ballsack.

There are no useless skills and they are all fun. The races do have differences. It's a good balance because your race will change the way you play, but it won't necessarily define your class, which defeats the point of having a choice. EDIT: Upon reflection, while I don't agree with you completely, I do wish there was more to distinguish the races from each other. There is an asston of specialization and I agonize constantly over the important choices. Don't know what you are on to there. I can't tell you how many times I have thought to myself "If I only had a few more skill-points..."

And you aren't playing a role? You're the goddamn Dovahkiin. Plus whatever role you want to be. People write long essays and freaking fanfiction about their characters' back-stories. Personally, I prefer the mystery of not knowing what happened before. The story is about fulfilling prophecy, really, not a character study. I like to think what happened in my past isn't as important as how I fulfilled the prophecy. But that's the whole point, there have to be strategically placed blank spots for your imagination to step in.

Strategically placed blank spots, the character entire fucking life is a blank spot. You know another game that starts character like that, Arcanum. You know how it lets you characterize your character? By letting you choose from a shit ton of backgrounds, each which can edit your stats and starting gear, and if none of them suit you, you can be a blank slate. Well of course you hated stats in Oblivion, Oblivion was a shit RPG that couldn't be damned to properly use stats. Please, give me some examples of "important choices" in skyrim. Also, how bout an example of this supposed specialization. Cause through personal experience, you can play the game as a mage, and then later on equip heavy armor and a two handed weapon and do just fine. Really, the Dovahkiin is not a role, with that logic, CoD is a RPG because your the goddamn chosen soldier! The world rarely reacts to your actions, and when they do all that changes is the person who tells you to do some dumb fetch quest.
Also, if you can't just pile horse shit and expect something good, than why are you praising the pile of horse shit named Skyrim?
One Handed and Two handed skills are useless, because it doesn't limit anything but a few animations if you don't put any skills into it. So are most of the magic skills, as all you need to cast master level spells is high magicka, it doesn't matter if you don't level your magic skills. Light armor and Heavy armor also don't matter, as you won't be missing out on anything if you don't put any points into them.

 

[getoffmycloud]

You have to realise the point of an elder scrolls game is that you make your own fun they just give you the tools to do it for example my first character was a nord that only used stuff that could be found in nature so it was a standard longbow and fur armour that I never upgraded and it was great fun. Basically just make your own story as you do stuff and make sure the main story is the last thing you ever do in the game.

 

[Rooster Cogburn]

Please tell me where Skyrim is more sophisticated than Oblivion. And don't say Story/Quests or I will HURT you. Not really. Symbolically.

lol Consider it noted. There are lots of little ways, but I'll try to focus on a few of big ones. I think the elephant in the room is the removal of stats. Rather than repeat myself, I will ask you to please view my earlier post to see why I think removing stats actually added sophistication to Skyrim, even though superficially that sounds dissonant. The expansion of the perk system added new depth, specialization, and meaningful choice that Oblivion simply never had.

Another big one is exposition. By far the most shocking disappointment of Oblivion was how the region of Cyrodiil itself did not feel explained and explored and examined in depth. Oh, any old game has these qualities to some extent, but Morrowind had a detailed and interesting explanation for every goddamn thing. And everything fit together and played off everything else to create a really interesting and believable landscape. There was so much to learn, and every location 'felt' real. Dwemer ruins contained Dwemer artifacts. A slavers' hideout contained things you would expect to find there. Oblivion didn't lack these expository elements completely, but they were emphasized much more in Skyrim. This may sound like a small thing to worry about, but in The Elder Scrolls it's everything.

And at the risk of being symbolically hurt, I am going to bring up the story lol. But maybe not in the way you think. This ties in to my point about exposition. Politically, culturally, and economically, Oblivion was fucking boring town. No one was having any kind of major political struggle or upheaval. In a game that is specifically about a region. Oh god, someone kill me! Maybe you'll call me an idiot because the Emperor just got assassinated, but that was an external threat for all intents and purposes. I mean, the man got murdered, and what happened to his Empire? Absolutely nothing. Talk about a missed opportunity for storytelling and world-building! Skyrim's attempts at reintroducing these elements were a little awkward, but they were very effective sometimes and they definitely weren't such colossal failures that we would have been better off without them.

 

[Applejack]

Magic is somewhat meh. Destruction magic with Impact is pretty much made to troll the enemies. Skill grinding the magic is annoying, though.

If you have the game on PC, I'd suggest mods. If not...the Divines help you. When I first played the game, after I was a couple of hours in or so, I realised I wasn't having fun. All the quests consisted of "go to X location, kill stuff, come back" and they made me trek all over the place to pad the length. I even questioned if I ever liked previous TES titles, since if they were all like this what had I been thinking. But I got over it. I mean, I remembered that Morrowind was actually fun to play. And I just stuck to bigger Skyrim quests - guilds, daedric, etc. Also mods. And now I'm waiting for Downguard (saving up money...) to play some more.

I tried magic for a few hours and it feels like I'm spraying people with a weak fire extuingisher. Not really what I was expecting, can I make spells later?

No, actually you can't. Which sucks majorly but there you go. I believe there are mods to allow it, though. And the first spells are quite crap, especially if you're levelled up already. What you need is the second damage spell (firebolt has the cheapest cost of the three) and Impact - when you do a two handed firebolt, the enemy is staggered. By the time they can move again, you would have launched another spell. It's permastun for as long as you have mana. Annoying when you haven't levelled up Destruction but when the spell cost gets low enough, you automatically win 1 vs 1 battles, while few opponents (2-3) are still easy with the right timing and maneuvering.

Be aware that the final level spells are flashy and sound powerful, but most of them are outdone by lower level ones, because of their huge cost and casting time.

Sad I loved making spells in Oblivion, like lightning damage and paralyze 1 sec or make you invisible as you paralyze for good mischief. I hear you can enchant your armor to make your spells cost nothing, so would it be better to spend all your level ups on health instead of magic? Maybe that would break the game so I don't want that I want to have to try to win.

 

[woodaba]

Please tell me where Skyrim is more sophisticated than Oblivion. And don't say Story/Quests or I will HURT you. Not really. Symbolically.

lol Consider it noted. There are lots of little ways, but I'll try to focus on a few of big ones. I think the elephant in the room is the removal of stats. Rather than repeat myself, I will ask you to please view my earlier post to see why I think removing stats actually added sophistication to Skyrim, even though superficially that sounds dissonant. The expansion of the perk system added new depth, specialization, and meaningful choice that Oblivion simply never had.

Another big one is exposition. By far the most shocking disappointment of Oblivion was how the region of Cyrodiil itself did not feel explained and explored and examined in depth. Oh, any old game has these qualities to some extent, but Morrowind had a detailed and interesting explanation for every goddamn thing. And everything fit together and played off everything else to create a really interesting and believable landscape. There was so much to learn, and every location 'felt' real. Dwemer ruins contained Dwemer artifacts. A slavers' hideout contained things you would expect to find there. Oblivion didn't lack these expository elements completely, but they were emphasized much more in Skyrim. This may sound like a small thing to worry about, but in The Elder Scrolls it's everything.

And at the risk of being symbolically hurt, I am going to bring up the story lol. But maybe not in the way you think. This ties in to my point about exposition. Politically, culturally, and economically, Oblivion was fucking boring town. No one was having any kind of major political struggle or upheaval. In a game that is specifically about a region. Oh god, someone kill me! Maybe you'll call me an idiot because the Emperor just got assassinated, but that was an external threat for all intents and purposes. I mean, the man got murdered, and what happened to his Empire? Absolutely nothing. Talk about a missed opportunity for storytelling and world-building! Skyrim's attempts at reintroducing these elements were a little awkward, but they were very effective sometimes and they definitely weren't such colossal failures that we would have been better off without them.

I see your point in regards to stats, but I don't agree. While part of me likes kyrim's more fluid approach to character building, it robs the game of any and all replayability. In Morrowind or Oblivion, I could be a completely different character right from the very beginning, and that would alter the way I played the game, at least initally. It felt different from character to character. Skyrim does not have this. Instead, every player starts off as Standard McDefault, with all the customization relegated to physical appearance, and maybe some racial bonuses. This was a huge mark against Skyrim.

I also agree with you in regards to Oblivion, but I would say that Skyrim did not improve the situation. We still never actually see what the Civil War does to Skyrim, we are only told that it is dividing the nation and there's fighting in the streets yadda yadda. We don't see a single destroyed settlement, the Civil War quests are set in already ruined castles, and, fuck, the final quest of the questlines, even though they take place in the two biggest cities in the ENTIRE COUNTRY, all the damage is cleared up overnight. Poof! Gone. Hopw you weren't getting invested! Both Oblivion and Skyrim forget the cardinal rule of writing: show, don't tell.

In regards to exposition, I kinda agree, but there was also far less to exposit in Skyrim. You can explore ancient temples, bandit hideouts, Vampire covens, forests inside paintings, Ayelid ruins, and all sorts in Oblivion. What is there in Skyrim? Draugr Tombs. And Caves. Aside from a VERY small number of exceptions, that is it.

 

[lordmardok]

Skyrim is kind of boring, the fun however is in a little thing called Mods. Of course if you have it on a console then, well, you're basically shit out of luck but compared to a lot of other games on consoles Skyrim probably would seem like the shit right out the box anyway. So assuming you're playing it correctly (read: "On a PC") then you go to Skyrim Nexus and download all the mods and overhauls you want to make it into a game that's worth playing and not a game that gets blown out of the water by a city-building sim from 2006 in terms of playable enjoyment (CivCity Rome was awesome.)

That said if you want awesome monsters download the Skyrim Monster Mod at:

http://skyrim.nexusmods.com/mods/9694

This literally makes the whole game a hundred times more awesome with new spawn locations all over the world map and brand new skins. If you want dragons that actually pose more of a threat than a whiffle bat download the Deadly Dragons mods at:

http://skyrim.nexusmods.com/mods/3829

Along with these gems are things like the Sky UI that makes the User Interface into something usable by humans instead of the Elder Ones from Yuggoth. Skyrim HD 2k that makes the whole world prettier. Better Females (not what you think get your mind out of the gutter) for prettier and better designed faces. Better Beast Races so the Argonians and the Khajit look actually cool instead of like someones mutant pet. So enjoy!

Unless you have it on a console.